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View Full Version : Duncan or Hakeem.......Who you got?



svtballa
02-14-2013, 11:22 AM
you have first pick in a draft and the best 2 players are these 2...Who are you taking and why...Ive been discussing this with my buddy and honestly cant come up with a definitave answer..Timmy has rings and longevity but there are always the hypotheticals such as coaching ans the mj era..

HTownOlajuwon
02-14-2013, 11:31 AM
Hakeem, he was a better player. Duncan was put in a better situation and nothing more, it's why it's stupid to just a bunch of rings and finals MVPs without taking it into context. Duncan was a better passer than Hakeem and that was it, Hakeem ****s on Duncan everywhere else.

Otaman
02-14-2013, 11:32 AM
hmm...can't go wrong with either one

I'd probably go with Hakeem. He'll get me a ring with or without stars

EuropeanHammer
02-14-2013, 11:33 AM
Hakeem was easily the better player, his post skills, footwork and defense were something we will never see for many many years.

Daewoo_Lanos
02-14-2013, 11:47 AM
hakeem without question

dRose37
02-14-2013, 11:47 AM
Duncan was put in a better situation than Hakeem was. Hakeem

uanjum
02-14-2013, 11:52 AM
What a stupid question. I would pick Hakeem over every NBA player in history except for maybe Michael Jordan.

nvrstopworking
02-14-2013, 11:56 AM
Hakeem. Not even close.

yieldtonothing
02-14-2013, 12:00 PM
hakeem
better passer
better scorer
better shot blocker

Otaman
02-14-2013, 12:14 PM
hakeem
better passer
better scorer
better shot blocker

real question is: who is a better person out of the two?

Shortstop36
02-14-2013, 12:16 PM
What a stupid question. I would pick Hakeem over every NBA player in history except for maybe Michael Jordan.

maybe?

sorry brah but MJ is the GOAT. no disrespect to olajuwon.

originaldood
02-14-2013, 12:27 PM
Hakeem was easily the better player, his post skills, footwork and defense were something we will never see for many many years.

you are a houston rockets fan, aka bias. but i am a spurs fan, so i guess i am bias as well. but ummmmmmmmmm duncans post skills, defense, and footwork are quite incredible as well. idk how you think hakeem is easily the better player. the only attribute that hakeem has over duncan is athleticism.

thefederalist
02-14-2013, 12:31 PM
Duncan.

way more versatile.
spreads the floor better

Spill512
02-14-2013, 12:33 PM
real question is: who is a better person out of the two?

Like the two nicest guys to ever play in the league. I still remember the time Duncan got ejected for laughing while on the bench. That's how nice guys get ejected from a game.

svtballa
02-14-2013, 12:43 PM
you are a houston rockets fan, aka bias. but i am a spurs fan, so i guess i am bias as well. but ummmmmmmmmm duncans post skills, defense, and footwork are quite incredible as well. idk how you think hakeem is easily the better player. the only attribute that hakeem has over duncan is athleticism.


This it's a lot closer than people are making it

Gorilla99
02-14-2013, 12:53 PM
the dream

thefederalist
02-14-2013, 12:54 PM
at 36, duncan is avg 2.8 blocks per game. that's better than any year of his but 2002-2003 when he was 26.

Hengman
02-14-2013, 12:55 PM
I'm a Spurs fan and will pick Hakeem anyday over any center or PF. He was just too unorthodox with his playing style and very smart too. Hakeem was a scientist on the court.

Duncan is the BEST PF ever. He did lead a old Spurs team to the Finals before and has led them to the playoffs numerous times. Duncan has one thing over many players and that is consistency. He might be boring to watch at times, but he's a great leader and a great player himself.

dankydank
02-14-2013, 01:03 PM
Duncan has the highest defensive rating in nba history (worst rating ever was in 2010 season where he had knee tendinitis and a 100 rating)
Hakeem in his prime defensive rating was 100 and his average was 98 and Duncan was anywhere from 91-95 with 88.5 being the lowest
Duncan has the most blocks in Playoffs history
won a Finals Mvp in his second year in the league and was a top 5 mvp candidate in his first year in the nba
Duncan also won without all nba or all star teammates in 03 and had the 2nd best statistical run in playoff history in 03
consistently will lead the team to a top record in the nba unlike Hakeems whose teams were always above average in the reg season
Higher career per and longevity
and Duncan is actually someone who coasts in the regular season
his playoff numbers are always way higher then his regular season
when he won finals mvp in his second year he put up 27/14 in the finals and his reg season numbers were only 22/11

rusvik
02-14-2013, 01:40 PM
I'd take Duncan then trade him for Lebron.

Not srs. I'd take Hakeem then trade for Kobe.

jkeithc82
02-14-2013, 01:47 PM
Duncan has the highest defensive rating in nba history (worst rating ever was in 2010 season where he had knee tendinitis and a 100 rating)
Hakeem in his prime defensive rating was 100 and his average was 98 and Duncan was anywhere from 91-95 with 88.5 being the lowest
Duncan has the most blocks in Playoffs history
won a Finals Mvp in his second year in the league and was a top 5 mvp candidate in his first year in the nba
Duncan also won without all nba or all star teammates in 03 and had the 2nd best statistical run in playoff history in 03
consistently will lead the team to a top record in the nba unlike Hakeems whose teams were always above average in the reg season
Higher career per and longevity
and Duncan is actually someone who coasts in the regular season
his playoff numbers are always way higher then his regular season
when he won finals mvp in his second year he put up 27/14 in the finals and his reg season numbers were only 22/11

A lot of that evidence points to Duncan simply being in a better situation than Hakeem for their careers.

evansanity
02-14-2013, 01:56 PM
Hakeem, can do everything duncan can + he's a better athlete.

jkeith, did you lock my Vince Carter thread? and if so, why? Not mad, just wondering.

lee4
02-14-2013, 02:29 PM
just HOW GOOD was hakeem? good enough that duncan decided to aim for "Best PF" instead. ;)

nvrstopworking
02-14-2013, 02:31 PM
Duncan.

way more versatile.
spreads the floor better

Tha fuq?

9X19
02-14-2013, 02:46 PM
Hakeem gets $100K for young nikkka's to come and spend the weekend with him while he teaches them basketballs.

originaldood
02-14-2013, 04:04 PM
This it's a lot closer than people are making it


i agree man. i feel like it is a toss up. hakeem had insane games in the playoffs. duncan had insane games in the playoffs. its very very close. i think ppl
pick hakeem bc he is more exciting to watch.


i don't get how ppl say hakeem had better footwork, and defense. duncan is mr fundamentalist, and is playing all nba type D as an old man. im going to be sad as fuuuu when he retires.

originaldood
02-14-2013, 04:07 PM
Duncan has the highest defensive rating in nba history (worst rating ever was in 2010 season where he had knee tendinitis and a 100 rating)
Hakeem in his prime defensive rating was 100 and his average was 98 and Duncan was anywhere from 91-95 with 88.5 being the lowest
Duncan has the most blocks in Playoffs history
won a Finals Mvp in his second year in the league and was a top 5 mvp candidate in his first year in the nba
Duncan also won without all nba or all star teammates in 03 and had the 2nd best statistical run in playoff history in 03
consistently will lead the team to a top record in the nba unlike Hakeems whose teams were always above average in the reg season
Higher career per and longevity
and Duncan is actually someone who coasts in the regular season
his playoff numbers are always way higher then his regular season
when he won finals mvp in his second year he put up 27/14 in the finals and his reg season numbers were only 22/11

repped. spurs fans are the only ones that realize how great TD is

dankydank
02-14-2013, 04:08 PM
lol at everyone saying Duncan had a better situation
is everyone forgetting Hakeem came in the league with a 7'4 #1 overall pick who was also young and put up better stats then hakeem did
he had multiple guys in double figures in his rookie season

Duncan came in the league with a david robinson who just had a worse injury then Dwight Coward did and looked worst then he did
luckily David had actual basketball skills like a midrange came so he was still able to produce after all the doubles Duncan drew in the low block
Avery Johnson the 5'11 undrafted pg was the only other player who averaged double figure scoring
hes been run out of every franchise hes coached because teams hate him that much
they also had Vinny del Negro who is considered one of the dumbest coaches in the league
and sean elliott who was diagnosed with kidney disease and missed most of the games and eventually retired

no one knew who Greg Popovich was when he first took over
at the start of the 99 season everyone was calling for him to get fired after a slow start
he became known as a great coach after he started winning with Duncan

btw Duncan also coaches guys in the offseason he just doesnt charge them
Roy Hibbert credits his all star year towards working with Duncan in the offseason
Tristan Thompson has been working out with Duncan over the past 2 summers also

corruptknt
02-14-2013, 04:33 PM
I'd pick Hakeem everytime. But it's not by a large margin like some people on here might suggest. Duncan has well surpassed his former teammate David Robinson as far as rankings go IMO..but he is a tier lower than Hakeem.

Hakeem had every arsenal in his game. His game was smooth as fk and was a defensive beast. I'd argue that Hakeem was a better overall center than Shaq in both their respective primes. Shaq might've been more dominant as far as powering opponents down low..but Hakeem had more of a complete game.

Aussiebrah66
02-14-2013, 04:39 PM
at 36, duncan is avg 2.8 blocks per game. that's better than any year of his but 2002-2003 when he was 26.

the reason for this isnt duncans amazing athletic ability its pop's spectacular management of his minutes

corruptknt
02-14-2013, 04:43 PM
the reason for this isnt duncans amazing athletic ability its pop's spectacular management of his minutes

Popovich is a genius when it comes to resting his players. He gets the most out of all his players and they all seem to give extra effort. I wish he was the Lakers head coach..he wouldn't stand for laziness and would know how to properly utilize rotations.

UHBrah
02-14-2013, 04:50 PM
Dream.

Dream was somewhat undersized for a C during his time yet still dominated every aspect of the game. Duncan is GOAT PF but Hakeem was just a bit more special.

lee4
02-15-2013, 10:39 AM
Duncan has the highest defensive rating in nba history (worst rating ever was in 2010 season where he had knee tendinitis and a 100 rating)
Hakeem in his prime defensive rating was 100 and his average was 98 and Duncan was anywhere from 91-95 with 88.5 being the lowest
Duncan has the most blocks in Playoffs history
won a Finals Mvp in his second year in the league and was a top 5 mvp candidate in his first year in the nba
Duncan also won without all nba or all star teammates in 03 and had the 2nd best statistical run in playoff history in 03
consistently will lead the team to a top record in the nba unlike Hakeems whose teams were always above average in the reg season
Higher career per and longevity
and Duncan is actually someone who coasts in the regular season
his playoff numbers are always way higher then his regular season
when he won finals mvp in his second year he put up 27/14 in the finals and his reg season numbers were only 22/11

how is defensive rating calculated? if it has anything to do with who you're matched up against, this is not a fair comparison on several levels. hakeem always had the hard defensive assignment. whereas (to pop's strengths) duncan routinely pulls the weaker big defensive assignment to keep him out of foul trouble. both were/are defensive greats, but it's not accurate to use a stat swayed by who you're guarding as a definitive statement on the matter.

additionally, you note the playoff blocking record. duncan JUST got this, and it took him +50 more post season games to take the record...from hakeem.

also, hakeem had plenty of career longevity. people forget that he dominated across the 80's as well. hakeem was passing his physical prime by the time he started winning rings. he was dominant for more than a decade before he got his first one. comparatively, duncan also has dominant years, with what can be seen as a more prolonged career, but much of this is not due to duncan's ability, but rather how he is coached. pop is a master of organizing a team around what has been a degrading version of timmy. swap rudy T (a good coach by all measures) for the legendary POP and i'm sure hakeem would have had a different career perspective. again, not definitive, but closely debatable.

and, hakeem won his first ring without ANY all-star help. drexler came along in year two to ride along.

now i don't want anyone thinking i hold a bias in my post. i'm a suns fan, and HATE both equally from a competitive standpoint. however, i've spent countless hours watching both as they were frequently the obstacle to my team's success. in picking between the two, you're splitting hairs. both are solid franchise pieces, and neither are the "wrong" choice. defensively, both were spectacular. offensively, both are spectacular. both are amazing team leaders, and each is uniquely advantaged in their own way.

the one characteristic that stands out when matching up against both though... over their careers, if you beat duncan...you might still lose to other spurs (parker, manu, admiral). whereas, if you beat hakeem, no one else was stepping up usually. both make their teammates better, but hakeem was the only person to carry the load and all of his team's success came only from him.

dankydank
02-15-2013, 10:59 AM
Hakeem always had elite roleplayers who stepped up
thats how they won in the playoffs
he didnt have an elite #2 option in one championship
Otis Thorpe 14/10 on 56% shooting
Veron Maxwell who open court talks about being one of the toughest defenders in the nba
Kenny Smith was one of the most offensive efficient players in the league
Robert Horry one of the best stretch 4s in nba history
Mario Ellie another good defender/3 point shooter who was clutch as fuark, it wasnt til he joined the spurs starting lineup in 1999 that they went on a tear and won the championship
Sam Cassel who went on to be an all star later on

and defensive rating is points allowed per 100 possessions
its a team stat and Duncan is the best anchor in nba history which is why his his so good and still is the best in the nba at age 36 soon to be 37
and no he doesnt take weaker defensive assignments and hes never had foul problems in his career
hes not a deandre jordan who jumps at every pump fake and pads his blocks
Duncan probably has the best defensive instincts of all time
he knows exactly when to contest, when to block, when to boxout, and when not to do anything
his offensive game is also really underrated
he didnt have as much moves but he was just as efficient

lee4
02-16-2013, 12:31 PM
1. Hakeem always had elite roleplayers who stepped up
thats how they won in the playoffs
2. he didnt have an elite #2 option in one championship
3. Otis Thorpe 14/10 on 56% shooting
4. Veron Maxwell who open court talks about being one of the toughest defenders in the nba
5. Kenny Smith was one of the most offensive efficient players in the league
6. Robert Horry one of the best stretch 4s in nba history
7. Mario Ellie another good defender/3 point shooter who was clutch as fuark, it wasnt til he joined the spurs starting lineup in 1999 that they went on a tear and won the championship
8. Sam Cassel who went on to be an all star later on

9. and defensive rating is points allowed per 100 possessions
10. its a team stat and Duncan is the best anchor in nba history which is why his his so good and still is the best in the nba at age 36 soon to be 37
11. and no he doesnt take weaker defensive assignments and hes never had foul problems in his career
hes not a deandre jordan who jumps at every pump fake and pads his blocks
12. Duncan probably has the best defensive instincts of all time
he knows exactly when to contest, when to block, when to boxout, and when not to do anything
his offensive game is also really underrated
13. he didnt have as much moves but he was just as efficient
numbered your posts for responses below...
1. if he always had "elite role players stepping up", then (on both perspectives)
a: why was maxwell his second leading contributor in the '94 playoffs averaging 13ppg on 37% FG%???
or b: who "stepped up" to cover for hakeems series clinching game 7 stats against phx (37p on 54%, 17rbs, 5ast, 3 blocks) or NY (25/10/7/3blk/1stl while holding PRIME ewing to 17 points)...oh, and this (who is stepping up here taking the ring away from one of the most dangerous clutch shooters of his era???)
CzUv5_YFhPI

2. what point does this prove? hakeem won it against a better NY team WITHOUT clyde. drexler JOINED a reigning championship team that DID NOT need him against a weaker orlando team (can you say sweep?).

3. otis thorpe PLAYOFF averages saw him score 4 points less per game, and his rebounds dipped too.

4. i liked maxwell, and he is a tenacious defender. however, in the 1994 playoffs he managed a defensive rating of 109. so, how exactly does a defensive rating of 109 get a team a ring?

5. the jet was so efficient in 1994 that he managed to shoot 45% from the field, while turning the ball over 1.4 times on his way to 4 assists. world class efficiency there.

6. horry was a solid stretch 4 with clutch performance over his CAREER. in 1994 he shot 43% and managed 8 points in game 7 vs. NY.

7. yes, mario ellie's 5 ppg on 39% shooting in the 1994 playoffs... how did he go unnoticed until he reached the spurs???

8. cassell did "go on to be an all-star"...in 2004, ten years after his rookie championship campaign in 1994, where he shot an amazing 39% from the field.

9. so, a players defensive rating is defined as "points allowed per 100 possessions", is that all?

10. a players defensive rating is a TEAM stat??? then how did "the glove" maxwell have a playoff defensive rating of 109 in '94 while hakeem had a rating of 97 that SAME playoff year?

11. really? so "the greatest defensive instincts and fundamentals ever" was responsible for amare's 38 points and 12 rebounds to close out the series in 06-07? further, for only ever beating shaq in the playoffs one time, in 2003, losing overall 4-1?

12. how can you quantify this, and if so, how can this same opinion not be said of hakeem?

13. i don't disagree here, both are amazing franchise players, but neither is above the other here.

monsterBEN
02-16-2013, 12:50 PM
Tim Duncan is my all-time favorite player, but I'd take Hakeem if I was starting a franchise with the #1 pick.