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View Full Version : Soldiers told that Tea Party and Christians are threat to USA.



Lakersbake
10-25-2013, 06:27 PM
Soldiers attending a pre-deployment briefing at Fort Hood say they were told that evangelical Christians and members of the Tea Party were a threat to the nation and that any soldier donating to those groups would be subjected to punishment under the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/10/23/does-army-consider-christians-tea-party-terror-threat/

megabrahh
10-25-2013, 11:09 PM
Cool

nutsy54
10-25-2013, 11:33 PM
Exclusive: Army halts training program that labeled Christians as extremists

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/10/24/exclusive-army-halts-training-program-that-labeled-christians-as-extremists/

tk217
10-26-2013, 12:23 AM
None of these slides were produced by the Army, but by soldiers who included information found during an Internet search

What the hell does that mean?

Dioskouori
10-26-2013, 01:33 AM
What the hell does that mean?That they aren't Army sanctioned, just slides some guy added who happens to be in the army.

If you made a PowerPoint at work and began using it as a training tool, does that mean it is sanctioned by your employer?

tk217
10-26-2013, 01:35 AM
That they aren't Army sanctioned, just slides some guy added who happens to be in the army.

If you made a PowerPoint at work and began using it as a training tool, does that mean it is sanctioned by your employer?

It doesn't mean it wasn't produced by the army - it was not "sanctioned."

The only problem here is that the military literally used the slides in an educational seminar - so it had to be sanctioned.

Someone signed off on something.

Dioskouori
10-26-2013, 01:49 AM
It doesn't mean it wasn't produced by the army - it was not "sanctioned."

The only problem here is that the military literally used the slides in an educational seminar - so it had to be sanctioned.

Someone signed off on something.Not necessarily. There is a decent bit of autonomy in creating training tools and not all of them are canned presentations produced by the DoD. Depending on the person making the presentation he may not of even passed it up for review.

tk217
10-26-2013, 01:55 AM
Not necessarily. There is a decent bit of autonomy in creating training tools and not all of them are canned presentations produced by the DoD. Depending on the person making the presentation he may not of even passed it up for review.

Wow.....

That is... just stupid. Serious reforms needed there.

Bosscoo
10-26-2013, 02:13 AM
Strong source.

http://mediamatters.org/research/2013/05/13/todd-starnes-5-fake-culture-wars/194005

Dioskouori
10-26-2013, 02:15 AM
Wow.....

That is... just stupid. Serious reforms needed there.

Depends. Picture the red tape nightmare of every possible training tool having to be sent up the chain just to be approved and sent back down? It would halt everything and the back log would be nuts. Some autonomy is needed and it comes down to a "good judgment" call. This person failed that. It happens, but it tends to get fixed when a bigger fish comes across it.

tk217
10-26-2013, 02:18 AM
Depends. Picture the red tape nightmare of every possible training tool having to be sent up the chain just to be approved and sent back down? It would halt everything and the back log would be nuts. Some autonomy is needed and it comes down to a "good judgment" call. This person failed that. It happens, but it tends to get fixed when a bigger fish comes across it.

Or an embarrassment is brought to light -- this isn't a combat zone -- this is generic training you have time to consider the consequences of your actions.

Dioskouori
10-26-2013, 02:20 AM
Or an embarrassment is brought to light -- this isn't a combat zone -- this is generic training you have time to consider the consequences of your actions.assuming you think your actions are wrong. This guy said nothing more than what Janet Napolitano herself said some time back as well as the liberal nightly news tells us on a daily basis. So in his eyes did he do something wrong?

tk217
10-26-2013, 02:36 AM
assuming you think your actions are wrong. This guy said nothing more than what Janet Napolitano herself said some time back as well as the liberal nightly news tells us on a daily basis. So in his eyes did he do something wrong?

I don't consider a right-wing evangelistic group of protester or Tea Party Copters to be on the same level as al-qaeda. So, yes. He did do something wrong when you can't see the difference between someone who votes and pays their taxes and someone who hijacks airplanes to fly them into civilian infrastructure.

Dioskouori
10-26-2013, 10:28 AM
I don't consider a right-wing evangelistic group of protester or Tea Party Copters to be on the same level as al-qaeda. So, yes. He did do something wrong when you can't see the difference between someone who votes and pays their taxes and someone who hijacks airplanes to fly them into civilian infrastructure.Yet our government has made that comparison.

I'm not trying to understand or justify this guys position. He is obviously an idiot, but intelligence is not prerequisite for joining the Army. All I am saying is that this isn't the Army doing this, just a guy who happens to be is the Army. The distinction should be made less others come to believe that the Army is condemning groups. All the military says in these regards is that you not attend political functions in uniform and you temper your online profiles if you are still on active duty. They don't preclude you from participating, just the extent that your Military career can be linked to such.

tk217
10-26-2013, 10:36 AM
Yet our government has made that comparison.

I'm not trying to understand or justify this guys position. He is obviously an idiot, but intelligence is not prerequisite for joining the Army. All I am saying is that this isn't the Army doing this, just a guy who happens to be is the Army. The distinction should be made less others come to believe that the Army is condemning groups. All the military says in these regards is that you not attend political functions in uniform and you temper your online profiles if you are still on active duty. They don't preclude you from participating, just the extent that your Military career can be linked to such.

Hence serious reform is needed. Heads should at a minimum be put to a barracks peeling potatoes as they clearly lack intelligence and are fit for only that duty.

brighamw
10-26-2013, 10:52 AM
Strong source.

http://mediamatters.org/research/2013/05/13/todd-starnes-5-fake-culture-wars/194005


Wait, did you just attack his source by sourcing media matters?


http://www.llllitl.fr/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/don-draper-mad-men-gif-work-lol-wtf-smile-smoke.gif

Exclusive: Army halts training program that labeled Christians as extremists

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/10/24/exclusive-army-halts-training-program-that-labeled-christians-as-extremists/

1) Why was it started in the 1st place?

2) Was it stopped because they suddenly saw the error of their ways or because people found out & got pissed?

Not necessarily questions for you Nuts, but questions I have in general about the program...

7thlife
10-26-2013, 01:32 PM
the army is right, them Christians keep talking about "taking back" america so we need to take them seriously.

nutsy54
10-26-2013, 02:22 PM
The only problem here is that the military literally used the slides in an educational seminar - so it had to be sanctioned.

Someone signed off on something.
No they didn't. That's the whole basis for the training being halted.

Someone decided to spew his own crap, and pretend it was Army policy.

stancel
10-26-2013, 02:51 PM
Fox News probably made this up. How come all the sites discussing this are right-wing?

tk217
10-26-2013, 02:52 PM
Fox News probably made this up. How come all the sites discussing this are right-wing?

Cause it matters to them.

nutsy54
10-26-2013, 03:10 PM
1) Why was it started in the 1st place?

2) Was it stopped because they suddenly saw the error of their ways or because people found out & got pissed?

Not necessarily questions for you Nuts, but questions I have in general about the program...
You're still not following. Predeployment training wasn't "started", it's been around forever.

This specific segment of training was an unauthorized, off the cuff segment. It was stopped because it was never supposed to exist in the first place.

brighamw
10-26-2013, 03:20 PM
You're still not following. Predeployment training wasn't "started", it's been around forever.

This specific segment of training was an unauthorized, off the cuff segment. It was stopped because it was never supposed to exist in the first place.

No, really, lol...

:D

Guess I should have been more clear, I meant specifically when was the tea party/Christians are bad part of the program started/implemented and more importantly by who and with who's approval.

As for why it stopped, you list one possible reason. I'm leaning more towards they stopped it because people (general public) found out not because the current policy makers, etc had any problem with it or thought it was necessarily wrong.

LizzieTish
10-26-2013, 05:43 PM
No really, lol...

:D

Guess I should have been more clear, I meant specifically when was the tea party/Christians are bad part of the program started/implemented and more importantly by who and with who's approval.

As for why it stopped, you list one possible reason. I'm leaning more towards they stopped it because people (general public) found out not because the current policy makers, etc had any problem with it or thought it was necessarily wrong.
Bold.

Dioskouori
10-26-2013, 06:19 PM
Bold.How many people in this thread have been through predeployment training?

GDPONE
10-26-2013, 06:21 PM
Having been in the Army I could easily see a training Sergeant making some dumbass slides like that. Whoever gives the training usually makes the slides for the training or uses whatever was passed on before. Nothing new here, training sergeants gun training sergeant.

CalmWind
10-26-2013, 06:37 PM
Christian persecution in America.... the prophecies will come to pass.....

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/walkingdead/images/8/81/So-It-Begins.gif

Tekkendo
10-26-2013, 06:44 PM
Christian persecution in America.... the prophecies will come to pass.....

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/walkingdead/images/8/81/So-It-Begins.gif

Why are you whinning about? JUST TAKE IT AND LIKE IT !! The Dems are GIVEN the Senate and the White HOUSE. They can do as they please!!


Obama "getting everything he wants", aka obamacare. The bill that was already voted on, passed, and went into law. What republicans are doing now is shameful. They lost the vote. Swallow it down like a big boy and move on, and hope to change the law. But to DEFUND a law after you lose the vote? That's pathetic, and no defending that.


and lastly, if a certain party has the majority in the Senate, and that same party also has their own president in the white house, then they are representing the people of the united states, as per our election system.

so, if Obama wants to "get everything he asks", he has a right to do it, as the people of the USA voted in Democrats to the white house, and gave the majority of the Senate to them as well. Why should democrats, who control the white house and the senate, as given to them by the people of the united states, have to cater to the republicans?

Repubs have no ground, and neither do you, to tell them otherwise. The white house and the senate represent the people who voted them in.... republicans crying about it when they can't even win elections is hilarious...... again.... do you even representative republic?



P.S. I have never voted for obama in my life, so don't call me a democrat.

nutsy54
10-26-2013, 07:17 PM
Bold.

Prove it.

nutsy54
10-26-2013, 07:18 PM
Christian persecution in America.... the prophecies will come to pass.....

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/walkingdead/images/8/81/So-It-Begins.gif

It's funniest when stupid people don't even bother to read beyond the first post :D

kusok
10-28-2013, 05:25 AM
People are a threat to the scum. Here are Dave22 and nutsy at work at a checkpoint:

http://i42.tinypic.com/es2csn.jpg


Yes, this is a checkpoint in Sacramento just now. The excuse of course was that they were looking for some bad guy. So they set up this checkpoint...

flairon
10-28-2013, 05:48 AM
Not necessarily. There is a decent bit of autonomy in creating training tools and not all of them are canned presentations produced by the DoD. Depending on the person making the presentation he may not of even passed it up for review.

Maybe things have changed quite a bit since I was in, but unless their section leader made that video...someone had to ok it....because of things just like this.

Dioskouori
10-28-2013, 06:21 AM
Maybe things have changed quite a bit since I was in, but unless their section leader made that video...someone had to ok it....because of things just like this.The thing is we don't know the rank of the person who did this. So most of this is just speculation. I agree that for the most part a pvt - spc is probably gonna seek approval, but a Sgt or above may be given more leeway and an Officer maybe given a bit more atonomy. My only real point though is that we shouldn't be blaming the Army for the action of a single soldier. This isn't a systemic problem, it is an isolated insstance. If anything it would be more likely to see those in the service pushing conservative christian values,, that is the overwhelming make up. If anything, the military goes out of its way to avoid this sort of thing food this very reason and so trainings of a societal value are boiled down into stewed cabbage.

tnel00
10-28-2013, 06:23 AM
That they aren't Army sanctioned, just slides some guy added who happens to be in the army.

If you made a PowerPoint at work and began using it as a training tool, does that mean it is sanctioned by your employer?

Yes

A random employee doesn't get to create training materials without it being approved by someone higher up in the DOD. If this was shown as training material, it was signed off on by someone with the authority to sanction it.

lasher
10-28-2013, 06:24 AM
the army is right, them Christians keep talking about "taking back" america so we need to take them seriously.

You best hide yo kids

JoshSP1985
10-28-2013, 06:40 AM
People are a threat to the scum. Here are Dave22 and nutsy at work at a checkpoint:

http://i42.tinypic.com/es2csn.jpg


Yes, this is a checkpoint in Sacramento just now. The excuse of course was that they were looking for some bad guy. So they set up this checkpoint...

I would fcuking rage if I drove up to a checkpoint and had a gun pointed at my face.

brighamw
10-28-2013, 11:49 AM
I would fcuking rage if I drove up to a checkpoint and had a gun pointed at my face.

That is pretty ignorant of the officer to point directly at him like that, one could argue that driver has the right to use whatever means necessary in self defense to get that gun out of his face...

TheIronAsylum
10-28-2013, 11:50 AM
what else do you expect to happen with Obama as president

nutsy54
10-28-2013, 12:17 PM
People are a threat to the scum. Here are Dave22 and nutsy at work at a checkpoint:



It's amazing the bullsh*t lies and personal attacks you'll pull out of your ass just to change the subject in a topic where your failed position has fallen apart.

Holy F*ck you moronic scum: Once again I AGREE with you that the instructor was an idiot, but that still doesn't matter, because anyone who doesn't 100% agree with every ranting CT claim must be attacked as an enemy.

Posts like that are why you, Voodoo, LizzieTish, and the other "everything is a conspiracy!" sheep are laughed at.


PS: That cop belongs behind bars until the Internal Affairs investigation is completed - a statement I'm sure you'll ignore, since it doesn't fit your endlessly false version of my positions. (If that picture is even real - which is also suspect given your history of random disregard for honesty).


Of course... What does any of that have to do with the military stopping an instructor from providing unauthorized and stupid training?

nutsy54
10-28-2013, 12:24 PM
Yes

A random employee doesn't get to create training materials without it being approved by someone higher up in the DOD. If this was shown as training material, it was signed off on by someone with the authority to sanction it.
It's amazing that people just make completely false statement, then pretend it's fact.

How does "someone higher up" approve a slide or two randomly added by an instructor? How do they approve his words as they're being spoken?

Rockchalk0420
10-28-2013, 12:51 PM
Exclusive: Army halts training program that labeled Christians as extremists

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/10/24/exclusive-army-halts-training-program-that-labeled-christians-as-extremists/

Fighting "extremist" with extreme views/rhetoric...hy-hyp-hypocrites!

Lakersbake
10-29-2013, 06:48 PM
It's amazing that people just make completely false statement, then pretend it's fact.

How does "someone higher up" approve a slide or two randomly added by an instructor? How do they approve his words as they're being spoken?

Yep. It was a lone slidemaker. ;)

nutsy54
11-14-2013, 03:31 PM
People are a threat to the scum. Here are Dave22 and nutsy at work at a checkpoint:

http://i42.tinypic.com/es2csn.jpg


Yes, this is a checkpoint in Sacramento just now. The excuse of course was that they were looking for some bad guy. So they set up this checkpoint...
And once again, Kusok is exposed for his standard fare of endless lies and false claims...

Funny that you "forgot" to add the caption on that picture - that police were involved in an active shooting situation, and the gun wasn't actually aimed at the driver's head. But anything to use fear mongering distraction to constantly change the topic, right?
Lies and deception, all we can count on from you...

A California Highway Patrol officer and another emergency responder stop a vehicle at a checkpoint near the neighborhood where a federal immigration officer was shot and three local police officers were wounded during a violent confrontation with a suspect in the Sacramento suburb of Roseville on Friday, Oct. 25, 2013. (NOTE: This photograph, by a Sacramento Bee photographer, was made from a fair distance away with a very long (600 mm) lens. The long lens and the angle make it look as though the gun is pointed directly at the driver, but really it is aimed into the back seat of the car. At no time did the photographer see the officer point the rifle at the driver. After a careful review of the photograph, it was determined the officer’s actions were within the law and CHP policy. We were unable to get identification of the driver.)

Cliffs: Kusok continues to be a f*cking liar whenever it supports his agenda.
"At no time did the photographer see the officer point the rifle at the driver".

http://www.sacbee.com/2013/10/25/5853282/four-officers-injured-in-roseville.html
Picture #27

SDC77
11-14-2013, 04:16 PM
This is precisely how these internet rumors go viral.... Listen, if something sounds completely batsh*t crazy, it almost certainly is. Christians claiming to be persecuted in the U.S. of all places is utterly laughable. Also, if it's on a blog, the chances of it being completely made up or heavily altered is around 100%, this goes for all blogs of all political persuasions.

dirtdickens
11-14-2013, 04:49 PM
I would fcuking rage if I drove up to a checkpoint and had a gun pointed at my face.If he is standing 2-3 feet back from the vehicle he isn't pointing it in anyones face and is doing the correct thing. It is obvious following the story and the angle the photographer used that this was meant to rile some people up. Finger off the trigger and weapon at the ready pointed away from the civilian. That is what he is supposed to do.

And these predeployment training sessions are given to every unit by the same people who's sole job is to do predeployment training. The guy that gave that power point, that is his only job. He does that sht every day.

I would be more concerned about the fat ass cop in the back.

Blindead
11-14-2013, 05:54 PM
Yes

A random employee doesn't get to create training materials without it being approved by someone higher up in the DOD. If this was shown as training material, it was signed off on by someone with the authority to sanction it.

please, continue to tell us how the military works, guy who has never been in the military.

just like teachers and professors get everything approved by administration before they teach it, right?

Ge_Tech
11-14-2013, 05:56 PM
The only threat the tea party and some Christians is to peoples intelligence.

Dioskouori
11-14-2013, 11:31 PM
The only threat the tea party and some Christians is to peoples intelligence.Oh snap yo! You totally burned those teaparty types! You da man dawg!