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View Full Version : Scientists find new face on Turin shroud



aserecuba
04-15-2004, 07:41 PM
interesting.

MILAN, Italy (Reuters) -- Italian scientists have found a matching image of a man's face and possibly his hands on the back of the Turin shroud, believed by many to be the burial cloth of Jesus Christ, one of the researchers said on Thursday.

The discovery that the ghostly image on the back of the linen cloth matches the face that adorns the front is likely to reignite debate over whether the shroud is genuine or a skilful medieval fraud.

"The fact that the image is two-sided makes any forgery difficult," Professor Giulio Fanti of the University of Padua told Reuters.

The findings of Fanti and Roberto Maggiolo, both from the university's department of mechanical engineering, were published this week by a journal of the Institute of Physics in London.

Fanti said the discovery would support those who maintain the cloth is genuine.

The shroud, one of Christianity's most sacred but most disputed relics, is a piece of linen some 14 feet long and 3 feet 7 inches wide.

It first appeared in France in the 14th century and has been held in the Italian city of Turin since 1578.

For over 600 years the debate has raged over the origin of the image of a tall, bearded man bearing the marks of crucifixion that can be seen on the front of the shroud.

Experts over the years say they have found traces of blood, pollen or soil typical of Jerusalem, where Christians believe Jesus was crucified.

But 15 years ago three separate laboratories said carbon dating indicated the shroud was no older than the 13th or 14th century. Researchers concluded the shroud was a hoax created for the hugely profitable medieval pilgrimage business.

While the front of the shroud has been studied intensively over the years, the back had remained hidden under a piece of Holland cloth which was sewn by nuns to cover up damage caused by a fire.

That protective layer was removed in 2002 for restoration and the back of the cloth was photographed.


Some say the figure's hands bear the marks of crucifixion.
The two scientists said they studied these photographs and used mathematical and optical techniques to process the images.

They found that the face that can be seen on the reverse of the shroud matches that of the front.

"We can detect the presence of a nose, eyes, hair, beard and moustache on the back surface that correspond in place, form, position and scale to those of the front," Fanti said.

Speculation has also grown over who created the image. One theory maintains it was the work of Leonardo da Vinci, who pioneered an early photograph technique and put his own face on the shroud.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/science/04/15/italy.shroud.reut/index.html

aserecuba
04-15-2004, 08:41 PM
cat got your tongue?

aserecuba
04-16-2004, 09:42 AM
aparently

matpal
04-16-2004, 09:51 AM
Intersting indeed. I personally have not made up my mind on the shroud, but I do know that our faith should not rest in relics but on the finished work of Christ.

Ragnarok
04-16-2004, 11:04 AM
Someone must have seen the recent release about the Shroud of Turin, either on Dicovery Channel, or History channel.

I have always believed it was a forgery. In the show, there was a scientist that duplicated the techniques purported to have been used to make the image.

It would require a solution of silver (the shroud has never been tested for this), a lens, lights source, and, of course, a corpse. (Or someone willing to stand motionless for 4 - 5 days.)

The light was bounced off the body (in this case it was a plastic dummy). The cloth and body were held motionless over a period of four days. At the end, there was an image of the "body" on the cloth, which was much more vibrant when viewed through a camera. It also produced a negative on the cloth (same as the Shroud), so when a photographic negative of the cloth is viewed, what you see is a positive image.

aserecuba
04-16-2004, 05:22 PM
Originally posted by Ragnarok
Someone must have seen the recent release about the Shroud of Turin, either on Dicovery Channel, or History channel.

I have always believed it was a forgery. In the show, there was a scientist that duplicated the techniques purported to have been used to make the image.

It would require a solution of silver (the shroud has never been tested for this), a lens, lights source, and, of course, a corpse. (Or someone willing to stand motionless for 4 - 5 days.)

The light was bounced off the body (in this case it was a plastic dummy). The cloth and body were held motionless over a period of four days. At the end, there was an image of the "body" on the cloth, which was much more vibrant when viewed through a camera. It also produced a negative on the cloth (same as the Shroud), so when a photographic negative of the cloth is viewed, what you see is a positive image.
read the article again. just because you can duplicate something doesnt mean its fake. and now they found a second face on the back of the shroud so it would be practically impossible that this is a forgery

Smitty26
04-17-2004, 01:20 PM
I dont know if this is the same shroud that I saw on the History channel..but that one they thought it was made by DaVinci or something? It looks like his self portrait..also it had a 6'0 man resembling a white male and from what we're learning in Religion class at my school it's unlikely..I'll talk to my teacher about it. He also had straight looking hair on this shroud and in the gospels it said he had hair like a sheep's..much like an "afro"