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gbat
01-26-2003, 04:27 AM
I am getting curious. I've heard mostly negatives about calipers and scales in here. They have a tub down at the local health club and they charge $30. for puttin ya in there and somehow seeing how much fat ya got. Are they accurate or should I just get an autopsy? :D

Gollum
01-26-2003, 04:35 AM
Originally posted by gbat
. Are they accurate or should I just get an autopsy? :D

LOL!


From what I understand this method is quite accurate.

MooreGuy
01-26-2003, 07:19 AM
The health club I go to has a machine that shoots a laser into your bicep and gives you a reading of your fat weight, lean (fat free) weight, total body water and your BMI. It's highly accurate and gives you a good idea of your over all body composition. Not only that but it doesn't take more than a minute and you don't have to get wet. My health club charges $10 for it.

Above I called it a laser but I'm pretty sure that's not the correct name. If anyone can give him more accurate name/info please do it. If no one else adds anything I'm sure you can call around to some local health clubs and they will know exactly what I'm talking about.

Minotaur
01-26-2003, 08:02 AM
I've come to look at any form of fat measurement as only a progress marker, not as an absolute in accuracy.

You can use calipers or a fat scale or a tape measure and web calculator, as long as you stick with calipers or a fat scale or a tape measure and web calculator as your method. I don't think any method is truly accurate.

But using the same method from one measurement time to the next will show relative progress.

I wouldn't spend the $30 unless my curiosity was insatiable, or there were others who testified to its accuracy.

TwoWalks
01-26-2003, 08:11 AM
Water weight is the Most accurate with calipers next followed by all the rest. Now with that said, no measurement is any more accurate than the people conducting the measurement. Water temp and a number of things if not monitored correctly will change even the water weight measurement.

I would not spend the money for the water weight measurement unless I planned to get down to 3% for a competition, then accuracy can be extremely important. Like Minotaur said: From day to day using the same way of measuring will tell you a good aproximate of the amount of bodyfat you have lost. After that the mirror is the most important, how do you look?

Phatman1179
01-26-2003, 08:22 AM
Yep, Yep, I agree 100% with Minotaur and Two Walks - It's all relative to your progress. I own one of those Body Logic electric analyzers and I don't think it is very accurate but if I measure the same way and at the same time of day I can track my progress very closely. Now if the thing ever says I am close to single digit body fat, I will pay for the Hydrostatic testing and get the truth.

edster951
01-26-2003, 10:16 AM
I'd like anything which tells me my body fat is going down :(

gbat
01-26-2003, 10:26 AM
I am supposing calipers are the cheapest. But I am wondering if taking a measurement on my bicep would not be quite innacurate because my biceps are a lot more fat free than my midsection.

Any good recommendations on the scales?

The measurement I use now is jumping up and down and feeling the aftershocks. Muscle has less bounce. :D

TwoWalks
01-26-2003, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by gbat
I am supposing calipers are the cheapest. But I am wondering if taking a measurement on my bicep would not be quite innacurate because my biceps are a lot more fat free than my midsection.

Any good recommendations on the scales?


I can not make a good recommendation on the scales because I found them extremely inaccurate on me. They also have a label that say's they are inaccurate if you workout or lift weights.

The bodyfat calculators measure from three to seven places and the fat reading is calculated for over all displacement. The fact the arm has less and the waist has more is figured into the equation. I prefer the calipers over all other types. This is looking at the cost vs accuracy and convenience of use. Now that ignores the fact that calipers can range from a small amount such as $39. to as much as $1500.00

Within minutes of each other I went for the hydrostatic weigh getting a reading 21.9%, a caliper reading showing me a 24.3% and the scale showing me at 39.6%. From here to there you have to choose.:)

Hibiscus09
01-26-2003, 11:54 AM
I'd like anything which tells me my body fat is going down

Me too Edster!!!!

I prefer the calipers to anything else I've tried. I've never bothered with the water thing -- do they dunk you completely under? -- ya'll know that would mess up my hair! :)

back2it
01-26-2003, 01:29 PM
I have a scale that measures fat% . Not very accurate and not very repeatable . The company says the scales are accurate if you have the same amount of water in your body from day to day . Like I know that . Calipers seem to be the best bet price wise and for using on a regular basis . Once you learn how to use them the results are repeatable even if they are not as accurate as hydrostatic who cares , I just want to know if the % is getting higher or lower .

MiloMan
01-26-2003, 02:32 PM
Use this as a rough guide:

1. Full House = No visible muscle definition. Bodyfat level = over 20%.

2. Hard = Some muscle separation appears between delts and upper arm. Abs are still not visible. Approx. bodyfat level = 15-19%

3. Cut = More muscle separation appears particularly in the chest and back, outline of the abs begins to appear slightly. Approx. bodyfat level = 12-14%

3. Defined = Muscle separations get deeper in the arms, chest, legs and back, and abs appear when flexed. Approx. bodyfat level = 10-12%

4. Ripped = Abs are clearly visible all the time, vascularity in arms is prominent, chest and back separation is obvious, and face is starting to appear more angular. Condition can be held indefinitely. Approximate bodyfat level = 7-9%

5. Shredded = Striations appear in large muscle groups when they are flexed. Vascularity appears in lower abdomen and in the legs. Condition can be held for several days with careful dieting. Approximate bodyfat level = 5-7%

6. Sliced = Muscles and tendons begin to appear in the face when chewing, striations appear everywhere and vascularity appears everywhere. Bodyfat levels are close to 3% and subcutaneous water levels are near 0. Condition can only be held for a few hours at a time. Not a healthy condition to stay in due to lower water level.

MiloMan
01-26-2003, 02:35 PM
Originally posted by Hibiscus09
Me too Edster!!!!

I prefer the calipers to anything else I've tried. I've never bothered with the water thing -- do they dunk you completely under? -- ya'll know that would mess up my hair! :)

Hibiscus09
01-26-2003, 02:58 PM
I'm a bit VERY claustrophobic -- I don't know if I could handle that one. :) Besides, her hair looks terrible! Lol

TrishB
01-26-2003, 04:14 PM
I agree with Hib....no way would I do that. :eek:
I use the calibers....but I just bought the scale, which everyone told me not to. But it measured just 2% over the calibers this morning. So I think I will use both for awhile.

I am so into numbers. Weight and measurements mentally show me how I am progressing. I am obsessed with them...even if they don't show the real picture.

IPR
01-26-2003, 06:25 PM
I don't consider hydrostatic measurements accurate at all. In order to get a proper measurement you must blow as much air out of your lungs as possible. This will vary considerably depending on someones attitude and experience in water.

After this its the same inaccurate method of comparing you against the standard person of your age etc.

All these methods suffer from the same problem, non of us are standard.

ANyway, who cares what the bf% say, there are no bragging rights IMO, the truth is visible to those around you whatever % you may believe. So, a tape measure and the mirror are the best measure of progress.

For a specific area where I have some remaining fat, I use the calipers, not for a bf% check, but just to record the thickness in this area as the tape won't tell me this and in the mirror it never seems to be getting smaller....but it is :)

MiloMan
01-26-2003, 06:36 PM
Hmm, I know more than a few people that spend good money on new swimsuits periodically - but never get in the water, i.e. "This is just to wear when sitting at the pool." Oh, they'll go to the beach - and wade in up to their knees - but point at a boogie board and they run away in terror.

They go on boats, even though they don't swim, yet they don't wear a life jacket, "it looks goofy". Not as goofy as a bloated, drowned body it doesn't.

I ask them why they don't take an adult swim class. Swimming skills might save their life someday, or allow them to save another's life, and all that jazz, but it's like preaching to a rock.

Hibiscus09
01-26-2003, 08:12 PM
Hey, I swim very well! :)

edster951
01-26-2003, 10:08 PM
Originally posted by Hibiscus09
Hey, I swim very well! :)
Like a brick!!!!!

IPR
01-26-2003, 10:10 PM
Originally posted by edster951
Like a brick!!!!!
No no.......I've got it, its that style with the head held as high out the water so as not to get the hair or make-up wet :D

Hibiscus09
01-27-2003, 04:17 AM
Hey, I actually do that sometimes, but it's more to keep the contact lenses in the eyes! (and I do not wear makeup swimming!)

IPR
01-27-2003, 03:52 PM
I have an idea for a method to checking body fat changes.

Sit down on a chair, breath out and lean forward (as if puting on your socks, but not all the way).

Now look at your abs area, from sternum to belly button. Count the number of creases or folds in the skin/fat.

The number of folds is inversely proportional to the amount of fat, so as you lose body fat so the number increases.

Got to be as accurate as any other method ;)

Now all I have to do is work out some complex formula that can kid people into believing its very scientific ...... ummm :rolleyes:

TrishB
01-27-2003, 04:14 PM
IPR....you are just excited cause you got a 6 pack now! :D

So the more folds you have, the better it is??
LOL...I know you are just making it up, but it still sounds good to me. :)

gbat
01-27-2003, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by IPR
I have an idea for a method to checking body fat changes.

Sit down on a chair, breath out and lean forward (as if puting on your socks, but not all the way).

Now look at your abs area, from sternum to belly button. Count the number of creases or folds in the skin/fat.

The number of folds is inversely proportional to the amount of fat, so as you lose body fat so the number increases.

Got to be as accurate as any other method ;)

Now all I have to do is work out some complex formula that can kid people into believing its very scientific ...... ummm :rolleyes:

Good idea. I know I have made some progress becouse I have just purchased string tie shoes. Before I had to get quick velcro ties because the bending over to tie would put unue strain on my eyes to stay in their sockets. :eek: :D

MagicMel
01-28-2003, 08:28 AM
...I know you are just making it up, but it still sounds good to me.

Actually, I don't think he is making it up.
I am sitting here, bending over, and sure enough I have only 1 fold. The one between my belly hanging over my thighs!! Got to be some truth in that. We'll see when I start cutting in March.

IPR
01-28-2003, 04:05 PM
I did make it up, but I believe its true. :D

Whenever I would sit in the bath I would notice how the folds appeared in my stomach area. Then, just the other day, I noticed how different it was now, many much smaller creases. I think logically it makes sense, try it and see ;)

edster951
01-28-2003, 09:09 PM
I just looked down and noticed I'm a male!!!!!!!

Where did that loose bit come from??????

IPR
01-28-2003, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by edster951
I just looked down and noticed I'm a male!!!!!!!

:D Don't kid yourself......its just loose skin ;)

edster951
01-28-2003, 10:20 PM
Originally posted by IPR
:D Don't kid yourself......its just loose skin ;)
Buggar!! :D

davidrthompson
01-29-2003, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by MooreGuy
The health club I go to has a machine that shoots a laser into your bicep and gives you a reading of your fat weight, lean (fat free) weight, total body water and your BMI. It's highly accurate and gives you a good idea of your over all body composition. Not only that but it doesn't take more than a minute and you don't have to get wet. My health club charges $10 for it.

Above I called it a laser but I'm pretty sure that's not the correct name. If anyone can give him more accurate name/info please do it. If no one else adds anything I'm sure you can call around to some local health clubs and they will know exactly what I'm talking about.

I believe you're talking about near-infrared interactance. See

http://www.futrex.com/f6100.html and

http://www.zelcore.com/futrex.htm

TrishB
01-29-2003, 03:11 PM
Originally posted by edster951
I just looked down and noticed I'm a male!!!!!!!

Where did that loose bit come from??????

LMAO :D