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masonb62
09-03-2012, 07:19 PM
Hey all,

Currently cutting at ~1800-1900 calories(maintenance of ~2500). Macros of ~150g of protein and 70g of fat. On average i consume ~130 - 150g of carbs. 5"7 and weight 94kg at the moment.

My training is mainly weight training however I have started dedicating a day or two to cardio and core. Normally I will burn 300-400 calories over ~30min doing HIIT running.

I have read that if doing cardio I should eat more to bring up my deficit to -500 cals from maintenance again. I was just curious of the negative impacts if I wasn't to do this and to just continue eating my 1800 cals a day. I don't feel drained for energy and take pre / post workout supplements. A 30 min run is rather easy and I still have plenty of energy for core conditioning after. On lifting days I feel I still have a lot of strength as well and am able to lift heavy.

By not eating more + cardio this would then put me at ~ 1500 calories which just seems like to much but physically I feel fine and have plenty of energy. Will it affect weight loss (i.e will i stop losing and plateau) or by not eating more will I just start to eventually eat muscle and lose strength? My goals at the moment are to get rid of this fat so a little bit of muscle loss is not a huge concern for me at the moment.

Cheers,
Ben

Paneetius
09-03-2012, 08:05 PM
IMO, you can cut the cardio, so that when you stall, you can use it to get out of the plateau. Right now, I am cutting at 1800-2100 cals with no cardio and I am losing fat real fast. 1 cheat day a week keeps me sane.

Anyways, to answer your question, doesn't matter if you add calories or stay at the same rate. If you add, you will lose fat slower, but you won't stall as often, but you won't have much space for cheat, extra stuff.

If you don't add, you will lose fat faster, but when you hit a plateau, you'll need to eat at maintenance for one week, for body to readjust.

What is important is that you get in your macros, multivitamin and something for your joints (e.g. glucosamine, msm, chondroitin, etc.) if you continue with HIIT, cos that stuff is HIGH IMPACT, not good for your joints, especially when you're overweight.

P.S. if you know your bf %, 30 calories x fat (in lb) on body is how big your deficit can be. One of Lyle mcdonalds articles on max deficit. so as long as you don't over do the deficit, you will spare muscle mass.

good luck, comrade.

masonb62
09-03-2012, 08:19 PM
P.S. if you know your bf %, 30 calories x fat (in lb) on body is how big your deficit can be. One of Lyle mcdonalds articles on max deficit. so as long as you don't over do the deficit, you will spare muscle mass.

good luck, comrade.

Thanks mate, cardio is something I enjoy doing so I don't really want to cut it out.

So that formula for me would be

~30% BF at 207lbs
~62 lbs of fat

30 x 62 = 1860 calories to avoid muscle loss

so on running days where i use ~ 300 - 400 calories i should try and eat 2100 calories in the day to avoid any muscle loss and to keep losing weight.

Paneetius
09-03-2012, 08:30 PM
that formula is for your max deficit, e.g. 30 x 62 = 1860. That is the maximum deficit you can be in, so maintenance Calories - 1860 = calories you eat to lose max fat, but sustain muscle. here's a calculator www[dot]conradcreel.com/ It will give you minimum calories. so as long as you eat above the listed calories, you're good, nothing bad will happen.

So yeah I really just put that in there for you to understand that there wouldn't be any huge negative effects like muscle loss if you didn't add cals

Also, are you sure about your maintenance calories? Cos I'm 5'4" if I'm lucky, 163lb (yeah, went from 172 to current weight since august) and my maintenance is like 2500-2700... I'm cutting at 2000-2200 cals and I'm losing about 1.5lb a week...

masonb62
09-03-2012, 08:41 PM
I just recalculated using Katch-McArdle scale. Considering BF% 30% and weight of 94kg.

BMR = 370 + (21.6 x LBM)

Where LBM = [94kg x (100 - 30%BF)]/100
[94 x 70] / 100
6580 / 100
= 65.8kg LBM

BMR = 370 + (21.6 x 65.8LBM)
BMR = 370 + 1421
BMR = 1791

1.2 = Sedentary (Desk job, and Little Formal Exercise

1791 x 1.2
= 2149 maintenance

That doesn't seem right to me, did i screw up somewhere? Originally I just followed the Harris-Benedict formula and got ~2400 - 2500 when I first did it (at 98kg).

Paneetius
09-03-2012, 08:58 PM
well, you lift and cardio, so your activity multiplier should be at least 1.5, not 1.2 so I'd say your maintenance is 2500-3000, maybe even a little more because of cardio.
pretty sure lifting and intense HIIT is not considered "little formal exercise". haha
IMO, you should slowly quit all stimulants (e.g. pre-workout), raise calories to 2500-3000 and find maintenance (2 weeks should be good), and then start to lower to 500-700 cal deficit. After a week or two of diet, you will feel all depressed and tired, but it will go away, it's natural during a cut to feel like that for a couple days as the body adapts.
Hit macros, and give yourself a goal, before you get a cheat day (remember, if you gain weight after a cheat day, it's water and glycogen).
Imo, you shouldn't need to depend on pre-workout stimulant for gym energy.

good luck, gonna go to sleep lol, I'll reply to more stuff tomorrow!

masonb62
09-03-2012, 09:15 PM
cool, well i originally thought 2500 maintenance was about right so i will keep pressing on at ~1800 - 2000 calories a day to achieve a 500-700 calorie deficit and will see if anything changes..

Pre-workouts are only used to give me a kick in the ass really after work. Staring at a monitor 8-10 hours a day and dealing with user support / technical issues is just mentally draining and i find it hard to actually get to the gym without a bit of a kick. Physically I don't feel drained and feel as if i coul run a marathon but mentally i just want to go home and hide in my room haha.

buckiaj
09-04-2012, 05:39 AM
well, you lift and cardio, so your activity multiplier should be at least 1.5, not 1.2 so I'd say your maintenance is 2500-3000, maybe even a little more because of cardio.
pretty sure lifting and intense HIIT is not considered "little formal exercise". haha
IMO, you should slowly quit all stimulants (e.g. pre-workout), raise calories to 2500-3000 and find maintenance (2 weeks should be good), and then start to lower to 500-700 cal deficit. After a week or two of diet, you will feel all depressed and tired, but it will go away, it's natural during a cut to feel like that for a couple days as the body adapts.
Hit macros, and give yourself a goal, before you get a cheat day (remember, if you gain weight after a cheat day, it's water and glycogen).
Imo, you shouldn't need to depend on pre-workout stimulant for gym energy.

good luck, gonna go to sleep lol, I'll reply to more stuff tomorrow!

While I think you gave some good advice here, I feel like I have to chime in on the maintenance calorie talk.

I'm almost 5"9, 175lbs, fairly active during the average workday and lift 4-5 times a week. If I eat more than 2500 calories per day, I will start to gain weight. My maintenance is somewhere around 2100-2300. To tell someone trying to lose fat, to eat between 2500-3000 calories to find their maintenance number I think is a little wreckless.

OP - If you want my advice, I think assuming your maintenance is 2,500 per day, is a good start. Just track every single calorie you eat for a couple weeks, and it will be pretty easy to see where you stand by doing some pretty simple math. Basically, you take all of your calories for those two weeks, add them up. Then take how many lbs you lost, and multiply it by 3,500. Add those two numbers together, then divide by 14 (or the number of days you are calculating, best to use two weeks). You will then have your number of calories you burned on average per day during those two weeks.

For Example:

Lets say for 14 days, you ate 28,000 calories. At the end of the two weeks, you lost two lbs. (2 * 3,500) so you add those 7,000 calories to the 28,000. That gives you, 35,000 calories that you burned in two weeks via dietary energy and stored energy. Once I divide that number by 14, i get 2,500. So in this example, I burned on average, 2,500 calories per day.

To best find the most accurate number, I will actually weigh myself twice at the beginning, and twice at the end and take the average of the two weights. More or less to control the possible variable of one of the weigh in days being an outlier with more or less water weight.

Paneetius
09-04-2012, 07:38 AM
Well, different people have different genetics :P So different metabolisms and other variables. In my case, my metabolism was higher than I expected :) so I got to eat more than I first expected. Only downside is that you might over shoot it like I did and not lose fat. but then once I recalculated. it was smooth sailing.