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James1050
10-20-2006, 09:44 PM
Has anyone done this before? I intend you try it and have a few questions, I've been reading about it at ironaddicts. They say fat should be at LEAST 40%, but they also encourage excessive protein, I might do 300 say grams = 1200 cals, to match that (id do 50% fat to be safe) I'd need 2700 calories, not counting the many calories you consume pwo and ppwo how are you supposed to cut on that? Also does anyone have any food ideas, I think I'll look into the keto section for some ideas because it's very similiar var pwo and ppwo.

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 10:17 PM
How much do you weigh?

TCD = starchy carbs @ breakfast, preWO, and postWO right?

James1050
10-20-2006, 10:26 PM
170 pounds, around 16%. TCD is zero carbs (6-8 grams MAXIMUM per meal) besides pwo (60 grams of dextrose) and ppwo which is 40/30/30 p/c/f then back to zero carbs. Do this for 5 days then carb up for 1-2 depending. Any help? THanks boyscout

Here's a link: *edit* sorry forgot about the rules, I'll pm it to you

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 10:58 PM
170 pounds, around 16%. TCD is zero carbs (6-8 grams MAXIMUM per meal) besides pwo (60 grams of dextrose) and ppwo which is 40/30/30 p/c/f then back to zero carbs. Do this for 5 days then carb up for 1-2 depending. Any help? THanks boyscout

Here's a link: *edit* sorry forgot about the rules, I'll pm it to you
Alright first let's find out your caloric needs and work from there.

How many calories do I need? Click here to find out, courtesy of forum member Short One (http://yianni.users.mcs2.netarray.com/FitnessWebApp/bmr.jsp)

Using that calculator, how many calories do you need to maintain?

James1050
10-20-2006, 11:10 PM
To maintain: 2977.25 cals

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 11:12 PM
To maintain: 2977.25 cals
Alright. How much of a deficit do you want to create?

PS: I've read the link on TCD (thanks!)... so I think we can take it from here.

James1050
10-20-2006, 11:16 PM
Well, I'm not really an expert with calories but I'm aiming at 1-1.5 pounds lost per week, judging from the guidelines on the site and my type (im an ecto), I think that's possible, I'm just a bit stumped as to what my ratios and calories should be.. thanks a lot

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 11:18 PM
Well, I'm not really an expert with calories but I'm aiming at 1-1.5 pounds lost per week, judging from the guidelines on the site and my type (im an ecto), I think that's possible, I'm just a bit stumped as to what my ratios and calories should be.. thanks a lot
How tall are you?

We'll start with a 500 calorie deficit btw, so that's around 2500 calories.

James1050
10-20-2006, 11:19 PM
5"11 - sounds good

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 11:21 PM
5"11
5'11" @ 170lbs... got pics?

(Just making sure you need to cut, instead of bulk)

James1050
10-20-2006, 11:26 PM
You hit me deep man:( yes I need to cut:(

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 11:30 PM
You hit me deep man:( yes I need to cut:(
Are you sure?

Just because you might have a little gut, may not mean you need to cut. You might be skinny fat...

Please post a pic? Pretty please? :D

boyscouT
10-20-2006, 11:48 PM
Just checking, you made sure to put in your correct weight when calculating your calories right? Or is the 3,000 number wrong...

James1050
10-21-2006, 12:09 AM
No I did it correctly.. Ill do it agin though to make sure

James1050
10-21-2006, 12:16 AM
Katch-McArdle (unisex-based on LBM ie. More accurate )
Harris-Benedict (gender-based on total weight)
Which one should I select, I'll do it again to see if it's correct..

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 12:19 AM
Katch-McArdle (unisex-based on LBM ie. More accurate )
Harris-Benedict (gender-based on total weight)
Which one should I select, I'll do it again to see if it's correct..
Harris-Benedict.

James1050
10-21-2006, 12:19 AM
Meal Plan: Simple Simple Taper Advanced Taper Heavy Start
Maintenance: TDEE based [most accurate]
Bodyweight based

which one of those do I choose? and my macro's were 5% carbs, 50% protein, 45% fat.

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 12:20 AM
Meal Plan: Simple Simple Taper Advanced Taper Heavy Start
Maintenance: TDEE based [most accurate]
Bodyweight based

which one of those do I choose? and my macro's were 5% carbs, 50% protein, 45% fat.
Don't worry about that. Just choose whatever. We're focusing on your calories right now. I'll help you figure out your macros.

ceilos456
10-21-2006, 12:21 AM
lets see some pics

James1050
10-21-2006, 12:34 AM
2741.01 cals to maintain..wow you guys are going to think I'm small now, I just found out I grew in 6 months, I just measured myself to make sure, 183cm - 6ft.

Sorry about that one:(

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 12:40 AM
2741.01 cals to maintain..wow you guys are going to think I'm small now, I just found out I grew in 6 months, I just measured myself to make sure, 183cm - 6ft.

Sorry about that one:(
How did you get the ~3,000 number before?

James1050
10-21-2006, 12:44 AM
I'm not sure - sorry again..

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 12:49 AM
I'm not sure - sorry again..
To be safe, we'll do 2,500 calories. That way after 2-4 weeks, if you are dropping too little weight, we'll increase the deficit. If you're dropping 1-2lbs a week, that's perfect.

Alright you weigh 170lbs so thats 255g protein daily. (1.5g protein per lb of BW)
20% of 2,500 = 500 calories / 9 calories per g of fat = 55.5g fat.. we'll make it 60g.

That leaves us with 235g carbs.

If you wanted a "traditional" diet, that would be 255g protein / 235g carbs / 60g fat. Macros would be 41%P / 38%C / 21%F

Timed Carb Diet calculations coming....

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 01:01 AM
Alright 40% fat @ 2,500 calories = 111.1g of fat. We'll make it 115g to be safe.

You need 85g carbs immediate PWO for your weight, so that leaves us with 1125 calories left.

I suggest getting 1.5g protein per lb of BW as well so thats 255g protein aka 1020 calories. That leaves us with 105 cals, or 26.25g carbs to eat at your PPWO meal.

It says you need a meal of 40P/30C/30F post workout, so that would mean 140 cals P / 105 cals C / 105 cals F, totaling 350 cal PPWO meal.

I think I did that right.. lol.

James1050
10-21-2006, 01:58 AM
so ppwo will be 35 grams protein, 26.5 carbs ane 11.6 grams fat.
He said ten minutes after the dextrose shake take in 65-100 grams whey drink, how much do you think I should get? And what difference should I be doing on non-workout days? ratio wise, and what should they be like on carb up days?
youre awesome for doing this for me thanks a lot man

James1050
10-21-2006, 02:02 AM
oh and it said at LEAST 40% fats, shouldn't we up it to maybe 45% to be safe?

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 03:00 AM
so ppwo will be 35 grams protein, 26.5 carbs ane 11.6 grams fat.
He said ten minutes after the dextrose shake take in 65-100 grams whey drink, how much do you think I should get? And what difference should I be doing on non-workout days? ratio wise, and what should they be like on carb up days?
youre awesome for doing this for me thanks a lot man
Have your whey and dextrose together PWO. For your weight, you need 42.5g protein.

The obvious thing about non-workout days is that you won't be having your PWO shake. I don't know anything more than that.. you need to do more research on TCD.

Same for carb up days.. I don't know. You're job to look it up ;).

oh and it said at LEAST 40% fats, shouldn't we up it to maybe 45% to be safe?
That would mean less carbs PWO and PPWO... can you really handle that LITTLE carbs?

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 03:24 AM
And remember bro.. you're 16... you're at the prime age of growth... you don't want to hinder that by doing some out of the ordinary diet.

ceilos456
10-21-2006, 03:29 AM
And remember bro.. you're 16... you're at the prime age of growth... you don't want to hinder that by doing some out of the ordinary diet.
well done!

Max Protein
10-21-2006, 06:48 AM
All these calculations, I'm doing a timed carb (but then I run as well) and all it takes is to pay attention to pre, post and post-post workout nutrition.
If you want to get cut, keep carbs to around 100g, but bump up the fats for meals which are not workout meals. And then as you get leaner, work in carb cycling and lower the fats and total calories gradually.
To maintain, keep the carbs about the same as bodyweight or maybe 1.5/lb if you work out a bit more and again, hit on the fats (they're vital for good health and energy).
This formula has never failed for me.

James1050
10-21-2006, 07:45 PM
Have your whey and dextrose together PWO. For your weight, you need 42.5g protein.

The obvious thing about non-workout days is that you won't be having your PWO shake. I don't know anything more than that.. you need to do more research on TCD.

Same for carb up days.. I don't know. You're job to look it up ;).

That would mean less carbs PWO and PPWO... can you really handle that LITTLE carbs?
Well it's just that he says at LEAST and we're at about 41% as you described above.
So I would say on off days I should be around 5% carbs, 50% protein and 45% fats correct? Thanks for all your help so far.

James1050
10-21-2006, 07:56 PM
Also does anyone have any suggestions, it says I should be getting the majority of my meals from efas and protein powder, so any specific mixes or anything, sorry I'm really bad at this..

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 07:59 PM
Well it's just that he says at LEAST and we're at about 41% as you described above.
So I would say on off days I should be around 5% carbs, 50% protein and 45% fats correct? Thanks for all your help so far.
What do you want to bump it up to on workout days then? 45% fat?

And I don't know about off-days... I googled "TCD" and "Timed Carb Diet" but NOTHING shows up regarding it.

Also does anyone have any suggestions, it says I should be getting the majority of my meals from efas and protein powder, so any specific mixes or anything, sorry I'm really bad at this..
Whole foods > supplements, ALWAYS.

James1050
10-21-2006, 08:07 PM
Well I'm just looking for what;s best so I guess so, I can't find anything else on it either besides another thread on that same site explaining different approaches, which doesn't help me.

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 08:42 PM
Well I'm just looking for what;s best so I guess so, I can't find anything else on it either besides another thread on that same site explaining different approaches, which doesn't help me.
IMHO what's best for you is NOT doing TCD. Stick to a "regular" diet. You are 16 man!!

James1050
10-21-2006, 09:17 PM
You mean not cutting at all right? I just want to lean down then clean bulk, it's just what I feel comfortable with:(

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 09:24 PM
You mean not cutting at all right? I just want to lean down then clean bulk, it's just what I feel comfortable with:(
No, I do not mean not cutting.

I mean going on caloric deficit diet with "normal" macros. Nothing extreme like 5% or less carbs.

James1050
10-21-2006, 09:38 PM
Ok thanks man but I honestly want to try this, it's been recomended by others and looks solid, I honestly think you know what you;re talking about though, I just want to try this for a couple of weeks to see how I go, isn't the keto similiar and more extreme than this anyway? I'm putting together a diet right now, any suggestions for foods?

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 11:11 PM
Ok thanks man but I honestly want to try this, it's been recomended by others and looks solid, I honestly think you know what you;re talking about though, I just want to try this for a couple of weeks to see how I go, isn't the keto similiar and more extreme than this anyway? I'm putting together a diet right now, any suggestions for foods?
I wish you the best bro.

You can basically eat anything you want.. just stay away from trans fats and empty calories.

James1050
10-21-2006, 11:43 PM
Ok thanks so much for all your help mate, if you don't mind I might get your opinion on my diet later on , thanks for everything

boyscouT
10-21-2006, 11:48 PM
Ok thanks so much for all your help mate, if you don't mind I might get your opinion on my diet later on , thanks for everything
Anytime bro. Just post it here and i'll critique it.

James1050
10-24-2006, 09:50 PM
Ok I'm trying to think of my diet and I'm stumped.. I have no idea what I can be eating.. and I had another question, do you think it matters when I take in my fats proteins etc. ie I may have a meal with 30 grams of fat and in another meal only have 10, I'd still be getting my ratios but at different times, because my main aim is to recognise fats as a fuel source. Also should I keep using casein before bed? Because the fats will be digested long before the casein stops throughout the night..

boyscouT
10-24-2006, 10:19 PM
Ok I'm trying to think of my diet and I'm stumped.. I have no idea what I can be eating.. and I had another question, do you think it matters when I take in my fats proteins etc. ie I may have a meal with 30 grams of fat and in another meal only have 10, I'd still be getting my ratios but at different times, because my main aim is to recognise fats as a fuel source. Also should I keep using casein before bed? Because the fats will be digested long before the casein stops throughout the night..
-Why are you having trouble finding foods to eat? :confused:
-Try to keep consistent protein/fat intake in all meals.
-Yes, casein before bed is great. You don't need to get so technical... sufficient fat+protein will sustain you throughout your sleep just fine.

James1050
10-24-2006, 11:40 PM
-Why are you having trouble finding foods to eat? :confused:
I'm not sure! I just can't think of anything..

James1050
11-03-2006, 07:35 PM
What should my ratios/cals look like on a carb up day.. comps been broken.. just putting the diet together now:(

James1050
11-03-2006, 11:56 PM
bump

boyscouT
11-04-2006, 12:38 AM
What should my ratios/cals look like on a carb up day.. comps been broken.. just putting the diet together now:(
Don't know about that bro.. what did that website say about carb ups?

James1050
11-04-2006, 01:06 AM
"Your carb-up days are designed to refill the glycogen stores in the muscle, and bump up caloric levels a bit to keep your thyroid off balance. They are not go all-out berserk pig-out days. MANY, MANY lifters make this mistake and cancel out all the fat loss they achieved up until the carb-up day(s)."

So I'm aiming for 2500 calories a day when cutting, so to bump it up a bit over maintenence maybe 2700 or 2800 maybe? Doesn't say anything about ratios either:(

James1050
11-04-2006, 01:07 AM
Wow i wish there could be people like him around where i live to train me, to cover everything.. no one at all does things like this here:(

boyscouT
11-04-2006, 01:13 AM
"Your carb-up days are designed to refill the glycogen stores in the muscle, and bump up caloric levels a bit to keep your thyroid off balance. They are not go all-out berserk pig-out days. MANY, MANY lifters make this mistake and cancel out all the fat loss they achieved up until the carb-up day(s)."

So I'm aiming for 2500 calories a day when cutting, so to bump it up a bit over maintenence maybe 2700 or 2800 maybe? Doesn't say anything about ratios either:(
Alright well it won't be hard to figure it out.

Bumping up to 2700-2800 for that one day sounds like a good place to start.

Now don't forget your protein will stay the same, it will still be 1.5g x BW.

Your fats will go down to compensate for the extra carbs, but they will not go below 20% of total cals.

So the macros / cals on your carb up day for 2800 cals should be:

1020 cals protein or 255g protein
560 cals fat or 62.2g fat
1220 cals carb or 305g carb

James1050
11-04-2006, 02:35 PM
Alright well it won't be hard to figure it out.

Bumping up to 2700-2800 for that one day sounds like a good place to start.

Now don't forget your protein will stay the same, it will still be 1.5g x BW.

Your fats will go down to compensate for the extra carbs, but they will not go below 20% of total cals.

So the macros / cals on your carb up day for 2800 cals should be:

1020 cals protein or 255g protein
560 cals fat or 62.2g fat
1220 cals carb or 305g carb
Sounds good, I'll throw in some cardio in on saturday and sunday (most likely my carb up days) to help me along, because its the holidays now, and I won't be nearly as active as when I was in school.

boyscouT
11-04-2006, 03:43 PM
Sounds good, I'll throw in some cardio in on saturday and sunday (most likely my carb up days) to help me along, because its the holidays now, and I won't be nearly as active as when I was in school.
Do low-moderate intensity. I imagine the cardio will be great for nutrient partitioning purposes and overall health.

James1050
11-10-2006, 01:52 AM
Ok here we are.. anyone feel free to comment.. especially boyscout:)

Ledge
11-10-2006, 04:23 AM
Ok here we are.. anyone feel free to comment.. especially boyscout:)

Steaks, fish, pastas, brown rice, plenty of vegetables, fruits.... you mentioned almonds, u could also include walnuts....

James1050
11-10-2006, 03:34 PM
bump

boyscouT
11-10-2006, 04:44 PM
bump
I'm going to go workout right now i'll help you out when I return.

James1050
11-10-2006, 05:38 PM
Ok mate i hope you're having fun working out:) i was thinking of adding some broccili into a couple of my meals for a few extra carbs.. ive been getting fairly hungry the last few days, what are your opinions on cheating, I don't think I will, maybe one every so often.

I also have another question if you don't mind asking.. ive had a week of to study and have not had any trouble concentrating, but I don't want to take any chances, so I'm going to carb up on the day of the exam, Ill wake at 7 15 and the exams at 9 (ill do this for the other three I have , ones int he arvo so I can fit in 2 or threee meals in befor eit), is one meal full of carbs enough to be running onfull speeds, or should I carb up the day before too. thanks

boyscouT
11-11-2006, 03:41 AM
Instead of 85g dex I would do half dex half oats or half dex half maltodextrin.

Don't know about adding broccoli into a TCD.. the carbs might not be welcomed..

Don't know about carbing up before exams either.

Bro honestly go buy a book on TCD it should answer everything for you.

James1050
11-11-2006, 03:43 AM
ok thanks, so the diet looks ok to you? thanks for everything, when should I lower my cals?

hynox.rain
11-11-2006, 03:50 AM
Hey dude,
If I were you I would be skeptical about eating too much before an exam. For one if you feel bloated or full your mind may be on other things. And two if your belly is filled up there is going to be an increased blood flow to the stomach in order to properly digest everything, which will mean less blood away from the brain.

Try do have a decent meal with complex carbs, some efa's and protein about 1-2 hours before the exam. Before exams I always try to have some blueberries, and some walnuts or flax seed.

boyscouT
11-11-2006, 03:51 AM
ok thanks, so the diet looks ok to you? thanks for everything, when should I lower my cals?
Watch the scale. When you stop losing weight, decrease cals by 200 either by diet or cardio.

iCY
11-11-2006, 07:34 AM
Ok here we are.. anyone feel free to comment.. especially boyscout:)

???????? 6 scoops of protein a day. are you taking a multivitamin with this diet?

what is the reason you're on this diet? do you want a fast fix? are you looking to slowly cut down in a HEALTHY way? are you looking to cut while gaining some muscle?? or are you looking to make healthy/efficient eating habbits so you dont have to constantly plan meals to stay in shape(pick this one lol)

it reminds me of the velocity diet on tnation.

James1050
11-11-2006, 04:00 PM
???????? 6 scoops of protein a day. are you taking a multivitamin with this diet?

what is the reason you're on this diet? do you want a fast fix? are you looking to slowly cut down in a HEALTHY way? are you looking to cut while gaining some muscle?? or are you looking to make healthy/efficient eating habbits so you dont have to constantly plan meals to stay in shape(pick this one lol)

it reminds me of the velocity diet on tnation.
Ah the last one.. and the 2nd last one.. thanks for your help boyscout, and hynox.rain, I was thinking, some steel cut oats, fish oil banana, milk yada yada and so on for some brain food before exam.. but I want to make sure I'm on full speed, so should I carb up the day before the exam aswell?

boyscouT
11-11-2006, 05:26 PM
Ah the last one.. and the 2nd last one.. thanks for your help boyscout, and hynox.rain, I was thinking, some steel cut oats, fish oil banana, milk yada yada and so on for some brain food before exam.. but I want to make sure I'm on full speed, so should I carb up the day before the exam aswell?
How about you just do a traditional 40/40/20 and go from there. Honestly, f*ck this TCD ****.