PDA

View Full Version : Bulk or cut



TheLeanDreamer
08-16-2015, 06:38 AM
I'm sorry if this is in the wrong section. I've been lurking on BB for several months now, but never actually posted anything. This seemed like the most appropriate section.

I used to be pretty fat, lost a lot of weight, gained a bit of muscle. I'm now 6"0 and 141 pounds, around 14-15% bf I think?
It's really hard to measure. I'm trying to see my abs for the first time, but I'm starting to doubt if I should continue cutting. I don't want to become underweight.

I'm starting to consider bulking, but I really don't want to gain a lot of fat again. When I was fat I felt miserable, and I'm comfortable now but I want to put on some more muscle mass. Would going on a clean bulk work? I'll explain below.

I'm planning to eat 500 calories above my TDEE on workout days, and 100 above my TDEE on non-workout days. I'll also be using carb cycling. I read that by doing this, fat gain should be minimal. I'm planning to bulk up to 155-160 pounds, then cut down and see if my physique has improved. I'll keep doing small bulking and cutting periods until I'm satisfied with my physique, and I'll probably go on a bigger bulk after that.

My workout schedule looks like this:

Monday - Chest: 3 Exercises/Triceps: 3 Exercises/Shoulders: 2 Exercises
Tuesday - Biceps: 3 Exercises/ Back: 4 Exercises/Abs: 3 Exercises
Wednesday - Legs: 4-5 Exercises
Thursday - Chest: 3 Exercises/Triceps: 3 Exercises/Shoulders: 2 Exercises
Friday: Biceps: 3 Exercises/ Back: 4 Exercises/Abs: 3 Exercises
Saturday & Sunday: Off

Big 3 lifts:

Bench - 88lbs
Squat - 110lbs
Deadlift - ??? (haven't figured out my max deadlift yet)

Would it be a bad idea to keep cutting to see those abs and go on a bulk after that, or should I start clean bulking right now?
Also, would the clean bulk I described above work for minimal fat gain?


Thanks in advance.

sevenhm
08-16-2015, 06:51 AM
There's no need to eat different on workout/nonworkout or carb cycle. Unless you enjoy doing so. If you think it will promote muscle growth or fat loss that is misguided. Your training routine is inadequate. From what you're describing you would have nothing to cut to so being in a deficit wouldn't be your best interest. Follow the guide below. Please post a picture if possible to give more specific advice.


Calculate your calories using the stickies below or IIFYM Calculator (http://iifym.com/iifym-calculator)
Apply a 10% deficit or surplus to your total intake based on your goal.
Make adjustments on a 2 week basis. Raise or lower your intake by 100kcal of whichever macronutrient you prefer provided minimum fat and protein requirements are met.
Track your weight daily or weekly at the same time of day for accuracy.
Aim to lose or gain 1-1.5lbs per 2 weeks. More overweight individuals may safely lose up to 2-3lbs per week.
Pick a novice program and be consistent.
To track your macros use an application such as MyFitnessPal (https://www.myfitnesspal.com) , Cron-O-Meter (https://cronometer.com) , MyMacros+ (http://getmymacros.com) , Fitocracy (https://www.fitocracy.com)
Acquire a food scale to accurately track your macros. How to use a food scale Food Scale 101 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Lg5YlIbeT0)


Must read:

Micronutrients matter.

Eating the same thing everyday can deprive you of other micronutrients thus variety in your diet is important.
Dietary fat is essential. The only bad fat is industrial trans fat.
No specific diet is necessary to acquire weight loss. What matters is that you are in a caloric deficit.
Depending on your carb intake when you increase/decrease you may see immediate weight gain or loss do not panic. Do not micromanage your intake per day, instead make adjustments on a 2 week basis.
Women during their menstrual cycle may experience larger swings in water weight do not panic stay the course.
Nutrient timing is largely irrelevant unless you're a serious athlete.
To look up the nutritional content of food head to NutritionData (http://nutritiondata.self.com) , CalorieKing (http://www.calorieking.com) , Caloriecount (http://www.caloriecount.com)
For information regarding vitamins or supplements head to Examine (http://examine.com)
For ideas to compose your own meal plans based on your macros head to Eathismuch (https://www.eatthismuch.com)
Eating tuna everyday is not healthy see spoiler.
EPA Guidelines:
Canned white, or albacore (0.32 parts per million of mercury). Children under six can eat up to one 3-ounce portion a month; children from 6–12, two 4.5-ounce portions a month. Adults, including pregnant women, can safely eat it up to three times a month (women, 6-ounce portions; men, 8-ounce portions).
Canned light — the safer choice (0.12 parts per million of mercury). Children under six can eat up to three 3-ounce portions per month. Older children and adults can safely eat it once a week. But look out for “gourmet” or “tonno” labels. They are made with bigger yellowfin tuna and can contain mercury levels comparable to canned white.
A better alternative is canned salmon (mostly sockeye or pink from Alaska), which is low in contaminants and high in heart-healthy omega-3s. It’s also sustainably caught in Alaska and similarly priced, making it a great choice all around.




Please refer to:
Calculating Calories and Macronutrients (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=156380183)
Nutrition For Newbies & Must Read Threads (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=136691851)
Discretionary Calorie Allowance (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=133634471)
The dirt on clean eating (http://wannabebig.com/diet-and-nutrition/the-dirt-on-clean-eating/)

Novice Programs:
All Pro's Beginner Routine (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=147447933)
Stronglifts 5x5 (http://www.stronglifts.com)
Fierce 5 (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=159678631)
Jason Blaha 5x5 (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=148036063)
Starting Strength (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=998224)
Push/Pull/Legs (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=149807833)


MyFitnesspal starter guide( If you want to learn how to calculate bulk recipes per gram, enters foods you often eat in grams rather than calculate serving size,quick add macros.)
O-x7v5Nc6no rn2bPlA7fMM 8wDMjfUVlcg

Partyrocking
08-16-2015, 06:55 AM
I’d start clean bulking now. If you don’t have abs at 6ft and 140, you won’t have them if you cut any more. Abs require low bf% and enough mass. You just don’t have enough mass right now.

Programmatically, I’d change some things. Given your numbers, I’d get on a beginners routine. You should be hitting each muscle group 3 times a week instead of 1-2.

If you keep the split, you should change the order. Doing back before legs will put a lot of strain on your lower back. I’d switch the order around, by either switching back and chest or putting legs first, then chest, then back. Also, I’d hit legs twice a week, so pull push legs X2 or legs, push, pull x 2, or an upper/lower.

ShyGuyXS
08-16-2015, 08:56 AM
Would it be a bad idea to keep cutting to see those abs and go on a bulk after that

You're not going to see abs until you build more substantial muscle mass. I'd bulk now. At 6'0" and 141, you're already pretty underweight. You could easily bulk up around 30 pounds, IMO.

As for a "clean" bulk, it's basically a slow bulk where you are in a slight surplus and gaining around ~2-3 pounds per month with relatively low fat gain. I'd aim for 10% above TDEE consistently (including rest days) as a starting point.

Cliffs:
- Get on a proven program (the ones sevenhm listed are worth looking into; pick the one you feel suits you the best)
- Start eating more
- Stay consistent with training and nutrition

TheLeanDreamer
08-16-2015, 09:44 AM
You're not going to see abs until you build more substantial muscle mass. I'd bulk now. At 6'0" and 141, you're already pretty underweight. You could easily bulk up around 30 pounds, IMO.

As for a "clean" bulk, it's basically a slow bulk where you are in a slight surplus and gaining around ~2-3 pounds per month with relatively low fat gain. I'd aim for 10% above TDEE consistently (including rest days) as a starting point.

Cliffs:
- Get on a proven program (the ones sevenhm listed are worth looking into; pick the one you feel suits you the best)
- Start eating more
- Stay consistent with training and nutrition

Consistency won't be a problem, I'm very dedicated, and plan to adapt to this lifestyle for the rest of my life. Thanks for the advice


I’d start clean bulking now. If you don’t have abs at 6ft and 140, you won’t have them if you cut any more. Abs require low bf% and enough mass. You just don’t have enough mass right now.

Programmatically, I’d change some things. Given your numbers, I’d get on a beginners routine. You should be hitting each muscle group 3 times a week instead of 1-2.

If you keep the split, you should change the order. Doing back before legs will put a lot of strain on your lower back. I’d switch the order around, by either switching back and chest or putting legs first, then chest, then back. Also, I’d hit legs twice a week, so pull push legs X2 or legs, push, pull x 2, or an upper/lower.

Alright. I'll change up the schedule and follow a program.


There's no need to eat different on workout/nonworkout or carb cycle. Unless you enjoy doing so. If you think it will promote muscle growth or fat loss that is misguided. Your training routine is inadequate. From what you're describing you would have nothing to cut to so being in a deficit wouldn't be your best interest. Follow the guide below. Please post a picture if possible to give more specific advice.

I appreciate all the links! I've uploaded a picture. My weight is pretty low, but I don't look skinny imo. I'm pretty sure I'm not skinny fat either.

magician27
08-16-2015, 09:47 AM
keep 200 cals surplus and bulk. keep it simple . you dont need to cycle calories , if your weekly average is same thats not gonna keep you any leaner.

TheLeanDreamer
08-16-2015, 10:12 AM
Also another question, I'm going to try the 5x5 program, should I do additional workouts for body parts like the shoulders and abs when not doing 5x5? Since simply doing 3 exercises isn't going to build muscles everywhere.

Partyrocking
08-16-2015, 11:14 AM
There are multiple 5x5s. I assume you meant Stronglifts, since that’s the one w/ 3 lifts each day. You can add whatever you want, but if you get too carried away, it may interfere with your recovery or be counterproductive. You can also grab a 5x5 with more work built into it, so you don’t have to try to figure out what to add.