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the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 06:43 PM
i keep reading more and more on how meal fequency doesnt mater. Biavailability of nutrients doesnt matter... Just get it in, no matter what and when.
I found this article WITH SOURCES AND REFERENCES very interesting.

http://1stphorm.com/blog/none-of-my-friends-are-in-very-good-shape-but-they-all-say-it%e2%80%99s-genetics-and-they-can%e2%80%99t-help-it-i-have-always-thought-you-were-supposed-to-eat-six-small-meals-a-day-to-get-lean-and-t/

I believe eating 6 meals a day is way more beneficial than not caring when, how often or what...
Let me know what you think.

BDeblo
04-09-2012, 06:49 PM
largely irrelevant in terms of body composition, especially considering you're most likely a hobbyist just trying to look better, get stronger and be healthier.
yes, there will be a slight adavantage to maximizing every single calorie and nutrient, but in the grand scheme of things you arent missing much. it wont have metabolism stoking benefit though.
remember that when you're eating 6 or so meals you'll still be digesting the previous meal and possible ones before that.

PBateman2
04-09-2012, 06:51 PM
"Every time you consume 8-12 grams of essential amino acids, what would be contained in a scoop or roughly 25g of most quality whey proteins out there, you are stimulating muscle protein synthesis which lasts for 2-3 hours [5, 6]. After this 2-3 hour window has passed your body will switch over to a catabolic state and begin breaking down your valuable muscle tissue, which in the long term will negatively affect your metabolic capacity."

LOL


"You should be able to begin to see why it’s not a good idea to eat two larger meals 6 hours a part or even 3 medium meals 4 hours apart … it’s going to cost you in the long run."

LOL


"You have to eat small meals containing a minimum of 25g of protein every 2-3 hours throughout the day."

LOL...."You HAVE to"...


Full of lulz.

thomasDB
04-09-2012, 06:58 PM
BrooooscienceLulz

Meal frequency isn't needed + the average adult with a very intense job can't eat 6 meals a day.. Last summer I was working as a security agent = 12-19hours shifts with 2 30 minutes pauses.. I had to workout like crazy and eat/rest well for my football season (less meals/bigger meals).

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 06:59 PM
largely irrelevant in terms of body composition, especially considering you're most likely a hobbyist just trying to look better, get stronger and be healthier.
yes, there will be a slight adavantage to maximizing every single calorie and nutrient, but in the grand scheme of things you arent missing much. it wont have metabolism stoking benefit though.
remember that when you're eating 6 or so meals you'll still be digesting the previous meal and possible ones before that.

Amino acids in your blood stream will dissapate after 2-3 hours (depending on metabolism, age, hormone levels, etc) then our body will look for a source of amino acids - muscle. So it will eat away muscle and hold on to fat... -> skinny fat.

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 07:02 PM
BrooooscienceLulz

Meal frequency isn't needed + the average adult with a very intense job can't eat 6 meals a day.. Last summer I was working as a security agent = 12-19hours shifts with 2 30 minutes pauses.. I had to workout like crazy and eat/rest well for my football season (less meals/bigger meals).

I get no breaks and I make it happen! U can if u want and care. gotta be smart and fast about it.
And I used to have your job too.

tominho7
04-09-2012, 07:18 PM
Do you think that cavemen were able to eat every 3 hours. This dude looks pretty jacked to me :)

http://pfitpfun.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/caveman1.jpg?w=244&h=300

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 07:24 PM
Do you think that cavemen were able to eat every 3 hours. This dude looks pretty jacked to me :)

http://pfitpfun.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/caveman1.jpg?w=244&h=300

I dont think they did and I also doubt they cared about losing weight or gaining muscle, nor did they work out as we know it.
Science advances everyday. Motel T ford was great back then, but I wouldnt drive it today...
Besides their food was clean and unprocessed (untill they cooked it)

rand18m
04-09-2012, 07:29 PM
"Every time you consume 8-12 grams of essential amino acids, what would be contained in a scoop or roughly 25g of most quality whey proteins out there, you are stimulating muscle protein synthesis which lasts for 2-3 hours [5, 6]. After this 2-3 hour window has passed your body will switch over to a catabolic state and begin breaking down your valuable muscle tissue, which in the long term will negatively affect your metabolic capacity."

LOL


"You should be able to begin to see why it’s not a good idea to eat two larger meals 6 hours a part or even 3 medium meals 4 hours apart … it’s going to cost you in the long run."

LOL


"You have to eat small meals containing a minimum of 25g of protein every 2-3 hours throughout the day."

LOL...."You HAVE to"...


Full of lulz.

None of the literature cited had anything to do with the quotes above, the only study by Tipton centered around post exercise and the need for mixed amino or simply essential amino ingestion. The body is constantly in a state of protein degradation and synthesis, that article is once again from someone selling supplements who are full of sheet!!

So as usual Manu!! You dead on target!!!

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 07:36 PM
None of the literature cited had anything to do with the quotes above, the only study by Tipton centered around post exercise and the need for mixed amino or simply essential amino ingestion. The body is constantly in a state of protein degradation and synthesis, that article is once again from someone selling supplements who are full of sheet!!

So as usual Manu!! You dead on target!!!
Muscle is metabolically active 24/7... So yeah muscle feeds of protein.

rand18m
04-09-2012, 07:42 PM
Muscle is metabolically active 24/7... So yeah muscle feeds of protein.

No, muscle does not "feed on protein"! I have no idea what that even means, and neither do you!

You should consider increasing your knowledge on the basics of nutrition science and amino acid metabolism before posting such silliness!

chillaxbroseph
04-09-2012, 08:22 PM
Another Dr.Oz follower who cherry picks a single post he found on some fool's website. Someone needs to conduct a systematic review or, at the very least, a literature review on some of these subjects. The results probably still wouldn't keep the trolls at home though.

Have fun clinging to dated pseudoscience my man.

Jen0va
04-09-2012, 08:23 PM
here OP, you gonna need dis...

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4331381&stc=1&d=1334028161

andyboi
04-09-2012, 08:33 PM
Talk to Greg Plitt. Love or hate the guy, he only eats one big meal per day.

Meal timing is irrelevant. Just eat whenever the phuk you can and quit complicating the process.

BOB55555
04-09-2012, 08:33 PM
OP, check the stickies or look for a thread called "another question about meal frequency" where I linked a compilation of studies and some more knowledgeable people got a little more in depth about it.

Basically, if you look at the bulk of studies done, meal timing really seems to have little relevance. And, if the studies are tilted to any side, I think a small number of meals may even have a little bit of an edge over the 6 meals a day approach, although that's very debatable.

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 08:49 PM
well I look at stickies and wonder if these people are credible?
I have my degree, I have my *****, i've done my studying and research.
I take research and info from credible sources and put them to use in my life and with my clients.
It works, thats all I care about at the end of the day.

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 08:54 PM
OP, check the stickies or look for a thread called "another question about meal frequency" where I linked a compilation of studies and some more knowledgeable people got a little more in depth about it.

Basically, if you look at the bulk of studies done, meal timing really seems to have little relevance. And, if the studies are tilted to any side, I think a small number of meals may even have a little bit of an edge over the 6 meals a day approach, although that's very debatable.

Little relevance in term of? Weight loss? Certainly! I'm talking about maximum results and body composition. And as explained many previous studies are scewed and only tell half the story.
Beware!

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 09:08 PM
Talk to Greg Plitt. Love or hate the guy, he only eats one big meal per day.

Meal timing is irrelevant. Just eat whenever the phuk you can and quit complicating the process.

Lol greg "says" he eats once a day. He drinks shakes multiple times and his marketing strategy with that "eating once" works well doesnt it? It got you. Lol

Kahldris
04-09-2012, 09:13 PM
I found a picture of the OP off his bodyspace:


http://i.imgur.com/s8M2f.gif (http://imgur.com/s8M2f)

thomasDB
04-09-2012, 09:18 PM
Do you think that cavemen were able to eat every 3 hours. This dude looks pretty jacked to me :)

http://pfitpfun.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/caveman1.jpg?w=244&h=300

This one probably discovered the first branch of roids.. look at the ones in geico commercials, not that big :)

mattypoole
04-09-2012, 09:30 PM
well I look at stickies and wonder if these people are credible?
I have my degree, I have my *****, i've done my studying and research.
I take research and info from credible sources and put them to use in my life and with my clients.
It works, thats all I care about at the end of the day.

You have stickies in here written by people who are practising surgeons, have extensive research experience & hold multiple degrees with honours, I doubt your creds even come close broseph.

As for that "it works" statement, it works no better than less frequent meals, which is the whole point others have tried to get across to you. You could eat 2-4 meals a day and your body composition would be no different to having spread that across 6 meals a day.

MakeABanana
04-09-2012, 09:37 PM
I like how the 5th and 6th studies do not even support the article's assertion. Basically it's another article which misinterprets studies and publishes nonsense.

"A little learning is a dangerous thing."

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 10:11 PM
I like how the 5th and 6th studies do not even support the article's assertion. Basically it's another article which misinterprets studies and publishes nonsense.

"A little learning is a dangerous thing."

Point made. Studies publishing nonsense...

the0hulk87
04-09-2012, 10:14 PM
You have stickies in here written by people who are practising surgeons, have extensive research experience & hold multiple degrees with honours, I doubt your creds even come close broseph.

As for that "it works" statement, it works no better than less frequent meals, which is the whole point others have tried to get across to you. You could eat 2-4 meals a day and your body composition would be no different to having spread that across 6 meals a day.

Lol I talk to surgeons, nurses, doctors, you name it, day in day out that dont have the slightest clue on nutrition or supplements.
Doctors take one (1) nutrition course in 4-8 years. Sorry BROSEPH

mattypoole
04-09-2012, 10:32 PM
Lol I talk to surgeons, nurses, doctors, you name it, day in day out that dont have the slightest clue on nutrition or supplements.
Doctors take one (1) nutrition course in 4-8 years. Sorry BROSEPH

Talking to doctors/surgeons/nurses/doctors/you name it =/= having degrees & experience in the area of sports nutrition over a number of years..


http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a197/Wrylyn/Facepalm.jpg

greekmanman
04-09-2012, 11:48 PM
And this is why we can't have nice things and why I stopped posting in this section long ago lolz

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 07:51 AM
Point made. Studies publishing nonsense...

No, not studies publishing nonsense. The studies are fine for whatever they're trying to accomplish. It's the article that's at fault.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 07:56 AM
A website selling supplements posts an article saying, effectively, that it's essential to use supplements. And some folks fall for it, which is sad.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 07:57 AM
I believe eating 6 meals a day is way more beneficial than not caring when, how often or what...

...why?

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 08:22 AM
...why?

Cuz I have a goal I wanna reach. I also want to be healthy. There are plenty of reasons and to me the most important is that the people that eat once or twice a day look it.... Not very in shape - versus body builders that eat every 2-3 hours, wake up in the middle of the night to down a shake etc.
I talk to hundreds of ppl a day about their eating habits and no matter if their goal is to lose or gain, the ones that have trouble are the ones that dont eat frequently enough. Every time. And of course research. I kno, I kno you like to look at those studies done that say it doesnt matter etc and its cool cuz like I already said, Confirmation bias becomes an issue for the lazy ppl to prove their point, flawed research that tells us only half, the purpose those studies were done for and who paid for them....

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 08:24 AM
Cuz I have a goal I wanna reach. I also want to be healthy. There are plenty of reasons and to me the most important is that the people that eat once or twice a day look it.... Not very in shape - versus body builders that eat every 2-3 hours, wake up in the middle of the night to down a shake etc.
I talk to hundreds of ppl a day about their eating habits and no matter if their goal is to lose or gain, the ones that have trouble are the ones that dont eat frequently enough. Every time. And of course research. I kno, I kno you like to look at those studies done that say it doesnt matter etc and its cool cuz like I already said, Confirmation bias becomes an issue for the lazy ppl to prove their point, flawed research that tells us only half, the purpose those studies were done for and who paid for them....You're the target audience for the supplement industry and your post demonstrates how they can effectively market using clearly erroneous assertions often contained in thinly veiled ads masquerading as articles.

germaine07
04-10-2012, 08:26 AM
Cuz I have a goal I wanna reach. I also want to be healthy. There are plenty of reasons and to me the most important is that the people that eat once or twice a day look it.... Not very in shape - versus body builders that eat every 2-3 hours, wake up in the middle of the night to down a shake etc.
I talk to hundreds of ppl a day about their eating habits and no matter if their goal is to lose or gain, the ones that have trouble are the ones that dont eat frequently enough. Every time. And of course research. I kno, I kno you like to look at those studies done that say it doesnt matter etc and its cool cuz like I already said, Confirmation bias becomes an issue for the lazy ppl to prove their point, flawed research that tells us only half, the purpose those studies were done for and who paid for them....
You've obviously been talking to the wrong people.

What determines weight loss/gain is overall energy balance. Calories in vs Calories out.

Meal frequency is largely irrelevant to metabolism, what determines your TEF is the amount consumed, no matter when.

Meal timing can impact performance and energy levels but it varies from person to person.

Please do more research, and try stay away from the supplement companies 'studies'.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 08:32 AM
You've obviously been talking to the wrong people.

What determines weight loss/gain is overall energy balance. Calories in vs Calories out.

Meal frequency is largely irrelevant to metabolism, what determines your TEF is the amount consumed, no matter when.

Meal timing can impact performance and energy levels but it varies from person to person.

Please do more research, and try stay away from the supplement companies 'studies'.

Yes like I already said, weight gain or weight loss is all about cal. In vs. cal. Out... That is if you're not concerned about body composition...
According to these blogs here, I could eat my 3400 calories in one meal at the end of the day. My carbs can come from soda, protein from dog food and fats from a bucket of lard... Since it all doesnt matter... You are telling me thay wzy of eating will get me in shape? Haha

vitornoob
04-10-2012, 08:34 AM
Y U NO READ?

http://www.leangains.com/2010/10/top-ten-fasting-myths-debunked.html

germaine07
04-10-2012, 08:35 AM
Yes like I already said, weight gain or weight loss is all about cal. In vs. cal. Out... That is if you're not concerned about body composition...
According to these blogs here, I could eat my 3400 calories in one meal at the end of the day. My carbs can come from soda, protein from dog food and fats from a bucket of lard... Since it all doesnt matter... You are telling me thay wzy of eating will get me in shape? Haha
Please read the following http://www.wannabebig.com/diet-and-nutrition/the-dirt-on-clean-eating/

And maybe watching this may help http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QOmLj5yRyI

But cal in vs cal out determines weight loss/gain.

And composition of your macro's determine body composition, not meal frequency.

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 08:35 AM
Yes like I already said, weight gain or weight loss is all about cal. In vs. cal. Out... That is if you're not concerned about body composition...
According to these blogs here, I could eat my 3400 calories in one meal at the end of the day. My carbs can come from soda, protein from dog food and fats from a bucket of lard... Since it all doesnt matter... You are telling me thay wzy of eating will get me in shape? Haha

Well, despite the diet probably lacking in a variety of micronutrients, let me ask you this question: why wouldn't it?

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 08:39 AM
Y U NO READ?

http://www.leangains.com/2010/10/top-ten-fasting-myths-debunked.html

Lol if you woulda read what I posted it would give you the answer to why your link is faulty. Thanks.

chuck442
04-10-2012, 08:40 AM
One dude on here gets half his cals from ice cream. I eat two or three large meals a day and I'm down to about 11 percent now. So in my bodies case and in ice cream dudes case it doesn't seem to matter what and when or how often. Now go troll somewhere else

germaine07
04-10-2012, 08:41 AM
Lol if you woulda read what I posted it would give you the answer to why your link is faulty. Thanks.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19943985

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 08:42 AM
Well, despite the diet probably lacking in a variety of micronutrients, let me ask you this question: why wouldn't it?

Srs???? Cuz the bioavailability is very low. Nutients have been completely denatured and you body can only do two things with a denatured nutrient A) pass is B) store it as fat.
Hence processed foods make americans fat.
Wtf?

vitornoob
04-10-2012, 08:45 AM
i keep reading more and more on how meal fequency doesnt mater. Biavailability of nutrients doesnt matter... Just get it in, no matter what and when.
I found this article WITH SOURCES AND REFERENCES very interesting.

http://1stphorm.com/blog/none-of-my-friends-are-in-very-good-shape-but-they-all-say-it%e2%80%99s-genetics-and-they-can%e2%80%99t-help-it-i-have-always-thought-you-were-supposed-to-eat-six-small-meals-a-day-to-get-lean-and-t/

I believe eating 6 meals a day is way more beneficial than not caring when, how often or what...
Let me know what you think.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1905998
Eur J Clin Nutr. 1991 Mar;45(3):161-9.Links
Influence of the feeding frequency on nutrient utilization in man: consequences for energy metabolism.

Verboeket-van de Venne WP, Westerterp KR.
Department of Human Biology, University of Limburg, Maastricht, The Netherlands.
A study was conducted to investigate whether there is a diurnal pattern of nutrient utilization in man and how this is affected by meal frequency to explain possible consequences of meal frequency for body weight regulation. When the daily energy intake is consumed in a small number of large meals, there is an increased chance to become overweight, possibly by an elevated lipogenesis (fat synthesis and accumulation) or storage of energy after the meal. Thirteen subjects, two males and eleven females, were fed to energy balance in two meals per day (gorging pattern) and seven meals per day (nibbling pattern) over 2-day intervals. On the second day on each feeding regimen, the diurnal pattern of nutrient utilization was calculated from simultaneous measurements of oxygen consumption, carbon dioxide production and urinary nitrogen excretion over 3 h intervals in a respiration chamber. A gorging pattern of energy intake resulted in a stronger diurnal periodicity of nutrient utilization, compared to a nibbling pattern. However, there were no consequences for the total 24 h energy expenditure (24 h EE) of the two feeding patterns (5.57 +/- 0.16 kJ/min for the gorging pattern; 5.44 +/- 0.18 kJ/min for the nibbling pattern). Concerning the periodicity of nutrient utilization, protein oxidation during the day did not change between the two feeding patterns. In the gorging pattern, carbohydrate oxidation was significantly elevated during the interval following the first meal (ie from 1200 h to 1500 h, P less than 0.01) and the second meal (ie from 1800 h to 2100 h, P less than 0.05). The decreased rate of carbohydrate oxidation observed during the fasting period (from rising in the morning until the first meal at 1200 h), was compensated by an increased fat oxidation from 0900 to 1200 h to cover energy needs. In the nibbling pattern, carbohydrate and fat oxidation remained relatively constant during the active hours of the day.(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED AT 250 WORDS)


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11319656
Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord. 2001 Apr;25(4):519-28.Links
Compared with nibbling, neither gorging nor a morning fast affect short-term energy balance in obese patients in a chamber calorimeter.

Taylor MA, Garrow JS.
Department of Nutrition and Dietetics, King's College London, London, UK.
OBJECTIVE: To test if a diet of 4.2 MJ/24 h as six isocaloric meals would result in a lower subsequent energy intake, or greater energy output than (a) 4.2 MJ/24 h as two isocaloric meals or (b) a morning fast followed by free access to food. DESIGN: Subjects were confined to the Metabolic Unit from 19:00 h on day 1 to 09:30 h on day 6. Each day they had a fixed diet providing 4.2 MJ with three pairs of meal patterns which were offered in random sequence. They were: six meals vs two meals without access to additional foods (6vs2), or six meals vs 2 meals with access to additional food (6+vs2+), or six meals vs four meals (6+vsAMFAST). In the AMFAST condition the first two meals of the day were omitted to reduce daily intake to 2.8 MJ and to create a morning fast, but additional food was accessible thereafter. Patients were confined in the chamber calorimeter from 19:00 h on day 2 until 09:00 h on day 4, and then from 19:00 h on day 4 to 09:00 h on day 6. The order in which each meal pattern was offered was balanced over time. MEASUREMENTS: Energy expenditure (chamber calorimetry), spontaneous activity (video) and energy intake (where additional foods were available) during the final 24 h of each dietary component. SUBJECTS: Ten (6vs2), eight (6+vs2+) and eight (6+vsAMFAST) women were recruited who had a BMI of greater than 25 kg/m2. RESULTS: From experiment 6vs2 the difference between energy expenditure with six meals (10.00 MJ) and two meals (9.96 MJ) was not significant (P=0.88). Energy expenditure between 23:00 h and 08:00 h ('night') was, however, significantly higher (P=0.02) with two meals (9.12 MJ/24 h) compared with six meals (8.34 MJ/24 h). The pattern of spontaneous physical activity did not differ significantly between these two meal patterns (P>0.05). Total energy intake was affected by neither meal frequency in experiment 6+vs2+ (10.75 MJ with six, 11.08 MJ with two; P=0.58) nor a morning fast in experiment 6+vsAMFAST (8.55 MJ/24 h with six, 7.60 MJ with AMFAST; P=0.40). The total diet of subjects who had a morning fast tended to have a lower percentage of total energy from carbohydrate (40%) than when they had six meals per 24 h (49%) (P=0.05). Subsequent energy balance was affected by neither meal frequency (6vs2; P=0.88, 6+vs2+; P=0.50) nor a morning fast (P=0.18). CONCLUSIONS: In the short term, meal frequency and a period of fasting have no major impact on energy intake or expenditure but energy expenditure is delayed with a lower meal frequency compared with a higher meal frequency. This might be attributed to the thermogenic effect of food continuing into the night when a later, larger meal is given. A morning fast resulted in a diet which tended to have a lower percentage of energy from carbohydrate than with no fast.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18053311
Br J Nutr. 2008 Jun;99(6):1316-21. Epub 2007 Dec 6. Links
Acute effects on metabolism and appetite profile of one meal difference in the lower range of meal frequency.

Smeets AJ, Westerterp-Plantenga MS.
Department of Human Biology, Maastricht University, P.O. Box 616, 6200 MD, Maastricht, The Netherlands. astrid.smeets@hb.unimaas.nl
A gorging pattern of food intake has been shown to enhance lipogenesis and increase body weight, which may be due to large fluctuations in storage and mobilisation of nutrients. In a state of energy balance, increasing meal frequency, and thereby decreasing inter-meal interval, may prevent large metabolic fluctuations. Our aim was to study the effect of the inter-meal interval by dividing energy intake over two or three meals on energy expenditure, substrate oxidation and 24 h satiety, in healthy, normal-weight women in a state of energy balance. The study was a randomised crossover design with two experimental conditions. During the two experimental conditions subjects (fourteen normal-weight women, aged 24.4 (SD 7.1) years, underwent 36 h sessions in energy balance in a respiration chamber for measurements of energy expenditure and substrate oxidation. The subjects were given two (breakfast, dinner) or three (breakfast, lunch, dinner) meals per d. We chose to omit lunch in the two meals condition, because this resulted in a marked difference in inter-meal-interval after breakfast (8.5 h v. 4 h). Eating three meals compared with two meals had no effects on 24 h energy expenditure, diet-induced thermogenesis, activity-induced energy expenditure and sleeping metabolic rate. Eating three meals compared with two meals increased 24 h fat oxidation, but decreased the amount of fat oxidised from the breakfast. The same amount of energy divided over three meals compared with over two meals increased satiety feelings over 24 h. In healthy, normal-weight women, decreasing the inter-meal interval sustains satiety, particularly during the day, and sustains fat oxidation, particularly during the night.
PMID: 18053311 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

more: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=119024341&page=1

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 08:45 AM
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19943985

Geez omg I didnt kno! Lol and AGAIN its about calories in vs calories out.... Its not mentioning body comp.

Arguing with a fool, proves there are two.
Bye now

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 08:46 AM
Cuz I have a goal I wanna reach. I also want to be healthy. There are plenty of reasons and to me the most important is that the people that eat once or twice a day look it.... Not very in shape - versus body builders that eat every 2-3 hours, wake up in the middle of the night to down a shake etc.
I talk to hundreds of ppl a day about their eating habits and no matter if their goal is to lose or gain, the ones that have trouble are the ones that dont eat frequently enough. Every time. And of course research. I kno, I kno you like to look at those studies done that say it doesnt matter etc and its cool cuz like I already said, Confirmation bias becomes an issue for the lazy ppl to prove their point, flawed research that tells us only half, the purpose those studies were done for and who paid for them....

i eat 2 meals a day...
people who are eating frequently are most likely doing it to "speed metabolism". so they are already conscious of their goal to lose/gain weight. usually people who eat 1-2 meals with no knowledge aren't too conscious of the fact the diet is the most important in body composition.

you can eat 6 meals a day, or 2 meals a day. i've done both. energy (calorie) balance is what matters. First law of thermodynamics, you cannot create nor destroy energy. so if i ingest the same amount of energy through 2 meals or 6 meals, what's the difference?
usually the people you talk to are going off of things they learned that rooted from Pro bodybuilders who are trying to sell products. they may also be eating more meals a day because they need to eat so many meals to be in a caloric surplus that they have to split it into more meals.

people who eat 6 times a day, usually do this because they have looked into bodybuilding and that's what they have been told. so obviously they know some basics like, "eat more", "eat adequate protein". individuals who eat twice a day may not understand that caloric surplus equals more muscle when applied to a training regimen.

you can find a ****load of people here that only eat once or twice and are in the best shape of their lives. people here that understand the science behind that eat either 6 or 2 meals understand its the energy balance that affects body composition.

koard31
04-10-2012, 08:49 AM
Ugh the0hulk87 you brought your trollish ass in here now?

Are you going to tell this forum that they need to take a basic biology course to undertand nutrition?

Can't you keep this Broscience at S2 and leave it there?

Please feel free to insult my e-stats again to prove your way is right.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 08:49 AM
more: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=119024341&page=1

Copy and paste from stickies? Lol com on we already talked about that. It doesnt give me any accurate information on what they were fed? How much of which macro at one point in time, when, etc. there are so many things wrong with those half ass research studies.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 08:50 AM
Yes like I already said, weight gain or weight loss is all about cal. In vs. cal. Out... That is if you're not concerned about body composition...
According to these blogs here, I could eat my 3400 calories in one meal at the end of the day. My carbs can come from soda, protein from dog food and fats from a bucket of lard... Since it all doesnt matter... You are telling me thay wzy of eating will get me in shape? Haha
no one here ever said that. get adequate protein, fat and micronutrients, then fill rest with what you want. as long as you're in a caloric deficit you will lose weight. if you are lifting and in a surplus, you will gain muscle and fat

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 08:58 AM
Srs???? Cuz the bioavailability is very low. Nutients have been completely denatured and you body can only do two things with a denatured nutrient A) pass is B) store it as fat.
Hence processed foods make americans fat.
Wtf?

http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzondd79TG1qkfixxo1_400.gif

I'm inclined to believe you don't know what the definitions of "bioavailability" and "denatured" are. Based on your last few posts, I'm almost certain I'm being trolled. Also, nice sources to back your claims up.

Please look those definitions up.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:00 AM
no one here ever said that. get adequate protein, fat and micronutrients, then fill rest with what you want. as long as you're in a caloric deficit you will lose weight. if you are lifting and in a surplus, you will gain muscle and fat

Yup! Thanks! Lose weight from losing muscle and gain weight from fat... U made my point exactly.
I would care for gaining only muscle or, if it were the case, lose fat only! And that is where meal timing and portion size are relevant!
Its the idea of muscle peotein synthesis and keeping muscles metabolically active to burn body fat.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 09:00 AM
Srs???? Cuz the bioavailability is very low. Nutients have been completely denatured and you body can only do two things with a denatured nutrient A) pass is B) store it as fat.
Hence processed foods make americans fat.
Wtf?
seen FatHead? the guy ate Fast food for 30 days and just watched his calorie intake. resulted in weight loss, better blood levels, etc

germaine07
04-10-2012, 09:02 AM
I would care for gaining only muscle or, if it were the case, lose fat only! And that is where meal timing and portion size are relevant!
Its the idea of muscle peotein synthesis and keeping muscles metabolically active to burn body fat.
Incorrect. Macronutrient composition is what is relevant.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 09:04 AM
Yup! Thanks! Lose weight from losing muscle and gain weight from fat... U made my point exactly.
I would care for gaining only muscle or, if it were the case, lose fat only! And that is where meal timing and portion size are relevant!
Its the idea of muscle peotein synthesis and keeping muscles metabolically active to burn body fat.
wow...
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/nutrition/nutrient-intake-nutrient-storage-and-nutrient-oxidation.html

and look at number 1: http://www.leangains.com/2010/10/top-ten-fasting-myths-debunked.html

edit: that's not at all what I said btw. how can you agree with cals in vs cals out and still say you need to increase metabolism. metabolism is based off TEF, movement/exercise, and BMR...

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:04 AM
V6
http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzondd79TG1qkfixxo1_400.gif

I'm inclined to believe you don't know what the definitions of "bioavailability" and "denatured" are. Based on your last few posts, I'm almost certain I'm being trolled. Also, nice sources to back your claims

Please look those definitions up.

I have son, I study every day and keep up with the newest resrarch not s**t from 1964. I also feel like i'm being trolled by you... You dont look to good... Ouch :/

nobrah
04-10-2012, 09:07 AM
seen FatHead? the guy ate Fast food for 30 days and just watched his calorie intake. resulted in weight loss, better blood levels, etc
Which he then attributed to carb restriction. :rolleyes: But I still give him credit for an entertaining documentary.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:07 AM
seen FatHead? the guy ate Fast food for 30 days and just watched his calorie intake. resulted in weight loss, better blood levels, etc

Are u not understanding? You're still talking about weight gain/loss. I'm past that. I get the idea of eating 1000 cal of dirt, expending 2000 and losing weight. Jesus!
I 'm talking about body composition.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 09:08 AM
V6

I have son, I study every day and keep up with the newest resrarch not s**t from 1964. I also feel like i'm being trolled by you... You dont look to good... Ouch :/
post some research supporting your meal frequency statement then

germaine07
04-10-2012, 09:10 AM
Are u not understanding? You're still talking about weight gain/loss. I'm past that. I get the idea of eating 1000 cal of dirt, expending 2000 and losing weight. Jesus!
I 'm talking about body composition.
So you're saying that eating 6 meals a day of dirt will make you lose fat only and gain muscle only. Very logical.

Macronutrient composition of your diet is what has an effect on body composition, not meal frequency.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:12 AM
wow...
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/nutrition/nutrient-intake-nutrient-storage-and-nutrient-oxidation.html

and look at number 1: http://www.leangains.com/2010/10/top-ten-fasting-myths-debunked.html

edit: that's not at all what I said btw. how can you agree with cals in vs cals out and still say you need to increase metabolism. metabolism is based off TEF, movement/exercise, and BMR...

Im not talking about speeding up metabolism. Im talking about promoting muscle protein synthesis, keeping muscle metabolically active, hold on to the muscle we have (since thats the bodies biggest fat burner) and burn fat only. When we talk about weight loss.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:14 AM
So you're saying that eating 6 meals a day of dirt will make you lose fat only and gain muscle only. Very logical.

Macronutrient composition of your diet is what has an effect on body composition, not meal frequency.

Thats exactly what I'm not saying. If you have a goal, meal frequency, quality of nutrients and portion size are very relevant!

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 09:14 AM
V6

I have son, I study every day and keep up with the newest resrarch not s**t from 1964. I also feel like i'm being trolled by you... You dont look to good... Ouch :/

LOL. Which is why you didn't even understand the last two studies that were posted in your article. And no, you do not understand what "bioavailability" means. Ooh, and physique bashing?

http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/img/profiledefault_thumb.jpg

To everyone else: you're being trolled. This thread belongs in the Misc.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 09:18 AM
Im not talking about speeding up metabolism. Im talking about promoting muscle protein synthesis, keeping muscle metabolically active, hold on to the muscle we have (since thats the bodies biggest fat burner) and burn fat only. When we talk about weight loss.
hmmmm.. i've been waking up at 6:00AM, not eating til about 7:30PM, and go to the gym from 4:00 to 5:00PM. staying in a slight calorie deficit... i've somehow been maintaining muscle and losing fat. ... maybe i should switch to 6 meals a day because my body is too stupid to understand how to use the same amount of calories if i give it too much at one time.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:26 AM
hmmmm.. i've been waking up at 6:00AM, not eating til about 7:30PM, and go to the gym from 4:00 to 5:00PM. staying in a slight calorie deficit... i've somehow been maintaining muscle and losing fat. ... maybe i should switch to 6 meals a day because my body is too stupid to understand how to use the same amount of calories if i give it too much at one time.

Really? are you really? I mean are you really?
No you just made that up. I wish it was that easy! That way everybody can be skinny! My clients come in crying about how they only eat two small meals a day and lose weight, but still got all that "flab".
This website is so full of morons. Lol
I cant wait when BB.com goes out of business. Lol

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 09:28 AM
Arguing with a fool, proves there are two.You have a point there.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 09:29 AM
You have a point there.
true. hopefully someone else keeps this going so i have entertainment for the rest of the work day

koard31
04-10-2012, 09:30 AM
Really? are you really? I mean are you really?
No you just made that up. I wish it was that easy! That way everybody can be skinny! My clients come in crying about how they only eat two small meals a day and lose weight, but still got all that "flab".
This website is so full of morons. Lol
I cant wait when BB.com goes out of business. Lol

S2 is going to put bb.com out of business?

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 09:31 AM
You have a point there.

Pug, I did a little detectiving (going through his posts, etc.) and I'm pretty damn sure OP is associated with the 1st Phorm supplement company. He's just pushing his (or his associate's) blog here and then getting mad when we tell him it's wrong.

Off to class now!

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 09:34 AM
Pug, I did a little detectiving (going through his posts, etc.) and I'm pretty damn sure OP is associated with the 1st Phorm supplement company. He's just pushing his (or his associate's) blog here and then getting mad when we tell him it's wrong.Now it makes sense.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:34 AM
Pug, I did a little detectiving (going through his posts, etc.) and I'm pretty damn sure OP is associated with the 1st Phorm supplement company. He's just pushing his (or his associate's) blog here and then getting mad when we tell him it's wrong.

Off to class now!

Ouch! Wrong again. I like the brand! No doubt! And I work 2 jobs in the supplement and nutrition industry. Thats all.

koard31
04-10-2012, 09:38 AM
Pug, I did a little detectiving (going through his posts, etc.) and I'm pretty damn sure OP is associated with the 1st Phorm supplement company. He's just pushing his (or his associate's) blog here and then getting mad when we tell him it's wrong.

Off to class now!

The guy who wrote the original blog post that the OP referenced owns a set of supplement stores (S2) here in Missouri. He also either owns or has ownership interests in 1st Phorm.

This clown is probably just one of the over-eager GNC flameouts that tend to work there, pouncing on kids and newbies with his Broscience PHD. His "clients" are actually just customers who haven't done any homework to realize he's full of ****.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:45 AM
The guy who wrote the original blog post that the OP referenced owns a set of supplement stores (S2) here in Missouri. He also either owns or has ownership interests in 1st Phorm.

This clown is probably just one of the over-eager GNC flameouts that tend to work there, pouncing on kids and newbies with his Broscience PHD. His "clients" are actually just customers who haven't done any homework to realize he's full of ****.
Hmmm interesting. Tell me more. Lol I have two jobs, like I said. But results speak for themselves. I'm not worried. You can hide online behind some profile, but at the end of the day you still look like s**t. Lol
Keep it up!

Also, where do you get your info? Online? Blogs on here, website that satisfy your confirmation bias?
How bout a book rookie!?

germaine07
04-10-2012, 09:48 AM
But results speak for themselves.
Indeed they do.

foodandfitness
04-10-2012, 09:49 AM
Really? are you really? I mean are you really?
No you just made that up. I wish it was that easy! That way everybody can be skinny! My clients come in crying about how they only eat two small meals a day and lose weight, but still got all that "flab".
This website is so full of morons. Lol
I cant wait when BB.com goes out of business. Lol


Ouch! Wrong again. I like the brand! No doubt! And I work 2 jobs in the supplement and nutrition industry. Thats all.

OP, I feel bad for your clients. I hope that when they finally realize you are unqualified to prescribe diets they find a competent nutrition professional to suit their needs.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 09:54 AM
I realize more and more, that people on here that totally fall for the BB.com stickies and "knowledgeable" staff, look like s**t. Lol and i'm sure you have your excuses etc etc. its all good. You all stay thay way! I'm outta here. Feels like a bunch of kids that just found out santa isn't real. Lol

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 09:57 AM
I'm outta here. Better luck with your marketing efforts next time. Bye.

BOB55555
04-10-2012, 09:58 AM
I don't know why you ignored me, OP, but I'll try once more.

MAIN POINT:

Everything you're defending here seems to be based on second hand information based on the 1999 article from Tipton, KD (that's the source of the protein synthesis idea your friend quoted in the article).

About that article, you don't know the size and characteristics of the sample, you don't know the methodology, the standard deviations, the distributions, the reviewing process, the sponsors, who the hell is this Tipton dude, anything, it may very well be extremely flawed... And yet you dismiss anything else.

Unless you have strong solid evidence pointing out that the Tipton study is better than all the other studies ever done combined, I fail to grasp your point. It seems illogical.


On books, books in any field are usually either 1) easier to read compilations of study results - yet a lot of them are outdated by the time they come out of the presses or 2) guessing (here we find the best sellers). So I wonder which books are you reading specifically. Can you give us some tips?

I respect the fact that your approach is working for you. And it should. But there's no reason to believe that this is optimal, or the only approach.

Here are a few guys that mostly don't give a damn about how many meals you'll have a day, and are OK with eating ice creams and poptarts if their micros and macros are already filled. Their protein synthesis seems to be going OK...

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=143876611&p=863371711#post863371711

In all fairness, if I recall correctly, two of those guys believe it's optimal to have BCAAs when fasting for too long - that just helps to show that no approach is written in stone.

Ampoliros
04-10-2012, 10:00 AM
I realize more and more, that people on here that totally fall for the BB.com stickies and "knowledgeable" staff, look like s**t. Lol and i'm sure you have your excuses etc etc. its all good. You all stay thay way! I'm outta here. Feels like a bunch of kids that just found out santa isn't real. Lol

Actually, the BB 'Super Site' is full of the **** you're preaching, because guess what their goal is as well? Selling supplements to uneducated folk.

The stickies in the forum are the work of people with more nutritional knowledge in their little finger than a thousand of you have. You're the typical bro, bro. You keep punishing yourself with silly rituals and I'll eat my quarter pounder and still be healthier than you.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 10:02 AM
I realize more and more, that people on here that totally fall for the BB.com stickies and "knowledgeable" staff, look like s**t. Lol and i'm sure you have your excuses etc etc. its all good. You all stay thay way! I'm outta here. Feels like a bunch of kids that just found out santa isn't real. Lol
rooted from actual scientific studies...

germaine07
04-10-2012, 10:11 AM
If meal frequency impacts body composition, although I'd view weight loss as a component of body composition, can you explain this for me.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22253539

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:12 AM
Actually, the BB 'Super Site' is full of the **** you're preaching, because guess what their goal is as well? Selling supplements to uneducated folk.

The stickies in the forum are the work of people with more nutritional knowledge in their little finger than a thousand of you have. You're the typical bro, bro. You keep punishing yourself with silly rituals and I'll eat my quarter pounder and still be healthier than you.

Yup... 5'7" & 156 lbs. Lol GTFO!

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 10:13 AM
Yup... 5'7" & 156 lbs. Lol GTFO!
attack the person's stats and not their knowledge...? thats bro'tastic!

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:14 AM
If meal frequency impacts body composition, although I'd view weight loss as a component of body composition, can you explain this for me.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22253539

Sorry thats to vague. Lol thanks for trying tho.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:17 AM
attack the person's stats and not their knowledge...? thats bro'tastic!

As always, i'm not letting someone, that looks like a lazy piece of lard, tell me how to eat righ. Takes away their credibility. If they practice what they preach and look like that, then whats wrong with that?

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 10:19 AM
Sorry thats to vague. Lol thanks for trying tho.
can you at least attempt to post any evidence to support your claims?

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 10:20 AM
OP, you mad I eat whenever I feel like it and have the same results as when I ate like a bro? Actually better because I learned what actually matters instead of eating rice and chicken and thinking that's what makes me jacked.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 10:20 AM
Cliffs:

1. OP says something stupid.
2. OP gets called out on it.
3. OP starts insulting people.

Next step: OP takes his ball and goes home.

germaine07
04-10-2012, 10:20 AM
This study shows a 'reduction in fat mass' while consuming 1meal/d

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17413096

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:23 AM
This study shows a 'reduction in fat mass' while consuming 1meal/d

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17413096

Good job! Of course you'll lose some fat when you're calorie deficient! But more muscle.
Guter versuch! ;)

Ampoliros
04-10-2012, 10:24 AM
Yup... 5'7" & 156 lbs. Lol GTFO!

Who says I'm here for lifting and not just nutrition? I could be 156lbs at 5% BF for all you know.

I joined this site last year when I was a newb and actually believed the stuff you're saying now (your way of thinking isn't new knowledge, most bodybuilders believe it too, sadly). I haven't updated my stats since and I don't care to.

germaine07
04-10-2012, 10:25 AM
Good job! Of course you'll lose some fat when you're calorie deficient! But more muscle.
Guter versuch! ;)
It doesn't say anything about muscle, you're just assuming with no evidence to back it up.

I notice you are not backing up any statements. Poor form.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 10:25 AM
As always, i'm not letting someone, that looks like a lazy piece of lard, tell me how to eat righ. Takes away their credibility. If they practice what they preach and look like that, then whats wrong with that?

i guess i gotta eat 6 meals a day to speed up my metabolizmz... then i gain all the muscle i want and lose fat.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:25 AM
OP, you mad I eat whenever I feel like it and have the same results as when I ate like a bro? Actually better because I learned what actually matters instead of eating rice and chicken and thinking that's what makes me jacked.

Oh! You're jacked? I didnt notice. Again proves my point.
I 'm not mad! Do whatever u feel like. But if its not working, then whats the point?

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 10:26 AM
Sorry thats to vague. Lol thanks for trying tho.Here is (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257969/?tool=pubmed) the full-text of the study.

Please read it and comment specifically.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 10:28 AM
Here is (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257969/?tool=pubmed) the full-text of the study.

Please read it and comment specifically.

LOL, he keeps setting the ball on the tee for you guys.

Ampoliros
04-10-2012, 10:31 AM
LOL, he keeps setting the ball on the tee for you guys.

Didn't people mention he has ties with supplement companies?

I'm not so sure this is strictly trolling and instead failed marketing to the wrong crowd.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 10:32 AM
Didn't people mention he has ties with supplement companies?

I'm not so sure this is strictly trolling and instead failed marketing to the wrong crowd.

Failed marketing is my guess.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:32 AM
What were they eating? How much at once? Food quality? Age? Hormone levels? Stress exposure? Alcohol consumption? Drug usage? Medical history?
Ouch

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 10:32 AM
What were they eating? How much at once? Food quality? Age? Hormone levels? Stress exposure? Alcohol consumption? Drug usage? Medical history?
Ouch

Grasping. I love it.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:37 AM
Grasping. I love it.

Son relax! Look at yourself! Just eat would be my suggestion! You look like you're starving my friend! 5'6", 148....

germaine07
04-10-2012, 10:39 AM
Son relax! Look at yourself! Just eat would be my suggestion! You look like you're starving my friend! 5'6", 148....
Attacking people's appearance rather than backing up your argument with scientific data.

You are yet to put up one study to back up your beliefs, just 1 blog post from a supplement site.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 10:40 AM
Grasping. I love it.Yup. He's completely lost and can't believe that his supplement pimping didn't work.

Obviously, he never figured he'd run into knowledgeable folks.

hulk4
04-10-2012, 10:40 AM
Son relax! Look at yourself! Just eat would be my suggestion! You look like you're starving my friend! 5'6", 148....
you might like this one

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21410865?dopt=Abstract

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:44 AM
you might like this one

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21410865?dopt=Abstract

That wasnt the argument really, but I like your username!

germaine07
04-10-2012, 10:45 AM
That wasnt the argument really, but I like your username!
Well, you don't have high meal frequency while IF so it kind of is.

hulk4
04-10-2012, 10:47 AM
That wasnt the argument really, but I like your username!

I'm pretty sure it was. You said weight loss is dictated by cals in vs cals out but eating more frequently is better at preserving fat-free mass. This study shows the opposite.

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 10:55 AM
Oh! You're jacked? I didnt notice. Again proves my point.
I 'm not mad! Do whatever u feel like. But if its not working, then whats the point?

lol, I actually meant jacked as in building muscle ie getting jacked. Post up an avi big guy, mine is a year old. And who said my dietary habits aren't working? The point I was making is that when I ate 6 meals a day it showed no greater benefit to eating 3 or so like I do now.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 10:57 AM
I'm pretty sure it was. You said weight loss is dictated by cals in vs cals out but eating more frequently is better at preserving fat-free mass. This study shows the opposite.

Its a abstract summary. Not really a study. It probably only tells you half to make it fit that persons views. Its tough to figure out whats right whats kinda right and whats bs.
I used to be 160 lbs 3 years ago. I ate whenever I was hungry and I are garbage. I looked at the s**t you guys are looking at. Then I decided to read actual books not half of online articles... Things took of and started to work. 75 lbs later...
I'm just saying that there is certain things that happen in all our bodys and we all work the same in certain aspects.
Do what you like if youre happy that way. I have a goal set that I will reach and from reading, doing and teaching others I know it works great! Its not a fad. Its not a diet. Its a lifestyle thats sustainable!

germaine07
04-10-2012, 11:00 AM
Perhaps your poor body composition was down to your poor diet and not how many meals you ate, ever think of that?

And nobody is saying your method won't work, because more than likely you will still be hitting macro's and calories. It's just unnecessary.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:01 AM
lol, I actually meant jacked as in building muscle ie getting jacked. Post up an avi big guy, mine is a year old. And who said my dietary habits aren't working? The point I was making is that when I ate 6 meals a day it showed no greater benefit to eating 3 or so like I do now.

How long did you eat 6 meals for? What macros were in each meal? Carb-protein-fat ratio? Workouts? Supplements?
I'm not arguing with you. I'm seriously asking.

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 11:02 AM
Its a abstract summary. Not really a study. It probably only tells you half to make it fit that persons views. Its tough to figure out whats right whats kinda right and whats bs.
I used to be 160 lbs 3 years ago. I ate whenever I was hungry and I are garbage. I looked at the s**t you guys are looking at. Then I decided to read actual books not half of online articles... Things took of and started to work. 75 lbs later...
I'm just saying that there is certain things that happen in all our bodys and we all work the same in certain aspects.
Do what you like if youre happy that way. I have a goal set that I will reach and from reading, doing and teaching others I know it works great! Its not a fad. Its not a diet. Its a lifestyle thats sustainable!

Sounds like IIFYM to me.

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 11:03 AM
How long did you eat 6 meals for? What macros were in each meal? Carb-protein-fat ratio? Workouts? Supplements?
I'm not arguing with you. I'm seriously asking.

About a year.

I didnt track macros, but I know from experience it was roughly similar to what I eat now, although it was definitely too low on fat IMO. Supplements don't really mean anything, all I take is creatine and some whey, and some fish oils. Workouts: 4day bro split, I'm doing PHAT but currently doing a 4 day split before taking a de-load and going back to a strength orientated routine.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:04 AM
Perhaps your poor body composition was down to your poor diet and not how many meals you ate, ever think of that?

And nobody is saying your method won't work, because more than likely you will still be hitting macro's and calories. It's just unnecessary.

Well see thats kinda what I was saying, but I'm being told on here it doesnt matter where the macros came from lol. It could b 5 pound of mayo once a day and I suposedly get jacked....
What do u think?

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:05 AM
About a year.

What about everything else? I'm trying to figure out?

germaine07
04-10-2012, 11:08 AM
Well see thats kinda what I was saying, but I'm being told on here it doesnt matter where the macros came from lol. It could b 5 pound of mayo once a day and I suposedly get jacked....
What do u think?
I think 80-90% of your diet should come from a variety of micronutrient dense, whole and minimally processed foods. As do most people on this forum. Some people take IIFYM theory to the extreme and suggest absurd things such as 5lbs of mayo or all macro's from BK etc. But in saying that, it is okay to fill remaining 10-20% with some enjoyable treats instead of restricting yourself and still see results.

However, I think the vast majority of people will see the same results eating 3-4 meals a day as eating 8-6 meals a day.

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 11:08 AM
Well see thats kinda what I was saying, but I'm being told on here it doesnt matter where the macros came from lol. It could b 5 pound of mayo once a day and I suposedly get jacked....
What do u think?

I eat pizza almost everyday, ice-cream most days and I'm making better progress than ever.


What about everything else? I'm trying to figure out?

See original post

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 11:09 AM
Well see thats kinda what I was saying, but I'm being told on here it doesnt matter where the macros came from lol. It could b 5 pound of mayo once a day and I suposedly get jacked....
What do u think?
what's wrong with mayo?

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:18 AM
I eat pizza amost everyday, ice-cream most days and I'm making better progress than ever.



See original post

Try calorie & nutrient dense foods. Protein carbs and veggies in each meal. unprocessed foods are great. I'm also a firm believer in usagse of high quality supplements. The basics at least, like a good multivitamin in a powder filled capsule, liquid gel or liquid. But there is more...

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:19 AM
I think 80-90% of your diet should come from a variety of micronutrient dense, whole and minimally processed foods. As do most people on this forum. Some people take IIFYM theory to the extreme and suggest absurd things such as 5lbs of mayo or all macro's from BK etc. But in saying that, it is okay to fill remaining 10-20% with some enjoyable treats instead of restricting yourself and still see results.

However, I think the vast majority of people will see the same results eating 3-4 meals a day as eating 8-6 meals a day.

I somewhat agree. Nutrient dense foods are the way to go! Thanks!

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 11:27 AM
Try calorie & nutrient dense foods. Protein carbs and veggies in each meal. unprocessed foods are great. I'm also a firm believer in usagse of high quality supplements. The basics at least, like a good multivitamin in a powder filled capsule, liquid gel or liquid. But there is more...

I do eat nutrient dense foods, but I manage to fit some pizza and ice-cream in too, that's why it's called "if it fits your macros". The cost of many supplements outweighs the benefits in my opinion, and I'm sure many would agree. But that's besides the point of meal frequency. Eating 6 meals a day was no more superior than eating 3 meals a day like I do now. I use to think it did, but the reality was that my progress came from being in a calorie surplus, eating enough protein and working out like no tomorrow. Correlation does not necessarily equal causation.

germaine07
04-10-2012, 11:33 AM
As for supplements, that's what they are. They are only there to supplement your diet if it is deficient. Getting it from whole foods always better IMO.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:34 AM
I do eat nutrient dense foods, but I manage to fit some pizza and ice-cream in too, that's why it's called "if it fits your macros". The cost of many supplements outweighs the benefits in my opinion, and I'm sure many would agree. But that's besides the point of meal frequency. Eating 6 meals a day was no more superior than eating 3 meals a day like I do now. I use to think it did, but the reality was that my progress came from being in a calorie surplus, eating enough protein and working out like no tomorrow. Correlation does not necessarily equal causation.

It looks like your bodys natural production of T3 & T4 hormones is high, meaning you have a fast metabolism. Your body will metabolize foods quicker. Once, what you ate is gone your body will tap into muscle for amino acids to keep amino acid levels in your blood stream high. If your goal is gaining muscle, I think you benefit from eating protein and carbs more often to keep promoting muscle protein synthesis, growth and stay anabolic.
I was in your shoes. I'm not tryin to hate.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 11:36 AM
Its a abstract summary. Not really a study.Here is (http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2011.00873.x/full) the full-text of the study. Please comment substantively on the content contained therein.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:36 AM
As for supplements, that's what they are. They are only there to supplement your diet if it is deficient. Getting it from whole foods always better IMO.

You would have to eat 16 different colored fruits and veggies from the earth to get all vitamins and minerals. I think they are beneficial. But true whole foods are always the best choice!

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 11:37 AM
It looks like your bodys natural production of T3 & T4 hormones is high, meaning you have a fast metabolism. Your body will metabolize foods quicker. Once, what you ate is gone your body will tap into muscle for amino acids to keep amino acid levels in your blood stream high. If your goal is gaining muscle, I think you benefit from eating protein and carbs more often to keep promoting muscle protein synthesis, growth and stay anabolic.
I was in your shoes. I'm not tryin to hate.

haha, oh lawdy lawd. That was funny, you are so full of it bro.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 11:37 AM
Its a abstract summary. Not really a study.Here is (http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2011.00873.x/full) the full-text of the study. Please comment substantively on the content contained therein.

germaine07
04-10-2012, 11:38 AM
You would have to eat 16 different colored fruits and veggies from the earth to get all vitamins and minerals. I think they are beneficial. But true whole foods are always the best choice!
Yeah I try eat wide variety of vegetables but am not a lover of most fruit. I do take a daily multi as a safe proof.

koard31
04-10-2012, 11:41 AM
Here is (http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2011.00873.x/full) the full-text of the study. Please comment substantively on the content contained therein.

He said he wanted books, stuff on the internet is bogus!

And I'm loving the comments on T3 and T4, oh boy.

rand18m
04-10-2012, 11:44 AM
OP congratulations on keeping a troll thread going this long, it's a very difficult task to do, and you have done so very well. I must admit it's be humorous!!!

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 11:46 AM
Here is (http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2011.00873.x/full) the full-text of the study. Please comment substantively on the content contained therein.

Cool. Much better. The problem I see is that both ways, IF and eating 3 times a day, arent good for promoting a good body composition. Both ways will show results in terms of reducing weight and some body fat. It is crucial that when taking 3 meals a day vs. 6 we cant just split up the 3 big meals into smaller ones. A certain amount of a certain macro is needed to cause certain reactions in the body. Its not an exact number, since individuals vary in weight, fat %, age, hormone levels.
I certainly see what you guys are seeing, but the point is that these studies have design flaws. Its not that they are necessarily inacurate, they show what happened when A vs B was compared.
Does that make sense?

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 11:48 AM
Son relax! Look at yourself! Just eat would be my suggestion! You look like you're starving my friend! 5'6", 148....

Just ate a HUGE lunch - lettuce, cauliflower, and two grape Jolly Ranchers. I am stuffed.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 11:57 AM
Cool. Much better. The problem I see is that both ways, IF and eating 3 times a day, arent good for promoting a good body composition. Both ways will show results in terms of reducing weight and some body fat. It is crucial that when taking 3 meals a day vs. 6 we cant just split up the 3 big meals into smaller ones. A certain amount of a certain macro is needed to cause certain reactions in the body. Its not an exact number, since individuals vary in weight, fat %, age, hormone levels.
I certainly see what you guys are seeing, but the point is that these studies have design flaws. Its not that they are necessarily inacurate, they show what happened when A vs B was compared.
Does that make sense?

so what do you suggest for each meal? f/p/c %? and give evidence as to why

Skoorbmax
04-10-2012, 11:57 AM
Amino acids in your blood stream will dissapate after 2-3 hours (depending on metabolism, age, hormone levels, etc) then our body will look for a source of amino acids - muscle. So it will eat away muscle and hold on to fat... -> skinny fat.If this were hard and fast a person eating only two meals/day would not be able to gain muscle, would they? The reality is that food digests very slowly in the body in most cases. If you eat a hunk of meat it's not like two hours later you're not getting anything--in fact you're probably hardly getting anything at the two hour mark because it's not digested much. It takes a long time to move through the guts and get to the point it's been deprived of nutrients.

Herschel Walker has been used as a case study of this for years. He may be a genetic freak but supposedly eats only once/day and he's jacked as all hell even at his athletically advanced age.

I don't believe meal-timing is irrelevant or the frequency of them. I do believe it's mainly minutiae, though. It's more likely than not the sort of thing that takes a very exacting study of many individuals to find any kind of a difference between 3 and 6 meals, such that one ought to do what is convenient. And if you are a freak and for some reason like to eat a 3000 calorie meal for dinner and nothing throughout the day, give it a shot.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 12:03 PM
If this were hard and fast a person eating only two meals/day would not be able to gain muscle, would they? The reality is that food digests very slowly in the body in most cases. If you eat a hunk of meat it's not like two hours later you're not getting anything--in fact you're probably hardly getting anything at the two hour mark because it's not digested much. It takes a long time to move through the guts and get to the point it's been deprived of nutrients.

Herschel Walker has been used as a case study of this for years. He may be a genetic freak but supposedly eats only once/day and he's jacked as all hell even at his athletically advanced age.

I don't believe meal-timing is irrelevant or the frequency of them. I do believe it's mainly minutiae, though. It's more likely than not the sort of thing that takes a very exacting study of many individuals to find any kind of a difference between 3 and 6 meals, such that one ought to do what is convenient. And if you are a freak and for some reason like to eat a 3000 calorie meal for dinner and nothing throughout the day, give it a shot.

You can still gain, but its not as efficient and slower. The idea is to constantly promote muscle protein synthesis. for me it would take roughly 25-30g of high quality bioavailable protein, to do that. Thats all I'm saying. I wanna grow, so I will do what I can to get there faster.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 12:03 PM
OP congratulations on keeping a troll thread going this long, it's a very difficult task to do, and you have done so very well. I must admit it's be humorous!!!This x1000.

Skoorbmax
04-10-2012, 12:11 PM
You can still gain, but its not as efficient and slower. The idea is to constantly promote muscle protein synthesis. for me it would take roughly 25-30g of high quality bioavailable protein, to do that. Thats all I'm saying. I wanna grow, so I will do what I can to get there faster.But how can you gain if you're spending only 2-3 hours out of a day with protein available and the rest in a catabolic state? You couldn't, and yet people can, which indicates that the 2-3 hour window is not accurate.

Food takes HOURS to digest. I'm sure you've dumped out carrots, for example. They spent a day in your intestines and still made it through the gauntlet without being completely digested. Coca cola will hit your blood stream fast but chunks of chicken will take hours, and continually release protein during those many hours.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 12:13 PM
You can still gain, but its not as efficient and slower. The idea is to constantly promote muscle protein synthesis. for me it would take roughly 25-30g of high quality bioavailable protein, to do that. Thats all I'm saying. I wanna grow, so I will do what I can to get there faster.

I heard that unprocessed bull semen straight from the source is the highest quality bioavailable protein and unlike other protein, this protein has no limit on how much the body could absorb at once, so more is better. Six or more times a day is preferable for ideal anabolic effects. If you can, set your alarm twice overnight and get in an extra two to prevent catabolism.

A strange side effect, for reasons largely unknown, is that the bulls who produce the semen are happier and healthier than ordinary bulls whose semen is not extracted regularly.

rob2093124
04-10-2012, 12:15 PM
But how can you gain if you're spending only 2-3 hours out of a day with protein available and the rest in a catabolic state? You couldn't, and yet people can, which indicates that the 2-3 hour window is not accurate.

Food takes HOURS to digest. I'm sure you've dumped out carrots, for example. They spent a day in your intestines and still made it through the gauntlet without being completely digested. Coca cola will hit your blood stream fast but chunks of chicken will take hours, and continually release protein during those many hours.

wish i had the study handy that compared slow digesting and fast digesting protein immediately after a workout. there was no significant difference in stimulation of protein synthesis.

also just throwing this out there for those who may not know, OP, catabolism refers to the breakdown of large molecules, meaning the breakdown of fats and carbs as well

likeawashboard
04-10-2012, 12:16 PM
A strange side effect, for reasons largely unknown, is that the bulls who produce the semen are happier and healthier than ordinary bulls whose semen is not extracted regularly.
lol ^

desslok
04-10-2012, 12:17 PM
I just eat PB and fruit 8 times per day.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 12:19 PM
wish i had the study handy that compared slow digesting and fast digesting protein immediately after a workout. there was no significant difference in stimulation of protein synthesis.

See:

http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/300/1/E231.long
http://journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/Abstract/2004/12000/Ingestion_of_Casein_and_Whey_Proteins_Result_in.12 .aspx

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 12:22 PM
I just eat PB and fruit 8 times per day.

I look down on people who do that.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 12:51 PM
wish i had the study handy that compared slow digesting and fast digesting protein immediately after a workout. there was no significant difference in stimulation of protein synthesis.

also just throwing this out there for those who may not know, OP, catabolism refers to the breakdown of large molecules, meaning the breakdown of fats and carbs as well

There is a big difference between protein synthesis and muscle protein synthesis!

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 01:33 PM
There is a big difference between protein synthesis and muscle protein synthesis!You should start focusing on information synthesis...as it's clear that you have a lot to digest.

BBqChicken1
04-10-2012, 01:48 PM
You should start focusing on information synthesis...as it's clear that you have a lot to digest.




http://gifowisko.pl/uimages/gifs/201112/1324474814_by_Doknic.gif

misterdeejay
04-10-2012, 01:49 PM
everyone stop wasting your time replying to this idiot, he obviously is a troll

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 02:00 PM
http://gifowisko.pl/uimages/gifs/201112/1324474814_by_Doknic.gif

http://s3.amazonaws.com/readers/2011/12/06/lionel-messi-gif_1.gif

BOB55555
04-10-2012, 02:15 PM
I don't know why you ignored me, OP, but I'll try once more.

MAIN POINT:

Everything you're defending here seems to be based on second hand information based on the 1999 article from Tipton, KD (that's the source of the protein synthesis idea your friend quoted in the article).

About that article, you don't know the size and characteristics of the sample, you don't know the methodology, the standard deviations, the distributions, the reviewing process, the sponsors, who the hell is this Tipton dude, anything, it may very well be extremely flawed... And yet you dismiss anything else.

Unless you have strong solid evidence pointing out that the Tipton study is better than all the other studies ever done combined, I fail to grasp your point. It seems illogical.


On books, books in any field are usually either 1) easier to read compilations of study results - yet a lot of them are outdated by the time they come out of the presses or 2) guessing (here we find the best sellers). So I wonder which books are you reading specifically. Can you give us some tips?

I respect the fact that your approach is working for you. And it should. But there's no reason to believe that this is optimal, or the only approach.

Here are a few guys that mostly don't give a damn about how many meals you'll have a day, and are OK with eating ice creams and poptarts if their micros and macros are already filled. Their protein synthesis seems to be going OK...

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=143876611&p=863371711#post863371711

In all fairness, if I recall correctly, two of those guys believe it's optimal to have BCAAs when fasting for too long - as far as I know the others think extra BCAAs are as unnecessary as extra meals - that just helps to show that no approach is written in stone.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 02:49 PM
You should start focusing on information synthesis...as it's clear that you have a lot to digest.

For tips on how to do this quickly, see the dump thread.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 02:52 PM
I heard that unprocessed bull semen straight from the source is the highest quality bioavailable protein and unlike other protein, this protein has no limit on how much the body could absorb at once, so more is better. Six or more times a day is preferable for ideal anabolic effects. If you can, set your alarm twice overnight and get in an extra two to prevent catabolism.

A strange side effect, for reasons largely unknown, is that the bulls who produce the semen are happier and healthier than ordinary bulls whose semen is not extracted regularly.

How old are you man? Why are you talking about bull semen? Whats wrong with you? I thought we were having a grown up convetsation! You're weird dude.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 02:54 PM
How old are you man? Why are you talking about bull semen? Whats wrong with you? I thought we were having a grown up convetsation! You're weird dude.

27.
Because it's highly anabolic and you would benefit from it.
We were and still are.
I know.

ironwill2008
04-10-2012, 03:02 PM
How old are you man? Why are you talking about bull semen? Whats wrong with you? I thought we were having a grown up convetsation! You're weird dude.

The problem is you're focusing on the things in life that don't really matter. When I was a kid I had hopes and dreams. We all did. But over time, the daily grind gets in the way and you miss the things that really matter, even though they are right in front of you, staring you in the face. I think the next time you should ask yourself "Am I on the right track here?" I don't mean to be rude but people like you I really pity. So maybe you could use the few brain cells you have and take advantage of the knowledge I have given you now. Good luck.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 03:02 PM
27.
Because it's highly anabolic and you would benefit from it.
We were and still are.
I know.

You're telling me you drink bull semen? Whats wrong with you?

PR1MO
04-10-2012, 03:09 PM
You're telling me you drink bull semen? Whats wrong with you?

Gotta stay anabrolic man

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 03:15 PM
The problem is you're focusing on the things in life that don't really matter. When I was a kid I had hopes and dreams. We all did. But over time, the daily grind gets in the way and you miss the things that really matter, even though they are right in front of you, staring you in the face. I think the next time you should ask yourself "Am I on the right track here?" I don't mean to be rude but people like you I really pity. So maybe you could use the few brain cells you have and take advantage of the knowledge I have given you now. Good luck.

Ok thanks old man rivers! Its called tuppa wear. My life is pretty stellar. I'm happy. But science was surely different 63 years ago. Lol
Enjoy!

ironwill2008
04-10-2012, 03:18 PM
My life is pretty stellar. I'm happy.

Let me tell you something you already know. The world ain’t all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place and it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain’t how hard you hit; it’s about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. How much you can take, and keep moving forward. That’s how winning is done.

Ampoliros
04-10-2012, 03:18 PM
Natural BBers who fit their macros and eat whenever the hell they want, and whatever they want to:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4242863&d=1331937232

How is this possible..?

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 03:30 PM
Natural BBers who fit their macros and eat whenever the hell they want, and whatever they want to:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4242863&d=1331937232

How is this possible..?

Oh geez. Another one. Its marketing. Dont you get it? Makes them stand out! They say they eat once, but they drink shakes all day...

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 03:33 PM
Let me tell you something you already know. The world ainít all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place and it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ainít how hard you hit; itís about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. How much you can take, and keep moving forward. Thatís how winning is done.

You dont even know me. What are you talking about?
I 'm a professional mma fighter, work 2 jobs, have my degrees, a house, a wife, kids.
Dont tell me about life, old man

Ampoliros
04-10-2012, 03:33 PM
Clearly I should've seen it sooner, but you are 100% guaranteed a troll. Bye now.

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 03:35 PM
The problem is you're focusing on the things in life that don't really matter. When I was a kid I had hopes and dreams. We all did. But over time, the daily grind gets in the way and you miss the things that really matter, even though they are right in front of you, staring you in the face. I think the next time you should ask yourself "Am I on the right track here?" I don't mean to be rude but people like you I really pity. So maybe you could use the few brain cells you have and take advantage of the knowledge I have given you now. Good luck.


Let me tell you something you already know. The world ainít all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place and it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ainít how hard you hit; itís about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. How much you can take, and keep moving forward. Thatís how winning is done.This is strong evidence that the proper use of CTRL-C CTRL-V is anabolic.

SwiftyX
04-10-2012, 03:37 PM
Natural BBers who fit their macros and eat whenever the hell they want, and whatever they want to:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=4242863&d=1331937232

How is this possible..?

Not for nothing but Layne Norton's own research leans towards what the OP is talking about....at least in regards to muscle growth. So he was a bad example. His research and ideas on the topic lean heavily towards a higher meal frequency with a minimum protein intake at every meal as being optimal.

As far as nutrient timing in general...There are no decent long-term studies that show the same results as the short-term and acute studies. Especially with sound methods and showing fractional synthesis rates and anything at a molecular level. People have gotten results with both methods of thought so at this point, taking the available research into consideration, no one way is more right than the other.

Everyone on this board has a proximity bias to what they like to do and search out examples trying to prove that their way is best. The same exact thing the guy in the article that began this thread got raked over the coals for. It's a IF circle jerk here, that's understood, but lets not pretend the research is actually shifting the scale heavily one way or the other....because it's not.

ironwill2008
04-10-2012, 03:48 PM
You dont even know me. What are you talking about?
I 'm a professional mma fighter, work 2 jobs, have my degrees, a house, a wife, kids.
Dont tell me about life, old man


http://i.imgur.com/aQoMy.jpg

WonderPug
04-10-2012, 03:55 PM
I work 2 jobs in the supplement and nutrition industry. Thats all.


I 'm a professional mma fighterI guess you changed professions between page 3 and page 6 of this thread.

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 04:07 PM
Not for nothing but Layne Norton's own research leans towards what the OP is talking about....at least in regards to muscle growth. So he was a bad example. His research and ideas on the topic lean heavily towards a higher meal frequency with a minimum protein intake at every meal as being optimal.

As far as nutrient timing in general...There are no decent long-term studies that show the same results as the short-term and acute studies. Especially with sound methods and showing fractional synthesis rates and anything at a molecular level. People have gotten results with both methods of thought so at this point, taking the available research into consideration, no one way is more right than the other.

Everyone on this board has a proximity bias to what they like to do and search out examples trying to prove that their way is best. The same exact thing the guy in the article that began this thread got raked over the coals for. It's a IF circle jerk here, that's understood, but lets not pretend the research is actually shifting the scale heavily one way or the other....because it's not.

thanks! I appreciate it! Its good hearing someone with some sense, talk!

MakeABanana
04-10-2012, 04:08 PM
You dont even know me. What are you talking about?
I 'm a professional mma fighter, work 2 jobs, have my degrees, a house, a wife, kids.
Dont tell me about life, old man

You know what life is? I remember when it was a hot summer day and I was in my workout room benching 1200 pounds. My abs were flexing and girls within a 10 mile radius were getting wet. Once I was done with my daily 32 hour workout I called one of the bitches I know, Jessica. She is really damn hot and looks like a supermodel. SO I got into my Lamborghini Gallardo and reved it up to 40,000 RPM (this is an Italian import with special engine system). I got onto the freeway near my house and threw it into 8th gear, I hit about 600 mph and I could hear the sonic boom as I broke the sound barrier. As I was flooring it on the freeway like a badass, Jessica called me and said she wanted me to **** her. So be it.
I came to a full stop from 700 mph in front of her house. These Ferraris have top notch brakes, you know. So she gets out of the house and walks up to my Bugatti and starts eyeballing my dick. I could tell she was staring at it because when I looked at her I noticed she was looking at my dick. Booya.

Flash forward 10 minutes later. My 30 inch dick is going inside of her VAGINA, hitting them walls. I'm holding her entire body up with my left pinky as I'm ****ing her and she has 30,000 orgasms. She looks me in the eyes and she says "harder." V-TEC just kicked in, yo. I blow my load so hard she falls off my dick. There had to have been about two pints of cum everywhere. People say I cum like a pornstar, I wouldn't disagree with them.

I throw her a towel so she can clean herself up then I do a triple backflip into my Maserati and drive home

SwiftyX
04-10-2012, 04:12 PM
thanks! I appreciate it! Its good hearing someone with some sense, talk!

Most of what you have said is horse****. I'm not siding with you at all. I was pointing out that this matter is more centered than leaning any one way. We're likely taking percentage points of a difference anyhow, which would matter to such a small fraction of people it's barely relevant for message board fodder.

ironwill2008
04-10-2012, 04:16 PM
Its good hearing someone with some sense, talk!

The irony................

desslok
04-10-2012, 04:48 PM
Man, I am trying to figure out who this troll is. Almost seems like VV, only not as intelligent or witty as VV. Unless perhaps he lost some brain cells from toxic sugar.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 04:50 PM
You're telling me you drink bull semen? Whats wrong with you?

I don't, hence the reason I'm so skinny. I'm not anabolic like you, brah.

Almost 7:00. Time for bull semen shake #5. Warm up those forearms and bring your appetite.

FitnessCPA
04-10-2012, 04:52 PM
You dont even know me. What are you talking about?
I 'm a professional mma fighter, work 2 jobs, have my degrees, a house, a wife, kids.
Dont tell me about life, old man

You must make crap money at your jobs. You should concentrate on a career instead of staying anabolic.

ironwill2008
04-10-2012, 04:52 PM
Man, I am trying to figure out who this troll is. Almost seems like VV, only not as intelligent or witty as VV. Unless perhaps he lost some brain cells from toxic sugar.

He's a "PROFESSIONAL MMA Fighter," plus he "works 2 jobs in the supplement and nutrition industry."

That should narrow it down some.

















:rolleyes:

the0hulk87
04-10-2012, 05:42 PM
I guess you changed professions between page 3 and page 6 of this thread.

Read what I said moron

ParsonBrown
04-10-2012, 05:55 PM
OP goes from deep red to plus green...

BOB55555
04-10-2012, 08:22 PM
As far as nutrient timing in general...There are no decent long-term studies that show the same results as the short-term and acute studies. Especially with sound methods and showing fractional synthesis rates and anything at a molecular level. People have gotten results with both methods of thought so at this point, taking the available research into consideration, no one way is more right than the other.

Everyone on this board has a proximity bias to what they like to do and search out examples trying to prove that their way is best. The same exact thing the guy in the article that began this thread got raked over the coals for. It's a IF circle jerk here, that's understood, but lets not pretend the research is actually shifting the scale heavily one way or the other....because it's not.

But that's pretty much the point (edit: I just noticed you emphasized that in your other post).

I believe earlier I posted a compilation of 106 studies showing that results are all over the place. OP seems to believe that a single study done by Tipton, KD is the answer to all questions and worths more than all the other studies combined, even though he does not know the size and characteristics of the sample, the methodology, the standard deviations, the distributions, the reviewing process, the sponsors, who the hell is this Tipton dude, anything... It may very well be extremely flawed... I am not even sure he realized at first that the bulk of his argument (and of the blog post he quoted) comes solely from the Tipton study.

I can't really grasp why the OP favors that position. Especially since after a while he seemed to disregard studies in general (which includes the 1999 Tipton study, I imagine) and favor "books". I'm also still curious about what are OP's favorite books on nutrition for bodybuilders since he ignored my posts twice already.

I actually read a little bit about Tipton on Google and even him doesn't seem to support 6 full meals a day - he seems to be pro BCAAs, much like Layne Norton and Martin Berkham - this just shows there is no consensus - yet if I recall correctly they both admitted that Alan's views (BCAAS on isolation are mostly unnecessary on a high protein diet) have a better scientific support righ now.

I think OP is the only one being close minded here. Heck, even if the Tipton study was the only one in existence, probabilities alone would make it reasonable to approach its results with caution and an open mind - considering it is a single study among hundreds/thousands, I can't grasp why he views this specific study as better than anything else.

Unless of course there's something fishy going on. It wouldn't be fair for me to make such an accusation. Yet, the claim of 75 pounds of lean mass in 3 years while juggling multiple jobs and professional MMA training, the ad hominem attacks and the apparent lack of interest to look up the study that form the basis of his own argument or to tell the title of his favorite books make for a pretty unusual combination.

OP, would you be so kind to upload a picture of you holding one of your nutrition books? I think you'll conquer a lot of trust from the posters here if you show both your phisique and your sources are for real.

Kahldris
04-10-2012, 08:48 PM
Tempted to rep OP as well, I mean how he got this thread to 6 pages is beyond me.

greekmanman
04-11-2012, 02:48 AM
negged OP for blatant trolling. OP u mad you look like **** and are borderline retarded? ;)

germaine07
04-11-2012, 02:57 AM
Still yet to see any relevant studies backing up these claims.

RunThenRunMore
04-11-2012, 03:07 AM
MGM Whey.

WonderPug
04-11-2012, 01:19 PM
Wow, the troll is now green. That's amazing.

lsiberian
04-11-2012, 01:34 PM
Wow, the troll is now green. That's amazing.

Must have given someone a good laugh. He's an MMA fighter lol. I invite him to come anytime and roll with me at our gym in Fort Worth, TX.

the0hulk87
04-11-2012, 09:42 PM
negged OP for blatant trolling. OP u mad you look like **** and are borderline retarded? ;)

Ohhh yayyy look the kid that used to get made fun of and pushed around in middle school, found the power of PHs. Lol and you got to put your two cents in too. Good job!
Go work on your traps.

Hold up, maybe not if he took some he'd probably be big. But then again, his nutrition may be flawed... Hmmm either way, develope some traps.

gymjunki3
04-11-2012, 09:59 PM
Let me tell you something you already know. The world ain’t all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place and it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain’t how hard you hit; it’s about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. How much you can take, and keep moving forward. That’s how winning is done.


You dont even know me. What are you talking about?
I 'm a professional mma fighter, work 2 jobs, have my degrees, a house, a wife, kids.
Dont tell me about life, old man

You an MMA Fighter and you dont know where this line is from?

germaine07
04-12-2012, 03:34 AM
Can you please post some relevant studies to support your claims?

If not, stop trolling.

rob2093124
04-12-2012, 05:19 AM
Oh geez. Another one. Its marketing. Dont you get it? Makes them stand out! They say they eat once, but they drink shakes all day...
so they're marketing a way to get you to eat different without promoting a supp. hmmm... i guess they have a lot of extra time, or its part of their master plan to rule the world some day.

WonderPug
04-12-2012, 06:07 AM
This troll is kind of funny. I hope he sticks around and continues to provide entertainment value.

FitnessCPA
04-12-2012, 06:14 AM
This troll is kind of funny. I hope he sticks around and continues to provide entertainment value.

Agreed. Makes a boring work day fly by.

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 07:24 AM
Can you please post some relevant studies to support your claims?

If not, stop trolling.

Sorry I'm not gonna copy you and use google to find "research" that supports my way.
If I want to increase muscle and reduce body fat I need to eat 5-6 times a dat with at least protein and carbs, it constantly promotes MPS, keeps me in a growing and fat burning environment.
Or I could go with your idea, go catabolic, lose muscle along with some fat, eat a massive meal right before bed, have my body store it, reduce hgh production... And one day wake up possibly looking like you.
No thanks. I'll go with what I learned in college, read and what my certification programs provided. And on top of that, when I compare my clients coming in that eat 2000 cal. in 2 meals vs. 4 months later after eating 2000 cal. in 5-6 meals, that speaks for itself.
As a matter of fact I have a lady thats down 113 pounds in 11 months, just changing her eating habits.
You can hate all you want. All you guys can. Its cute to see a bunch of amped up skinny kids get so excited.
You all enjoy yourself here. Beware of the "bb.comscience"

WonderPug
04-12-2012, 07:31 AM
Sorry I'm not gonna copy you and use google to find "research" that supports my way.
If I want to increase muscle and reduce body fat I need to eat 5-6 times a dat with at least protein and carbs, it constantly promotes MPS, keeps me in a growing and fat burning environment.
Or I could go with your idea, go catabolic, lose muscle along with some fat, eat a massive meal right before bed, have my body store it, reduce hgh production... And one day wake up possibly looking like you.
No thanks. I'll go with what I learned in college, read and what my certification programs provided. And on top of that, when I compare my clients coming in that eat 2000 cal. in 2 meals vs. 4 months later after eating 2000 cal. in 5-6 meals, that speaks for itself.
As a matter of fact I have a lady thats down 113 pounds in 11 months, just changing her eating habits.
You can hate all you want. All you guys can. Its cute to see a bunch of amped up skinny kids get so excited.
You all enjoy yourself here. Beware of the "bb.comscience"Sadly, there are people the actually believe idiotic crap like the above.

Interesting, when presented in an overtly tolling fashion, it does make the broscience all the more obvious and absurd.

FitnessCPA
04-12-2012, 07:32 AM
LOL @ 2,000 calories over 5-6 "meals."

Please keep posting.

ironwill2008
04-12-2012, 07:47 AM
You can hate all you want.


http://i.imgur.com/c3UFn.png

germaine07
04-12-2012, 08:40 AM
Sorry I'm not gonna copy you and use google to find "research" that supports my way.
If I want to increase muscle and reduce body fat I need to eat 5-6 times a dat with at least protein and carbs, it constantly promotes MPS, keeps me in a growing and fat burning environment.
Or I could go with your idea, go catabolic, lose muscle along with some fat, eat a massive meal right before bed, have my body store it, reduce hgh production...
So you're saying you have no evidence, proof or anything besides your word to back up your statements. Point proved.

germaine07
04-12-2012, 08:42 AM
Sorry I'm not gonna copy you and one day wake up possibly looking like you.
You should be so lucky. I'm way too good looking :)

PBateman2
04-12-2012, 08:45 AM
EPIC thread! lol. Wow.

Xfaxtor
04-12-2012, 08:50 AM
I dont blame him. Id be pissed off to if I payed good money for an education and all I got out of it was a bunch of herp derp one liners and zero actual knowledge. I can relate

rand18m
04-12-2012, 08:53 AM
EPIC thread! lol. Wow.

PB, according to him you're an "amped up skinny kid"!! LOL

PBateman2
04-12-2012, 08:58 AM
PB, according to him you're an "amped up skinny kid"!! LOL

*yawns*

:D

DTrulez616
04-12-2012, 12:17 PM
2012 Thread of the Year

rob2093124
04-12-2012, 12:18 PM
i get pretty excited when i see this thread on the front page of the nutrition section

WonderPug
04-12-2012, 12:21 PM
OP: Please return to this thread or at least start another thread.

Your work here is far from done.

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 12:30 PM
OP: Please return to this thread or at least start another thread.

Your work here is far from done.

Do you practice what you preach, little guy?

WonderPug
04-12-2012, 12:41 PM
Do you practice what you preach, little guy?

dp4339EbVn8


And now for you:

Q8Tiz6INF7I

ArchangelEST
04-12-2012, 01:07 PM
Do you practice what you preach, little guy?

You know, this entire thread can be summed up with you as the OP providing no support for your claims and dozens of people going out of their way to educate you, and you ignoring them. Cute.

Kinda failed trolling IMO. As nobody in their right mind would believe a human being to be as stupid as you to argue a point with no evidence, while facing unsurmountable proof, lol.

desslok
04-12-2012, 01:19 PM
This troll is kind of funny. I hope he sticks around and continues to provide entertainment value.

Pretty sure its that little asian kid that tried trolling Alan's site and got schooled hard. Seems equally as dumb.

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 01:24 PM
You know, this entire thread can be summed up with you as the OP providing no support for your claims and dozens of people going out of their way to educate you, and you ignoring them. Cute.

Kinda failed trolling IMO. As nobody in their right mind would believe a human being to be as stupid as you to argue a point with no evidence, while facing unsurmountable proof, lol.

Wait! Someone provided unsurmountable proof? I havent noticed... Only half ass studies pulled from google, that someone had paid for and which were still structured like crap. I wanna see evidence that disproves everyday biological and biochemical processes in our body.
Good luck.

koard31
04-12-2012, 01:54 PM
Shocked you have time to post between your jobs at S2 and Starbucks and your MMA training.

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 02:03 PM
Shocked you have time to post between your jobs at S2 and Starbucks and your MMA training.

Lol its not always me responding. I have friends, you know? We're getting a laugh out of short skinny kids telling us how to eat. Hahahahaha oh man...

koard31
04-12-2012, 02:22 PM
Lol its not always me responding. I have friends, you know? We're getting a laugh out of short skinny kids telling us how to eat. Hahahahaha oh man...

Well that's good, maybe one of the other posters that's posting under your name will be intelligent enough to either post some proof of what you're saying (not just claiming it's basic biology), or actually be smart enough to understand what's been posted here and draw it out in crayons for you.

PR1MO
04-12-2012, 02:32 PM
Wait! Someone provided unsurmountable proof? I havent noticed... Only half ass studies pulled from google, that someone had paid for and which were still structured like crap. I wanna see evidence that disproves everyday biological and biochemical processes in our body.
Good luck.

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0764554220.jpg

FitnessCPA
04-12-2012, 02:33 PM
Wait! Someone provided unsurmountable proof? I havent noticed... Only half ass studies pulled from google, that someone had paid for and which were still structured like crap. I wanna see evidence that disproves everyday biological and biochemical processes in our body.
Good luck.

MMA fighter: The world is flat
World: No it's not.
MMA fighter: Prove it.

See how silly that is?

The burden of proof is on you, Hulkster.

BBqChicken1
04-12-2012, 02:45 PM
Injecting yourself with protein powder in the eye can put on 20lbs of muscle in a day.


Don't believe me? Prove it.

WonderPug
04-12-2012, 02:52 PM
I can't find my pet iguana. Has anyone seen an iguana wandering around this or another forum? If so, please contact WonderPug.

Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Xfaxtor
04-12-2012, 02:52 PM
Lol its not always me responding. I have friends, you know? We're getting a laugh out of short skinny kids telling us how to eat. Hahahahaha oh man...

Avi: None. lol, nice e-stats

desslok
04-12-2012, 02:52 PM
Lol its not always me responding. I have friends, you know? We're getting a laugh out of short skinny kids telling us how to eat. Hahahahaha oh man...

This you OP?

http://www.lolgangsta.com/gangstas/icy-hot-stuntaz.jpg

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 02:58 PM
"Basic Nutrition Counseling" - Kathleen Bauer PhD, RD
"Nutrient Periodization for Athletes" - Bob Seebohar MS, RD, CSCS
Buy a book. Read it. If you can.

gymjunki3
04-12-2012, 03:09 PM
2012 Thread of the Year

Imo this is the front runner for me

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=143914761

ArchangelEST
04-12-2012, 04:07 PM
Wait! Someone provided unsurmountable proof? I havent noticed... Only half ass studies pulled from google, that someone had paid for and which were still structured like crap. I wanna see evidence that disproves everyday biological and biochemical processes in our body.
Good luck.

What is your argument anyway? That eating protein every 2-3 hours is beneficial to bodycomp changes compared to eating in longer intervals?

And how do you think that works?

*Are you aware of the average time of digestion and absorption of different proteins? I don't think so. Otherwise you'd know it takes a fuking long time. Making any such attempts to manipulate MPS levels in such a short time frame a futile endeavour.

*Are you aware that unless Amino Acid concentrations after a meal are allowed to return to basal values, subsequent doses have no direct effect on MPS? Sit on a BCAA IV all day, dripping aminos into the blood and all you'll have is one "spike" at the beginning and after that it's just near basal MPS values after a few hours.

*Are you aware that the longer you go without dietary Amino Acid intake, the stronger the Anabolic response to them becomes? Just about completely nullifying any and all Catabolic negativity that has occurred.

*Are you Aware that you have not provided a single solid shred of Evidence for your claims for us to review and are unable to grasp even the simplest Biochemical processes that take place within the human body?

FitnessCPA
04-12-2012, 04:09 PM
Imo this is the front runner for me

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=143914761

Cliffs?

ErickStevens
04-12-2012, 04:12 PM
Does OP even lift?

gymjunki3
04-12-2012, 04:38 PM
Cliffs?

Op asks misc on how to pursue his long lost love
Misc, just msg her you phaggot
Op listens to misc, come across as a beta psycho
Misc why did you listen to misc you phaggot

FitnessCPA
04-12-2012, 04:44 PM
Op asks misc on how to pursue his long lost love
Misc, just msg her you phaggot
Op listens to misc, come across as a beta psycho
Misc why did you listen to misc you phaggot

LOL, good stuff.

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 04:59 PM
Does OP even lift?

Do you? Where are your pecs, buddy? Jerking off got your arms some size, but it neglects all other muscle groups...

gymjunki3
04-12-2012, 05:16 PM
Do you? Where are your pecs, buddy? Jerking off got your arms some size, but it neglects all other muscle groups...

damm I must be doing it wrong, dont have arms like Erik.

Sinaku5
04-12-2012, 05:19 PM
damm I must be doing it wrong, dont have arms like Erik.

Lol I love this thread.

This is a true laugh, and honestly I'm not 100 percent sure if OP is trolling or serious...I THINK OP is legitimately serious which makes it sooo much funnier.

I loved the bull sperm comment lol.

Sinaku5
04-12-2012, 05:20 PM
Do you? Where are your pecs, buddy? Jerking off got your arms some size, but it neglects all other muscle groups...

You got something to say about EVERYONE who is jacked...

What kinda bs can you throw out about PBateman's physique?

bboytommy
04-12-2012, 05:22 PM
Do you? Where are your pecs, buddy? Jerking off got your arms some size, but it neglects all other muscle groups...

hahaha. internet gangstahhh alert

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 05:32 PM
You got something to say about EVERYONE who is jacked...

What kinda bs can you throw out about PBateman's physique?

Omg! Steroids DO work!? I'm so excited, I want some!

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 05:35 PM
http://1stphorm.com/blog/i-am-trying-hard-to-gain-muscle-and-i-was-told-by-my-personal-trainer-that-if-i-shouldn%e2%80%99t-be-eating-6-meals-a-day-because-it-will-speed-up-my-metabolism-too-much-and-i-wont-be-able-to-gain-any/

Sinaku5
04-12-2012, 05:42 PM
Omg! Steroids DO work!? I'm so excited, I want some!

Lol I see where this is going...

If your jacked and dont eat every 2-3 hours with the highest grade quality of protein around then you must by logical deduction be on steroids (or you just deny the impressive aspect of someone's physique in general)

HOWEVER if you eat every 2-3 hours with the highest grade protein available then you are a reliable source.

Gotcha.

Sinaku5
04-12-2012, 05:44 PM
http://1stphorm.com/blog/i-am-trying-hard-to-gain-muscle-and-i-was-told-by-my-personal-trainer-that-if-i-shouldn%e2%80%99t-be-eating-6-meals-a-day-because-it-will-speed-up-my-metabolism-too-much-and-i-wont-be-able-to-gain-any/

Did you really just post that blog entry from a pharmaceutical website who sells supplements on here as "proof" to support your claim while everyone else here has been providing studies from highly credible sources?

...

Please tell me u didn't.

the0hulk87
04-12-2012, 05:49 PM
[/QUOTE] while everyone else here has been providing studies from highly credible sources?

...

[/QUOTE]

Please tell me you didnt! Lol foolio

Sinaku5
04-12-2012, 06:04 PM
while everyone else here has been providing studies from highly credible sources?

...

[/QUOTE]

Please tell me you didnt! Lol foolio[/QUOTE]

Is Pubmed not a credible source? Thats where many of the studies came from...

gymjunki3
04-12-2012, 06:19 PM
?

...

Please tell me u didn't.


http://www.dailyhaha.com/_pics/oh_no_you_didnt.jpg

K1ngRippa
04-12-2012, 06:22 PM
I'm outta here

LUL didn't happen

http://i41.tinypic.com/10htys0.gif

BBqChicken1
04-13-2012, 10:40 AM
Please OP, by all means continue refuting studies and explanations with the blog posts of your which are from a non-biased source, that does not, in any way, try and sell or promote the use of supplements, it's just a supplement website, I mean, why would they want to try and persuade us into buying supplements.