PDA

View Full Version : Hakeem Olajuwon is the GOAT Center



JustBulk
08-10-2012, 06:34 AM
From the GOAT himself:

"If I had to pick a center [for an all-time best team], I would take Olajuwon. That leaves out Shaq, Patrick Ewing. It leaves out Wilt Chamberlain. It leaves out a lot of people. And the reason I would take Olajuwon is very simple: he is so versatile because of what he can give you from that position. It's not just his scoring, not just his rebounding or not just his blocked shots. People don't realize he was in the top seven in steals. He always made great decisions on the court. For all facets of the game, I have to give it to him."
—Michael Jordan

Source: Shanken, Marvin. One-on-One with Michael Jordan, Cigar Aficionado, September 1, 2005.

And oh,

0GCyU0sKxqI

namean
08-10-2012, 06:42 AM
Random thread is random lulz

Ivan7x
08-10-2012, 06:43 AM
in b4 mad phaggots

the GOAT has spoken

jkeithc82
08-10-2012, 06:44 AM
What a handsome thread.

UHBrah
08-10-2012, 06:47 AM
Too much real life ITT

namean
08-10-2012, 06:51 AM
He made David Robinson look like a rookie in that Western Conference Finals in 93-94 (I think that was the year)

Mr_Aryze
08-10-2012, 06:53 AM
http://i.imgur.com/h1Avh.gif

JustBulk
08-10-2012, 06:55 AM
He made David Robinson look like a rookie in that Western Conference Finals in 93-94 (I think that was the year)

I think it was 94-95, if you are referring to the year when Robinson won MVP.

hW4uXlRGAF0

You forgot to mention that both Robinson and Rodman made All-Defensive teams that year.

namean
08-10-2012, 07:00 AM
I think it was 94-95, if you are referring to the year when Robinson won MVP.

hW4uXlRGAF0

You forgot to mention that both Robinson and Rodman made All-Defensive teams that year.

Yep, that was the year. David was my boy. Couldnt believe he got abused like that.

wifestealer
08-10-2012, 08:26 AM
the dream... only seen highlight of this fukker and it blows my mind how quick he was.

but if we were playing a pickup game and you took him first, i'd be very happy taking a prime shaq secound. i'm sorry but 38 ppg, 17 rpg, 2.3apg, 61% shooting with less than 3 minutes rest each game? is this real fukking life, sorry excuse for centers we have in the league now.

the 90s was easily the GOAT decade for bigs, pls go with the russell/wilt talk, the records from 1980 and earlier could all be erased and noone would actually give a fuk.

JustBulk
08-11-2012, 10:48 PM
the dream... only seen highlight of this fukker and it blows my mind how quick he was.

but if we were playing a pickup game and you took him first, i'd be very happy taking a prime shaq secound. i'm sorry but 38 ppg, 17 rpg, 2.3apg, 61% shooting with less than 3 minutes rest each game? is this real fukking life, sorry excuse for centers we have in the league now.

the 90s was easily the GOAT decade for bigs, pls go with the russell/wilt talk, the records from 1980 and earlier could all be erased and noone would actually give a fuk.

Brute force isn't everything, son.

Many people forgot that the Rockets were a semi-decent team that Olajuwon took to championships.

YellowOnYellow
08-11-2012, 10:53 PM
the dream... only seen highlight of this fukker and it blows my mind how quick he was.

but if we were playing a pickup game and you took him first, i'd be very happy taking a prime shaq secound. i'm sorry but 38 ppg, 17 rpg, 2.3apg, 61% shooting with less than 3 minutes rest each game? is this real fukking life, sorry excuse for centers we have in the league now.

the 90s was easily the GOAT decade for bigs, pls go with the russell/wilt talk, the records from 1980 and earlier could all be erased and noone would actually give a fuk.

Jakes on you! The dream schooled baby shaq in the finals.

ilovedrpepper
08-11-2012, 10:55 PM
http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs2/1468239_o.gif
http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/943162/dream-shake_medium.gif

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/943159/dream.gif

mmherzog
08-11-2012, 10:57 PM
brb bill russell

SystemTrend
08-11-2012, 10:57 PM
no thanks GTFO (srs)



http://ionetheurbandaily.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/shaquille-oneal-2011.jpeg

DFINC
08-11-2012, 10:57 PM
That top play is sick..guards can't even pull that sh!t off today. He's definitely a better player than Shaq in my book, beat him in the finals too.

TTexasTT
08-11-2012, 10:58 PM
The Dream....

YellowOnYellow
08-11-2012, 11:04 PM
no thanks GTFO (srs)



http://ionetheurbandaily.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/shaquille-oneal-2011.jpeg

Hakeem would literally run circles around shaq and hold his own in the paint.

wheynweed
08-11-2012, 11:14 PM
Itt: phaggots mad nobody has ever heard of hakeem. Lol at op creating this thread out of insecurity.. u mad in a poll of 100 NBA fans, olajuwon would be lucky to get ten votes for goat c? If he's so good how come nobody's ever heard of his ass? Ursofukingmadrightnow.jpg

SystemTrend
08-11-2012, 11:16 PM
Hakeem would literally run circles around shaq and hold his own in the paint.

we're just gonna agree to disagree, no point in arguing, i can't convince you and you can't convince me.

good day sir.

spirit3530
08-11-2012, 11:21 PM
Actually it is because Hakeem played in Houston

GOAT Center Lineup

Mikan Lakers
Russell Celtics
Wilt Lakers
Kareem Lakers
Walton Celtics
Ewing Knicks
Robinson Spurs
Hakeem Rockets
Shaq Lakers



???

DFINC
08-11-2012, 11:21 PM
Itt: phaggots mad nobody has ever heard of hakeem. Lol at op creating this thread out of insecurity.. u mad in a poll of 100 NBA fans, olajuwon would be lucky to get ten votes for goat c? If he's so good how come nobody's ever heard of his ass? Ursofukingmadrightnow.jpg

Ignorant fuk..

CLandry
08-11-2012, 11:23 PM
From the GOAT himself:

"If I had to pick a center [for an all-time best team], I would take Olajuwon. That leaves out Shaq, Patrick Ewing. It leaves out Wilt Chamberlain. It leaves out a lot of people. And the reason I would take Olajuwon is very simple: he is so versatile because of what he can give you from that position. It's not just his scoring, not just his rebounding or not just his blocked shots. People don't realize he was in the top seven in steals. He always made great decisions on the court. For all facets of the game, I have to give it to him."
—Michael Jordan

Source: Shanken, Marvin. One-on-One with Michael Jordan, Cigar Aficionado, September 1, 2005.

And oh,

0GCyU0sKxqI Wasn't kareem better? (wasn't old enough to watch them play)

SirPercival
08-11-2012, 11:41 PM
Don't think LeBron ever said that...

StreetSharks
08-11-2012, 11:45 PM
Actually it is because Hakeem played in Houston

GOAT Center Lineup

Mikan Lakers
Russell Celtics
Wilt Lakers
Kareem Lakers
Walton Celtics
Ewing Knicks
Robinson Spurs
Hakeem Rockets
Shaq Lakers



???

fukin lol

mikan? really have you seen him play?

dankydank
08-11-2012, 11:47 PM
plz go
david robinson still averaged something like 23/11/3/3
thats not being abused
in real tea the rockets just double/tripled robinson because his best players were sean elliot/vinny del negro or the offensively challenged rodman who hated being in san antonio

olajuwon couldnt be doubled because he had elite shooters or very good role players around him
mario ellie
kenny smith
otis thorpe
clyde drexler
roberty horry
sam cassel

spirit3530
08-11-2012, 11:52 PM
fukin lol

mikan? really have you seen him play?

The great centers are all winners except Ewing and from big markets. Hakeem is not well known because he is from a small market.


Wow, did I really have to say that that is not the order of their greatness...


WTF?

DFINC
08-11-2012, 11:54 PM
plz go
david robinson still averaged something like 23/11/3/3
thats not being abused
in real tea the rockets just double/tripled robinson because his best players were sean elliot/vinny del negro or the offensively challenged rodman who hated being in san antonio

olajuwon couldnt be doubled because he had elite shooters or very good role players around him
mario ellie
kenny smith
otis thorpe
clyde drexler
roberty horry
sam cassel

Sees sig..SA fan, understood. Hakeem won back to back titles without any HOF players on his team

SpiderSense
08-11-2012, 11:57 PM
Meh, IMO The Great Shaqtus.

Dude came in the league and straight dominated from the jump.

Also SMH at the tard who said he beat Shaq in the finals.

Yeah, he beat Shaq when Shaq was still basically a kid.

If they played in their primes I have no doubt Shaq would take his lunch money.

StreetSharks
08-12-2012, 12:04 AM
Meh, IMO The Great Shaqtus.

Dude came in the league and straight dominated from the jump.

Also SMH at the tard who said he beat Shaq in the finals.

Yeah, he beat Shaq when Shaq was still basically a kid.

If they played in their primes I have no doubt Shaq would take his lunch money.

prime shaq would be too fat to handle hakeem

SpiderSense
08-12-2012, 12:08 AM
prime shaq would be too fat to handle hakeem

Yes and tell me again how is Hakeem gonna stop Shaq?

heat63
08-12-2012, 12:19 AM
lets be real hakeem and robinson have both had a quadruple double before.



gimme prime shaq though on my team.

Schmyzz
08-12-2012, 12:19 AM
hakeem is goat

ClevageGobbler
08-12-2012, 12:22 AM
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
/thread

SpiderSense
08-12-2012, 12:25 AM
LMAO people don't think about the straight intimidation factor.

Think about your the guy about to play the Lakers, you have a 350 Lb. monster who wants to get to the basket.

But he's not one of these ***gy finesse players, he wants to go through you to get to the basket.

Dudes seen Lakers on the schedule and knew they were in for a long day.

TTexasTT
08-12-2012, 12:31 AM
LMAO people don't think about the straight intimidation factor.

Think about your the guy about to play the Lakers, you have a 350 Lb. monster who wants to get to the basket.

But he's not one of these ***gy finesse players, he wants to go through you to get to the basket.

Dudes seen Lakers on the schedule and knew they were in for a long day.
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn200/nbacardDOTnet/zz%20NBA%20Photo%20Gallery/Hakeem%20Olajuwon/VS/Shaquille%20Oneal/HAKEEM21_627a.jpg
http://ww2.hdnux.com/photos/04/47/77/1212357/3/628x471.jpg

TTexasTT
08-12-2012, 12:37 AM
http://i44.tinypic.com/w1a0ix.gif

SpiderSense
08-12-2012, 12:39 AM
You're a homer.

And I may be wrong but that's bad D on Ewing why not force him to the help?

wifestealer
08-12-2012, 12:45 AM
Brute force isn't everything, son.

Many people forgot that the Rockets were a semi-decent team that Olajuwon took to championships.


Jakes on you! The dream schooled baby shaq in the finals.

not sure if you misunderstood me, i think hakeem is the GOAT center, but at the same time i don't think shaq is any worse.

i'm just glad there are little to no mentions of wilt, russell and kareem. you have to be retarded to think either of those 3 guys can play ball with hakeem and shaq. robinson and ewing are better than those 3 grandpas.

motiv8td
08-12-2012, 12:47 AM
Being from Phoenix and of course growing up a Suns fan, whenever I hear Olajuwon, all I can think of is this dunk

8kidpegzfFc

BasedPrincess
08-12-2012, 12:48 AM
I never seen a center with moves like Hakeem. There's noone ever since who has even come close. Even skilled guys like Pau and Dirk don't even come close to matching them post moves. ****'s crazy....

wifestealer
08-12-2012, 12:55 AM
I never seen a center with moves like Hakeem. There's noone ever since who has even come close. Even skilled guys like Pau and Dirk don't even come close to matching them post moves. ****'s crazy....

pau is a good passer with nice footwork but no strength and dirk is a decent driver/great turnaround fade-away shooter. neither have any legit scoring low-post moves though, and both are soft as fuark on D

hayekforever
08-12-2012, 01:08 AM
Being from Phoenix and of course growing up a Suns fan, whenever I hear Olajuwon, all I can think of is this dunk

8kidpegzfFc

Theres a reason why The Dream is the all-time shot block leader in the NBA

ClevageGobbler
08-12-2012, 01:09 AM
not sure if you misunderstood me, i think hakeem is the GOAT center, but at the same time i don't think shaq is any worse.

i'm just glad there are little to no mentions of wilt, russell and kareem. you have to be retarded to think either of those 3 guys can play ball with hakeem and shaq. robinson and ewing are better than those 3 grandpas.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=abdulka01&p2=olajuha01

It's all about the W.

JustBulk
08-12-2012, 01:17 AM
LMAO people don't think about the straight intimidation factor.

Think about your the guy about to play the Lakers, you have a 350 Lb. monster who wants to get to the basket.

But he's not one of these ***gy finesse players, he wants to go through you to get to the basket.

Dudes seen Lakers on the schedule and knew they were in for a long day.

I'm a Lakers fan here too, but cmon, Hakeem > Shaq.

What's this mention of Hakeem being a "***gy finesse" player? You don't earn a reputation as the league's top shot-blocker and 2x DPOY as a "***gy finesse player". He did depend more on finesse to score, but he's one tough mofo on the defensive end as well.

Hardcore_D00d
08-12-2012, 01:29 AM
Itt: phaggots mad nobody has ever heard of hakeem. Lol at op creating this thread out of insecurity.. u mad in a poll of 100 NBA fans, olajuwon would be lucky to get ten votes for goat c? If he's so good how come nobody's ever heard of his ass? Ursofukingmadrightnow.jpg

da fuk. no one has heard of hakeem? not sure if srs...u gotta be trolling, i barely started watching bball when lebron came into the league and even ive heard of hakeem.

kronzino
08-12-2012, 02:04 AM
I was convinced that this dude roided during the championship years.

Harrock
08-12-2012, 03:56 AM
Too many trolls/20 year olds in this thread who don't know **** about basketball/never saw the nba in the 90s. Oh and Shaq better than Hakeem? You went full retard.

wifestealer
08-12-2012, 03:59 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=abdulka01&p2=olajuha01

It's all about the W.

showtime lakers with magic johnson running the point doesn't disprove anything about who the better center was. hakeem was superior in every facet of the game. scoring, rebounding, assists, steals, blocks, defensive presence, offensive arsenal. it's not even a real contest, just look at their respective games.

Hengman
08-12-2012, 05:12 AM
Hakeem is the best center of all time.

He was versatile to a point where he would guard even around the perimeter and then run back to the lane to guard the big men, AND still shut down the entire offense on his own. He was also very smooth and had the BEST footwork for any center. Nobody could stick D on him because they couldn't predict if he was going to go left or right, especially in the post. He's known more for his footwork
if anything. Numerous guys in the league have said this about Hakeem.

Shaq already admitted how good Hakeem really was, and I think Shaq said this in an interview that Hakeem was the hardest person he's ever really had to match up against. The interview can be found on YouTube (I'm on mobile so can't look for it).

And it's funny how ignorant some people are in this thread when it comes to Hakeem. One guy said isn't Kareem better because he was too young to see Hakeem play. Hakeem came way after Kareem's prime (Kareem retired in 89).

What is up with the stats too? Michael Jordan didn't have the most points ever, yet he is GOAT status. Watch each legendary player play and then be the judge. Besides, people are pointing out stupid stat categories instead of looking at the efficiency of each player statistically when they are compared.

JustBulk
08-12-2012, 05:52 AM
He was versatile to a point where he would guard even around the perimeter and then run back to the lane to guard the big men, AND still shut down the entire offense on his own.

This.

BRB averaging nearly 2 steals as a C.

yungbreezy
08-12-2012, 05:56 AM
Kareem > Hakeem.

duece49
08-12-2012, 09:03 AM
dream shaking on these haters

StreetSharks
08-12-2012, 09:14 AM
Yes and tell me again how is Hakeem gonna stop Shaq?

how is shaq going to stop hakeem?

Ivan7x
08-12-2012, 09:29 AM
http://i44.tinypic.com/w1a0ix.gifhnnnnnnggggggggg

lol at all the mad phaggots lmao

evansanity
08-12-2012, 09:58 AM
Hard to dislike a guy like Hakeem. Nice of Lebron to say that.

ko5567
08-12-2012, 10:04 AM
its hard for me to pick between shaq and hakeem...but they are definitely the best 2 centers of all time

they dominated in an era filled with great centers

StreetSharks
08-12-2012, 10:07 AM
its hard for me to pick between shaq and hakeem...but they are definitely the best 2 centers of all time

they dominated in an era filled with great centers

shaq didnt dominate until the great centers retired

ko5567
08-12-2012, 10:16 AM
shaq didnt dominate until the great centers retired

umm wat?

shaq was pretty dominant in his first few years in the league while players like hakeem, ewing, and robinson were playing still

JustBulk
08-12-2012, 10:46 AM
umm wat?

shaq was pretty dominant in his first few years in the league while players like hakeem, ewing, and robinson were playing still

Lol, no he didnt.

He got schooled hard by Hakeem in the 1995 Finals.

I'm not using the above fact as a basis to compare Shaq and Hakeem, but it is a fact that Shaq didn't dominate until all the great centers retire.

JoshSelbyfor3
08-12-2012, 10:51 AM
We gonna act like Shaq wouldn't embarass the fuk out of Olajuwon?

BRB single handedly winning 3 titles in a row.
BRB most dominant offensive center of modern era.

wheynweed
08-12-2012, 10:59 AM
Nobody knows who the fuk Hakeem Olajuwon is. Thread is invalid.

WestAfrica
08-12-2012, 11:06 AM
Nobody knows who the fuk Hakeem Olajuwon is. Thread is invalid.

Everytime I read one of your posts its just trash? Ppl know Kareem but won't know Hakeem?

wheynweed
08-12-2012, 11:10 AM
Everytime I read one of your posts its just trash? Ppl know Kareem but won't know Hakeem?
Correct. He's not a big as name as you'd like to believe. I know this section loves to root for the underdog, but face it, when people think GOAT center they think Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Hakeem is talented, yes, but he's virtually unheard of.

Ivan7x
08-12-2012, 11:14 AM
Nobody knows who the fuk Hakeem Olajuwon is. Thread is invalid.lol youre dumb as fuk

JBhaverhill
08-12-2012, 11:23 AM
Love how all the laker fans comes to say Shaq is the GOAT. But when someone says Kobe was carried by Shaq to the finals, all the sudden Shaq had nothing to do with it.

kronzino
08-12-2012, 11:48 AM
Correct. He's not a big as name as you'd like to believe. I know this section loves to root for the underdog, but face it, when people think GOAT center they think Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Hakeem is talented, yes, but he's virtually unheard of.

Wow what is this I don't even

Please don't ever post about basketball ever again

WestAfrica
08-12-2012, 01:06 PM
Correct. He's not a big as name as you'd like to believe. I know this section loves to root for the underdog, but face it, when people think GOAT center they think Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Hakeem is talented, yes, but he's virtually unheard of.

But the thing is if someone calls themselves a basketball fan you are going to know Hakeem...You might not know Mikan or Gervin but Hakeem was relevant when we were like 10 yrs old so...

JoshSelbyfor3
08-12-2012, 01:17 PM
Love how all the laker fans comes to say Shaq is the GOAT. But when someone says Kobe was carried by Shaq to the finals, all the sudden Shaq had nothing to do with it.
It doesn't take homer goggles to see that Shaq was the GOAT offensive force and could play D at a high level as well. Hakeem was great, legendary even. He just wasn't the GOAT.

lee4
08-12-2012, 01:51 PM
OP and his Airness speak the truth.

Hakeem, Quadruple Double King. Won back to back titles. Competed in an era of dominant centers and owned them all, with a weaker roster ('94 and prior).


LOL at people saying he's not known...
- when OP has quoted MICHAEL JORDAN as the person who picked him,
-Shaq admits he couldn't shake The Dream,
-and his stats and basketball IQ are light years ahead of any center around today, which is why every post player pays Hakeem BANK to teach them HOW to play.

i mean seriously, the Magic had PATRICK EWING as a coach for dwight howard and they still sent him to olajuwon for an education.




BUT...he didn't have a shoe deal, so he MUST be worthless.

http://imgc.allpostersimages.com/images/P-473-488-90/40/4085/WU9VF00Z/posters/hakeem-olajuwon.jpg

ko5567
08-12-2012, 02:42 PM
Lol, no he didnt.

He got schooled hard by Hakeem in the 1995 Finals.

I'm not using the above fact as a basis to compare Shaq and Hakeem, but it is a fact that Shaq didn't dominate until all the great centers retire.

you realize shaq was scoring almost 30 ppg by his 2nd season right?

Peter Ruby
08-12-2012, 03:00 PM
OP and his Airness speak the truth.

Hakeem, Quadruple Double King. Won back to back titles. Competed in an era of dominant centers and owned them all, with a weaker roster ('94 and prior).


LOL at people saying he's not known...
- when OP has quoted MICHAEL JORDAN as the person who picked him,
-Shaq admits he couldn't shake The Dream,
-and his stats and basketball IQ are light years ahead of any center around today, which is why every post player pays Hakeem BANK to teach them HOW to play.

i mean seriously, the Magic had PATRICK EWING as a coach for dwight howard and they still sent him to olajuwon for an education.




BUT...he didn't have a shoe deal, so he MUST be worthless.

http://imgc.allpostersimages.com/images/P-473-488-90/40/4085/WU9VF00Z/posters/hakeem-olajuwon.jpg

Truth right here fellas.

duece49
08-12-2012, 03:24 PM
to all the shaq lovers, Hakeem always had shaq's number when they played, and wooped that ass in the finals.

4backcracks
08-12-2012, 03:29 PM
Brute force isn't everything, son.

Many people forgot that the Rockets were a semi-decent team that Olajuwon took to championships.


Correct. He's not a big as name as you'd like to believe. I know this section loves to root for the underdog, but face it, when people think GOAT center they think Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Hakeem is talented, yes, but he's virtually unheard of.

lololololol no.

If anything, they think Kareem, Wilt, Russel.


We can't ignore the fact that parts of Shaq's enduring legacy will be the fact that he was a late game liability, and that he coasted through most of his regular seasons. His complete disregard for team chemistry, and his unwillingness to share the spotlight will undoubtedly surface more and more as time goes on.


Show me any other big man in history who won a title without a single all star teammate. Hakeem did. Twice.

Hakeem was the clear cut best in the NBA's greatest crop of big men. Shaq never had to contend with any other hall of fame centers in their prime.

ProLibertas
08-12-2012, 03:49 PM
Iz7ZUzqG93c

yieldtonothing
08-12-2012, 03:54 PM
hakeem played in the era of the golden age of centers and he swallowed them all whole.

wilt was more dominant because nobody could match him physically...i think hakeem would for sure outplay him

russel has the rings

kareem has the all time #s

but hakeem is the goat.

brb dream shake

jkeithc82
08-12-2012, 08:37 PM
Correct. He's not a big as name as you'd like to believe. I know this section loves to root for the underdog, but face it, when people think GOAT center they think Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Hakeem is talented, yes, but he's virtually unheard of.

You're a f*cking idiot.

JrM703
08-12-2012, 08:38 PM
Op is an idiot.

dillow
08-13-2012, 12:02 AM
http://i44.tinypic.com/w1a0ix.gif

damnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

JustBulk
08-13-2012, 12:07 AM
Love how all the laker fans comes to say Shaq is the GOAT. But when someone says Kobe was carried by Shaq to the finals, all the sudden Shaq had nothing to do with it.

I'm a lakers fan and I am OP of thread.

Problem?

MilwaukeeBrah
08-13-2012, 12:17 AM
Local sports radio host Matt Jackson was talking about past drafts and brought up something that then Rockets coach Bill Fitch said in a book (didn't get the name of the book).

He said that in 1984 the Blazers offered Drexler AND the #2 pick in the draft for Ralph Sampson (only). Sampson had just come off a ROY campaign and Drexler struggled his rookie year, plus the Blazers needed a big man. The Rockets said no, and everyone ended up with who they got.

The Rockets would have had hometown favorites Olajuwon and Drexler, and since they had a big man, wouldn't have drafted injured Sam Bowie, thus picking Jordan at #2.

what in the actual fuk....

gswarrior510
08-13-2012, 12:18 AM
Shaq played as well if not better than Hakeem in the finals..Stop with that outplayed bs. His team chocked

HelloDurr
08-13-2012, 12:30 AM
Laker fan checking in. All you guys went full retard.

Shaq better than the dream??? Smfh
Srs?

Reason why Kobe and lebron gets lessons from the dream. Come on kids

gswarrior510
08-13-2012, 12:37 AM
Laker fan checking in. All you guys went full retard.

Shaq better than the dream??? Smfh
Srs?

Reason why Kobe and lebron gets lessons from the dream. Come on kids

for the post moves...wtf is kobe going to learn from shaq? how to push everybody over with his 7'3 300 lb frame and dunk on everybody?

HelloDurr
08-13-2012, 12:42 AM
for the post moves...wtf is kobe going to learn from shaq? how to push everybody over with his 7'3 300 lb frame and dunk on everybody?

Do you even dream?

gswarrior510
08-13-2012, 12:50 AM
Do you even dream?

no idea, dont remember my dreams :(

ClevageGobbler
08-13-2012, 01:19 AM
It doesn't take homer goggles to see that Shaq was the GOAT offensive force and could play D at a high level as well. Hakeem was great, legendary even. He just wasn't the GOAT.

Shaq is definitely not the GOAT offensive force. Kareem owns that title and it's by a landslide. It's not even remotely close. There isn't one player anybody can name that has done more on the offensive end than Kareem. Not one.

BasedPrincess
08-13-2012, 01:50 AM
How can you say Shaq is better when Shaq himself will tell you Hakeem owned him every time they played. He owned David Robinson, he owned Ewing, and always came through in the playoffs. LOL at people saying nobody knows Hakeem. Obviously, compared to Shaq, a dude that did music, movies, shows, shoes etc., he's not a big celebrity but we are talking basketball here...



I don't see any big men going to shaq during the offseason for lessons...



@gswarrior, shaq himself says Hakeem "embarrassed" him in that finals (@ 2:20). Also go to 4:20 to hear some great words from Kenny Smith on the type of guy Hakeem was....
rEQH5QRH60I

wifestealer
08-13-2012, 01:57 AM
Shaq is definitely not the GOAT offensive force. Kareem owns that title and it's by a landslide. It's not even remotely close. There isn't one player anybody can name that has done more on the offensive end than Kareem. Not one.

kareem had high durability, in terms of an offensive skill set he doesn't own anything by a landslide, not over hakeem and not over shaq. he had magic johnson distributing to him for half his career. what he has over other big men was his durability. he played less than 74 games twice in 19 years, and even then he played 62 and 65 games. overrated player, 7'2 and barely 100kgs. he wouldn't have lasted 19 years if he had to match up with ewing, robinson, shaq and hakeem all in their primes. keep sucking his dick because he wore purple and gold

yungbreezy
08-13-2012, 02:52 AM
kareem had high durability, in terms of an offensive skill set he doesn't own anything by a landslide, not over hakeem and not over shaq. he had magic johnson distributing to him for half his career. what he has over other big men was his durability. he played less than 74 games twice in 19 years, and even then he played 62 and 65 games. overrated player, 7'2 and barely 100kgs. he wouldn't have lasted 19 years if he had to match up with ewing, robinson, shaq and hakeem all in their primes. keep sucking his dick because he wore purple and gold

Jesus Christ, what am I reading? educate yourself on Kareem, dude was a once in a lifetime player.

He dominates Shaq in every catergory, and the only thing you could give Hakeem over him is his defense.

TheRejuvenated
08-13-2012, 02:56 AM
Top 4 centers are Russell Wilt Hakeem and Jabbar without question, mix em around how you please, hard of course, to debate inter generational players

ClevageGobbler
08-13-2012, 03:07 AM
kareem had high durability, in terms of an offensive skill set he doesn't own anything by a landslide, not over hakeem and not over shaq. he had magic johnson distributing to him for half his career. what he has over other big men was his durability. he played less than 74 games twice in 19 years, and even then he played 62 and 65 games. overrated player, 7'2 and barely 100kgs. he wouldn't have lasted 19 years if he had to match up with ewing, robinson, shaq and hakeem all in their primes. keep sucking his dick because he wore purple and gold

So, how many points do you want to discredit the man? Is it Kareem's fault no other center to play the game didn't play the game as intelligently as himself?

Kareem spent a total of 62,317 minutes on the hardwood if you count all the reg season, playoff, and all star games. He did that as seven foot two center making his living in the blood and guts area. You want to know who holds second place among centers? Wilt Chamberlain with a total of 55,808 minutes played throughout his professional career. That's a huge difference and Kareem's era boasted a ton of brilliant centers.

KAJ has one of the best offensive minds basketball has ever seen. There's no way he could have lead his teams to 10 NBA Finals appearances and 6 NBA championships without his superior skill set, both offensively and defensively.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-13-2012, 03:57 AM
There are alot of great centers and its hard to pick the GOAT. People act as if they actually seen every single one of them play. Hakeem in the 90's was the best at that time. He outplayed Robinson, Ewing, and young Shaq. If your talking straight up skills you have to choose Hakeem over Shaq. Shaq was successful because of his size not necessarily his skill set. However he used it to his advantage and I would say was one of the most dominant centers in his Prime. He was just too big and strong. He appeared to be much bigger in his LA days than his Orlando days, yet he still had the quickness which was pretty freaky.

Prime Shaq vs Prime Olajuwon would be crazy to watch. I swear at the time nobody can handle Hakeem, he had too many go to moves, and as someone said made Robinson who was MVP all team Defense, look like a rookie.

Fuji400
08-13-2012, 04:13 AM
I'm just going to leave this here...


uBrEsNS9zKg


Notice how he blocks to the advantage of his team...GOAT.

yourname2221
08-13-2012, 04:32 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=abdulka01&p2=olajuha01

It's all about the W.

u had me till u look at the playoffs

4-1 hakeem

Harrock
08-13-2012, 04:35 AM
Shaq is definitely not the GOAT offensive force. Kareem owns that title and it's by a landslide. It's not even remotely close. There isn't one player anybody can name that has done more on the offensive end than Kareem. Not one.

Age: 21.

What do you know about Kareem? I only saw highlights and i watched basketball as long as i could remember. Son...

I OuTsiDeR I
08-13-2012, 04:41 AM
Age: 21.

What do you know about Kareem? I only saw highlights and i watched basketball as long as i could remember. Son...This ^^^^^

Nobody that post here has seen all the considered great centers play unless they watched highlights. The younger Generation will always disregard Wilt, Russell, never seeing them really play.

In my generation it would be Hakeem vs Shaq for the debate since I actually watched them. Overall complete player would be Hakeem. But still its hard to pick against a Prime Shaq. Don't know who to choose they are both great.

wifestealer
08-13-2012, 04:50 AM
So, how many points do you want to discredit the man? Is it Kareem's fault no other center to play the game didn't play the game as intelligently as himself?

Kareem spent a total of 62,317 minutes on the hardwood if you count all the reg season, playoff, and all star games. He did that as seven foot two center making his living in the blood and guts area. You want to know who holds second place among centers? Wilt Chamberlain with a total of 55,808 minutes played throughout his professional career. That's a huge difference and Kareem's era boasted a ton of brilliant centers.

KAJ has one of the best offensive minds basketball has ever seen. There's no way he could have lead his teams to 10 NBA Finals appearances and 6 NBA championships without his superior skill set, both offensively and defensively.

i don't want to discredit him of any points whatsoever, he deserves to be the all-time scoring leader because of his ability to stay dedicated and stay healthy. does that make him the landslide GOAT center in terms of skills? not a chance. if we wanna work like that then why don't we go ahead and say jason kidd was a better PG than magic.

we're going to pretend there was competition in the nba back then? 17 teams in kareems rookie season, and only the celtics won 9 of the previous 10 championships. when did russell retire? OMG, the year kareem was drafted!!

people that ride the sacks of the pre-shot clock pre-3 point line era need to stfu already. kareem won ONE title on his own when there wasn't the competition like the 80's and 90's. who was on his team for every other ring? magic fukking johnson. did you see hakeem, ewing, shaq, or robinson play with anyone who can be named in the same sentence as him? shaq had kid kobe, who was a good player with a clashing ego. nowhere near magic status at that point of his career.

jkeithc82
08-13-2012, 05:59 AM
Shaq better than the dream??? Smfh
Srs?


Uh yeah srs.

Ivan7x
08-13-2012, 06:13 AM
Correct. He's not a big as name as you'd like to believe. I know this section loves to root for the underdog, but face it, when people think GOAT center they think Shaq, Wilt, and Kareem. Hakeem is talented, yes, but he's virtually unheard of.


We gonna act like Shaq wouldn't embarass the fuk out of Olajuwon?

BRB single handedly winning 3 titles in a row.
BRB most dominant offensive center of modern era.http://cdn.ientry.com/sites/webpronews/article_pics/terry_gif.gif

ClevageGobbler
08-13-2012, 05:03 PM
Age: 21.

What do you know about Kareem? I only saw highlights and i watched basketball as long as i could remember. Son...

I know a bit. Obviously, I have to rely on oldschool games and highlights but it doesn't take a genius to realize he's #1.


i don't want to discredit him of any points whatsoever, he deserves to be the all-time scoring leader because of his ability to stay dedicated and stay healthy. does that make him the landslide GOAT center in terms of skills? not a chance. if we wanna work like that then why don't we go ahead and say jason kidd was a better PG than magic.

we're going to pretend there was competition in the nba back then? 17 teams in kareems rookie season, and only the celtics won 9 of the previous 10 championships. when did russell retire? OMG, the year kareem was drafted!!

people that ride the sacks of the pre-shot clock pre-3 point line era need to stfu already. kareem won ONE title on his own when there wasn't the competition like the 80's and 90's. who was on his team for every other ring? magic fukking johnson. did you see hakeem, ewing, shaq, or robinson play with anyone who can be named in the same sentence as him? shaq had kid kobe, who was a good player with a clashing ego. nowhere near magic status at that point of his career.

There was still great competition throughout the seventies. The Lakers and Celtics were still great. The Celts beat the Bucks 4-3 in the 1974 NBA Finals and would go on to win in 1976 too. Bullets, Knicks, Supersonics, Trail Blazers = all very good teams. Like I said earlier, Kareem faced off against a plethora of incredible competitors. There were many great big men in his era. The majority of the NBA's greatest rebounders played against Kareem.

GoingPlaces
08-13-2012, 05:09 PM
If you are only considering their prime you have to take shaq, even jordan would defer on a prime shaq team

jkeithc82
08-13-2012, 06:37 PM
If you are only considering their prime you have to take shaq, even jordan would defer on a prime shaq team

When exactly was Shaq's prime? He was basically in his prime from day one. Relied on raw talent and size and not much else. Never developed much of an offensive game besides a small hook and low post dunks. Never became even remotely decent at the line and was a liability late in close games. Ate himself out of shape for too many seasons which caused injuries that he shouldn't have had. Shaq entered the league as good as he would get and just continued year after year. Hakeem developed something new offensively in his game each year, was superior defensively and was not a late game liability at the line. Hakeem also never had a Kobe Bryant or Dwyane Wade.

In sum, Hakeem > Shaq.

JustBulk
08-13-2012, 07:08 PM
If you are only considering their prime you have to take shaq, even jordan would defer on a prime shaq team

Suppose what you said is true, then Jordan would defer to prime Hakeem too. So what exactly do you hope to achieve with your silly statement? The quote in OP was made in 2005 where Shaq's prime was over, to which Jordan basically said Hakeem > Shaq.

GoingPlaces
08-13-2012, 09:53 PM
Suppose what you said is true, then Jordan would defer to prime Hakeem too. So what exactly do you hope to achieve with your silly statement? The quote in OP was made in 2005 where Shaq's prime was over, to which Jordan basically said Hakeem > Shaq.

No he wouldn't defer to hakeem because the only player who was more dominant than mj offensively was a prime shaq. And I wouldn't take jordan's word on hakeem vs shaq without a grain of salt considering his history of talent evaluation.

GoingPlaces
08-13-2012, 09:57 PM
When exactly was Shaq's prime? He was basically in his prime from day one. Relied on raw talent and size and not much else. Never developed much of an offensive game besides a small hook and low post dunks. Never became even remotely decent at the line and was a liability late in close games. Ate himself out of shape for too many seasons which caused injuries that he shouldn't have had. Shaq entered the league as good as he would get and just continued year after year. Hakeem developed something new offensively in his game each year, was superior defensively and was not a late game liability at the line. Hakeem also never had a Kobe Bryant or Dwyane Wade.

In sum, Hakeem > Shaq.

No.

Shaq Rookie Year: 23/14/2
Shaq 1999-2000: 30/13.5/4

And its an even bigger disparity when you look at their playoff numbers for those years.

Rookie: 21/13/2
99-00: 31/15.5./3

RocketsFan
08-13-2012, 10:09 PM
i co-signed this powerful thread.

WestAfrica
08-14-2012, 12:14 AM
Its funny how ppl either say Shaq or Kareem or Wilt. First of all pleas go with Wilt, he was good but lettuce be real drop Lebron in the Russian League and let him go off. Second all of you young phaggots talking about Kareem... I know for a fact that none of you are going to sit down and watch a fuking game from the god damn 70s...Ya'll must have lost ya mind. Third there is a difference in raw skill/talent and raw size. When you watch Shaq dominate how does he do it? By taking his defender to school? Showing him who the better player is? Or knocking the motherfuker to the ground? Srsly its not that hard. "Oh Shaqs the GOAT, 30 n 14..." Well if you are that damn big you better be doing 30 n 14 when no one can guard you...

Just cause you big doesn't mean skill/talent. Shaq has tons of talent don't get me wrong...Butterbean the boxer has talent and hes huge as fuark. He doesn't win on skill or talent, he uses his size to take abuse and one shot his opponent.

Hakeem
sbmm2IZvdtg

Shaq...idk why is in Spanish
GofeqRfHAS4

AmazinJason
08-14-2012, 12:50 AM
Its funny how ppl either say Shaq or Kareem or Wilt. First of all pleas go with Wilt, he was good but lettuce be real drop Lebron in the Russian League and let him go off. Second all of you young phaggots talking about Kareem... I know for a fact that none of you are going to sit down and watch a fuking game from the god damn 70s...Ya'll must have lost ya mind. Third there is a difference in raw skill/talent and raw size. When you watch Shaq dominate how does he do it? By taking his defender to school? Showing him who the better player is? Or knocking the motherfuker to the ground? Srsly its not that hard. "Oh Shaqs the GOAT, 30 n 14..." Well if you are that damn big you better be doing 30 n 14 when no one can guard you...

Just cause you big doesn't mean skill/talent. Shaq has tons of talent don't get me wrong...Butterbean the boxer has talent and hes huge as fuark. He doesn't win on skill or talent, he uses his size to take abuse and one shot his opponent.

Hakeem
sbmm2IZvdtg

Shaq...idk why is in Spanish
GofeqRfHAS4
Umm... if a player is so physically strong that no one can guard him, and he doesn't need a bunch of different moves in order to score, that shouldn't be a knock against him or remove him from contention as the GOAT center. We are talking about the GOAT center, not the most skilled center or the most talented center.

If there was a center who was 7 feet 3 inches, 300 pounds, could run up and down the court like Dwight, and was literally unguardable because he was so physically strong, and he averaged 40 points 20 rebounds 10 blocks but had absolutely no moves or resemblance of talent at all, all he did was get near the basket and dunk or make lay ups, he would be the GOAT center, and it wouldn't matter that he had no talent at all.

sdballer5588
08-14-2012, 02:51 AM
Umm... if a player is so physically strong that no one can guard him, and he doesn't need a bunch of different moves in order to score, that shouldn't be a knock against him or remove him from contention as the GOAT center. We are talking about the GOAT center, not the most skilled center or the most talented center.

If there was a center who was 7 feet 3 inches, 300 pounds, could run up and down the court like Dwight, and was literally unguardable because he was so physically strong, and he averaged 40 points 20 rebounds 10 blocks but had absolutely no moves or resemblance of talent at all, all he did was get near the basket and dunk or make lay ups, he would be the GOAT center, and it wouldn't matter that he had no talent at all.

Can't believe I have to agree w this dude.

But like ..... SERIOUSLY WHO CARES HOW SKILLED HAKEEM IS.

You can't imitate Shaqs physique, which what MAKES him the goat center. Who cares if you can dream shake as Shaq annihilates your whole family and dunks on you.

GoingPlaces
08-14-2012, 02:53 AM
Everyone who is arguing that hakeem is better than shaq because he was more skilled is missing the point. Being more skilled doesn't make him a better player at all. Pau Gasol is the most skilled 4 in the nba, but nobody is taking him over blake griffin or kevin love. Prime Shaq literally could not be stopped, and it doesn't matter that all he needed to do was a 1 dribble drop step 15 times a game.

JustBulk
08-14-2012, 03:12 AM
No he wouldn't defer to hakeem because the only player who was more dominant than mj offensively was a prime shaq. And I wouldn't take jordan's word on hakeem vs shaq without a grain of salt considering his history of talent evaluation.

Are we reading the same quote?

Here's a break-down:

It's not just his scoring-this means Jordan is mirin Hakeem's ability on the offensive end
He always made great decisions on the court-Jordan thinks Hakeem makes great decisions on the offensive end.

What talent evaluation? If you're talking about his picks like Kwame Brown, then pls go. That's trying to gauge potential, but what we have here are already completed careers.

GoingPlaces
08-14-2012, 03:16 AM
Are we reading the same quote?

Here's a break-down:

It's not just his scoring-this means Jordan is mirin Hakeem's ability on the offensive end
He always made great decisions on the court-Jordan thinks Hakeem makes great decisions on the offensive end.

What talent evaluation? If you're talking about his picks like Kwame Brown, then pls go. That's trying to gauge potential, but what we have here are already completed careers.

Hakeem being more skilled doesnt make him a better player

JustBulk
08-14-2012, 03:22 AM
ITT: For some reason everyone thinks Hakeem is a pu$$y, strong wtf.

JustBulk
08-14-2012, 03:24 AM
Hakeem being more skilled doesnt make him a better player

In which part of my post did I said Hakeem is more skilled?

I said Hakeem made better decisions and earned Jordan's admiration with his offensive skills.

brb the better player doesnt make better decisions.
brb the worse player earns Jordan's admiration.

serevei
08-14-2012, 03:25 AM
I'd take sabonis or walton personally....

BusterMudd
08-14-2012, 08:33 AM
but if we were playing a pickup game and you took him first, i'd be very happy taking a prime shaq secound.

I'm guessing you never saw the 1995 NBA finals. After Hakeem got done outplaying David Robinson in the Conference Finals he completely schooled Shaq in the Finals. Just embarassed the big guy.

JoshSelbyfor3
08-14-2012, 08:41 AM
I'm guessing you never saw the 1995 NBA finals. After Hakeem got done outplaying David Robinson in the Conference Finals he completely schooled Shaq in the Finals. Just embarassed the big guy.
Schooled Shaq so hard that Shaq averaged 28/12.5/6.3 on 60% shooting. Had Dennis Scott and especially Nick Anderson not played not complete phaggots, the Magic would not only have won the Finals but Shaq would have averaged a triple double.

jkeithc82
08-14-2012, 08:50 AM
Schooled Shaq so hard that Shaq averaged 28/12.5/6.3 on 60% shooting. Had Dennis Scott and especially Nick Anderson not played not complete phaggots, the Magic would not only have won the Finals but Shaq would have averaged a triple double.

I'm not one of those who think that Hakeem dominated Shaq in the finals, because he didn't, but this statement is pretty ridiculous.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-14-2012, 12:01 PM
Its funny how ppl either say Shaq or Kareem or Wilt. First of all pleas go with Wilt, he was good but lettuce be real drop Lebron in the Russian League and let him go off. Second all of you young phaggots talking about Kareem... I know for a fact that none of you are going to sit down and watch a fuking game from the god damn 70s...Ya'll must have lost ya mind. Third there is a difference in raw skill/talent and raw size. When you watch Shaq dominate how does he do it? By taking his defender to school? Showing him who the better player is? Or knocking the motherfuker to the ground? Srsly its not that hard. "Oh Shaqs the GOAT, 30 n 14..." Well if you are that damn big you better be doing 30 n 14 when no one can guard you...

Just cause you big doesn't mean skill/talent. Shaq has tons of talent don't get me wrong...Butterbean the boxer has talent and hes huge as fuark. He doesn't win on skill or talent, he uses his size to take abuse and one shot his opponent. You can't fault Shaq for his size. I agree that Hakeem has more skill, Shaq was successful just because he was big.

To me he is similar to Lebron in the physical dominace of his position. Shaq for his size was actually pretty athletic. If a Center had the size to stop, body him (there weren't many), he was quicker and faster than them. If they were too small he was bigger and stronger. Now if you took away Shaq size and physical dominance than of course he wouldn't be all that great. Thing is you can say the same for Lebron, if he wasn't as big/strong/fast as he is, he would be a shell of himself. But they do have it and we can't knock them for it. It's what makes them great players.

Personally I would take skilled players over size though.

SpiderSense
08-14-2012, 12:38 PM
Schooled Shaq so hard that Shaq averaged 28/12.5/6.3 on 60% shooting. Had Dennis Scott and especially Nick Anderson not played not complete phaggots, the Magic would not only have won the Finals but Shaq would have averaged a triple double.

LMAO that's what I'm saying bro.

Keep in mind that was Olajuwon in his prime vs. Shaq a few years in (but not in his prime yet).

People stay underestimating The Deisel, only here would anybody be retarded enough to claim 28, 12 and 6 on 60% FG is getting dominated.

camaleom
08-14-2012, 12:42 PM
I just gonna leave this one here:

"The first thing I learned was, you can't be nice. You know, the first time I made it to the Finals, we lost the Finals because I was a nice guy. I respected Hakeem Olajuwon too much. Yeah, he had his way with me he scored 25, I scored 24 but I was too nice." Shaquille O'Neal on TNT's "Inside the NBA," Monday night.

A response* by Hakeem Olajuwon, who actually averaged 32.8 points, 11.5 rebounds, 5.5 assists, two blocks and two steals per game in the Houston Rockets' sweep of O'Neal's Orlando Magic, making 56 shots on Shaq in four games

camaleom
08-14-2012, 12:44 PM
LMAO that's what I'm saying bro.

Keep in mind that was Olajuwon in his prime vs. Shaq a few years in (but not in his prime yet).

People stay underestimating The Deisel, only here would anybody be retarded enough to claim 28, 12 and 6 on 60% FG is getting dominated.

what was the dif between young shaq and "prime" shaq?

he didn't add any moves...

StarfaceChris
08-14-2012, 12:46 PM
most overratest player ever.

brb jordan retires wins mvp
brb jordan retires wins 2 rings
brb jordan comes back = back to being irrelavant

I OuTsiDeR I
08-14-2012, 12:50 PM
what is the dif between young shaq and "prime" shaq?

he didn't add any moves... He got bigger which made it that much harder because he was already big. Granted sometimes it was a sloppy big sometimes it was a good big.

Young Shaq = When he lost all his weight and went to Miami with D Wade.

Prime Shaq was probably 15-20 pounds (maybe more) heavier. I believe he got a little better in the post, he could go either shoulder.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-14-2012, 12:52 PM
most overratest player ever.

brb jordan retires wins mvp
brb jordan retires wins 2 rings
brb jordan comes back = back to being irrelavant Being the 2nd Best player next to Jordan isn't being overrated. I guess Barkley, Malone, Stockton, Shaq, Robinson, Ewing and any other super star at the time is overrated then.

camaleom
08-14-2012, 12:54 PM
He got bigger which made it that much harder because he was already big. Granted sometimes it was a sloppy big sometimes it was a good big.

Young Shaq = When he lost all his weight and went to Miami with D Wade.

Prime Shaq was probably 15-20 pounds (maybe more) heavier. I believe he got a little better in the post, he could go either shoulder.

I agreed but don't u think he became so much more dominant because the competition was weaker as well?

It is hard to say who is the greatest because most of them play in dif eras... Other than MJ dominating everybody for a long f time IMHO there is no other clear cut "greatest ever" in the NBA.

evansanity
08-14-2012, 12:55 PM
prime dream was just too fast, athletic and technical. Shaq is a top 5 center imo

Hakeen
Wilt
russel
shaq
robinson
kareem

SpiderSense
08-14-2012, 12:56 PM
what was the dif between young shaq and "prime" shaq?

he didn't add any moves...

No.

The difference is age.

A guy who's 25, IMO is gonna get owned by a guy who's in his late 20's.

I know I'd whip the **** out of 25 year old me in anything.

It's not about moves, it's about mentality, work ethic, intelligence and strength.

I think prime Shaq would knock Olajuwon silly, as he even admitted he was too nice.

SpiderSense
08-14-2012, 12:59 PM
I agreed but don't u think he became so much more dominant because the competition was weaker as well?

It is hard to say who is the greatest because most of them play in dif eras... Other than MJ dominating everybody for a long f time IMHO there is no other clear cut "greatest ever" in the NBA.

Shaq was already dominant.

Look at his numbers in his first 3 (I believe) seasons.

That was up against Ewings, Motumbo's, Mournings, Olajuwon's and Robinson's of the world.

If anything you wanna say weak competition, Jordan IMO had weak competition.

Shaq came in the NBA against absolute studs at his position and balled out.

jkeithc82
08-14-2012, 01:02 PM
No.
It's not about moves, it's about mentality, work ethic, intelligence and strength.


It's also about Kobe Bryant and weaker competition as he got older, etc.

leafs43
08-14-2012, 01:06 PM
The Dream dominated some of the best all time centers ever to play the game.

In straight up match ups, Hakeem dominated Ewing, Robinson and Shaq. Although Shaq was still in his early skinny days with the Magic.

SpiderSense
08-14-2012, 01:08 PM
It's also about Kobe Bryant and weaker competition as he got older, etc.

Yeah my point was how much did that matter (the competition) if Shaq was dominant early on against HOF'ers.

Having Kobe helped though of course.

UHBrah
08-14-2012, 01:10 PM
Dream is indeed the GOAT of centers

His average for the 86 western finals against magics lakers

31 pts 11 rbs 2 ast 2 stl 4 blcks

Faauurrkkk!!

jkeithc82
08-14-2012, 01:16 PM
The Dream dominated some of the best all time centers ever to play the game.

In straight up match ups, Hakeem dominated Ewing, Robinson and Shaq. Although Shaq was still in his early skinny days with the Magic.

Statistically Hakeem didn't dominate Shaq in the total of their matchups though.

Again, my basis of opinion is in the fact that Hakeem had so many ways to score, was dominant defensively, and was not a liability at the free throw line. He also added something new to his game each season and continued to refine his skills. Shaq relied on size, allowed himself to get fat and out of shape (shortening his "prime" due to unnecessary injuries), never developed any other shooting skills and never even became a decent free throw shooter. Shaq was the most dominant center, possibly of all time, but there were ways to take him out of the game. You couldn't do the same with Hakeem. You had to respect him on both sides of the court and you couldn't just "hack" him.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-14-2012, 01:19 PM
I agreed but don't u think he became so much more dominant because the competition was weaker as well?

It is hard to say who is the greatest because most of them play in dif eras... Other than MJ dominating everybody for a long f time IMHO there is no other clear cut "greatest ever" in the NBA. The competition did get weaker but I think he got more dominant because he just got better. Everyone gets smarter, learns how to play the game better in their prime. As someone stated he still played well in his young days vs the great centers of the 90's.


A guy who's 25, IMO is gonna get owned by a guy who's in his late 20's.

I know I'd whip the **** out of 25 year old me in anything.

It's not about moves, it's about mentality, work ethic, intelligence and strength. Disagree. Why is Durant and even Westbrook, Rose, all these young guys are already above the competition. I agree that the older you get the more experience and smarter you get towards the game. This doesn't mean that if your older you should be able to "school" someone younger. Kobe was schooling ALOT of people and he was still young.

Everyones talent level is different. Now if a young kid has more talent than you, plus he works hard, you are going to get beat no matter how hard you try (you'll give a good game though). This is why we see young kids being successful.

At the same time Hard work + some talent > Just talent. This is where the older guys like you said would have an advantage because talent with no work doesn't go too far.

lee4
08-14-2012, 01:30 PM
Umm... if a player is so physically strong that no one can guard him, and he doesn't need a bunch of different moves in order to score, that shouldn't be a knock against him or remove him from contention as the GOAT center. We are talking about the GOAT center, not the most skilled center or the most talented center.

If there was a center who was 7 feet 3 inches, 300 pounds, could run up and down the court like Dwight, and was literally unguardable because he was so physically strong, and he averaged 40 points 20 rebounds 10 blocks but had absolutely no moves or resemblance of talent at all, all he did was get near the basket and dunk or make lay ups, he would be the GOAT center, and it wouldn't matter that he had no talent at all.


Schooled Shaq so hard that Shaq averaged 28/12.5/6.3 on 60% shooting. Had Dennis Scott and especially Nick Anderson not played not complete phaggots, the Magic would not only have won the Finals but Shaq would have averaged a triple double.

all you shaq defenders, please read the thread first before you post...



1) yes, shaq got embarrassed in '95. you know who thinks that SHAQ DOES (see his own commentary on page three OF THIS THREAD).



2) stop talking all about offense as making shaq amazing. yes, he was huge and athletic for his size, but his offense was not BETTER...
compare shaq and hakeem's BEST years, it was a TWO POINT scoring difference per game (29v27). i'd call that a push between hakeem and shaq's offensive "production".

-now, if you insist that TWO points makes shaq win, consider shaq averaged TWICE as many FTA's per game to do it, AND shaq couldn't play in cruch time MOSTLY due to fouling out all the time or his COMPLETE LIABILITY on offensive end of game free throws.



hakeem, however, not only played in fourth quarters, he would win them...

this is against the magic...in the finals...but WHERE is shaq??? no box out? no defense??
j1tf28qahCo

which brings me to my final point. DEFENSE! where was shaq in that last highlight??? failing his team, that's where.





3) HAKEEM WON CHAMPIONSHIPS WITH HIS DEFENSE. unlike "the most absent" center of all time in the last clip, hakeem can run down quick guards ALONE ON THE PERIMETER and still beat them.

CzUv5_YFhPI

shaq couldn't guard a pick and roll...EVER.


SO, even GRANTING a PUSH on offense for shaq's prime two points on 13 FTA per game, and fourth quarter benchriding compared to hakeem's fourth quarter clutch... hakeem played DEFENSE better than anyone.

shaq: 3x 2nd Team All-Defense (and GTFO, shaq has NEVER averaged 4 blocks per game!)
hakeem: 4x 2nd Team All-D, 5X FIRST TEAM DEFENSE! (9x All D total) 2x DPOY! 4x League Shot Block Leader, Consistently Top Ten in Steals.


If Shaq is better than Hakeem, it's news to him...

http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/funny-gifs-shaqs-magic.gif

Ivan7x
08-14-2012, 01:52 PM
all you shaq defenders, please read the thread first before you post...



1) yes, shaq got embarrassed in '95. you know who thinks that SHAQ DOES (see his own commentary on page three OF THIS THREAD).



2) stop talking all about offense as making shaq amazing. yes, he was huge and athletic for his size, but his offense was not BETTER...
compare shaq and hakeem's BEST years, it was a TWO POINT scoring difference per game (29v27). i'd call that a push between hakeem and shaq's offensive "production".

-now, if you insist that TWO points makes shaq win, consider shaq averaged TWICE as many FTA's per game to do it, AND shaq couldn't play in cruch time MOSTLY due to fouling out all the time or his COMPLETE LIABILITY on offensive end of game free throws.



hakeem, however, not only played in fourth quarters, he would win them...

this is against the magic...in the finals...but WHERE is shaq??? no box out? no defense??
j1tf28qahCo

which brings me to my final point. DEFENSE! where was shaq in that last highlight??? failing his team, that's where.





3) HAKEEM WON CHAMPIONSHIPS WITH HIS DEFENSE. unlike "the most absent" center of all time in the last clip, hakeem can run down quick guards ALONE ON THE PERIMETER and still beat them.

CzUv5_YFhPI

shaq couldn't guard a pick and roll...EVER.


SO, even GRANTING a PUSH on offense for shaq's prime two points on 13 FTA per game, and fourth quarter benchriding compared to hakeem's fourth quarter clutch... hakeem played DEFENSE better than anyone.

shaq: 3x 2nd Team All-Defense (and GTFO, shaq has NEVER averaged 4 blocks per game!)
hakeem: 4x 2nd Team All-D, 5X FIRST TEAM DEFENSE! (9x All D total) 2x DPOY! 4x League Shot Block Leader, Consistently Top Ten in Steals.


If Shaq is better than Hakeem, it's news to him...

http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/funny-gifs-shaqs-magic.gif

oh lawd

_grape
08-16-2012, 07:27 PM
GA_EIVfE8ak

GetBigyo
08-16-2012, 07:38 PM
Shaq>Hakeem

inbefore age 20

inbefore stfu

Shaq most dominant C of all time (maybe even player). Don't care if Hakeem was better defensively, Shaq's impact was bar none. Every team he was on in his prime was near title contenders.

jkeithc82
08-16-2012, 07:41 PM
Shaq's impact was bar none. Every team he was on in his prime was near title contenders.

I'm sure Kobe Bryant had a little something to do with that don't you think? Imagine if Hakeem had a Kobe Bryant on any of his teams.

GetBigyo
08-16-2012, 07:44 PM
I'm sure Kobe Bryant had a little something to do with that don't you think? Imagine if Hakeem had a Kobe Bryant on any of his teams.
Kobe didn't become elite until 2001.

hayekforever
08-16-2012, 07:47 PM
most overratest player ever.

brb jordan retires wins mvp
brb jordan retires wins 2 rings
brb jordan comes back = back to being irrelavant

Thats the biggest misconception.
Jordan came back in the 95 season and the Bulls didn't even get to the finals.

jkeithc82
08-16-2012, 07:53 PM
Kobe didn't become elite until 2001.

22, 6 and 5 may not be elite, but its damn good, which is what Kobe averaged during the Lakers first title run. He only got better and Shaq benefited greatly from that. Then with the Heat he played second fiddle to Dwyane Wade. Shaq's always had a good-great counter part on his titles. Hakeem didn't during the first run and had an older Clyde midway through the second.

GetBigyo
08-16-2012, 07:57 PM
22, 6 and 5 may not be elite, but its damn good, which is what Kobe averaged during the Lakers first title run.
And he averaged 15/5 in that 1st Finals. Shaq was completely dominant.

Shaq also had Orlando as contenders, then Miami after LA, then even Phoenix too for like one year. I won't argue though if you claim he needed that good wing (Penny, Kobe, Wade) to be contenders. Just saying, Shaq always had his teams on top. Also, once he left LA, Lakers were irrelevant for a few years.

Love Hakeem, don't care if anyone has him above. I just think Shaq had a more overall impact and more dominant.

jkeithc82
08-16-2012, 08:00 PM
Love Hakeem, don't care if anyone has him above. I just think Shaq had a more overall impact and more dominant.

Impact I'll agree with. Dominant I'll also buy. But I'd still take Hakeem for the reasons I've listed above.

TexasMajor
08-16-2012, 08:02 PM
And he averaged 15/5 in that 1st Finals. Shaq was completely dominant.

Shaq also had Orlando as contenders, then Miami after LA, then even Phoenix too for like one year. I won't argue though if you claim he needed that good wing (Penny, Kobe, Wade) to be contenders. Just saying, Shaq always had his teams on top. Also, once he left LA, Lakers were irrelevant for a few years.

Love Hakeem, don't care if anyone has him above. I just think Shaq had a more overall impact and more dominant.

Age: 20

Kobe led the Lakers to the Finals. Shaq just finished the job. Who was on the bench late in the fourth quarters? Who was making free-throws when it mattered?

GetBigyo
08-16-2012, 08:07 PM
Age: 20

Kobe led the Lakers to the Finals. Shaq just finished the job. Who was on the bench late in the fourth quarters? Who was making free-throws when it mattered?
Shaq Finals Stats: 2000: 38/16 2001: 33/15 2002: 36/12 2004: 26/10

Kobe Finals Stats: 2000: 15/4/4 2001: 24/7/5 2002 26/5/5 2004: 22/4/2 (sub 40% shooting)

Clearly Kobe Bryant led the Lakers whereas Shaq just "finished the job". lmao


:rolleyes:

If anything it's the other way around.

TexasMajor
08-16-2012, 08:11 PM
Shaq Finals Stats: 2000: 38/16 2001: 33/15 2002: 36/12 2004: 26/10

Kobe Finals Stats: 2000: 15/4/4 2001: 24/7/5 2002 26/5/5 2004: 22/4/2 (sub 40% shooting)

Clearly Kobe Bryant led the Lakers whereas Shaq just "finished the job". lmao


:rolleyes:

If anything it's the other way around.

Reading comprehension is obviously not your forte.......

2001 Western Conference playoffs where Kobe LED the Lakers to get to the Finals.

Kobe (11g): 31.6 PTS (.577 TS%), 7.0 REB, 6.2 AST, 1.6 STL, 0.5 BLK, 3.0 TOV
Shaq (11g): 29.3 PTS (.558 TS%), 15.3 REB, 2.5 AST, 0.5 STL, 1.9 BLK, 3.4 TOV

Once they were in the Finals, Kobe stepped back and Shaq just destroyed everything in sight.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-16-2012, 09:52 PM
Reading comprehension is obviously not your forte.......

2001 Western Conference playoffs where Kobe LED the Lakers to get to the Finals.

Kobe (11g): 31.6 PTS (.577 TS%), 7.0 REB, 6.2 AST, 1.6 STL, 0.5 BLK, 3.0 TOV
Shaq (11g): 29.3 PTS (.558 TS%), 15.3 REB, 2.5 AST, 0.5 STL, 1.9 BLK, 3.4 TOV

Once they were in the Finals, Kobe stepped back and Shaq just destroyed everything in sight. They look pretty even to me.

TexasMajor
08-16-2012, 10:09 PM
They look pretty even to me.

You excelled in mathematics, didnt you?

I OuTsiDeR I
08-16-2012, 10:50 PM
You excelled in mathematics, didnt you? Didn't know avg 2 more pts made it a deal breaker for you.

Your the type of person that would make Kobe the leader if he avg 29.5 ppg to Shaq 29.3.

Even as in they both played well, Shaq had monster numbers, so did Kobe. Shaq was the team leader. No need to get your panties twisted.

Again you stated Kobe Led the team in the WCF and let Shaq take over in the Finals. That was VERY MISLEADING. You act as if Kobe carried them on his back or something, then Shaq took over. 29ppg 15rpg nearly 2bpg and you wanna act like it was all Kobe for the WCF. Shaq beasted in the WCF and the Finals, lets not get it twisted.

TexasMajor
08-16-2012, 11:03 PM
Didn't know avg 2 more pts made it a deal breaker for you.

Your the type of person that would make Kobe the leader if he avg 29.5 ppg to Shaq 29.3.

Even as in they both played well, Shaq had monster numbers, so did Kobe. Shaq was the team leader. No need to get your panties twisted.

Again you stated Kobe Led the team in the WCF and let Shaq take over in the Finals. That was VERY MISLEADING. You act as if Kobe carried them on his back or something, then Shaq took over. 29ppg 15rpg nearly 2bpg and you wanna act like it was all Kobe for the WCF. Shaq beasted in the WCF and the Finals, lets not get it twisted.

and you're the type of person who tries to discredit Kobe Bryant. Kobes legacy will go down greater than Shaqs. Sorry.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-16-2012, 11:14 PM
and you're the type of person who tries to discredit Kobe Bryant. Kobes legacy will go down greater than Shaqs. Sorry.Did I say that? OBVIOUSLY his Legacy is greater than Shaqs already. Did you not hear the part that I said Kobe was great?

The difference between a nuthugger like you and me is I can at least tell the truth and be honest. I give credit where credit is due. Shaq played EXTREMELY well in the WCF and Finals. So for you to make Kobe look better by attempting to make like he led the team and put them on his back is a typical thing a nuthugger would do.

Thanks for being a perfect example of what a nuthugger is

TexasMajor
08-16-2012, 11:19 PM
Did you not hear the part that I said Kobe was great?

I can't hear you through my computer monitor.

I OuTsiDeR I
08-16-2012, 11:21 PM
I can't hear you through my computer monitor. Listen harder and try to bite your ear at the same time, you'll hear it

woofermazing
08-17-2012, 12:49 AM
most overratest player ever.

brb jordan retires wins mvp
brb jordan retires wins 2 rings
brb jordan comes back = back to being irrelavant

The Rockets were 5-1 against Jordan and the Bulls from 91-93. They matched up really well, the Bulls had no answer for Hakeem. They just never met up in the finals.

Hakeem had the most moves and best footwork I've ever seen in a center. He dominated Ewing en route to his first championship. He dominated Shaq in his second.

Kind of suprised you guys consider Shaq that dominant anyways. He got swept in the playoffs 6 times during his career, dominant players don't let that happen that often. He wasn't a great defender, where as Hakeem was one of the best in the league during his career and holds the record for career blocks. Hakeem also had the clutch gene, he made big defensive plays that sealed big games.

CzUv5_YFhPI

Best center ever IMO. He had great length, skill, and size. He was clutch, one of the best defenders of all time, and a prolific scorer.

0GCyU0sKxqI

Edit: Oh yea, he made his free throws.

ClevageGobbler
08-17-2012, 01:03 AM
Kobe didn't become elite until 2001.

2000 actually

lee4
08-27-2012, 04:17 PM
all you shaq defenders, please read the thread first before you post...



1) yes, shaq got embarrassed in '95. you know who thinks that SHAQ DOES (see his own commentary on page three OF THIS THREAD).



2) stop talking all about offense as making shaq amazing. yes, he was huge and athletic for his size, but his offense was not BETTER...
compare shaq and hakeem's BEST years, it was a TWO POINT scoring difference per game (29v27). i'd call that a push between hakeem and shaq's offensive "production".

-now, if you insist that TWO points makes shaq win, consider shaq averaged TWICE as many FTA's per game to do it, AND shaq couldn't play in cruch time MOSTLY due to fouling out all the time or his COMPLETE LIABILITY on offensive end of game free throws.



hakeem, however, not only played in fourth quarters, he would win them...

this is against the magic...in the finals...but WHERE is shaq??? no box out? no defense??
j1tf28qahCo

which brings me to my final point. DEFENSE! where was shaq in that last highlight??? failing his team, that's where.





3) HAKEEM WON CHAMPIONSHIPS WITH HIS DEFENSE. unlike "the most absent" center of all time in the last clip, hakeem can run down quick guards ALONE ON THE PERIMETER and still beat them.

CzUv5_YFhPI

shaq couldn't guard a pick and roll...EVER.


SO, even GRANTING a PUSH on offense for shaq's prime two points on 13 FTA per game, and fourth quarter benchriding compared to hakeem's fourth quarter clutch... hakeem played DEFENSE better than anyone.

shaq: 3x 2nd Team All-Defense (and GTFO, shaq has NEVER averaged 4 blocks per game!)
hakeem: 4x 2nd Team All-D, 5X FIRST TEAM DEFENSE! (9x All D total) 2x DPOY! 4x League Shot Block Leader, Consistently Top Ten in Steals.


If Shaq is better than Hakeem, it's news to him...

http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/funny-gifs-shaqs-magic.gif

i drop this and go out of town. shaq lovers pretend not to see it and two pages later still spewing the same refuted garbage.

zenzone
08-27-2012, 05:39 PM
Hakeem for the 2 years they won the titles was the best player on the planet, but only for those two years.

JustBulk
06-03-2017, 05:26 AM
bump

MBisonSon
06-03-2017, 06:42 AM
I would take the athleticism of a young Shaq over anybody I've ever watched play.

Always was a fan of Vlade Divac and Chris Weber with the passing too.