PDA

View Full Version : I need to get my nutrition straight



SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 10:25 AM
Here is my history:
As of April 2012 i weighed about 250lbs, and currently i weigh 183lbs(21 years old, male, ~20% bf). Ive been trying to lose weight still but I've been having no luck. Ive weighed myself mondays and fridays since July 2012. Since then, my weight has gone like this:
236, 234.5, 233.25, 233.25, 230.75, 227.75, 227.5, 227, 225.25, 223.5, 222, 223, 222.5, 217.5, 215.25, 214.5, 219.5, 214.25, 213.25, 210.5, 210.5, 208.25, 208.5, 206, 207.5, 204.25, 206, 203.75, 204, 200.75, 200.75, 198.25, 199.75, 196, 196, 194.5, 193.5, 193, 190.5, 187.75, 188.5, 185.75, 185, 186.5, 183.5, 180.25,
184(January, 2nd), 185.75, 186, 182.25, 184.25, 184, 183.5, 179.5, 180.75,
177(February, 1st), 179, 175, 177.25, 174, 178.25, 174.75, 176,
174(March, 1st), 179, 177.5, 175.5, 178.5, 176.5, 179, 176.5,
178(April, 1st), 174.5, 176.5, 177, 178, 174, 176, 171.5, 175.5,
173.5(May, 3rd), 176.5, 176.5, 180.5, 181, 181, 179.5, 182.5, 180,
179(June, 3rd), 178, 181.5, 178, 178.5, 179,
183(yesterday)

As you can see, in the last year, I've practically gone nowhere. I tried cutting my calories way lower than I know I should have and things were just not right. Ive been lifting the entire time, but so far this year I have hardly made any gains(im sure due to such low calorie intake).
So what i want to do is stop worrying about the fatloss for a while, and just focus on a solid nutritional diet and get back to making gains in my lifts.

I figure from calculators that my BMR is near 2300 Cals. I work a deskjob and on weekends I'm fairly sedentary.
For exercise ive done ~20 min of HIIT every weekday and followed the Shortcut-To-Size weight training program (Mon-Chest/tris/calves, Tues-Back/bis/abs, Thurs-Shoulders/traps/calves, Fri-Legs/abs).
I'm considering changing to 5x5 and making tuesdays, thursdays, saturdays, and sundays complete off days. Thus lifting mon, wed, & friday and following with a bit of HIIT.

As far as supplements, ive been taking a multivitamin and fish oil regularly. I use muscle pharm pre workout before lifting and their combat protein powder after lifting(4 days a week each). Im, currently weening myself off of the preworkout and planning on stictly using protein powder(to keep my protein intake high enough). For protein powder im considering switching to Dymatize Elite Fusion 7 for a while.

Here is what I need:
I need help figuring out a good meal plan for myself, I live with my parents still (and they pay for my groceries). This weekend I plan on going shopping and getting all kinds good stuff.
Im not allergic to anything, I'm not against taste if it's going to be healthy for me, and I'm not one to get burnt out on repetettively eating the same food over and over again.
I have time to prepare meals, I have tupperware to take meals anywhere, I have time at any point in the day to eat.

Thanks a lot for reading, I'm really hoping to get something figured out for myself here!

KayPS
06-25-2013, 10:28 AM
I would start with the stickies, specifically the one regarding calorie and macronutrient requirements.

SelfMotivated
06-25-2013, 10:30 AM
Before we figure out a food plan we need to find out your TDEE.

To find that out look in the sticky thread titled "Calculating your Calorie & Macronutrient Needs"

After you figure that out, let us know what numbers you put in and how you came up with your TDEE. If you are confused about how to calculate it as well, please come back with any questions.

P.S. All those supplements are unnecessary. The only ones I would keep would be the Multi and the fish oil.

xJellyBirdx
06-25-2013, 10:34 AM
I need help figuring out a good meal plan for myself, I live with my parents still (and they pay for my groceries). This weekend I plan on going shopping and getting all kinds good stuff.
Im not allergic to anything, I'm not against taste if it's going to be healthy for me, and I'm not one to get burnt out on repetettively eating the same food over and over again.
I have time to prepare meals, I have tupperware to take meals anywhere, I have time at any point in the day to eat.

Thanks a lot for reading, I'm really hoping to get something figured out for myself here!

Way too much info my man lol. Read the sticky, then start finding food you like and logging it as you eat or you can pre-plan your food out in advance. At the end of the day all that matters is that your hit your macros/micros. Only you can plan your food plan out because none of us know what you like or don't like.

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 10:53 AM
Thanks for the quick reponses.


Estimating Requirements
The simplest method is to base your intake on a standard 'calories per unit of weight (usually kilograms)'. Typically:
- 26 to 30 kcals/kg/day for normal, healthy individuals with sedentary lifestyles doing little physical activity [12.0-14 kcal/pound]
2200-2500 Cals


1/ Harris-Benedict formula: Very inaccurate. Notorious for OVERESTIMATING requirements, especially in the overweight.
MEN: BMR = 66 + [13.7 x weight (kg)] + [5 x height (cm)] - [6.76 x age (years)]
66 + (13.7 * 83) + (5 * 175.5) - (6.76 * 21) = 1938 Cals


2/Mifflin-St Jeor: It still doesn't take into consideration the differences as a consequence of high BF%. Thus, once again, it OVERESTIMATES NEEDS, ESPECIALLY IN THE OVERWEIGHT.
MEN: BMR = [9.99 x weight (kg)] + [6.25 x height (cm)] - [4.92 x age (years)] + 5
(9.99 * 83) + (6.25 * 175.5) - (4.92 * 21) + 5 = 1828 Cals


3/Katch-McArdle:Considered the most accurate formula for those who are relatively lean. Use ONLY if you have a good estimate of your bodyfat %.
BMR = 370 + (21.6 x LBM)Where LBM = [total weight (kg) x (100 - bodyfat %)]/100
370 + (21.6 * 332/5) = 1804 Cals


To convert BMR to a TOTAL requirement you need to multiply the result of your BMR by an 'activity variable' to give TEE.
The Activity Factor is the TOTAL cost of living, NOT JUST YOUR TRAINING. Think about it - if you train 1 hr a day - WHAT ARE YOU DOING THE OTHER 23 HRS?! So MORE important than training -- it includes work, life activities, training/sport & the TEF of ~15% (an average mixed diet).
Average activity variables are:
1.2 = Sedentary (Desk job, and Little Formal Exercise)
1.3-1.4 = Lightly Active (Light daily activity AND light exercise 1-3 days a week)
1.5-1.6 = Moderately Active (Moderately daily Activity & Moderate exercise 3-5 days a week)
1.7-1.8 = Very Active (Physically demanding lifestyle & Hard exercise 6-7 days a week)
1.9-2.2 = Extremely Active (Athlete in ENDURANCE training or VERY HARD physical job)
im not 100% sure what to choose here. What would be good for desk job(i walk back and forth about 1/10th of my time[around 6 minutes per hour are pure walking]) + moderate activity in the gym?

KayPS
06-25-2013, 10:55 AM
I would start with Katch McArdle, activity multiplier of 1.5, add/subtract 10-20% based on your goals (bulk/cut, respectively), monitor for a few weeks, and adjust as necessary.

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 10:55 AM
Way too much info my man lol. Read the sticky, then start finding food you like and logging it as you eat or you can pre-plan your food out in advance. At the end of the day all that matters is that your hit your macros/micros. Only you can plan your food plan out because none of us know what you like or don't like.

Yeah haha, I do understand that. Maybe what im more asking for is: What are the macros & micros that i need to hit and what are some of the most common ways to hit them.


I would start with Katch McArdle, activity multiplier of 1.5, add/subtract 10-20% based on your goals (bulk/cut, respectively), monitor for a few weeks, and adjust as necessary.

Alright, that puts me at right around 2700 Cals.

SelfMotivated
06-25-2013, 11:04 AM
Alright, that puts me at right around 2700 Cals.

Okay so if you want to lose weight we need to go 10% - 20% below that number, depending on how aggressive you want to go. Just keep in mind that the higher the deficit the more muscle loss.

So as far as your minimum requirements are concerned you need the following:
.82g per pound of body weight for protein
.4g per pound of body weight for fat
No minimum requirement for carbs

Once you hit the minimum requirements for fats and protein the remaining calories and be dispersed however you want between extra protein, fat and carbs.

As far as what foods, it's all personal preference. Here are some quick and easy examples:
Chicken
Fish
Steak
Peanut Butter
Ice Cream
Extra Virgin Olive Oil
Eggs
Vegetables
Fruit
Bread
Rice
Oats
etc.

byukid
06-25-2013, 11:11 AM
Okay so if you want to lose weight we need to go 10% - 20% below that number, depending on how aggressive you want to go. Just keep in mind that the higher the deficit the more muscle loss.

So as far as your minimum requirements are concerned you need the following:
.82g per pound of body weight for protein
.4g per pound of body weight for fat
No minimum requirement for carbs

Once you hit the minimum requirements for fats and protein the remaining calories and be dispersed however you want between extra protein, fat and carbs.

As far as what foods, it's all personal preference. Here are some quick and easy examples:
Chicken
Fish
Steak
Peanut Butter
Ice Cream
Extra Virgin Olive Oil
Eggs
Vegetables
Fruit
Bread
Rice
Oats
etc.

For the multipliers, you use total bodyweight and not lbm?

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 11:13 AM
Alright, and what if i want to gain muscle and put the fat loss to the side for now? Do i only eat at my TDEE? or do i go a little above? Do i still keep those macros?

WonderPug
06-25-2013, 11:13 AM
For the multipliers, you use total bodyweight and not lbm?Which multiplier?

SelfMotivated
06-25-2013, 11:14 AM
For the multipliers, you use total bodyweight and not lbm?

Yes sir.

byukid
06-25-2013, 11:15 AM
Which multiplier?

protein and fat. Makes quite the difference. I had been going by lbm for both. I will readjust now.

WonderPug
06-25-2013, 11:23 AM
protein and fat. Makes quite the difference. I had been going by lbm for both. I will readjust now.If you're 335 pounds, then your nutrition requirements are somewhat different than would be the case for a normal weight or even overweight or class 1 obese individual.

Can you confirm your bodyweight and height please?

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 11:25 AM
If you're 335 pounds, then your nutrition requirements are somewhat different than would be the case for a normal weight or even overweight or class 1 obese individual.

Can you confirm your bodyweight and height please?

Right, i wouldnt think byukid needs to set his macros for his weight if the bf% is really high...

byukid
06-25-2013, 11:25 AM
If you're 335 pounds, then your nutrition requirements are somewhat different than would be the case for a normal weight or even overweight or class 1 obese individual.

Can you confirm your bodyweight and height please?

335 was one month ago. Have been on 2750 calories over the past month, shooting for 200 g of protein and 90 g of fat, the rest of my calories mixed. 6'2" for height. Have continued to see progress with respect to looser clothing and belt holes. Am picking up a scale this friday when I get paid for weight tracking.

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 11:25 AM
So as far as your minimum requirements are concerned you need the following:
.82g per pound of body weight for protein
.4g per pound of body weight for fat
No minimum requirement for carbs

What made you pick these proportions?

WonderPug
06-25-2013, 11:26 AM
Right, i wouldnt think byukid needs to set his macros for his weight if the bf% is really high...Not exactly.

Dietary fat requirements would be vastly lower, protein requirements would be based on lean body mass (or target weight), total caloric intake can be more acutely titrated, etc.


335 was one month ago. Have been on 2750 calories over the past month, shooting for 200 g of protein and 90 g of fat, the rest of my calories mixed. 6'2" for height. Have continued to see progress with respect to looser clothing and belt holes. Am picking up a scale this friday when I get paid for weight tracking.
As long as you're getting EFA, you don't need to consume much additional fat at this stage unless you want to.

Protein intake of 150 grams is more than enough.

CHO intake is up to you, but at your weight you might have metabolic syndrom or worse so a ketogenic diet might have special benefits.




What made you pick these proportions?Protein intake is based on the highest intake justifiably by any research. Dietary fat intake is generally based on clinical observations.

byukid
06-25-2013, 11:32 AM
Not exactly.

Dietary fat requirements would be vastly lower, protein requirements would be based on lean body mass (or target weight), total caloric intake can be more acutely titrated, etc.


As long as you're getting EFA, you don't need to consume much additional fat at this stage unless you want to.

Protein intake of 150 grams is more than enough.

CHO intake is up to you, but at your weight you might have metabolic syndrom or worse so a ketogenic diet might have special benefits.



Protein intake is based on the highest intake justifiably by any research. Dietary fat intake is generally based on clinical observations.


Basically I just set all my calorie requirements and macros based on my goal weight. I don't mind the extra fat- it's satiating. Otherwise I'm just going to keep on the calorie deficit train until I've adapted, then I'll readjust.

WonderPug
06-25-2013, 11:35 AM
Basically I just set all my calorie requirements and macros based on my goal weight. I don't mind the extra fat- it's satiating. Otherwise I'm just going to keep on the calorie deficit train until I've adapted, then I'll readjust.That sounds like a great plan.

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 11:45 AM
What about timings? How big of a deal is it to eat certain things at certain times? Like do I NEED to have something like gummy bears right after i workout? Stuff like that

WonderPug
06-25-2013, 11:49 AM
What about timings? How big of a deal is it to eat certain things at certain times? Like do I NEED to have something like gummy bears right after i workout? Stuff like thatYou're kidding, right?

You don't have to eat candy at any specific time of the day or ever.

KayPS
06-25-2013, 11:50 AM
What about timings? How big of a deal is it to eat certain things at certain times? Like do I NEED to have something like gummy bears right after i workout? Stuff like that

See here (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=123915821). Follow the advice in this thread, and you'll be on the right track, OP.

EDIT: Ugh, didn't see about gummy bears. Just read about meal timing. Last I checked, gummy bears were not essential for bodybuilding.

SelfMotivated
06-25-2013, 11:51 AM
What about timings? How big of a deal is it to eat certain things at certain times? Like do I NEED to have something like gummy bears right after i workout? Stuff like that

Meal timing is largely irrelevant. Keep it simple and just eat when you're hungry. If you workout better with some food in your belly then eat something small like an hour or so before your workout. If you workout better fasted, then don't eat anything, it's ALL personal preference. There are no magical windows of opportunity, that's just a marketing gimmick for supplement ads.

SandSnip3r
06-25-2013, 12:32 PM
haha alright, thanks a lot guys, so now i understand where my caloric intake needs to be(around 2700 Cals +/- 10%-20% depending on what my goals are) and what i should be consuming as far as macronutrients (Near 150g of protein and 74g of fat).

Just some clarification, if my main goal is to gain strength and ignore fatloss for the time being, are these macronutrients right? Or do the macronutrient requirements change from wanting to lose fat to wanting to gain muscle?

And KayPS, why did you suggest using the 1.5 multiplier?

SelfMotivated
06-25-2013, 12:38 PM
haha alright, thanks a lot guys, so now i understand where my caloric intake needs to be(around 2700 Cals +/- 10%-20% depending on what my goals are) and what i should be consuming as far as macronutrients (Near 150g of protein and 74g of fat).

Just some clarification, if my main goal is to gain strength and ignore fatloss for the time being, are these macronutrients right? Or do the macronutrient requirements change from wanting to lose fat to wanting to gain muscle?

Gaining weight (both muscle and some fat) is dependent upon eating more calories than you burn. Conversely losing weight is just the opposite, burning more calories than you eat. The minimum macro requirements (.4g and .82g) for fats and protein will not change based on your goal, the only thing that will change is the total number of calories.

KayPS
06-25-2013, 12:46 PM
haha alright, thanks a lot guys, so now i understand where my caloric intake needs to be(around 2700 Cals +/- 10%-20% depending on what my goals are) and what i should be consuming as far as macronutrients (Near 150g of protein and 74g of fat).

Just some clarification, if my main goal is to gain strength and ignore fatloss for the time being, are these macronutrients right? Or do the macronutrient requirements change from wanting to lose fat to wanting to gain muscle?

And KayPS, why did you suggest using the 1.5 multiplier?

Because I would guess that anyone who is on this site, exercises on a regular basis, and is trying to take their nutrition and fitness goals seriously probably doesn't lie around on the couch the rest of the day, regardless if his/her job is sedentary. And so, I recommend 1.5. Plus, it's a good midway point to start with if you're not sure.

SandSnip3r
07-01-2013, 08:43 PM
Ok, so, for the last week i aimed for ~2260 cal per day. At the end of the week i totaled 601 cals under that goal (so really around 2174 cals per day).
Here are my macros (in grams) (aiming for 150g protein and 75g fat starting )
Monday: 103 protein, 56 fat, 231 carbs
Tuesday: 143 protein, 75 fat, 266 carbs
Wednesday: 119 protein, 111 fat, 286 carbs
Thursday: 150 protein, 75 fat, 270 carbs
Friday: 190 protein, 79 fat, 223 carbs
Saturday: 159 protein, 101 fat, 365 carbs
Sunday: 127 protein, 60 fat, 341 carbs

I gained 2.5 lbs from monday(24) to monday(Today), is there any reason why?

SandSnip3r
07-02-2013, 11:47 AM
bump