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Tuscan
08-20-2002, 02:11 PM
I've been reading up on all the fat-burners out there and getting confused. What do you all think is the best fat - burner out there? Is it just a straight CEA stack? Any help would be apprecaited.

Tuscan
08-20-2002, 02:24 PM
bump- anyone- I know you guys have an option on this.

biggdave
08-20-2002, 10:26 PM
hears my adivice. Go back to the "supplement" forum page. This is where it gets tricky, go to the SEARCH BOX at the lower left corner of the page and put your question in there. see now was it really that hard. using this method in all you posts will save you the type Flaming your are receving right now in the future.

windows250279
08-21-2002, 05:28 AM
dnp, but its very harsh, and needs a lot of research on b4 even thinking about trying it

arb
08-21-2002, 05:58 AM
i tried yohimburn before.... its a topical product so is a bit of a pain to use, but it worked fairly well although i had to use it for ten days straight before seeing any results.

rippedskeletor
08-21-2002, 08:38 AM
like windows said, dnp is the best...by far. but the sides make it less desireable than others. usnic acid is pretty damn good too. it's like dnp, but not as strong.

Judo
08-21-2002, 08:43 AM
you don't need to recommending DNP in the supps section, it is a drug and therefore doesn't need to be discussed here. Discuss it in the steroid forum.
Good fatburners include your typical ECA, Yohimbe, NYC, SU/UA, and/or Lipoderm Y. For non-stimulants, you have Metabolic Thyrolean, MM4, XXX, Xenadrine EFX, etc....

Dezzil
08-21-2002, 09:03 AM
Originally posted by Judo
you don't need to recommending DNP in the supps section, it is a drug and therefore doesn't need to be discussed here.

Most supplements are also drugs.

Judo
08-21-2002, 10:05 AM
Originally posted by Dezzil


Most supplements are also drugs.

for the most part, what is considered a "drug" and what is considered a "supplement" is pretty obvious. It is also common sense to know what is discussed in the supplement section and what is not.

Nutz
08-21-2002, 11:25 AM
DNP is technicaly illegal, which may have been what you ment. UA and SU work in pretty much the same way, there just less potent. many supplements are drugs ( ECA is a drug by definition) but I do see your point why DNP is better in the 'roids room :)

I'd say start with ECA and maybe ALA , when you can nearly see your ab's ( if that swhat your going for) then maybe add some lipoderm-y.

if you still have problems consider SU / UA if you consider the possible chance they could be carcinogenic worth it. Personaly, I figure that many, many chemicals Im exposed to daily are carcinogens and a small dose of UA for maybe three / four weeks of a year with plenty of anti-oxidents is worth the risk

RoughN_Tough
08-21-2002, 01:03 PM
Technically meaning it is illegal to be used for consumption. It is perfectly legal as an industrial dye or explosve stabilizer

97LT1
08-21-2002, 01:51 PM
Why do people keep saying DNP??!! It is utter bull****. If someone is asking about a fatburner, are you people so ****ing narrow minded to keep even typing it? Does it ever cross any of your minds that this may be his first time using a fatburner period? Name a fatburner available to him which has the less side effects!! Maybe something he can order of Bodybuilding. com??!!!!!
:mad:X1000


Right now, Xenadrine is the most effective ECA stack. A NYC stack(Nor-ephedrine,caffiene, and yohimbe) is another effective fatburner. TriCuts, is a N/Y stack, but you could add 100mgs per tablet of TriCuts to make it even more effective. If this is your first time taking an ECA, i would suggest that you always start at half the maximum dosage, and work your way up to the full dosage in a period of a few weeks.

aprildawn
08-21-2002, 02:24 PM
Yeah. I don't think you guys should be recommending DNP to a person who calls an ECA stack a CEA stack. Maybe a typo. :)

Tuscan: Bump 97s advice (once again today). Also, different people swear by different fat burners so it's kind of a personal thing. More importantly, get your diet in check first.

J-Rod
08-21-2002, 02:28 PM
The most effective ECA stack on the market is Pyroclen

1 cap gives you:

20mg of Ephedrine alkaloids
200mg of Caffeine anhydrous
100mg of Aspirin USP

100 caps under $14 here at bb.com

J-Rod
08-21-2002, 02:42 PM
I am sorry, it sells for $14.98 for 100 servings. It is recommended to use 2 to 3 servings daily. Most importatant to get your diet clean, train with weights and add in cardio. Then kick it up a notch with an ECA. ECA can be enhanced with Thyroidal compounds or other metabolic modulators such as Forskolin. Some people will add guggulsterones as well. I have not seen much added bonus from Guggul. ECA is not for everyone. Play around with your servings and remeber to eat. They will kill your appetite almost immediately.

Blindfaith
08-21-2002, 03:07 PM
i personally like stacker2, xenedrine, and homemade e/c/a along with some usnic acid and yohimbee.

They will all work good if ur diet is top noch!

cheers

Dante B.
08-21-2002, 03:18 PM
Originally posted by J-Rod
The most effective ECA stack on the market is Pyroclen

1 cap gives you:

20mg of Ephedrine alkaloids
200mg of Caffeine anhydrous
100mg of Aspirin USP


I would hardly call that the most effective ECA stack. It is just that, ECA. However, it is at a good price (so it is certainly one of the most economical). I have used it before, and rather liked it (5 caps per day, served me quite well :) ).

DaddyR
08-21-2002, 04:04 PM
The ANSWER to the QUESTION which was asked is DNP. I didn't see it being RECOMMENDED that he TAKE the stuff! I saw appropriate cautionary statements being made along with the answer being given. That was, before people started ripping into those who gave the correct answer to the friggin' question.

After that, it was all the typical "don't say this" and "how dare you say that" B.S.

And since when was Judo made a Moderator, to decide for everyone what is taboo here? DNP is not a steroid, so who's to say it cannot be discussed here?

97LT1
08-21-2002, 04:10 PM
I can state how i feel. Just like you can. The question was also about which was the best fat burner.

It is not taboo here. It rarely gets discussed on this section. It is better suited to be asked on the Steroid forum, where members who post there often could give more complete answers unlike ours.

TTT
08-21-2002, 04:11 PM
the sure-fire way to lose weight:

1. wake up
2. make coffee
3. drink coffee (not the whole pot).
4. go run (at least a couple miles per day - if you can't run do some other intense form of cardio).
5. do this in the morning & at night (try to lay off the coffee at night).

of course there are a ton of supps out there that will "assist" you in your effort to shed some lbs., but the best way will always be just some fresh, hot coffee & lots of running.

J-Rod
08-21-2002, 04:56 PM
Originally posted by dantebattista


I would hardly call that the most effective ECA stack. It is just that, ECA. However, it is at a good price (so it is certainly one of the most economical). I have used it before, and rather liked it (5 caps per day, served me quite well :) ).

In regards to effectiveness ECA is ECA and other thermogenic formulas are such. Pyroclen is ECA. So it is in my honest, but obviously biased opinion, your best option for a thermogenic ECA stack considering price/effectiveness is Pyroclen. It is not guarana or willow bark bark, as you obviously know it contains pure caffeine and aspirin, preventing variances that will occur in herbal extracts.

The original version introduced back in '97 had pure ephedrine HCl. Obviously we have barriers with this and use Ma Huang extract. Anyway it is not fancy but it kicks and the price/quality is right.

5 a day. Right now I am using 3 Pyroclen and 3 Hollywood (NYC), 1 of each three times a day. I like this best for thermogenisis.

navymuscle
08-21-2002, 05:20 PM
I like how everyone jumped all of these guys for saying that DNP is the best fat burner. Well guys it IS THE BEST FAT BURNER hands down. That is there opinion, and thats the truth. For someone who isn't that versed in fat burners I'd say ECA stack, lipoderm-y, thyro-cuts 2.

J-Rod
08-21-2002, 05:30 PM
Originally posted by navymuscle
I like how everyone jumped all of these guys for saying that DNP is the best fat burner. Well guys it IS THE BEST FAT BURNER hands down. That is there opinion, and thats the truth. For someone who isn't that versed in fat burners I'd say ECA stack, lipoderm-y, thyro-cuts 2.

I am not doubting the efficacy of DNP. It is just health/safety concerns. Is It Worth The Risk. And this should be asked about ECA, Yohimbine, Steroidals etc....

Bobo
08-21-2002, 06:44 PM
A good diet....


Sorry, I just had too... :D

dio
08-21-2002, 07:05 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR
DNP is not a steroid, so who's to say it cannot be discussed here?

This is a supplement board with the unspoken rule that all products be OTC and legally accessable. Certain acessable drugs like nolva, clomid etc really don't push this boundary but DNP and Finaplex definitely cross the line.

Nutz
08-21-2002, 11:38 PM
I agree, a lot of newbies will be coming here hopeing for a quick fix. DNP can be that, but if they dont know themselves and there bodys as well as most of the regulers here they could be asking for trouble. DNP isnt easy to get hold of , which is just as well, but I dont think it should be mentioned unless they obviously know there stuff, and it is best kept a 'secret' and idealy to the steroid section.

Judo
08-22-2002, 05:09 AM
Originally posted by DaddyR
And since when was Judo made a Moderator, to decide for everyone what is taboo here? DNP is not a steroid, so who's to say it cannot be discussed here?

Never said I was a mod. This is the supplement section. To most DNP is not considered a "supplement" It is more often discussed in the Steroid Forum. I am free to speak my opinion and that is my OPINION.

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 06:25 AM
Originally posted by Judo
Discuss it in the steroid forum.

Somehow that just didn't sound like an opinion to me.

In my opinion, it would have been better to give the guy more detailed information about WHY dnp is not the thing to be taking, with a lot less emotion. Speaking of attacking others' opinions, I suggest you consider that I am most p!ssed about the attacks on the two who dared to express their opinion that dnp is the best (by which they clearly mean "most powerful" rather than best choice for this guy).

Unspoken rules, being unspoken, need to be communicated with less fury. Please try to refrain from assuming that everybody agrees with you as to exactly what is a supp and what is a steroid and what is allowed for diswcussion and what is verboten. There are gray areas, and I believe this is one of them.

I believe the comparison that was made to Fina is a bad one. Fina is rarely discussed here, though when someone does mention it they are not usually attacked for doing so. Detailed discussion and recommendations regarding Fina are more appropriate to the Steroids forum because, . . . hmmm let's see: it IS a steroid!

As for drugs vs. supps argument, I basically agree with Dezzil and Nutz. We freely talk about UA and SU here, though they certainly have no nutritive value and act in the same manner as dnp. I think the distinction you're attempting to make is more one of legality. While the illegality of dnp should indeed be mentioned, I just don't think it ought to be used as a grounds for censoring anyone's speech.

Bobo
08-22-2002, 07:21 AM
I trust you don't know the difference in penalties in shipping DNP than UA/SU (which is legal). To me its just common sense.

kyser
08-22-2002, 08:55 AM
Originally posted by Tuscan
I've been reading up on all the fat-burners out there and getting confused. What do you all think is the best fat - burner out there? Is it just a straight CEA stack? Any help would be apprecaited.

'cmon guys re- read the man's question and then ask yourself if he really wanted to hear about DNP. Somehow I reeeaaallly doubt it! :)

Judo
08-22-2002, 09:38 AM
Originally posted by kyser


'cmon guys re- read the man's question and then ask yourself if he really wanted to hear about DNP. Somehow I reeeaaallly doubt it! :)

I agree completely, it'd be like someone coming on the supplement board asking "hey guys, is that andro stuff that Mark McGwire took good for bulking" and then someone tells him "No Sustanon or anadrol is best" Well OBVIOUSLY! But someone with 2 posts who puts down CEA instead of ECA is a newbie and really IMO shouldn't even have the idea of DNP put in his head right now.

Bobo
08-22-2002, 09:42 AM
I think we all understand this now....Now lets move on and flame some other people...:D

Judo
08-22-2002, 09:46 AM
you suck Bobo, you ass clown, I bet you use creatine serum and buy all your PH's from SDI-Labs.... :)

John Benz
08-22-2002, 10:21 AM
Originally posted by 97LT1
Why do people keep saying DNP??!! It is utter bull****. If someone is asking about a fatburner, are you people so ****ing narrow minded to keep even typing it? Does it ever cross any of your minds that this may be his first time using a fatburner period? Name a fatburner available to him which has the less side effects!! Maybe something he can order of Bodybuilding. com??!!!!!
:mad:X1000

Right now, Xenadrine is the most effective ECA stack. A NYC stack(Nor-ephedrine,caffiene, and yohimbe) is another effective fatburner. TriCuts, is a N/Y stack, but you could add 100mgs per tablet of TriCuts to make it even more effective. If this is your first time taking an ECA, i would suggest that you always start at half the maximum dosage, and work your way up to the full dosage in a period of a few weeks.

97LT1 and Judo, you guys are 100% correct. Anyone recommending dnp needs their head examined. DaddyR, enough of your protests against people offering helpful advice, especially pertaining to dangerous and lethal drugs.I just posted the following dnp info in another thread. I re-post it now:

DNP has been around since the turn of the century. Although not used as a diet aid or weight loss supplement to begin with, it was eventually found to be a very effective weight loss drug. It is an industrial chemical first being used to ignite TNT in the 1900's. It has also been used as a bug pesticide (melting the bug from the inside out), fabric dye and then a Stanford University study showed that it caused significant weight loss and has been used for that purpose since the 1930's. Hitler used it in the concentration camps during World War 2 to keep prisoners warm during the winter without the need for heating the buildings.
DNP is a mitochondrial uncoupler of oxidative phosphorylation, boosting the metabolism up to 50% by inhibition of the FOF1 ATP synthesis molecule located in the inner wall of mitochondria. As a result, ATP production is dramatically reduced and the energy is turned into heat. A 30- 50% increase in metabolic rate makes this the 'mother' of all fat burners. Compared to other thermogenic compounds such as ephedrine/aspirin/caffeine (ECA) which has a boost of about 3% and clenbuterol /cytomel which has a boost of about 10%.
Unlike clen/t3 and ECA, DNP won't boost body temperature to the same degree. DNP will only cause an increase of 1-1.5 degree Celsius. DNP competes with the thyroid for carrier proteins. Even though Thyroid Stimulating Hormone (STH) and free thyroid levels maybe normal, they are being excreted instead of being used. To extend the length of a DNP cycle, T3 could be added, but most people don't absorb T3 very well, which causes levels of T3 to become way too high. Therefore, it is ill advised and not recommended. It is better to use it on a rotating 8-day cycle with a 7 day off period. During this 2 week period you will look best on the 14th day after the water being retained is dropped. T3 in the amount of 25-50 mcg per day during the off week will also help restore normal thyroid levels.
The main problem with DNP use is the severity of side effects. Since there are no negative feedback loops to deal with possible overdose, there is no limit to how hot you can make your body. Death is a definite possibility if too much is used. The "more is better"rule does not pertain to this drug. Side effects include insomnia, yellow body fluids (urine, sweat, sperm etc.), muscle soreness (reps during workouts will need to be kept light with at least 15 reps), overheating, carcinogenesis, (although DNP has never been associated with cancer) discomfort, lethargy, sweating, carb cravings, stroke, kidney damage, brain damage, and DEATH. These are all very possible as the lethal dose is only four times that of the normal dose.
This drug is not anorectic so you will be hungry on DNP. Ten percent of some users experience allergic reactions (hives, blisters, rashes etc.) and a .1% of users get cataracts. DNP users will also feel lethargic due to the glucose being transferred into the cells without the use of insulin.
Dosages were put after the side effects because this is a chemical that is not forgiving and it is more important that everyone understands what the side effects are before trying to acquire DNP and use it. Doses range between 2-8mgs/kg of body weight, NOT lean body mass. It's best dosed at 200mgs/d for someone in an active type job (landscaper, construction worker etc.), 400-600mgs/d for most others and only 800mgs/d for the morbidly obese. Although doses at 1gm/d have been used they are not recommend. DNP has an accumulative affect due to its 36-hour half-life. When users don?t feel their body temperature rise, DO NOT INCREASE DOSAGE. 30mg/kg are the lethal dose and are very possible if the dose is above 800mgs/d.

Bobo
08-22-2002, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by Judo
you suck Bobo, you ass clown, I bet you use creatine serum and buy all your PH's from SDI-Labs.... :)

yeah, so!!!! I also buy from vpx so there.....:D

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 02:17 PM
Originally posted by John Benz
DaddyR, enough of your protests against people offering helpful advice, especially pertaining to dangerous and lethal drugs.

John, in this case, enough of your ignorance!

Open your eyes and READ, for heaven's sake! My protest was and is against people attacking the two guys who expressed their opinions, daring to mention dnp! With Judo trying to kick the whole thread off of the forum, and 97LT1 going postal on them for daring to mention dnp (talk about narrow-minded), I was pissed!

Your opinions regarding dnp are good, valid, and I agree with them almost entirely. But as much as I may or may not agree with your opinions, I do NOT support attacks against those who hold a different view.

I'm beginning to wonder how many foks here are simply incapable of providing a rational explanation for their opinions. It's easy, but also ignorant and cowardly to simply flame someone for holding an opinion with which you disagree. You won't change anyone's mind by attacking them, but sometimes, if you have a good rational basis for your views, you can actually have a positive influence on someone.

97LT1
08-22-2002, 02:25 PM
Mark my words DaddyR.

Anyone suggesting DNP as a way to lose unwanted bodyfat to someone who obviously has had no experience with any type of stimulant(determined by the post or thread) will get the strongest type of response from me.

And spin away, my friend. I don't care if DNP is mention as part of a discussion. But when it is directed to someone new to dieting and such, my previous response will be the same as stated above.

I mean really, it's not the best choice of fatburner anyway.

97LT1
08-22-2002, 02:27 PM
And don't generalize me as a typical board flammer.



Everyone here knows i'm not.

dio
08-22-2002, 02:35 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


John, in this case, enough of your ignorance!

Open your eyes and READ, for heaven's sake! My protest was and is against people attacking the two guys who expressed their opinions, daring to mention dnp! With Judo trying to kick the whole thread off of the forum, and 97LT1 going postal on them for daring to mention dnp (talk about narrow-minded), I was pissed!

Your opinions regarding dnp are good, valid, and I agree with them almost entirely. But as much as I may or may not agree with your opinions, I do NOT support attacks against those who hold a different view.



Judo, John and 97lt are right: there is no place for DNP on this board. There is a steroid board for such things, with people who have already made up their minds about which way they swing.

This is a supp board and I don't think it's a stretch to limit it to legal supps. There are far too many impressionable people on this board to treat DNP as an acceptable avenue. It's hard enough talking teens out of prohormones.

I respect you DaddyR, but you're wrong here. I also did see any flames in their posts.

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 02:39 PM
I must say that it is flat-out irresponsible to recommend DNP to a newbie.

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 02:40 PM
Originally posted by dio


It's hard enough talking teens out of prohormones.



He has a good point, well said dio.

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by 97LT1
And don't generalize me as a typical board flammer.

Everyone here knows i'm not.

Including me, which left me wondering what the heck was wrong with you. Just made me want to smack you upside the head all the harder.

I'm not disagreeing with your opinions re dnp. I'm disagreeing with your conduct. If that's a problem, I can guarantee you we'll be in conflict again.

P.S. - Hmmm . . . Better watch out, or I'll come over there with my 3.8 liter stock Camaro and challenge you to a gas mileage competition LOL!

:D

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 02:53 PM
Originally posted by Supa Freek 420
I must say that it is flat-out irresponsible to recommend DNP to a newbie.

NOBODY RECOMMENDED DNP TO ANY NEWBIE!

Can't you people READ?

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


NOBODY RECOMMENDED DNP TO ANY NEWBIE!

Can't you people READ?

Sorry about the verbage, DaddyR.

Let me change that to it is flat-out irresponsible to even put that in a newbie's head.

Judo
08-22-2002, 03:05 PM
it may not have been a flat out recommendation, but by answering his question "Whats the best fat-burner" with saying "DNP", that is just going to make most think, "well den, dats whud dem der fellers say'd is da best, so I giss I gotta git me sum of dat" Granted the guy may not be a southern backwoods redneck:) , but still, If I didn't know better and didn't know how to use the search button or was just plain lazy, I would have taken those answers as a recommendation.

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by dio
Judo, John and 97lt are right: there is no place for DNP on this board. There is a steroid board for such things, with people who have already made up their minds about which way they swing.

This is a supp board and I don't think it's a stretch to limit it to legal supps. There are far too many impressionable people on this board to treat DNP as an acceptable avenue. It's hard enough talking teens out of prohormones.

I respect you DaddyR, but you're wrong here. I also did see any flames in their posts.

Dio,

If you're going to quote one of my posts, at least respond to <b>it</b>, not some other statement I made! In the only part of your message that is relevant, I think you intended to say that you didn't see any flames in their posts. Well, okay, but I did. I don't know how you could NOT call 97LT1's first post on this thread a flame. Totally out of character for him and therefore all the more shocking.

I couldn't give a damn whether you agree with their opinions. They are not what I was criticizing. As for you dictating the content of this forum, I've already told Judo what I think about that. . . . "which way they swing" - how comical! Rather than dumbing down our discussions, maybe we need to get rid of the kiddies who are so impressionable that they need to be TOLD what to do rather than given a good reason why they shouldn't, if there really are any here.

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 03:10 PM
Originally posted by Supa Freek 420
Let me change that to it is flat-out irresponsible to even put that in a newbie's head.

If I were a newbie, I would feel very insulted!

All of this smacks of paternalism. Which just doesn't work.

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 03:12 PM
Originally posted by Judo
"well den, dats whud dem der fellers say'd is da best, so I giss I gotta git me sum of dat"

Well gee willickers mister JU-DO! I wish I wuz as good wif dem dere wurdz as yous is! :D

But seriously, my point exactly.

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 03:15 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


If I were a newbie, I would feel very insulted!

All of this smacks of paternalism. Which just doesn't work.

Newbies get insulted all the time! :D
That's what we're here for!

You have a valid point, but all I know is that if this guy went out and actually got some DNP and sufferred some irreversible damage where would we be then?

With ephedrine and PHs already under the microscope the last thing we need as a community is another reason for public outcry against our means.

DaddyR
08-22-2002, 03:23 PM
Originally posted by Supa Freek 420
if this guy went out and actually got some DNP and sufferred some irreversible damage where would we be then?


Extremely unlikely. Because he would still have been told all of the good reasons why he shouldn't. But I think it would've been done better without all of the ridiculous outcry.

97LT1
08-22-2002, 03:26 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


Including me, which left me wondering what the heck was wrong with you. Just made me want to smack you upside the head all the harder.

I'm not disagreeing with your opinions re dnp. I'm disagreeing with your conduct. If that's a problem, I can guarantee you we'll be in conflict again.

P.S. - Hmmm . . . Better watch out, or I'll come over there with my 3.8 liter stock Camaro and challenge you to a gas mileage competition LOL!

:D LOL!
I can't disagree anymore with you anymore Friend. I have respect for you, and i always will. I flew off the handle. You called me on it, and you were right. My response was not in my usual caliber. Last response on this subject.

Keith

97LT1
08-22-2002, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


Extremely unlikely. Because he would still have been told all of the good reasons why he shouldn't. But I think it would've been done better without all of the ridiculous outcry. Bump.

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 03:36 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


Extremely unlikely. Because he would still have been told all of the good reasons why he shouldn't. But I think it would've been done better without all of the ridiculous outcry.

I know it's unlikely, but all the while still possible. And this outcry here is really nothing compared to the media outcry should the unimaginable happen... again.

Case in point... the guy over in the elite boards, I forgot his handle.

I know everybody's not like him, but there may be somebody out there like him.

ndn diablo
08-22-2002, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by Supa Freek 420


Newbies get insulted all the time! :D
That's what we're here for!

You have a valid point, but all I know is that if this guy went out and actually got some DNP and sufferred some irreversible damage where would we be then?

With ephedrine and PHs already under the microscope the last thing we need as a community is another reason for public outcry against our means.

If this guy is infact a newbie then he has no idea what DNP is. He will probabbly end up walking into GNC and asking the clerk if they sell DNP, get smacked upside the head and will end up leaving with some xenadrine in his pocket. I dont feel its that big of a deal if someone said DNP is a good fat burner - because it is. But it is not easily accessible for a newbie or even someone like myself for that matter.

SupaNatural
08-22-2002, 04:19 PM
Yeah I know I go to extremes sometimes. I guess it just stems from my better safe than sorry attitude.

Just my opinion. Guess we'll have to agree to disagree here.

PEACE

Bobo
08-22-2002, 04:47 PM
Originally posted by ndn diablo


asking the clerk if they sell DNP, get smacked upside the head and will end up leaving with some xenadrine in his pocket. I

Nah...They wouldn't have a clue...They're just as clueless...:D

John Benz
08-22-2002, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by Supa Freek 420
You have a valid point, but all I know is that if this guy went out and actually got some DNP and sufferred some irreversible damage where would we be then?

Originally posted by DaddyR
Extremely unlikely. Because he would still have been told all of the good reasons why he shouldn't. But I think it would've been done better without all of the ridiculous outcry.

Originally posted by Supa Freek 420
With ephedrine and PHs already under the microscope the last thing we need as a community is another reason for public outcry against our means.
This has already happened. I pulled a few quotes from a thread posted on July 22, 2002:

Originally posted by SLY
Sh#t is gonna hit the fan! A member over at the Elite Boards has passed away and Business Week wants to run a story on his death focussing on the sale of drugs on the internet. The FDA has gotten involved and is centering its investigation around the guys DNP use. So get ready for alot of headlines on how creatine kills ect. Also for those of you with "cows" be careful when this story hits, things will be watched alot closer for awile. Things like this could lead to a ban on alot of things alot faster.

Originally posted by K (same)
Stupid people not fit for survival. DNP can literally "cook" you inside out. Must be a pretty "well done" corpse :D :D
I have no sympathy for morons like that. Warning about DNP is everywhere.

Originally posted by WHOSYOURDADDY02
While somewhat harsh in a sense... I think that is well said...
It is clear that this person under estimated the power of DNP ...

Originally posted by 2demon2
BTW, he had a physique that very few people in this world will ever attain.

Originally posted by Blacksmith
No one will remember that looking at him lying in his coffin.
Now like it or not DaddyR, a guy with 2 posts, asking about a fat burner is generally regarded as a rank newbie. And the response to his question was dnp. The flames were appropriate, and in fact he deserved a more livid response. If the boy who had a physique that very few people in this world will ever attain can easily under estimate the power of DNP, and die, then to advise a newbie to get dnp is reprehensible. :(

K (same)
08-22-2002, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by TTT
the sure-fire way to lose weight:

1. wake up
2. make coffee
3. drink coffee (not the whole pot).
4. go run (at least a couple miles per day - if you can't run do some other intense form of cardio).
5. do this in the morning & at night (try to lay off the coffee at night).

of course there are a ton of supps out there that will "assist" you in your effort to shed some lbs., but the best way will always be just some fresh, hot coffee & lots of running.

Switch the coffee to protein shake. This is the best advice.

dio
08-22-2002, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


Dio,

If you're going to quote one of my posts, at least respond to <b>it</b>, not some other statement I made! In the only part of your message that is relevant, I think you intended to say that you didn't see any flames in their posts. Well, okay, but I did. I don't know how you could NOT call 97LT1's first post on this thread a flame. Totally out of character for him and therefore all the more shocking.

I couldn't give a damn whether you agree with their opinions. They are not what I was criticizing. As for you dictating the content of this forum, I've already told Judo what I think about that. . . . "which way they swing" - how comical! Rather than dumbing down our discussions, maybe we need to get rid of the kiddies who are so impressionable that they need to be TOLD what to do rather than given a good reason why they shouldn't, if there really are any here.

I responded to the idea in the post -- if you want me to draw you a diagram I'd be happy to do so.

I don't see why the swing comment is comical, the truth is that there are many impressionable people on these boards young and old. There is a steroid board here for a reason. I also never recommended dumbing down discussions. I never or bullsh*t anyone. DNP was recommended on a supp board and John's analogy above holds true.

I am not dictating anything to anyone. While there are mods here, it's the experienced members who usually determine what is discussed here. That means they have a certain amount of responsibilty.

I would have thought you would realize this but it seems you are too busy balancing the chip on your shoulder.

K (same)
08-22-2002, 07:38 PM
No need to fight among us, guys.

John and others are extremely cautious against the risk associated with DNP, and rightfully so.

DaddyR is not discounting the risk of DNP neither. He just wants it to be discussed and presented as a matter of fact.

DNP may be be the most potent fatburner , but also the one with the highest health risk. I don't think anyone dispute that point.

dio
08-22-2002, 07:42 PM
Originally posted by K (same)
No need to fight among us, guys.

John and others are extremely cautious against the risk associated with DNP, and rightfully so.

DaddyR is not discounting the risk of DNP neither. He just wants it to be discussed and presented as a matter of fact.

DNP may be be the most potent fatburner , but also the one with the highest health risk. I don't think anyone dispute that point.

There's nothing wrong with discussing it in the proper place. I have no problem with it on this steroid board or any other.

Clintdogg
08-22-2002, 07:46 PM
O/T where in maryland do u live daddy R

Clintdogg
08-23-2002, 09:51 AM
^^^^^ bump

DaddyR
08-23-2002, 10:57 AM
Clintdogg, check your PMs. Especially after pissing everybody off in this thread, being a single dad and all, I didn't want to get more specific on the public forum. Probably just being overly paranoid.

DaddyR
08-23-2002, 11:07 AM
Thanks for stepping in, K! I guess this time it was your turn to try to make peace.

I could respond to some what has been said since my last post, but I think you've summarized my basic concerns well enough, and I'm willing to let it all slide this time. :D

John Benz
08-23-2002, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by DaddyR
Clintdogg, check your PMs. Especially after pissing everybody off in this thread, being a single dad and all, I didn't want to get more specific on the public forum. Probably just being overly paranoid.
DaddyR,

This was simply a disagreement between outspoken hardheaded prople. I still have great respect for you and usually share most of your views. In fact I apologize for letting my temper get the best of me. Anyone who would threaten you because of conflicting viewpoints on a supp board doesn't even belong here. While I feel you are wrong in taking the stance you took, I hope we are still friends, and can agree not to let a few diametrically opposing viewpoints ruin that.

Your friend,
John

SupaNatural
08-23-2002, 11:30 AM
Originally posted by DaddyR
Clintdogg, check your PMs. Especially after pissing everybody off in this thread, being a single dad and all, I didn't want to get more specific on the public forum. Probably just being overly paranoid.

DaddyR,

I don't know specifically who you feel you pissed off, but if in my posts my tone was anything close to threatening I apologize. Like Benz said it was just a heated discussion between hardheaded people.

PEACE

DaddyR
08-23-2002, 11:41 AM
To be honest I worry more about those who may be lurking. I likewise respect you guys, even dio :D

The problem with open message boards is that there's always a chance some wacko could come across your post and decide you will be his next victim. Any discusssion where emotions run high just increases the likelihood of getting somebody riled up who may not be able to handle their emotions so well.

K (same)
08-23-2002, 01:26 PM
:) Everything is cool, guys. :) Reasonable people can and do disagree on issues.

dio
08-23-2002, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR
To be honest I worry more about those who may be lurking. I likewise respect you guys, even dio :D

The problem with open message boards is that there's always a chance some wacko could come across your post and decide you will be his next victim. Any discusssion where emotions run high just increases the likelihood of getting somebody riled up who may not be able to handle their emotions so well.

You mean it would have been wrong to put you on a few mailing lists? :D

DaddyR
08-23-2002, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by dio
You mean it would have been wrong to put you on a few mailing lists? :D

That depends on what they were. I'll let you know what I think LOL!

dio
08-23-2002, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by DaddyR


That depends on what they were. I'll let you know what I think LOL!

Well I thought I'd introduce you to my good friend Jeff Summers for starters... ;)

DaddyR
08-23-2002, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by dio
Well I thought I'd introduce you to my good friend Jeff Summers for starters... ;)

Hey! But I'm straight - I did mention I've got kids, didn't I? Bartman/Jeffyboy wouldn't get very far with me.

I think he's more interested in seducing young, innocent, impressionable boys with his pseudointellectualism.

brooklyn mike
08-23-2002, 07:13 PM
yo i need a good fat burner i am totally stupid when it comes to this since i have never used one before, i dont wanna get really complicated or spend a rediculous amount of money and i dont have a credit card so i need sumthing i can buy in like gnc or vitamin shop or vitamin world ..i could order online if i ask some one to order it for me so inless that is absolutily neccesary can some one recomend somethign good and cheep?...thanks...

K (same)
08-23-2002, 07:56 PM
Try RUNNING!! It is free!! And it works.

dio
08-24-2002, 10:56 AM
Originally posted by DaddyR


Hey! But I'm straight - I did mention I've got kids, didn't I? Bartman/Jeffyboy wouldn't get very far with me.

I think he's more interested in seducing young, innocent, impressionable boys with his pseudointellectualism.

Hmm, I thought we were talking about mailing lists -- once you're on his you're on for life. I don't know what you had in mind...

Admittedly, I've never read his materials, but he never struck me as a pseudo intellectual. You need some brains to be one of those.

jasonl
08-24-2002, 12:05 PM
Try adding in some CLA....

fonzo
01-13-2003, 04:43 PM
Can you tell me what dnp is and how it works? Also, can you tell me what SU/UA is and how it is similar to dnp and how well it works compared to dnp? Thanks.

John Benz
01-13-2003, 05:22 PM
Just read the entire thread and your dnp questions will all be answered. Then use the search buttom to look for usnic acid. Several lengthy threads on this.