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View Full Version : Lebron has been a role player since 2010 (Cavs most stacked team)



isawthesign
08-19-2014, 09:14 PM
The Cleveland Cavaliers are one of the most stacked teams in recent history. Who's going to check Lebron James, Kevin Love, and Kyrie Irving simultaneously? Not to mention the team of 40%+ career three point specialists Lebron recruited... teams will be forced to stay at home on the three point line... This just further confirms what we already knew: Lebron has been a role player since 2010.

LeRolePlayer needs to be surrounded with specialists and superstars in order to win a title. That's why he joined Wade and Bosh in 2010, and then left them for Love and Kyrie in 2014. LeRolePlayer is a Robin, not a Batman. I had said it time and time again: the Miami Heat will go as far as Wade takes them. They go as he goes, not Lebron. In the 2011 NBA Finals, he was regulated to third fiddle, averaging less points than both Bosh and Wade.

Lebron is a role player, who wants to play in a hard and steady system with a predefined "role" (i.e. Robin) and strict allocation of minutes. In 2010, he complained about playing too many minutes (44 minutes). Ray Allen, who is 10 years older, played 41 minutes... This was also against the Boston Celtics... who doesn't get up to play against your heated rivals? Jordan, Kobe, and Iverson never complained about playing too many minutes.

Lebron still hasn't won a ring without colluding and without his superstar teammates. Kobe and Duncan didn't need all of these "specialists" and superstars. You threw them the ball, and you got out the way. Jordan never called up Bird and Isaiah, asking to team up. Duncan never called Kobe or Dirk to team up.

ShweezyBTFO
08-19-2014, 10:37 PM
CLIFFS:








jNw2h-unr6U

Based2014
08-20-2014, 01:56 AM
ITT: OP attempts to out potato australiaspotato.

ThatKindaGuy
08-20-2014, 03:09 AM
He is obviously not a roleplayer, but he somewhat set the precedent to build superstar-teams on paper. I don't think it caught on too much just yet (only the Dwight/Harden/Bosh attempt initially comes to mind, really), but overall I think its worse for the game.

And I still don't understand the "he makes his team mates better" line, when in fact everyone around him needs to play in a supporting role to elevate LeBrons game. You got Bosh on the perimeter so the lane is free'd up. You got Wade running the base line to draw away a potential help when LeBron passes his defender or shakes him off on a screen. You got RayRay and Miller opening shop at the corner three and thats all they are allowed to do, again to tie up a defender at the perimeter to open up the paint.

It makes assessing LeBrons legacy really hard, because other than his fruitless Cav 1.0 stay, you really don't know how much of the success needs to be attributed to his skill, and how much is just Pat Rileys managerial skill in convincing other superstars to run support for LBJ, hindering their own game/progress. With 4 people on the court doing everyone they can to solely support you, I somewhat can't take his scoring serious, even though the tactic makes perfect sense as long as you are successful.

fsujoseph
08-20-2014, 03:56 AM
LeBron is a role player

Well goodnight misc

wildchildish
08-20-2014, 04:51 AM
Lebron a roleplayer

never change, sports misc

Mac_xX
08-20-2014, 05:28 AM
lmao dude actually put time into trying to argue lebron as a roleplayer

typical basketball sports misc

BreakToBuild
08-20-2014, 08:25 AM
He is obviously not a roleplayer, but he somewhat set the precedent to build superstar-teams on paper. I don't think it caught on too much just yet (only the Dwight/Harden/Bosh attempt initially comes to mind, really), but overall I think its worse for the game.

And I still don't understand the "he makes his team mates better" line, when in fact everyone around him needs to play in a supporting role to elevate LeBrons game. You got Bosh on the perimeter so the lane is free'd up. You got Wade running the base line to draw away a potential help when LeBron passes his defender or shakes him off on a screen. You got RayRay and Miller opening shop at the corner three and thats all they are allowed to do, again to tie up a defender at the perimeter to open up the paint.

It makes assessing LeBrons legacy really hard, because other than his fruitless Cav 1.0 stay, you really don't know how much of the success needs to be attributed to his skill, and how much is just Pat Rileys managerial skill in convincing other superstars to run support for LBJ, hindering their own game/progress. With 4 people on the court doing everyone they can to solely support you, I somewhat can't take his scoring serious, even though the tactic makes perfect sense as long as you are successful.

The Celtics (Garnett, Allen, Pierce) "set the precedent" when they established the "Big 3" in the modern Era. In reality, we all know there is only one true big 3 in the modern ERA (Duncan-Parker-Manu), but DisneyESPN will be DisneyESPN.

Respect to Rose who doesn't gaf in assembling super teams for Plastic Rings.

BatteryBro42
08-20-2014, 08:49 AM
I can't take people seriously who think this Cavs team would stand a chance vs either of the Heat's title teams in the big 3 era.

BatteryBro42
08-20-2014, 08:56 AM
The Cleveland Cavaliers are one of the most stacked teams in recent history. Who's going to check Lebron James, Kevin Love, and Kyrie Irving simultaneously? Not to mention the team of 40%+ career three point specialists Lebron recruited... teams will be forced to stay at home on the three point line... This just further confirms what we already knew: Lebron has been a role player since 2010.

LeRolePlayer needs to be surrounded with specialists and superstars in order to win a title. That's why he joined Wade and Bosh in 2010, and then left them for Love and Kyrie in 2014. LeRolePlayer is a Robin, not a Batman. I had said it time and time again: the Miami Heat will go as far as Wade takes them. They go as he goes, not Lebron. In the 2011 NBA Finals, he was regulated to third fiddle, averaging less points than both Bosh and Wade.

Lebron is a role player, who wants to play in a hard and steady system with a predefined "role" (i.e. Robin) and strict allocation of minutes. In 2010, he complained about playing too many minutes (44 minutes). Ray Allen, who is 10 years older, played 41 minutes... This was also against the Boston Celtics... who doesn't get up to play against your heated rivals? Jordan, Kobe, and Iverson never complained about playing too many minutes.

Lebron still hasn't won a ring without colluding and without his superstar teammates. Kobe and Duncan didn't need all of these "specialists" and superstars. You threw them the ball, and you got out the way. Jordan never called up Bird and Isaiah, asking to team up. Duncan never called Kobe or Dirk to team up.

The revisionist history that has gone into the 2011 finals is absurd. Lebron wasn't regualted to ****. The facts are that prime Wade had one of the best series in finals history that year. Miami only needed a sub par series from James and the Heat take the title, and Wade the FMVP.

He chocked plain and simple, Lebron in the biggest moment of his career stood in corner and feared the pressure. Let us not forget the greatness of prime Wade. For one game I'd take prime Wade over James, do not sell that Heat team short. 2011 Miami was arguably the most talented starting 5 of all time.

Wade during the big 3 era subjugated a tremdous part of his game to compliment James. He routinley drew the toughest defensive matchup, and took a tremendous amount of pressure off Lebron. You saw this season what Miami looked like without a dominant Wade. He is what put that team over the top, Lebron is incapable of willing a team to anything.

For as much as everybody wants to put last years finals on everybody else but Lebron perhaps you should watch the defensive effort James gave. It says a lot when your team leader won't run back on D or give consistent effort. It spread like wildfire, and was the story of the entire season.

As a leader that falls on you, and I blame James for letting his teammates slide the entire season with mediocre defensive effort. It caught up to them in the finals, and they got exposed. What did Lebron do, did he raly his guys, did he step up and take responsibility? No he ran out of town, and took the path of least resistance. Lebron is the Peyton Manning of the NBA, great talent, but zero fire, or competitive spirit. Spent the last 4 years defending it, and I must say I was wrong the entire time about him. That passion is what will always set Kobe and Jordan apart from Lebron.

I know its a feel good story that he went home, and I get that the media loves it, but what about his promises? Remeber not 1, not 2, not 3....I applaud the way Miami and Riley handled his departure, he deserves to be trashed for ducking out. Good on Miami for taking the high road

BatteryBro42
08-20-2014, 09:12 AM
LeBron is a role player

Well goodnight misc

He is a megastar trapped within the mind of a role player. He's mentally weak, the type of guy you get to mentally. Look at how Lebron handled the likes of Deshaun Stevenson. Remember Juan Howard having to threaten the Pacers because Lebron couldn't handled the **** talking? You will see it this year once more. Can't wait to see the Cavs match up vs Chicago or Miami in the playoffs.

isawthesign
08-20-2014, 10:14 AM
I can't take people seriously who think this Cavs team would stand a chance vs either of the Heat's title teams in the big 3 era.

Love is better than Bosh and actually rebounds. Kyrie is argubably better than Wade was in the big three era. Plus, is anyone of Miami's big better than Anderson V?

BullBoy8
08-20-2014, 10:23 AM
Love is better than Bosh and actually rebounds. Kyrie is argubably better than Wade was in the big three era. Plus, is anyone of Miami's big better than Anderson V?

Holy troll. There is no way you actually believe this, or anyone else. Dont even know why I am responding to this, I am embarrassed that I am.

Carpig
08-20-2014, 10:30 AM
The Celtics and Lakers were quite successful with role players like Larry Bird and Magic Johnson.

Onita
08-20-2014, 10:32 AM
The revisionist history that has gone into the 2011 finals is absurd. Lebron wasn't regualted to ****. The facts are that prime Wade had one of the best series in finals history that year. Miami only needed a sub par series from James and the Heat take the title, and Wade the FMVP.

He chocked plain and simple, Lebron in the biggest moment of his career stood in corner and feared the pressure. Let us not forget the greatness of prime Wade. For one game I'd take prime Wade over James, do not sell that Heat team short. 2011 Miami was arguably the most talented starting 5 of all time.

Wade during the big 3 era subjugated a tremdous part of his game to compliment James. He routinley drew the toughest defensive matchup, and took a tremendous amount of pressure off Lebron. You saw this season what Miami looked like without a dominant Wade. He is what put that team over the top, Lebron is incapable of willing a team to anything.

For as much as everybody wants to put last years finals on everybody else but Lebron perhaps you should watch the defensive effort James gave. It says a lot when your team leader won't run back on D or give consistent effort. It spread like wildfire, and was the story of the entire season.

As a leader that falls on you, and I blame James for letting his teammates slide the entire season with mediocre defensive effort. It caught up to them in the finals, and they got exposed. What did Lebron do, did he raly his guys, did he step up and take responsibility? No he ran out of town, and took the path of least resistance. Lebron is the Peyton Manning of the NBA, great talent, but zero fire, or competitive spirit. Spent the last 4 years defending it, and I must say I was wrong the entire time about him. That passion is what will always set Kobe and Jordan apart from Lebron.

I know its a feel good story that he went home, and I get that the media loves it, but what about his promises? Remeber not 1, not 2, not 3....I applaud the way Miami and Riley handled his departure, he deserves to be trashed for ducking out. Good on Miami for taking the high road

So much butthurt that he left "your team". Its awesome reading your posts.

BatteryBro42
08-20-2014, 10:33 AM
Love is better than Bosh and actually rebounds. Kyrie is argubably better than Wade was in the big three era. Plus, is anyone of Miami's big better than Anderson V?

Anderson V is trash and was the anchor on one of the worst front lines in the league last season. What is arguable about Kyrie being better than Wade in the big 3 era? Might I remind you they both have played almost the same amount of games during that stretch in the regular season, the stats don't compare. Wade during that stretch has been a top ten player in the NBA consistently and arguably the leagues most efficient scorer. In fact Wade had the best shooting season for a guard in 29 years last season, so pretty much all of modern basketball.

I just love these dumb Cleveland homers, and uneducated basketball minds that convince themselves into thinking Kevin Love is better than Chris Bosh. Chris Bosh is probably the most versatile defensive big in the game right now. He is the best pick and roll defender in the league, and he has been operating as the 3rd option on offense. Bosh has never been an exceptional rebounder, but then again in Miami he was never put into the position to grab a ton of boards. He is usually on the elbow extended, and is the guy contesting most shots, either at the rim, or in the mid range, he isn't in position to pad stats with boards like Love.

Love is defensive liability as is Irving. Go back and watch some Heat games from last season, and maybe you will understand Lebron is becoming a liability defensively himself. He cannot give you the total effort in his minutes that he once could, and it showed all of last season. His effort last season in the finals was pitiful. By the looks of it Cleveland will be relying on James to do the bulk of the defensive work. He will be responsible for guarding the best player 1-4 on every team, and if he doesn't that presents a huge mismatch, because Irving and Love are terrible on defense. This team will struggle mightily on the defensive end, the very thing that made Miami so special, and such a juggernaut during their 4 year run

BatteryBro42
08-20-2014, 10:41 AM
Is it not telling that Golden State refused to give up Clay Thompson for Kevin Love?

FGCHENG
08-20-2014, 10:46 AM
I can't take people seriously who think this Cavs team would stand a chance vs either of the Heat's title teams in the big 3 era.

Truth. Healthy Wade is just so much better than Kyrie, and Chris Bosh is a better player than Kevin Love. Not by much, but better.

Coaching makes a heluva lot difference come playoffs time, and David Blatt's inexperience will show during the playoffs. I will admit this Cavs team is a bit deeper than those Heat teams though.

BatteryBro42
08-20-2014, 11:00 AM
Truth. Healthy Wade is just so much better than Kyrie, and Chris Bosh is a better player than Kevin Love. Not by much, but better.

Coaching makes a heluva lot difference come playoffs time, and David Blatt's inexperience will show during the playoffs. I will admit this Cavs team is a bit deeper than those Heat teams though.

The Cavs are deeper, but they lack defensive depth something I think will hurt them come big games. Really intrigued about Blatt he will make the difference. I keep hearing he's a genius if so why was he coaching foreign and not in the NBA? Also why was he on nobodies radar other than the Cavs?

isawthesign
08-20-2014, 08:24 PM
Anderson V is trash and was the anchor on one of the worst front lines in the league last season. What is arguable about Kyrie being better than Wade in the big 3 era? Might I remind you they both have played almost the same amount of games during that stretch in the regular season, the stats don't compare. Wade during that stretch has been a top ten player in the NBA consistently and arguably the leagues most efficient scorer. In fact Wade had the best shooting season for a guard in 29 years last season, so pretty much all of modern basketball.

I just love these dumb Cleveland homers, and uneducated basketball minds that convince themselves into thinking Kevin Love is better than Chris Bosh. Chris Bosh is probably the most versatile defensive big in the game right now. He is the best pick and roll defender in the league, and he has been operating as the 3rd option on offense. Bosh has never been an exceptional rebounder, but then again in Miami he was never put into the position to grab a ton of boards. He is usually on the elbow extended, and is the guy contesting most shots, either at the rim, or in the mid range, he isn't in position to pad stats with boards like Love.

Love is defensive liability as is Irving. Go back and watch some Heat games from last season, and maybe you will understand Lebron is becoming a liability defensively himself. He cannot give you the total effort in his minutes that he once could, and it showed all of last season. His effort last season in the finals was pitiful. By the looks of it Cleveland will be relying on James to do the bulk of the defensive work. He will be responsible for guarding the best player 1-4 on every team, and if he doesn't that presents a huge mismatch, because Irving and Love are terrible on defense. This team will struggle mightily on the defensive end, the very thing that made Miami so special, and such a juggernaut during their 4 year run

People on this site are downplaying Bosh's status as the third "superstar", but now they're trying to say he's way better than Kevin Love, who's averaging 26 and 15? The same guy who's in all of these advertisement and commercials? And Chris Bosh isn't a superstar?

At least be objective and not skew the facts into your favor and have an agenda.

I reached a bit with Kyrie and Wade, but Wade hasn't been himself the last two years, and Kyrie's ascendence stardom... I think if you take average of their years, it's neck and neck, but I'd give the edge to Wade if it's a toss up.

Not to mention, Wade and Lebron play similar roles, so they couldn't maximize their productive. Love, Kyrie, and Lebron all play different positions and roles.

BullBoy8
08-20-2014, 10:05 PM
People on this site are downplaying Bosh's status as the third "superstar", but now they're trying to say he's way better than Kevin Love, who's averaging 26 and 15? The same guy who's in all of these advertisement and commercials? And Chris Bosh isn't a superstar?

At least be objective and not skew the facts into your favor and have an agenda.

I reached a bit with Kyrie and Wade, but Wade hasn't been himself the last two years, and Kyrie's ascendence stardom... I think if you take average of their years, it's neck and neck, but I'd give the edge to Wade if it's a toss up.

Not to mention, Wade and Lebron play similar roles, so they couldn't maximize their productive. Love, Kyrie, and Lebron all play different positions and roles.

That settles it. Commercials and advertisements means you are better.

Bosh the year before going to Miami 24pts 10.8rebs per game on 52% shooting. Lead the Raptors to the playoffs twice. Love 26pts 12.5 rebs on 46% shooting. Never lead a team to the playoffs.

And Wade sucked this year. 19pts on 54.5% shooting 4.5rebs and 4.5 asts per game. Kyrie was a superstar at 21pts 6asts and 3.5rebs per game on 43%....according to you. If wade put up as many shots as kyrie, hed still avg 25pts. He shot less this year.

And again, Kyrie isnt even close to Wades level the 1st 2 years of Lebron on the heat. Kyrie is horrible in catch and shoot, which is what he will be doing with lebron. He is a ball dominant player and needs it in his hands to be affective, like wade, like lebron.

EQuiiNoXx
08-20-2014, 10:20 PM
He is obviously not a roleplayer, but he somewhat set the precedent to build superstar-teams on paper. I don't think it caught on too much just yet (only the Dwight/Harden/Bosh attempt initially comes to mind, really), but overall I think its worse for the game.

And I still don't understand the "he makes his team mates better" line, when in fact everyone around him needs to play in a supporting role to elevate LeBrons game. You got Bosh on the perimeter so the lane is free'd up. You got Wade running the base line to draw away a potential help when LeBron passes his defender or shakes him off on a screen. You got RayRay and Miller opening shop at the corner three and thats all they are allowed to do, again to tie up a defender at the perimeter to open up the paint.

It makes assessing LeBrons legacy really hard, because other than his fruitless Cav 1.0 stay, you really don't know how much of the success needs to be attributed to his skill, and how much is just Pat Rileys managerial skill in convincing other superstars to run support for LBJ, hindering their own game/progress. With 4 people on the court doing everyone they can to solely support you, I somewhat can't take his scoring serious, even though the tactic makes perfect sense as long as you are successful.

Well said.

australiasbrain
08-20-2014, 11:38 PM
Michael Jordan was a role player behind such super stars as Bill Cartwright, Steve Kerr and John Paxton.

NateTheGood
08-21-2014, 12:39 AM
The Cleveland Cavaliers are one of the most stacked teams in recent history. Who's going to check Lebron James, Kevin Love, and Kyrie Irving simultaneously? Not to mention the team of 40%+ career three point specialists Lebron recruited... teams will be forced to stay at home on the three point line... This just further confirms what we already knew: Lebron has been a role player since 2010.

LeRolePlayer needs to be surrounded with specialists and superstars in order to win a title. That's why he joined Wade and Bosh in 2010, and then left them for Love and Kyrie in 2014. LeRolePlayer is a Robin, not a Batman. I had said it time and time again: the Miami Heat will go as far as Wade takes them. They go as he goes, not Lebron. In the 2011 NBA Finals, he was regulated to third fiddle, averaging less points than both Bosh and Wade.

Lebron is a role player, who wants to play in a hard and steady system with a predefined "role" (i.e. Robin) and strict allocation of minutes. In 2010, he complained about playing too many minutes (44 minutes). Ray Allen, who is 10 years older, played 41 minutes... This was also against the Boston Celtics... who doesn't get up to play against your heated rivals? Jordan, Kobe, and Iverson never complained about playing too many minutes.

Lebron still hasn't won a ring without colluding and without his superstar teammates. Kobe and Duncan didn't need all of these "specialists" and superstars. You threw them the ball, and you got out the way. Jordan never called up Bird and Isaiah, asking to team up. Duncan never called Kobe or Dirk to team up.

-OP writes a novel criticizing Lebron for being a role player
-Calls him a star recruiter, not hungry, second fiddle, etc
-Turns out to just be another sad attempt to lump Kobe in with Jordan

ThatKindaGuy
08-21-2014, 12:56 AM
Jordan, Kobe, and Iverson never complained about playing too many minutes.

Lebron still hasn't won a ring without colluding and without his superstar teammates. Kobe and Duncan didn't need all of these "specialists" and superstars. You threw them the ball, and you got out the way. Jordan never called up Bird and Isaiah, asking to team up. Duncan never called Kobe or Dirk to team up.


-OP writes a novel criticizing Lebron for being a role player
-Calls him a star recruiter, not hungry, second fiddle, etc
-Turns out to just be another sad attempt to lump Kobe in with Jordan

OP talks about: Jordan, Duncan, Kobe, Iverson, Bird, Isiah, Dirk.

NateThePhaggot picks out Jordan and Kobe ... yea ... who's sad attempt was it, really?

sdballer5588
08-21-2014, 01:33 AM
Cringe worthy posts ITT lol

Fist-Of-Freedom
08-21-2014, 05:14 AM
Yes we all know that Lebron is one of the most over rated players (if not the biggest) of all time. Nothing will change the mind of fanboys though.

isawthesign
08-21-2014, 05:54 AM
That settles it. Commercials and advertisements means you are better.

Bosh the year before going to Miami 24pts 10.8rebs per game on 52% shooting. Lead the Raptors to the playoffs twice. Love 26pts 12.5 rebs on 46% shooting. Never lead a team to the playoffs.

And Wade sucked this year. 19pts on 54.5% shooting 4.5rebs and 4.5 asts per game. Kyrie was a superstar at 21pts 6asts and 3.5rebs per game on 43%....according to you. If wade put up as many shots as kyrie, hed still avg 25pts. He shot less this year.

And again, Kyrie isnt even close to Wades level the 1st 2 years of Lebron on the heat. Kyrie is horrible in catch and shoot, which is what he will be doing with lebron. He is a ball dominant player and needs it in his hands to be affective, like wade, like lebron.

I'm highlighting the fact that both Love and Kyrie are not just "stars"... they are big time superstars, which Lebron needs to win titles.

Superstar = all-star, endorsements, commercials, shoe deals, red carpet events... BIG TIME players... one notch above regular old "all-stars"

the superstars are the face of the league. Josh Smith is an all-star, Blake Griffin is a superstar. Jrue Holiday is an all-star, CP3 is a superstar. Al Hortford is an all-star, Tim Duncan is a superstar. Jordan is a superstar, Mitch Richmond is an all-star.

orderoutofchaos
08-21-2014, 09:34 AM
Lebron is a star but of the all around type. Not many come and go over the decades. Pippen and magic werr. Lebron tramed up with wade because youthful wade was the perfect compliment to bron. Sadly wafe and allen were over the hump by the time they teamed up. Lebron wont do well in cleveland because there will be no pure scorer guard. Rose and bron would of won 8 str8 titles. Rose is a pure scorer but too late now