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shroomed
04-23-2013, 03:53 PM
Trying to figure out nutrition wise what is the bad part. Example of burger king nutrient info

http://www.bk.com/en/us/menu-nutrition/lunch-and-dinner-menu-202/fire-grilled-burgers-220/double-cheeseburger-m10/index.html

Calories aren't too bad and there's plenty of protein. There is trans fat and cholesterol though, and a load of sodium. Is that "it"?

kenny85
04-23-2013, 04:09 PM
A lot of processed meat, mainly in fast food burgers. A lot of soy meat burgers

snorkelman
04-23-2013, 04:10 PM
A lot of soy meat burgers

where the hell are you finding soy meat burgers at a fast food joint?

rand18m
04-23-2013, 04:14 PM
Trying to figure out nutrition wise what is the bad part. Example of burger king nutrient info

http://www.bk.com/en/us/menu-nutrition/lunch-and-dinner-menu-202/fire-grilled-burgers-220/double-cheeseburger-m10/index.html

Calories aren't too bad and there's plenty of protein. There is trans fat and cholesterol though, and a load of sodium. Is that "it"?

That's a very good question and a point I have made here many times. As far as trans fats go, those would be naturally occurring trans fats unless there are some in the bun. You should avoid artificial trans fats, dietary cholesterol has little to no affect on serum cholesterol levels in the vast majority of people.

Remember, total daily nutrition, energy balance and nutrient sufficiency is what matters.

bambam601
04-23-2013, 04:20 PM
where the hell are you finding soy meat burgers at a fast food joint?

lol, this^.

KobiDC
04-23-2013, 04:29 PM
there arguably isn't one, considering that your net energy balance and intake of nutrients isn't dictated by one meal. if you ONLY eat at burger joints however, then I'm willing to bet you'd run into a micronutrient deficiency problem

also, dietary cholesterol has little influence on serum cholesterol levels, and sodium isn't usually an issue for most people unless you're drinking soy sauce or something...

kenny85
04-23-2013, 04:44 PM
where the hell are you finding soy meat burgers at a fast food joint?

What I mean is those burgers are not 100% beef. A lot of soy in the burgers

synkestrel
04-23-2013, 04:56 PM
That's a very good question and a point I have made here many times. As far as trans fats go, those would be naturally occurring trans fats unless there are some in the bun. You should avoid artificial trans fats, dietary cholesterol has little to no affect on serum cholesterol levels in the vast majority of people.

Remember, total daily nutrition, energy balance and nutrient sufficiency is what matters.

most the toxic chemicals are in the bread product / fried foods. Transfat isnt your only worry. Also fast food is usually so processed that micronutrients barely exist.

Dimaline312000
04-23-2013, 05:19 PM
I think the fact that it's so processed is probably the biggest issue. You're always hearing something about Processed foods causing cancer or some type of disease or just generally not being good for you. People on here stress the improtance of eating whole foods over processed foods becasue of the difference in Micronutriton between the two. I work at a Fast Food Joint (McDonalds) and as an employee you're always allowed to eat or bring home 1 meal during or after working and I am one of those people who almost always do just for the conveince of it. After a long hard day of cooking food you really don't wanna go home and cook again and you can't always prepare your meals before hand. Now I've learned to make healthier choices like today I brought home a Grilled Chicken Sandwitch which it's still processed chicken but it's the lesser of 2 evils in that it's not Fried and Processed Chicken and it's not Fried and Processed Beef. If you only eat it every once in a while you should be fine and not have to worry about it. I couldn't say what even that one meal is doing to the inside of your body but overall if you're only doing it once in a while and not having a constant diet of Fast Food that I'm not sure you'd have to worry about your overall health. I mean even 1 Big Mac a day probably wouldn't hurt you, sure there are better ways to eat that many calories but I'm not sure I could say it's such a bad thing to eat it. This is a really good question and I'm glad you asked it becasue it's something like what I've been wondering about as far as what exactally it's doing to my body besides adding fat. Would like to touch more on this subject later but I've rambled on enough for now.

KobiDC
04-23-2013, 05:26 PM
I think the fact that it's so processed is probably the biggest issue. You're always hearing something about Processed foods causing cancer or some type of disease or just generally not being good for you. People on here stress the improtance of eating whole foods over processed foods becasue of the difference in Micronutriton between the two. I work at a Fast Food Joint (McDonalds) and as an employee you're always allowed to eat or bring home 1 meal during or after working and I am one of those people who almost always do just for the conveince of it. After a long hard day of cooking food you really don't wanna go home and cook again and you can't always prepare your meals before hand. Now I've learned to make healthier choices like today I brought home a Grilled Chicken Sandwitch which it's still processed chicken but it's the lesser of 2 evils in that it's not Fried and Processed Chicken and it's not Fried and Processed Beef. If you only eat it every once in a while you should be fine and not have to worry about it. I couldn't say what even that one meal is doing to the inside of your body but overall if you're only doing it once in a while and not having a constant diet of Fast Food that I'm not sure you'd have to worry about your overall health. I mean even 1 Big Mac a day probably wouldn't hurt you, sure there are better ways to eat that many calories but I'm not sure I could say it's such a bad thing to eat it. This is a really good question and I'm glad you asked it becasue it's something like what I've been wondering about as far as what exactally it's doing to my body besides adding fat. Would like to touch more on this subject later but I've rambled on enough for now.


Whey protein is processed (twice through lol) and it has a better nutritional profile compared to it's 'whole food counterparts'. Whey also scores higher in standard protein ranking methods (biological value, net protein utilization, protein efficiency ratio etc) than beef, eggs, milk, etc. All in all, it's a great protein source regardless of it being processed or not.

Processed doesn't automatically mean the food is 'evil', and not all processed foods deserve the demerit they receive. Nearly all supplements are processed, but it doesn't stop them from being beneficial... 'processed vs. clean' is not a reliable judgement method for foods.

rand18m
04-23-2013, 05:27 PM
most the toxic chemicals are in the bread product / fried foods. Transfat isnt your only worry. Also fast food is usually so processed that micronutrients barely exist.

That's not remotely correct.

What if I told you that a cheeseburger from McDonalds has more nutrients than a meal consisting of chicken and brown rice? Would you believe me? You should!

This subject has been beaten to death on this forum, use the search feature and you'll find many threads and some more detailed discussions.

What "toxic chemicals" are you referring to specifically?

vimalancity
04-23-2013, 06:00 PM
Trying to figure out nutrition wise what is the bad part. Example of burger king nutrient info

http://www.bk.com/en/us/menu-nutrition/lunch-and-dinner-menu-202/fire-grilled-burgers-220/double-cheeseburger-m10/index.html

Calories aren't too bad and there's plenty of protein. There is trans fat and cholesterol though, and a load of sodium. Is that "it"?

Just the damn trans fat, lack of micronutrients and fiber. That's it. Dietary cholesterol has no effect on blood cholesterol. Sodium doesn't create huge issues with bloog pressure. That's it.

synkestrel
04-23-2013, 06:04 PM
That's not remotely correct.

What if I told you that a cheeseburger from McDonalds has more nutrients than a meal consisting of chicken and brown rice? Would you believe me? You should!

This subject has been beaten to death on this forum, use the search feature and you'll find many threads and some more detailed discussions.

What "toxic chemicals" are you referring to specifically?

if it is not remotely correct then you shall provide evidence to refute the claim, likewise I will provide evidence to back mine:

questionable ingredients in big mac bun bolded:

Enriched flour (bleached wheat flour, malted barley flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamin mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid), water, high fructose corn syrup and/or sugar,
yeast, soybean oil and/or canola oil, contains 2% or less of the following: salt, wheat gluten, calcium sulfate, calcium carbonate, ammonium sulfate, ammonium
chloride, dough conditioners (may contain one or more of the following: sodium stearoyl lactylate, datem, ascorbic acid, azodicarbonamide, mono- and diglycerides,
ethoxylated monoglycerides, monocalcium phosphate, enzymes, guar gum, calcium peroxide), sorbic acid, calcium propionate and/or sodium propionate
(preservatives), soy lecithin, sesame seed.
CONTAINS: WHEAT AND SOY LECITHIN.

lovingit
04-23-2013, 06:05 PM
You can get grilled chicken sandwich or burger, a nice salad, and a baked potato from Wendy's. Seems ok to me.

I also enjoy Chick Fil A grilled chicken salads.

eta: Synthetic, is that you?

rand18m
04-23-2013, 06:13 PM
if it is not remotely correct then you shall provide evidence to refute the claim, likewise I will provide evidence to back mine:

questionable ingredients in big mac bun bolded:

Enriched flour (bleached wheat flour, malted barley flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamin mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid), water, high fructose corn syrup and/or sugar,
yeast, soybean oil and/or canola oil, contains 2% or less of the following: salt, wheat gluten, calcium sulfate, calcium carbonate, ammonium sulfate, ammonium
chloride, dough conditioners (may contain one or more of the following: sodium stearoyl lactylate, datem, ascorbic acid, azodicarbonamide, mono- and diglycerides,
ethoxylated monoglycerides, monocalcium phosphate, enzymes, guar gum, calcium peroxide), sorbic acid, calcium propionate and/or sodium propionate
(preservatives), soy lecithin, sesame seed.
CONTAINS: WHEAT AND SOY LECITHIN.

You still haven't shown any toxic chemicals. Were those toxic chemicals they wouldn't be in there long!! ;)
Try again!

synkestrel
04-23-2013, 06:36 PM
You still haven't shown any toxic chemicals. Were those toxic chemicals they wouldn't be in there long!! ;)
Try again!

fda allows a certain percentage of toxic chemicals. it seems they removed tbhq/bht from the bread but it can still be found in other products of their's

rand18m
04-23-2013, 06:47 PM
fda allows a certain percentage of toxic chemicals. it seems they removed tbhq/bht from the bread but it can still be found in other products of their's

It's a straw man calling these things "toxic chemicals". You ingest arsenic daily, assuming of course you drink water, however that certainly can be a toxic chemical, but not in those quantities.

For example for some reason people seem to think that preservatives are harmful simply because they can't pronounce the names, when in fact preservatives are a very integral part of keeping our food supply safe for everyone.

Dimaline312000
04-23-2013, 06:47 PM
Whey protein is processed (twice through lol) and it has a better nutritional profile compared to it's 'whole food counterparts'. Whey also scores higher in standard protein ranking methods (biological value, net protein utilization, protein efficiency ratio etc) than beef, eggs, milk, etc. All in all, it's a great protein source regardless of it being processed or not.

Processed doesn't automatically mean the food is 'evil', and not all processed foods deserve the demerit they receive. Nearly all supplements are processed, but it doesn't stop them from being beneficial...b.

Very good point and thanks for the clarifications. I'm not saying that processed food doesn't still have nutriton to it but I guess that would prompt my question as to why Whole Foods are more recommended than Processed Foods? I mean I'm sure that Whole Foods do have more nutritonal value than Processed but aren't you putting more (bad) chemicals in your body by eating Processed than Whole Foods? Sure you can find Processed foods in you grocery store just as easily as going to McDonalds or Burger King, but I guess the more of concern about Fast Food is what it's doing to your overall health once you eat. Sure a Salad from McDonalds is no less nutritonal than a salad you find in a grocery store but does it make a difference if you put a Fried Chicken Breast from McDonalds on top of the Salad like you can order from McD's Vs Buying some whole Chicken in your grocer's freezer taking it home an frying it yourself and putting it on top of your store bought salad? Just seems to me the more chemicals in the food the worse off it is and it seems like Processed foods have more Chemicals in them than whole foods.


'processed vs. clean' is not a reliable judgement method for foods.



I mean even you are saying Processed Foods Vs Clean Foods so I mean just in that you're almost agreeing with me that Processed isn't good.

x-ray vision
04-23-2013, 06:57 PM
What I mean is those burgers are not 100% beef. A lot of soy in the burgers
Where are you getting your info? BK's beef patties are 100% beef. Why not check the ingredients from the very website you linked to?

http://www.bk.com/cms/en/us/cms_out/digital_assets/files/pages/MenuNutritionInformation_April2013_1.pdf

DatMurse
04-23-2013, 07:15 PM
You still haven't shown any toxic chemicals. Were those toxic chemicals they wouldn't be in there long!! ;)
Try again!

It wasnt until recently that they removed ammonia hydroxide from the products.

Maybe I do have a fear of foods but I refuse to eat mcdonalds. I always feel that they are garbage, and it is the face of **** quality chains to me.

I love chik fil a. I also love chipotle, I would rather go to taco bell.

It just has to do with the representation of it, the history, and I will never forget the old days before the chicken nuggets looked like strips.

When I was younger, I bit into one and chicken sludge came out the other end.
foreverhaunted

Same thing goes with these cheap chinese restaurants. If I cut into chicken and I dont see strips I am not eating that.

Scrabbz
04-23-2013, 07:16 PM
As a person who works at a BK, I must say, the real problem for "fast food" being bad comes in really only 2 forms: add-ons and portion size.

For instance: you go to your favorite burger joint and what are you going to buy? A burger. Sweet. Let's say you grab a Whopper. That's not terrible, even if you throw the cheese on (drop the mayo though, just my personal taste.) But then wait, what goes with burgers? Fries! Onion Rings! Curly Fries! So we add those on. And my oh my, doesn't that milkshake look tasty? I'll take one of them too.

What happens here is that you see a small amount of food packing a metric-ton of calories. A medium fry alone has almost as many calories as a Whopper without cheese and mayo. So right there you're netting about 900kclas or so. You might say, "The Whopper isn't small!" and no, no it's not, hence it's name sake. But how easy is it to tack on those small extras like the fries, the cookie, the cinnamon roll, the milkshake ect? $1 to supersize? It's that simple. THAT'S the problem with fast food. The simplicity of the food and the amount of calories in those small additions.

I'll be honest, I get a tendergrill every time I stop in to a BK. Nothing wrong with it if it fits my calorie intake and macros for the day. But that's all I get, maybe Apple slices if I crave a sweet side. It's just you need to be careful about the extras, because they're what will sneak up on you.

DatMurse
04-23-2013, 07:22 PM
As a person who works at a BK, I must say, the real problem for "fast food" being bad comes in really only 2 forms: add-ons and portion size.

For instance: you go to your favorite burger joint and what are you going to buy? A burger. Sweet. Let's say you grab a Whopper. That's not terrible, even if you throw the cheese on (drop the mayo though, just my personal taste.) But then wait, what goes with burgers? Fries! Onion Rings! Curly Fries! So we add those on. And my oh my, doesn't that milkshake look tasty? I'll take one of them too.

What happens here is that you see a small amount of food packing a metric-ton of calories. A medium fry alone has almost as many calories as a Whopper without cheese and mayo. So right there you're netting about 900kclas or so. You might say, "The Whopper isn't small!" and no, no it's not, hence it's name sake. But how easy is it to tack on those small extras like the fries, the cookie, the cinnamon roll, the milkshake ect? $1 to supersize? It's that simple. THAT'S the problem with fast food. The simplicity of the food and the amount of calories in those small additions.

I'll be honest, I get a tendergrill every time I stop in to a BK. Nothing wrong with it if it fits my calorie intake and macros for the day. But that's all I get, maybe Apple slices if I crave a sweet side. It's just you need to be careful about the extras, because they're what will sneak up on you.

You reminded me. Restaurant cleanliness is always a big issue to me. it is more associated with fast food restaurants to me.

I also forgot the whole ****ty thing of transmission of organisms. I have seen too many times where fast food employees touch money,trash, wipe their pants, and handle food.

I am not a germ freak when it comes to sharing things with my friends. If they handle trash or their place looks like **** i am not going to eat there. Regardless of what place it is.
Fast food employees always seem unhappy and they dont care about their job. I would assume they didnt care about hygiene either.

Chik fil a and chipotle are different stories

kenny85
04-23-2013, 07:23 PM
Where are you getting your info? BK's beef patties are 100% beef. Why not check the ingredients from the very website you linked to?

http://www.bk.com/cms/en/us/cms_out/digital_assets/files/pages/MenuNutritionInformation_April2013_1.pdf


I didn't link anything

Scrabbz
04-23-2013, 07:27 PM
You reminded me. Restaurant cleanliness is always a big issue to me. it is more associated with fast food restaurants to me.

I also forgot the whole ****ty thing of transmission of organisms. I have seen too many times where fast food employees touch money,trash, wipe their pants, and handle food.

I am not a germ freak when it comes to sharing things with my friends. If they handle trash or their place looks like **** i am not going to eat there. Regardless of what place it is.
Fast food employees always seem unhappy and they dont care about their job. I would assume they didnt care about hygiene either.

Chik fil a and chipotle are different stories

Eh, as for how the employees act and the state of the restaurant, I figure you could argue that anywhere, whether it be a Wendy's or an Olive Garden. Typically I run a tight ship on myself when I make food, at work or home. But yeah, you'll find some people just don't care but again, you could find that at any restaurant. Depends on the people I think, less so the actual establishment.

DatMurse
04-23-2013, 07:37 PM
Eh, as for how the employees act and the state of the restaurant, I figure you could argue that anywhere, whether it be a Wendy's or an Olive Garden. Typically I run a tight ship on myself when I make food, at work or home. But yeah, you'll find some people just don't care but again, you could find that at any restaurant. Depends on the people I think, less so the actual establishment.

personal experience it is more associated with fast food restaurants.

i got food poisoning at olive garden btw so its on my **** list out here.

note to self:do not get calamari in east texas.
that was my fault. No reason for **** quality control though

I would like to add I try to buy foods that promote animal rights. They have the right to be my food but they shouldnt have to be tortured.
If the price isnt ridiculous and it is in front of me I will buy what I can.
I am looking for the study of heavy metals in grass fed beef vs corn fed. cant seem to find anything on it though

JaredPunch
04-23-2013, 07:39 PM
It's not bad for you
Don't know, sounds like the argument that fresh mozzarella, sliced tomatoes and a slice of bread is a clean meal but if you combine them together and buy a pizza you're eating a dirty/fast food. Doesn't make sense to me.

There's a certain amount of preservatives but they're in every prepackaged food including quick-cooking brown rice, whole wheat bread, protein powders... but I haven't seen any evidence those preservative are really bad for one's health or that the amount allowed is such to be dangerous even if your diet was nothing but fast food.

Scrabbz
04-23-2013, 07:43 PM
personal experience it is more associated with fast food restaurants.
To each their own. Nothing wrong with your views.

Can't say I'm too fond of tortured animals myself.

x-ray vision
04-23-2013, 07:45 PM
I didn't link anything
Confused you with the OP. But you're still the one that said there's a lot of soy in the burgers.

determined4000
04-23-2013, 07:54 PM
its not about the macros its about the lack of micros
AND
trans fat, added sodium, preservatives etc

synkestrel
04-23-2013, 08:01 PM
It's a straw man calling these things "toxic chemicals". You ingest arsenic daily, assuming of course you drink water, however that certainly can be a toxic chemical, but not in those quantities.

For example for some reason people seem to think that preservatives are harmful simply because they can't pronounce the names, when in fact preservatives are a very integral part of keeping our food supply safe for everyone.

incorrect, it is to keep PROFITS safe by preserving the food so that there is no loss due to maximized shelf time.

RussianGerman
04-23-2013, 08:02 PM
the process the food, especially the meat, goes through during its journey onto your plate.

DatMurse
04-23-2013, 08:14 PM
incorrect, it is to keep PROFITS safe by preserving the food so that there is no loss due to maximized shelf time.
some of it is safety, some of it is to maximize shelf time.

JaredPunch
04-23-2013, 08:19 PM
its not about the macros its about the lack of micros


I don't think a pizza or hamburger lacks micros
Might check the USDA database but bread and meat on a burger have quite the same B vitamins, magnesium, salenium, iron etc of your average meat and bread

determined4000
04-23-2013, 08:20 PM
some of it is safety, some of it is to maximize shelf time.in the long term your health is far safer eating fresh foods not preservatives

determined4000
04-23-2013, 08:31 PM
enriched flour does not have the same micronutrient content as whole grains
processed beef does not have the same as grass fed
they are also made with trans fats
I don't think a pizza or hamburger lacks micros
Might check the USDA database but bread and meat on a burger have quite the same B vitamins, magnesium, salenium, iron etc of your average meat and bread

ErikTheElectric
04-23-2013, 08:46 PM
1. Trans fats most of the time
2. Crappy quality of food
3. it's pre-made, it's been sitting for an extended period of time..


Worked in 5 fast food places, all the same. Would never eat there.

LiftCore
04-23-2013, 09:18 PM
1. Trans fats most of the time
2. Crappy quality of food
3. it's pre-made, it's been sitting for an extended period of time..


Worked in 5 fast food places, all the same. Would never eat there.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a lot of fast food joints don't have trans fats in their food anymore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans_fat#Major_users.27_response

Inb4 wikipedia

I have a hard time finding artificial trans fats on most foods now, where I live anyway.

@OP: There isn't anything particularly wrong with most fast food. Where the problem lies is how fast food sits in people's diets. The reason why fast food is linked to obesity is because things like McD's offer a chit tonne of calories in most of their meals, and their stuff just isn't satiating, so people will eat more to be full. This combined with a lack of micronutrients and fibre causes further health issues. To top it off, it is safe to assume that the people who base their diet on fast food and micronutrient deficient food are also the ones who don't excersise, and most likely drink alcohol too. This only creates a higher potential for a larger excess in calories + even more health issues.

determined4000
04-23-2013, 09:29 PM
@ liftcore
What is listed on the label of trans fat and what is actually trans fat is not the same
look at the ingredients
anything with mono or diglycerides (preety much in all bread/baked prodcuts) or hydrogenated or refractionated oil is trans fat

and most places put hydrogenated vegetable oils on their flat grill tops to cook the meats

Christiffer
04-23-2013, 09:30 PM
Stressing about what food you're gonna eat next is probably worse for you than consuming some fast food in moderation. If I'm out and I'm hungry, hell yeah I'll eat a McDonalds burger. Angus mushroom and swiss FTW!! Stressing it causes more problems than some trans fat!

determined4000
04-23-2013, 09:38 PM
Mcdonalds bun
Enriched flour (bleached wheat flour, malted barley flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamin mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid), water, high fructose corn syrup and/or sugar,yeast, soybean oil and/or canola oil, contains 2% or less of the following: salt, wheat gluten, calcium sulfate, calcium carbonate, ammonium sulfate, ammonium
chloride, dough conditioners (may contain one or more of the following: sodium stearoyl lactylate, datem, ascorbic acid, azodicarbonamide, mono- and diglycerides,
ethoxylated monoglycerides, monocalcium phosphate, enzymes, guar gum, calcium peroxide), sorbic acid, calcium propionate and/or sodium propionate
(preservatives), soy lecithin, sesame seed.
CONTAINS: WHEAT AND SOY LECITHIN.


So basically any burger, sandwich, the wraps. they all have trans fat NOT even accounting for the meat or cooking process

ErikTheElectric
04-23-2013, 09:43 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but a lot of fast food joints don't have trans fats in their food anymore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans_fat#Major_users.27_responseThe ones that I've worked at still have, as well as MSG too.
In my opinion, it's nice to take a day off.. and dine out once and a while.. but most fast food places, it's just a complete hit or a miss. And you never really know.

Even if they aren't using trans fats, I'd still prefer a "quality" meal at a sit down place. But if I'm pressed for time, there's nothing really terrible about stopping at wendys for a chicken sand which.

DatMurse
04-23-2013, 09:45 PM
in the long term your health is far safer eating fresh foods not preservatives
based off of what?

Christiffer
04-23-2013, 09:49 PM
And a fair portion of all bread products contain trans fat but are you going to seclude yourself from the world because you're scared to consume food from the majority of places available outside your home. Not to mention even some whole wheat/ whole grain bread contains trans fat. Get over it!

determined4000
04-23-2013, 09:55 PM
tbh I dont buy breads with those ingredients and I dont feel deprived not eating fast food burgers
I enjoy cooking for myself and would prefer to spend less money on better tasting food
IMO fast food is only good for those prioritizing convenience
I am someone who also doesnt buy coffee at a dunkin or starbucks either
I prefer to save my money and make it at home

And a fair portion of all bread products contain trans fat but are you going to seclude yourself from the world because you're scared to consume food from the majority of places available outside your home. Not to mention even some whole wheat/ whole grain bread contains trans fat. Get over it!

JaredPunch
04-23-2013, 09:58 PM
So basically any burger, sandwich, the wraps. they all have trans fat NOT even accounting for the meat or cooking process

such a minimum amount of trans-fat is not going to have any effect in the body


IMO fast food is only good for those prioritizing convenience

To me is good for being social, it's a place I love to go with friends, you can eat at whatever time, for little money
and in an unformal place unlike restaurants, so it's my choice when hanging out with friends, eating something, chatting
and taste is great in my opinion

determined4000
04-23-2013, 10:08 PM
my comments are in answering the question
not telling others what to do

AirForceV
04-23-2013, 10:09 PM
not a damn thing


best **** for bulking/10

Christiffer
04-23-2013, 10:34 PM
my comments are in answering the question
not telling others what to do

OP acknowledged the trans fat and basically asked if there was anything else to worry about.

I know your about Micros and trans fat "doesn't fit your macros" as you say but you can eat like a normal person without eating like a dumb@ss. Synthetic much? You don't have to be extremely ocd and rigid to be healthy and attain your fitness goals. All or nothing mindsets only cause problems. You of anyone should know that.

JaredPunch
04-23-2013, 10:53 PM
I know your about Micros and trans fat "doesn't fit your macros" as you say but you can eat like a normal person without eating like a dumb@ss. Synthetic much? You don't have to be extremely ocd and rigid to be healthy and attain your fitness goals.

It's useless anyway. I know this person who eats everything organic, buy food from farms, never touch anything processed or from a supermarket. He is always sick and way less healthy than me. Maybe because I have the most important things covered calories, average micro intake, rest, exercise.

In my opinion someone who eats organic/healthy/non-processed 100% of the time is not going to be any healthier than someone eating that 80% of the time just way more stressed.

desslok
04-23-2013, 11:17 PM
Why does everyone AlWAYS make sweeping generlizations about fast food? ITT, the only fast food you can possibly get at any of the million + fast food places is a bigmac on buns.

DatMurse
04-23-2013, 11:40 PM
Why does everyone AlWAYS make sweeping generlizations about fast food? ITT, the only fast food you can possibly get at any of the million + fast food places is a bigmac on buns.

mcdonalds is the face of face food
its like when we talk about white people and obama

LarryWVUUSAF
04-24-2013, 02:30 AM
lots of stuff, i eat it maybe once a week if that. If i do fried food ill make it myself which is for my cheat day

transformerchad
04-24-2013, 02:43 AM
The only thing bad is the processed ingredients and trans fats , lack of nutrients in some ... thats about it

Apex702
04-24-2013, 04:33 AM
It's a simple choice.

Eat fast food--IIFYM
Avoid fast food--IIFYM

Unless one's diet consists of a disproportionate amount of fast food I would say your concerning yourself with minutiae.

Sherjav
04-24-2013, 04:52 AM
Fast foods and other processed foods give you tons of calories without much micronutrient content, But hey now your thinking ''I can always pop in a mutli and be ok?'' while you are in fact right, you can eat junk food and still get in shape with the calories intake vs calories burned approach. However, eating a clean diet with a variety of whole foods provides the body with everything it needs to function at its best and get optimum performance during workouts which is you really need to improve in the gym overall. One example I can give is green veggies contain a exellent source of folate who's main purpose is demethylation in our bodies. So when you eat eggs(the perfect protien) for breakfast then have lunch with some veggies, the cholesterol from the eggs will get converted to to many hormones your body needs especially testosterone which we all know increases muscle mass along with many other things, and the folate will also help in formation of a variety of amines and improve gene expression from your DNA resulting a better performing body.

Basically all I am saying is eating clean will help your body be more efficient at meeting its demands versus eating a junk diet where the end result is the same. The human body is amazing at adapting to anything you need to survive but if you give it clean foods will function at its best versus eating junk foods which will still help you reach your end goal but will provide less support.

and by the way, companies took advantage of the labeling loophole that allowed any content under .5 grams to be listed as zero. Considering that the American Heart Association suggests a 2 gram/day ceiling on trans fat intake (based on a 2000 calorie/day diet), it seems pretty likely that processed food consumers still have a solid chance of meeting that limit and then some. Ignorance may be bliss to these folks, but it’s not well-being.

nae25
04-24-2013, 04:54 AM
IIFYM.... eat that ****!

x-ray vision
04-24-2013, 04:57 AM
One example I can give is green veggies contain a exellent source of folate who's main purpose is demethylation in our bodies. So when you eat eggs(the perfect protien) for breakfast then have lunch with some veggies, the cholesterol from the eggs will get converted to to many hormones your body needs especially testosterone which we all know increases muscle mass along with many other things, and the folate will also help in formation of a variety of amines and improve gene expression from your DNA resulting a better performing body.
Good point, Sherjav. Hopefully some day green vegetables and eggs will be available at fast food restaurants, and when we choose to eat at those restaurants, we won't be forced to get all of our food from there. Some day.

rand18m
04-24-2013, 06:42 AM
incorrect, it is to keep PROFITS safe by preserving the food so that there is no loss due to maximized shelf time.

You don't think keeping food safe is good for the bottom line?

Food preservation techniques have been going on for many millennia. From temp to PH control to smoke techniques, all designed and developed to keep our food safe. Without preservatives your food choices would be quite small. And you seem to have some aversion to food preservatives, based on your use of the term "toxic chemicals" however you've provided no evidence of any harmful effects of modern food preservatives, and you likely won't find any.

rand18m
04-24-2013, 06:44 AM
@ liftcore
What is listed on the label of trans fat and what is actually trans fat is not the same
look at the ingredients
anything with mono or diglycerides (preety much in all bread/baked prodcuts) or hydrogenated or refractionated oil is trans fat

and most places put hydrogenated vegetable oils on their flat grill tops to cook the meats

According to FDA rules trans fats in quantities over .5g must be listed as trans fat content.

x-ray vision
04-24-2013, 06:48 AM
Good article regarding preservatives:

http://www.eufic.org/page/en/faqid/preservatives-harmful-eat-regularly/

snorkelman
04-24-2013, 06:59 AM
http://i35.tinypic.com/315nb6g.jpg

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/mcdonalds-burger-that-looks-the-same-as-day-it-was-cooked-14-years-ago/story-e6frf7jo-1226628424189

Bergivation
04-24-2013, 07:17 AM
What you all are forgetting is the "100% Beef" doesn't take into account that most hamburgers are made with beef that is nearly 50% fat -- Saturated fats that do major damage inside of our bodies in the long run. You shouldn't be neglecting health risks just because "I'm meeting my macros!"

AAOBob
04-24-2013, 07:30 AM
The bro science is strong in this thread.

Getting an Egg McMuffin before my 11am workout today.

rand18m
04-24-2013, 07:31 AM
What you all are forgetting is the "100% Beef" doesn't take into account that most hamburgers are made with beef that is nearly 50% fat -- Saturated fats that do major damage inside of our bodies in the long run. You shouldn't be neglecting health risks just because "I'm meeting my macros!"

Perhaps the large body of evidence with regards to SFA's you have missed. Here is some information for you to consider.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20354806

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/91/3/535.full?sid=76b69e79-b21d-47cc-848c-46edea4bfc52

FitnessFan76
04-24-2013, 07:44 AM
What about takeaway chicken - where does that fit into things? Most of the time if I get 'fast food', it's chicken breast from KFC or local fish and chip shop. And what if you take the skin off prior to eating?

Anyway, after that 'horsemeat' thing over here in the UK, I haven't had a burger of any description for ages.

http://i35.tinypic.com/315nb6g.jpg

Yeeuuch. I definitely think I'll stick with chicken. More protein in that as well. ;)

WonderPug
04-24-2013, 07:51 AM
What you all are forgetting is the "100% Beef" doesn't take into account that most hamburgers are made with beef that is nearly 50% fat -- Saturated fats that do major damage inside of our bodies in the long run. You shouldn't be neglecting health risks just because "I'm meeting my macros!"FYI: The burger meat is rarely more than 20% fat and, also, saturated fat is beneficial, not harmful.

desslok
04-24-2013, 07:54 AM
The bro science is strong in this thread.

Getting an Egg McMuffin before my 11am workout today.

Not me. I was planning to go to McDs and get their oatmeal for breakfast. But instead I am going to avoid fast food, so I will go to IHOP and get the Chicken Fried steak and eggs, pancakes, and biscuits and gravy combo. And for lunch rather than getting the Premium Grilled Chicken Salad at McDs, I will go to Cheesecake Factory and get the famous Factory Meatloaf and a slice of cheesecake. No more of that fattening fast food for me!

Engineer_Guy
04-24-2013, 07:56 AM
McDonalds is just bad food to begin with. Even if it wasn't terrible for you, I wouldn't eat there. There are other fast options that at least taste much better.

lovingit
04-24-2013, 08:02 AM
Why does everyone AlWAYS make sweeping generlizations about fast food? ITT, the only fast food you can possibly get at any of the million + fast food places is a bigmac on buns.A point I tried to make as well but clearly people can only buy one thing at fast food joints: burger and fries.

And facepalming at the suggestion in this thread that fast food places don't have food options containing micronutrients.

AAOBob
04-24-2013, 08:08 AM
What about takeaway chicken - where does that fit into things? Most of the time if I get 'fast food', it's chicken breast from KFC or local fish and chip shop. And what if you take the skin off prior to eating?

Anyway, after that 'horsemeat' thing over here in the UK, I haven't had a burger of any description for ages.

http://i35.tinypic.com/315nb6g.jpg

Yeeuuch. I definitely think I'll stick with chicken. More protein in that as well. ;)

When you see "Daily Mail" as the source think "World News Weekly", you know the kinda paper that puts out pictures of aliens and bat boy.

Engineer_Guy
04-24-2013, 08:15 AM
And facepalming at fast food places not having any food options containing micronutrients.

Facepalm at people suggesting fast food is loaded with micro-nutrients lol but seriously there might be SOME options but the majority of what is offered at fast food joints is very lacking in micro nutrients.

desslok
04-24-2013, 08:15 AM
And facepalming at fast food places not having any food options containing micronutrients.

The salads that have mixed leafy greens, carrots, mandarin orange slices, cucumber, tomatoes, avocado, almonds etc, have all of their micronutrients extracted to create mulitivitamins(where did you think they get vitamin pills? Thin air?) Then "they" spray them with chemicals that control your thoughts.

rand18m
04-24-2013, 08:22 AM
A point I tried to make as well but clearly people can only buy one thing at fast food joints: burger and fries.

And facepalming at fast food places not having any food options containing micronutrients.

No micro nutrients? Not the case. For example here is the nutrition value of a Big Mac, note the complete lack of trans fatty acids in a Big Mac.



Nutrition Facts
Serving Size 1 sandwich (215.0 g)
Amount Per Serving
Calories 576Calories from Fat 292
% Daily Value*
Total Fat 32.5g50%
Saturated Fat 12.0g60%
Polyunsaturated Fat 2.8g
Monounsaturated Fat 14.1g
Cholesterol 103mg34%
Sodium 742mg31%
Total Carbohydrates 38.7g13%
Protein 31.8g
Vitamin A 1% • Vitamin C 2%
Calcium 9% • Iron 31%

snorkelman
04-24-2013, 08:22 AM
http://i44.tinypic.com/j9oaoj.jpg


What about takeaway chicken - where does that fit into things? Most of the time if I get 'fast food', it's chicken breast from KFC or local fish and chip shop.

See above chart.

Since 2004, trans fat has been slashed from US diets. Partial hydrogenation has fallen sharply in a relatively short time

http://i41.tinypic.com/msoqxu.jpg


This graph ^^ shows that non-biodiesel (food) usage of partially hydrogenated oils has dropped from 8.26 billion lbs. (39% of total) in 2004 to 1.68 billion lbs. (8% of total) by 2009. While sunflower and palm oils were initially the main substitutes for partially hydrogenated soybean oil; now canola oil is used the most

rand18m
04-24-2013, 08:29 AM
As a person who works at a BK, I must say, the real problem for "fast food" being bad comes in really only 2 forms: add-ons and portion size.

For instance: you go to your favorite burger joint and what are you going to buy? A burger. Sweet. Let's say you grab a Whopper. That's not terrible, even if you throw the cheese on (drop the mayo though, just my personal taste.) But then wait, what goes with burgers? Fries! Onion Rings! Curly Fries! So we add those on. And my oh my, doesn't that milkshake look tasty? I'll take one of them too.

What happens here is that you see a small amount of food packing a metric-ton of calories. A medium fry alone has almost as many calories as a Whopper without cheese and mayo. So right there you're netting about 900kclas or so. You might say, "The Whopper isn't small!" and no, no it's not, hence it's name sake. But how easy is it to tack on those small extras like the fries, the cookie, the cinnamon roll, the milkshake ect? $1 to supersize? It's that simple. THAT'S the problem with fast food. The simplicity of the food and the amount of calories in those small additions.

I'll be honest, I get a tendergrill every time I stop in to a BK. Nothing wrong with it if it fits my calorie intake and macros for the day. But that's all I get, maybe Apple slices if I crave a sweet side. It's just you need to be careful about the extras, because they're what will sneak up on you.

And this^^ is correct. The only problem associated with fast food in general is the fact it is highly palatable and calorically dense. People end up eating many more calories than they would ever think, not many people are calorie or food conscious such as the people that would participate in this forum.

The overall composition of most of the "fast food" I have investigated is no different than virtually anything you would buy in the grocery store. The amount of trans fats for instance is low to nonexistent depending on the type restaurant and the specific food. The idea they have no mirco nutrients would suggest they are somehow different than the buns and tortillas you buy in the store, that's nonsense. I will note, hydrogenated oils are mostly used in baked goods, large companies have made very concerted efforts to eliminate them from much of their processes.

rand18m
04-24-2013, 08:31 AM
http://i44.tinypic.com/j9oaoj.jpg



See above chart.

Since 2004, trans fat has been slashed from US diets. Partial hydrogenation has fallen sharply in a relatively short time

http://i41.tinypic.com/msoqxu.jpg


This graph ^^ shows that non-biodiesel (food) usage of partially hydrogenated oils has dropped from 8.26 billion lbs. (39% of total) in 2004 to 1.68 billion lbs. (8% of total) by 2009. While sunflower and palm oils were initially the main substitutes for partially hydrogenated soybean oil; now canola oil is used the most

And of course you beat me to it again!! ;) Everyone take a look at this^^!!

JaredPunch
04-24-2013, 08:38 AM
http://i35.tinypic.com/315nb6g.jpg

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/mcdonalds-burger-that-looks-the-same-as-day-it-was-cooked-14-years-ago/story-e6frf7jo-1226628424189

Of course, there's salt in the meat and bread.
What do you think would happen to a farm cured ham or salami made traditionally?
The salt will just dry and shrink it but it will never totally spoil even after 15 years

x-ray vision
04-24-2013, 08:40 AM
Of course, there's salt in the meat and bread.
What do you think would happen to a farm cured ham or salami made traditionally?
The salt will just dry and shrink it but it will never totally spoil even after 15 years
Here's a link to a plausible theory regarding the old burger:
http://aht.seriouseats.com/archives/2010/11/the-burger-lab-revisiting-the-myth-of-the-12-year-old-burger-testing-results.html

Brosynthesis
04-24-2013, 08:41 AM
That its faster than my ex

Engineer_Guy
04-24-2013, 09:06 AM
Of course, there's salt in the meat and bread.
What do you think would happen to a farm cured ham or salami made traditionally?
The salt will just dry and shrink it but it will never totally spoil even after 15 years

Burger turned into beef jerky lol

DatMurse
04-24-2013, 09:23 AM
http://i44.tinypic.com/j9oaoj.jpg



See above chart.

Since 2004, trans fat has been slashed from US diets. Partial hydrogenation has fallen sharply in a relatively short time

http://i41.tinypic.com/msoqxu.jpg


This graph ^^ shows that non-biodiesel (food) usage of partially hydrogenated oils has dropped from 8.26 billion lbs. (39% of total) in 2004 to 1.68 billion lbs. (8% of total) by 2009. While sunflower and palm oils were initially the main substitutes for partially hydrogenated soybean oil; now canola oil is used the most

are you sure it isnt .5g?

lovingit
04-24-2013, 09:43 AM
Facepalm at people suggesting fast food is loaded with micro-nutrients lol but seriously there might be SOME options but the majority of what is offered at fast food joints is very lacking in micro nutrients.Well, I'm not sure people have (would need to re-read) said all fast food is loaded with micros, but I manage to eat healthy options at fast food restaurants a minimum of once a week (chick fil a night every monday - grilled chicken salad is my favorite, also like the grilled nuggets and fruit cups). I just don't care for broad statements that "fast food" is bad because it's not.

Wendy's has some good options as well. = )


The salads that have mixed leafy greens, carrots, mandarin orange slices, cucumber, tomatoes, avocado, almonds etc, have all of their micronutrients extracted to create mulitivitamins(where did you think they get vitamin pills? Thin air?) Then "they" spray them with chemicals that control your thoughts.Need...moar....burgers...


No micro nutrients? Not the case. For example here is the nutrition value of a Big Mac, note the complete lack of trans fatty acids in a Big Mac.


I know. I was saying there are fast food options that DO contain micros and aren't doused in transfats, but edited my post to clarify as I realize the way I typed it was unclear. ;)

Christiffer
04-24-2013, 09:46 AM
I still stand by the statement that all the stress from OCD'ing everything is worse than consuming some "taboo" foods. OCD just leads to disordered eating in most cases.

So in light of this conversation I went to a place call J&J gourmet and got a breakfast wrap with ham and a slice of lemon cheesecake for breakfast!! SO MUCH WIN!! Although they do use fresh/whole/local Ingredients the wrap could have some hidden trans fatz idk know about. :D

NOTASINGLEFUKGIVEN

WonderPug
04-24-2013, 09:47 AM
Food for thought: there are more trans fats in 16 ounces of grass fed beef than in a BigMac.

Cronos1247
04-24-2013, 09:58 AM
Age old debate.

snorkelman
04-24-2013, 10:24 AM
This thread resulted in me doing this for lunch:

http://i36.tinypic.com/2po73f5.jpg

DatMurse
04-24-2013, 10:48 AM
Food for thought: there are more trans fats in 16 ounces of grass fed beef than in a BigMac.
so a pound of grass fed beef has more trans fat than a big mac.

I would honestly hope so

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/
a little interesting study on the antioxidant composition of grass fed vs grain fed.
obviously idc about the fatty acid profile other than TA.

synkestrel
04-24-2013, 11:05 AM
And a fair portion of all bread products contain trans fat but are you going to seclude yourself from the world because you're scared to consume food from the majority of places available outside your home. Not to mention even some whole wheat/ whole grain bread contains trans fat. Get over it!

It is sad that TV has taught you that eating out at fast food places is the social norm. What did people do in the early 1900s when there was no fast food joints?



http://i44.tinypic.com/j9oaoj.jpg



See above chart.

Since 2004, trans fat has been slashed from US diets. Partial hydrogenation has fallen sharply in a relatively short time

http://i41.tinypic.com/msoqxu.jpg


This graph ^^ shows that non-biodiesel (food) usage of partially hydrogenated oils has dropped from 8.26 billion lbs. (39% of total) in 2004 to 1.68 billion lbs. (8% of total) by 2009. While sunflower and palm oils were initially the main substitutes for partially hydrogenated soybean oil; now canola oil is used the most

The oil is not hydrogenated when they put it into the fryer yay! But.... When they turn the fryer on, the high heat reaction causes hydrogenation. Hydrogen atoms do not need to be added, but they can be removed to mimic a saturated fat, so its still goes from cis to trans under this reaction.

synkestrel
04-24-2013, 11:24 AM
This thread resulted in me doing this for lunch:

http://i36.tinypic.com/2po73f5.jpg

its funny people brag about eating like junk, but if you are going to brag that means you have some great results?

405x5 on deadlift any average gym rat can reach at the height/bodyweight you possess. How can we know if a poor diet with these food items could have lead to proper nutrients NOT reaching your disc and surrounding structure to prevent a herniation ?

Nutrition should be based on Optimal Performance over mediocre results !

rand18m
04-24-2013, 11:42 AM
It is sad that TV has taught you that eating out at fast food places is the social norm. What did people do in the early 1900s when there was no fast food joints?

Well I hate to tell you this but Crisco has been around since the first decade of the 20th century, over 100 years now.





The oil is not hydrogenated when they put it into the fryer yay! But.... When they turn the fryer on, the high heat reaction causes hydrogenation. Hydrogen atoms do not need to be added, but they can be removed to mimic a saturated fat, so its still goes from cis to trans under this reaction.

This^^ is completely false, hydrogen has to be added and done so under pressure to go from a cis configuration to a trans. If partial hydrogenation is taken all the way through the process a saturated fatty acid is formed and it's basically unusable. You should do more homework!!

rand18m
04-24-2013, 11:47 AM
its funny people brag about eating like junk, but if you are going to brag that means you have some great results?

405x5 on deadlift any average gym rat can reach at the height/bodyweight you possess. How can we know if a poor diet with these food items could have lead to proper nutrients NOT reaching your disc and surrounding structure to prevent a herniation ?

Nutrition should be based on Optimal Performance over mediocre results !

The problem is you don't have a basic understanding of what constituents a poor or good diet. You are simply parroting things you have heard, so I encourage you to begin studying and learn the basics of nutrition. From that point I encourage you to take it further and learn much more than the basics. You can download many nutrition science classes on I-Tunes U for example and begin there, providing you have some basic understanding of chemistry, which at this point I'm not certain that's the case. If not start with learning the basics of chemistry.

synkestrel
04-24-2013, 12:38 PM
Well I hate to tell you this but Crisco has been around since the first decade of the 20th century, over 100 years now.


This^^ is completely false, hydrogen has to be added and done so under pressure to go from a cis configuration to a trans. If partial hydrogenation is taken all the way through the process a saturated fatty acid is formed and it's basically unusable. You should do more homework!!

Crisco was around, but fast food chains where not dominant and most bread used good ole butter at that time.

As per wikipedia:

Hydrogenation – to treat with hydrogen – is a chemical reaction between molecular hydrogen (H2) and another compound or element, usually in the presence of a catalyst. The process is commonly employed to reduce or saturate organic compounds. Hydrogenation typically constitutes the addition of pairs of hydrogen atoms to a molecule, generally an alkene. Catalysts are required for the reaction to be usable; non-catalytic hydrogenation takes place only at very high temperatures. Hydrogenation reduces double and triple bonds in hydrocarbons


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18680380 not catalyst, heat raises pressue , and no hydrogen needed.... just plain old roasting!

rand18m
04-24-2013, 12:58 PM
Crisco was around, but fast food chains where not dominant and most bread used good ole butter at that time.

As per wikipedia:

Hydrogenation – to treat with hydrogen – is a chemical reaction between molecular hydrogen (H2) and another compound or element, usually in the presence of a catalyst. The process is commonly employed to reduce or saturate organic compounds. Hydrogenation typically constitutes the addition of pairs of hydrogen atoms to a molecule, generally an alkene. Catalysts are required for the reaction to be usable; non-catalytic hydrogenation takes place only at very high temperatures. Hydrogenation reduces double and triple bonds in hydrocarbons


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18680380 not catalyst, heat raises pressue , and no hydrogen needed.... just plain old roasting!

That has absolutely nothing to do with what we are discussing. A trace amount of TFA's found in specific roasted nuts, ok!

You don't have to look very far to find the answer, here's a piece from the Price foundation that should help, first one I came to.

http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-fats/trans-fatty-acids-are-not-formed-by-heating-vegetable-oils

http://www.foodproductdesign.com/news/2010/07/trans-fat-formation-in-frying-oils.aspx

http://www.oliveoilsource.com/page/heating-olive-oil

synkestrel
04-24-2013, 01:08 PM
That has absolutely nothing to do with what we are discussing. A trace amount of TFA's found in specific roasted nuts, ok!

You don't have to look very far to find the answer, here's a piece from the Price foundation that should help, first one I came to.

http://www.westonaprice.org/know-your-fats/trans-fatty-acids-are-not-formed-by-heating-vegetable-oils




and I guess you didnt read the comments below I posted a peer review study. point goes to me :)

WonderPug
04-24-2013, 01:12 PM
The problem is you don't have a basic understanding of what constituents a poor or good diet. You are simply parroting things you have heard, so I encourage you to begin studying and learn the basics of nutrition. From that point I encourage you to take it further and learn much more than the basics. You can download many nutrition science classes on I-Tunes U for example and begin there, providing you have some basic understanding of chemistry, which at this point I'm not certain that's the case. If not start with learning the basics of chemistry.This x2.

AAOBob
04-24-2013, 01:16 PM
its funny people brag about eating like junk, but if you are going to brag that means you have some great results?

405x5 on deadlift any average gym rat can reach at the height/bodyweight you possess. How can we know if a poor diet with these food items could have lead to proper nutrients NOT reaching your disc and surrounding structure to prevent a herniation ?

Nutrition should be based on Optimal Performance over mediocre results !

So you are saying we should eat like power lifters, being obviously how much we all can lift is what determines if a diet is good for you right?

rand18m
04-24-2013, 01:21 PM
and I guess you didnt read the comments below I posted a peer review study. point goes to me :)

I did read the abstract you posted, it looked at roasted nuts, and there was a trace amount of TFA's found in some nuts, what on earth does that have to do with what we are talking about?

AAOBob
04-24-2013, 01:26 PM
I have to confess, I did not have an Egg McMuffin today. I got out of the office a touch late.
I did have a Classic Grilled Chicken Sandwich though after my workout.

I can only dream of the gains had that been made from wild wheat and free range hormone free chicken :(

desslok
04-24-2013, 01:29 PM
I did read the abstract you posted, it looked at roasted nuts, and there was a trace amount of TFA's found in some nuts, what on earth does that have to do with what we are talking about?

I think he means the sesame seeds on top of the bun? But I'm not sure if that was dry roasted or regular roastd.

synkestrel
04-24-2013, 01:34 PM
So you are saying we should eat like power lifters, being obviously how much we all can lift is what determines if a diet is good for you right?

do you not know powerlifting has weight classes so its not just all fat fks?

also running or any cardio effort can be a performance metric too


I did read the abstract you posted, it looked at roasted nuts, and there was a trace amount of TFA's found in some nuts, what on earth does that have to do with what we are talking about?

if you read back in the thread it is in regards to non hydrogenated oils being heated to high temperatures (frying). Here the nuts are non hydrogenated, and obtained the properties of hydrogenation under high heat, as they contain unsaturated fats.



Here is another good read on why to avoid high heat cooking of oils:

http://www.allenfiltersinc.com/sowhyexactlycanreusingfryingoilbedangeroustoyourhe alth.cfm

PerpetualMotion
04-24-2013, 01:35 PM
its not about the macros its about the lack of micros
AND
trans fat, added sodium, preservatives etc

I'll never believe sodium is bad.


enriched flour does not have the same micronutrient content as whole grains

Alan already has posted a bunch of stuff in regards to this but when examined a person consuming whole grains isn't necessarily better off and that seems to be because of the inhibition of nutrient uptake from whole grain sources. One of Alan's sources (I'll post it when I find it) stated that despite the evidence there is no difference between core refined grains and whole grains in the diet, they recommend a diet composed of 50/50 core-refined grains and whole grains without any ill effects. That's their cautionary recommendation.


processed beef does not have the same as grass fed

I'm well aware that grass-fed beef has almost twice as much n-3s but anything that links to it being much better in other micros? Even then, if someone supplements with n-3s then the difference may be miniscule. As Alan posted ages ago, more EPA+DHA =/= better.



Worked in 5 fast food places, all the same. Would never eat there.

The word "fast food" covers a lot. I wouldn't demonize ALL fast food joints, especially considering some of the best hamburgers on earth are produced at fast food joints (think In-N-Out, Shake Shack, etc.).


as well as MSG too

If I recall correctly, there isn't much saying that MSG is even bad, kind of like sucralose. If you know something contrary, please share (and I mean this in a non-combative way but merely as asking for insight). Besides, MSG is a tastant, kind of like salt, and it can add umami to a dish.


Why does everyone AlWAYS make sweeping generlizations about fast food? ITT, the only fast food you can possibly get at any of the million + fast food places is a bigmac on buns.

Pretty much this. Poor burgers.

Dimaline312000
04-24-2013, 01:45 PM
One cool thing about this topic is that starting today McDonalds started selling the Egg White Delight McMuffin Sandwitches. Or District Manager came in to show us how to cook them properly. So it is kinda nice to see that fast food joints are at least attempting to give it's customers some healithier options on the Fast Food Menu.

Terrimonas
04-24-2013, 02:03 PM
One cool thing about this topic is that starting today McDonalds started selling the Egg White Delight McMuffin Sandwitches. Or District Manager came in to show us how to cook them properly. So it is kinda nice to see that fast food joints are at least attempting to give it's customers some healithier options on the Fast Food Menu.

It's really not any more "healthy" than the original. Just fewer calories and fat.

WonderPug
04-24-2013, 02:07 PM
One cool thing about this topic is that starting today McDonalds started selling the Egg White Delight McMuffin Sandwitches. Or District Manager came in to show us how to cook them properly. So it is kinda nice to see that fast food joints are at least attempting to give it's customers some healithier options on the Fast Food Menu.Why do you think it's a "healthier" option to remove virtually all the micronutrients and the essential fats from a food?

Dimaline312000
04-24-2013, 02:50 PM
It's really not any more "healthy" than the original. Just fewer calories and fat.

Well for someone who is watching their calories and fat it's a better choice. Not everyone on here is trying to be a Body Builder or put on Muscle Weight. Some are trying to just LOSE FAT and if a food has less calories and fat than it's a better option. We all know it comes down to calories in vs calories out and if someone is on say a 1200 calorie diet it's better. Maybe I shouldn't have used the word "Healtheir" as opposed to just a better option for people on a weight loss diet.

Pug: I'm not saying that it's "healthier" to remove micronutrients and essential fats especially not the Nutrients but I mean we all know that when it comes to Eggs that the Yolk is where the Cholesterol is, yes there are a good amount of Micros and Fats in a Whole Egg. Forgive me for using the word "Healthier" I will try to rephrase what I'm saying in the future. I guess what I'm trying to say is that coming from my own personal diet that inculdes eggs I eat 2 whole eggs and 2 eggs worth of whites so I'm actually eating 4 egg whites and only 2 yolks. So when I said healthier I was speaking from my own mind and I guess not an educated prospective which is where I should have been speaking from. For people who are only consuming a certain amount of calories and fats who maybe don't want the cholesterol from the yolks it MIGHT be a better choice. Forgive my IGNORANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WonderPug
04-24-2013, 03:02 PM
Well for someone who is watching their calories and fat it's a better choice.I guess you think plain popcorn is the "healthiest" food in the world and extra virgin olive oil is the least "healthy" food in the world, based on caloric density.





For people who are only consuming a certain amount of calories and fats who maybe don't want the cholesterol from the yolks it MIGHT be a better choice. Forgive my IGNORANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!These people tend to be the ones that think the esterified cholesterol in egg yolks is bioavailable, which, of course, it is not.

dimmupelto
04-24-2013, 03:16 PM
I think this has been asked already but, synkestrel=synthetic?!?!? Cause he's just as annoying and argumentative. Oh and wrong.

Terrimonas
04-24-2013, 03:21 PM
I think this has been asked already but, synkestrel=synthetic?!?!? Cause he's just as annoying and argumentative. Oh and wrong.

Yup. Sigs are almost identical.


synthetic sig
-----------------------------------
All time PR's 405/295/500

Proof of strength is my overhead squat.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqZ7mB6FPag 235ohs

1m: 4:39 5k= 20:05 (2011) 10k= 41:17 (2011) 26.2= 3:54 (2009) 140.6= 13:53 (2011)

snorkelman
04-24-2013, 04:16 PM
I think this has been asked already but, synkestrel=synthetic?!?!? Cause he's just as annoying and argumentative. Oh and wrong.

The similarities are uncanny.

lovingit
04-24-2013, 04:49 PM
I think this has been asked already but, synkestrel=synthetic?!?!? Cause he's just as annoying and argumentative. Oh and wrong.I asked in another thread and wasn't responded to.

Terrimonas
04-24-2013, 05:09 PM
I asked in another thread and wasn't responded to.

It definitely is. Their sigs are basically the same except he's now a faster runner.

lovingit
04-24-2013, 05:13 PM
Synthetic, where you been, bro? You said the bagels got you and then faded away. We were worried.

desslok
04-24-2013, 05:32 PM
Synthetic, where you been, bro? You said the bagels got you and then faded away. We were worried.

They got him! They $%&$ing got him! Now he is known as synkestral(a mild mannered reporter) by day, and Radioactive Bagel Man by night.

synkestrel
04-24-2013, 06:13 PM
Well for someone who is watching their calories and fat it's a better choice. Not everyone on here is trying to be a Body Builder or put on Muscle Weight. Some are trying to just LOSE FAT and if a food has less calories and fat than it's a better option. We all know it comes down to calories in vs calories out and if someone is on say a 1200 calorie diet it's better. Maybe I shouldn't have used the word "Healtheir" as opposed to just a better option for people on a weight loss diet.

Pug: I'm not saying that it's "healthier" to remove micronutrients and essential fats especially not the Nutrients but I mean we all know that when it comes to Eggs that the Yolk is where the Cholesterol is, yes there are a good amount of Micros and Fats in a Whole Egg. Forgive me for using the word "Healthier" I will try to rephrase what I'm saying in the future. I guess what I'm trying to say is that coming from my own personal diet that inculdes eggs I eat 2 whole eggs and 2 eggs worth of whites so I'm actually eating 4 egg whites and only 2 yolks. So when I said healthier I was speaking from my own mind and I guess not an educated prospective which is where I should have been speaking from. For people who are only consuming a certain amount of calories and fats who maybe don't want the cholesterol from the yolks it MIGHT be a better choice. Forgive my IGNORANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

they cook the egg whites in margarine, and the muffin bread ingredients is also bad.

Sherjav
04-24-2013, 06:55 PM
Burgers do mold but the french fries don't.

mjpe2sO2Gkw

s2pid
04-24-2013, 07:02 PM
chemical additives in the "foods"

AAOBob
04-24-2013, 07:25 PM
Cottage fries will have a lot more water in them than McDonalds thinner fries, experiment if flawed.

digger6218
04-24-2013, 07:51 PM
I am a 56 year old woman. I started to eat healthier about 2 years ago. A year ago started juicing/ smoothies. I will tell you my tastebuds changed. I crave green foods. My diet was horrible and yes I ate fast food.Been soda free also for a year. And I have had McDonalds and It taste terrible now.So if this is healthy...I will take it. And yes I just return to lifting weights and love it. Scip the pink slime and eat real food.

Chicago54Bears
04-24-2013, 09:28 PM
Things I have learned from this thread:

A lot of people are very angry.
When people pick on fast food, they generally target poor ol' McDonalds. (Who ironically provide the most nutritional information on their products)
On a related note, apparently McDonald's has a egg white sandwich coming out.
The legendary Synthetic is back, stronger and more butthurt than ever.
And finally, people stress way too much over things that really aren't that big of a deal.

desslok
04-24-2013, 10:21 PM
Things I have learned from this thread:

A lot of people are very angry.
When people pick on fast food, they generally target poor ol' McDonalds. (Who ironically provide the most nutritional information on their products)
On a related note, apparently McDonald's has a egg white sandwich coming out.
The legendary Synthetic is back, stronger and more butthurt than ever.
And finally, people stress way too much over things that really aren't that big of a deal.

You forgot one thing. There is no middles ground with fast food. You HAVE to eat it for breakfast lunch and dinner every.single.day, or just totally avoid it. You have no choice over this.

JaredPunch
04-24-2013, 11:04 PM
I am a 56 year old woman. I started to eat healthier about 2 years ago. A year ago started juicing/ smoothies. I will tell you my tastebuds changed. I crave green foods. My diet was horrible and yes I ate fast food.Been soda free also for a year. And I have had McDonalds and It taste terrible now.So if this is healthy...I will take it. And yes I just return to lifting weights and love it. Scip the pink slime and eat real food.

I eat fast food, I like McDonalds and I'm very healthy. I used to have a terrible diet and be unhealthy but what made my diet horrible was certainly not eating or not eating fast food but

*inadequate protein intake
*caloric intake not matching my needs
*lot of calories coming from soft drinks
*food choices so bad to limit my micro intake heavily (candies, chips, lot of sugar added to milk, coffee...)

As long as my protein and calories intake is adequate, as long as my food choices are not so horrible (50% of calories worth of candies, chips) and I eat enough vegetables and as long as I limit alcohol and soft drinks I feel extremely health, good digestion, never sick, never a cold even if I eat mcdonald, street hot-dgos, pizza, ice-cream, chocolate, fried food...

AAOBob
04-25-2013, 05:11 AM
I am a 56 year old woman. I started to eat healthier about 2 years ago. A year ago started juicing/ smoothies. I will tell you my tastebuds changed. I crave green foods. My diet was horrible and yes I ate fast food.Been soda free also for a year. And I have had McDonalds and It taste terrible now.So if this is healthy...I will take it. And yes I just return to lifting weights and love it. Scip the pink slime and eat real food.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/07/McD-Egg-McMuffin.jpg/250px-McD-Egg-McMuffin.jpg

Mmmmm real food.

synkestrel
04-25-2013, 10:27 AM
I eat fast food, I like McDonalds and I'm very healthy. I used to have a terrible diet and be unhealthy but what made my diet horrible was certainly not eating or not eating fast food but

*inadequate protein intake
*caloric intake not matching my needs
*lot of calories coming from soft drinks
*food choices so bad to limit my micro intake heavily (candies, chips, lot of sugar added to milk, coffee...)

As long as my protein and calories intake is adequate, as long as my food choices are not so horrible (50% of calories worth of candies, chips) and I eat enough vegetables and as long as I limit alcohol and soft drinks I feel extremely health, good digestion, never sick, never a cold even if I eat mcdonald, street hot-dgos, pizza, ice-cream, chocolate, fried food...

If you say that you are healthy than you are:
1) fast runner (races at 9mph or faster)
2) very strong person - http://hugegainer.com/strong-strength-standards-raw-natural-lifters/
3) can show some bloodwork to back this up

Engineer_Guy
04-25-2013, 10:31 AM
I eat fast food, I like McDonalds and I'm very healthy. I used to have a terrible diet and be unhealthy but what made my diet horrible was certainly not eating or not eating fast food but

*inadequate protein intake
*caloric intake not matching my needs
*lot of calories coming from soft drinks
*food choices so bad to limit my micro intake heavily (candies, chips, lot of sugar added to milk, coffee...)

As long as my protein and calories intake is adequate, as long as my food choices are not so horrible (50% of calories worth of candies, chips) and I eat enough vegetables and as long as I limit alcohol and soft drinks I feel extremely health, good digestion, never sick, never a cold even if I eat mcdonald, street hot-dgos, pizza, ice-cream, chocolate, fried food...

In other words, use moderation.

Chicago54Bears
04-25-2013, 10:39 AM
You forgot one thing. There is no middles ground with fast food. You HAVE to eat it for breakfast lunch and dinner every.single.day, or just totally avoid it. You have no choice over this.

hahaha true true

AAOBob
04-25-2013, 10:52 AM
If you say that you are healthy than you are:
1) fast runner (races at 9mph or faster)
2) very strong person - http://hugegainer.com/strong-strength-standards-raw-natural-lifters/
3) can show some bloodwork to back this up

And nothing here listed has anything to do with health directly.

Dimaline312000
04-25-2013, 02:08 PM
I guess you think plain popcorn is the "healthiest" food in the world and extra virgin olive oil is the least "healthy" food in the world, based on caloric density.




These people tend to be the ones that think the esterified cholesterol in egg yolks is bioavailable, which, of course, it is not.


Well whatever, I just put MY thoughts in on the subject and how I PERSONALLY Feel about what is wrong with Fast Food. My information may be Flawed and Mistaken and my thoughts may or may not be wrong but it's just how I feel based on what I have learned mostly on here about nutriton and fast food. I think when it comes to Fast Food that the Nutriton Information of it is very cloudy. So I've said what I wanna say I won't say anymore and keep getting my balls busted.

Sherjav
04-25-2013, 02:28 PM
http://i35.tinypic.com/25kk38x.jpg

Yummy 50 grams of fat 50 grams of carbs and almost 900 calories all from one burger.

Perfect during cutting.


not srs by the way.

Terrimonas
04-25-2013, 02:33 PM
Well whatever, I just put MY thoughts in on the subject and how I PERSONALLY Feel about what is wrong with Fast Food. My information may be Flawed and Mistaken and my thoughts may or may not be wrong but it's just how I feel based on what I have learned mostly on here about nutriton and fast food. I think when it comes to Fast Food that the Nutriton Information of it is very cloudy. So I've said what I wanna say I won't say anymore and keep getting my balls busted.

Good luck with your misinformation coveting goals in 2013.

AAOBob
04-25-2013, 03:27 PM
http://i35.tinypic.com/25kk38x.jpg

Yummy 50 grams of fat 50 grams of carbs and almost 900 calories all from one burger.

Perfect during cutting.


not srs by the way.

I do the grilled chicken sandwiches for cutting myself. Srs.

Dimaline312000
04-25-2013, 04:18 PM
Good luck with your misinformation coveting goals in 2013.

Well was going to be done with this thread but gotta respond to this, because I just love Smart-@$$ comments like this. A lot of the information I'm refering to is from this site and from the stickies yeah there is some information that I've heard through various sources reliable or not but of you really wanna get down and dirty about this Subject you basically have to talk about overall nutrition as well everything you put into your body and what you expect to get out of it. I could go on an almost endless rant about my beliefs and also actual hard facts about Food whether it's Fast Food or Not but since this thread is already 5 pages long I won't. What I'll say is that it comes down to the person and what they want as far as fitness goals and how they wanna live.