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bob_alfisti
02-17-2003, 11:18 PM
with all the confusing statements around, just thought your opinion would help.

- what are they?
- do we need them (especially over 35)?
- side-effects?
- recommendations/advise

little lats
02-18-2003, 07:50 AM
Love them, but would rather use a 1-test. Is there a need? depends on you. They really help some of us older farts. I guess recommendations, would be can you accept any side effects you might get. I don't think I noticed any sides with 1-test. Except lack of sex drive. Like anything else in life, you have to use them wisely!!

Brother Phil
02-18-2003, 08:25 AM
Bob,
There are a lot of good aricles/info on pro hormones on the BB.com site. Just go to articles main page and do a search. I was a bit cautious about using them myself, because my thought was I would have harmful side effects. I know my own body's hormone production has diminished with age, and this is why I considered them. I chose to use a product that was orally available, as one of the challenges with pro hormone products is actually getting the product into the blood. Thats why some products are transdermal, or gargled in your mouth, I've even seen injectables. I wanted something easy to take (swallowed), but that would still be effective. I chose Syntrax Sauce Extreme, I guess because the adds claim impressed me. I'll be coming off my first five week cycle (35 days) this week. I know of no side effects that I have had, although I haven't had a physical or anything. But the usuals (hair loss, pimples, lowered labido) haven't occured. The dosage on the bottle is 1 or 2 caplets 3X a day with meals. On the first bottle I only took 3 a day, then on the second bottle I took 4 a day (2 at 2nd dosage). At my last weighing I had gained 12 lbs, even though I was sick during the 3rd to4th week and lost about 4 lbs, and have made significant gains in strength in all exercises. I plan to try another Syntrax product in May, when I'll be cutting, to retain muscle mass, or hopefully even gain some. Pro hormones need to be cycled so that your body's own hormone production won't stop. I'm definately not an expert on this, so I would research this subject on your own and make your own decision. It wouldn't hurt to get your doctors opinion either, before considering using these products yourself.

Eye2_Man
02-18-2003, 08:49 AM
Brother Phil, good to hear no side-effects with the Sauce. Keep us posted.

In order to gain your 12 pounds did you have to increase your food intake?

I've been wondering (for future reference) if a combination of TKE Monster Food and 6-OXO would be something to try. Do you think that would be enough stimulation to build quality mass or would it just turn a person into a hippopotamus?

Brother Phil
02-18-2003, 10:39 AM
Eye2,
I had already increased my food consumption, especially protein,as I was in a bulking cycle, so when I started this cycle I didn't increase food consuption. I haven't used TKE monster food, but it looks like a good meal replacement supplement, if your not too prone to putting on the fat. You've given me the thought, however, to try it, as I tend to be a hard gainer, and have been looking for a high protein/complex carb meal repacement. I think it would be real beneficial for me as a mid-morning meal replacement, as I work out about 4 - 5 o'clock, and would have some good energy for workouts. I don't always have time to prepare my food in the morning, where I usually have a high complex carb meal around 10:00. I had to go read up on 6-OXO and it sounds like a great supplement, especially if you're coming off a prohormone cycle, as it helps the bodies own testosterone production by blocking estrogen in the blood. This would help anyone coming off a cycle to resume normal testosterone production. As far as using it alone for its own anabolic effect, I can't really judge, as I have no personal experience myself. I can only say to give it a try for yourself, and see if you get some results. What I do like about 6-OXO is it is completely natural, already manufactured by the body, so there is certainly nothing harmful about it.

back2it
02-18-2003, 03:53 PM
I have been reading a ton about PH eventhough I have never used anything even close to them before from fear of long term side effects . Like years later . But I guess it is like anything else if you maintain general good health then it appears they should not be a problem . I also think that if there are other problems like BHP starting to show it would be wise to steer clear . On the other hand as long as no symptoms are showing up now and based on the feedback from Dutchman and others a short term trial like 4weeks would be worth considering . I am 47 with no sign of hairloss it is just changing color also the finger test indicated a slight enlargement of the prostate last summer although the PSA came back at <1 which is extremely low . I began the saw palmetto right after the test and neve have shown any symptoms .
I probably will try something like 1-AD and /or a 4-AD tranderm . One more problem when I do decide to do this I won't be able to buy them legally as they are considered a level 3 steroid in Canada . So I will need to find a good{cheap} place to buy them over the counter in Buffalo or N.F NY . I would like some help on that one if anyone can assist . AND I guess I just need some reasurance that these things won't do any damage .
In the 80's I took every streoid replacement that didn't work{remember glandulars} and paid lots for the stuff too . It would be nice to use something that actually did what it claimed and all without ruining the liver , kidneys etc .

Original Poster
02-18-2003, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by bob_alfisti
with all the confusing statements around, just thought your opinion would help.

- what are they?
- do we need them (especially over 35)?
- side-effects?
- recommendations/advise

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/catproh.htm

It has 3 parts and is worth the read.

There are quite a few people in the over35 section that can answer any questions you may have.

Also, there are also some guru's in the supps section lurking around.

PEACE

Gollum
02-18-2003, 05:10 PM
As usual,here I come pimping anoither Big Cat article.:D

Bob,this article is a good place to start:

http://bodybuilding.com/fun/catproh.htm


Back2it,

I took all that junk in the 80s too.Glandulars,plant sterols,Smilax,all kinds of weird crap.We live and learn.

Gollum
02-18-2003, 05:14 PM
Chi-town beat me to it...by less than a minute.

:D

Original Poster
02-18-2003, 05:15 PM
I can assure you that 1-ad and 1-test is not the andro of yester year.

They work.
As good as AS, NO.

But Damn good IMO.

There is no magic pill or transdermal. They are still supplements and will never replace the good nutrition and training, but will augment them quite well.

PEACE

back2it
02-18-2003, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by Gollum
As usual,here I come pimping anoither Big Cat article.:D

Bob,this article is a good place to start:

http://bodybuilding.com/fun/catproh.htm


Back2it,

I took all that junk in the 80s too.Glandulars,plant sterols,Smilax,all kinds of weird crap.We live and learn.

Yeah it was never ending I can't imagine how much I spent for nothing . None of that sh*t worked .

bob_alfisti
02-19-2003, 01:30 AM
guys, thanks for all the replies, really appreciate it. i've done a search on it, before i posted this thread, and with all the info i gathered, i actually became confused..what's safe and what is not. i now need "real experience" from you guys who have tried it...any positive results or vice versa. and thanks for the links to Big Cat...awesome! btw, keep the comments coming coz at this age, growth is never that easy anymore...except the FAT thing!!!

Macattack
02-19-2003, 05:04 PM
you think prohormones are confusing try researching AS stuff, and thats when it gets real serious because your definetly going to shut some glandular activity down and better be ready for sides from doing that.

I just learned something about half way thru a cycle i was doing WRONG, mixing 2 substances and wasting money on one and i thought i new what i was doing with hours and hours of research before the cycle, no harm done just wasted money and i've fixed the problem but not without adding another i am afraid and its to late to change that unless i stop the whole damn cycle completely and i dont want to do that but i may just to be safe....

I gained big on 1-T alone, though the lethargy was heavy and maybe that was due to using to much, but didn't get that lethargy when i added 4AD.....

Minotaur
02-19-2003, 08:25 PM
I've been leery of prohormones mainly because I know they won't work for me. My hormones were so screwed up and so low, that nothing but real replacement would boost them.

I wish I had normal hormones so I could try this stuff like everyone else. :(

Hey, wait a minute... my hormones have been boosted. Duh! :p

Seriously, because I've battled screwed up hormones from unknown cause, I'm leery of deliberately tinkering with the hormonal axes (plural of axis? :D) unless you know what you're doing, monitor blood, and know how to compensate. The same goes for dabbling in AS. I'm not against any of this, I just urge caution and research so you don't wind up being a hormonal mess.

Brother Phil
02-20-2003, 05:30 PM
Yo Bob,
I don't know if you've looked, but in the supplement section there's a lot of posts reguarding peoples experience with prohormones. But if you're thinking like me, you put more value in the "older folks" opinions on supps. I just think we respond a little differently to supplementation as we get older, particularly prohormones. There is some information there, however, that is pertinent to any age.