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View Full Version : Bad economy - is there any hope?



johnt12
09-02-2009, 08:42 PM
Everyone seems to say the economy runs in cycles and it will get better. With unemployment not improving (I know not an indicator of saying the economy will not get better soon, but not exactly a good sign) and our trillions of dollars in debt, what hope is there that it will get better? Manufacturing jobs will not come back and there seems to be no end in sight. Now I probably have a lot to learn, but Obama seems like hes just going to run our country down the ****ter even further. Can someone explain some optimism?

Melkor
09-02-2009, 08:46 PM
Everyone seems to say the economy runs in cycles and it will get better. With unemployment not improving (I know not an indicator of saying the economy will not get better soon, but not exactly a good sign) and our trillions of dollars in debt, what hope is there that it will get better? Manufacturing jobs will not come back and there seems to be no end in sight. Now I probably have a lot to learn, but Obama seems like hes just going to run our country down the ****ter even further. Can someone explain some optimism?

Green shoots brah

chapelthrill62
09-02-2009, 08:47 PM
There is HOPE!!! AND CHANGE!!!











































































































































yes we can...

Pay_Me
09-02-2009, 08:49 PM
Everyone seems to say the economy runs in cycles and it will get better. With unemployment not improving (I know not an indicator of saying the economy will not get better soon, but not exactly a good sign) and our trillions of dollars in debt, what hope is there that it will get better? Manufacturing jobs will not come back and there seems to be no end in sight. Now I probably have a lot to learn, but Obama seems like hes just going to run our country down the ****ter even further. Can someone explain some optimism?

Seems Fed thinks best way to achieve growth is to debase dollar. With China now investing in IMF bonds. It appears they are making a gesture towards us, even if $50 Billion is chump change right now.

reyalp
09-02-2009, 08:50 PM
The economy will do a 180 and begin growing in the complete opposite direction. You'll see.
GDP growth for this year will be flat but it will be double the average in 2010.









http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff244/ubercomments/birthday/animated/055.gif

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 08:59 PM
Everyone seems to say the economy runs in cycles and it will get better. With unemployment not improving (I know not an indicator of saying the economy will not get better soon, but not exactly a good sign) and our trillions of dollars in debt, what hope is there that it will get better? Manufacturing jobs will not come back and there seems to be no end in sight. Now I probably have a lot to learn, but Obama seems like hes just going to run our country down the ****ter even further. Can someone explain some optimism?

relax.

http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSTRE5693VZ20090710

Dirk Diggler
09-02-2009, 09:02 PM
My opinion is that you can't extinguish a fire by throwing gas on it. The various "stimulus" programs may delay the carnage but they aren't fixing the problems.

Pay_Me
09-02-2009, 09:11 PM
My opinion is that you can't extinguish a fire by throwing gas on it. The various "stimulus" programs may delay the carnage but they aren't fixing the problems.


The improvement in financial markets was due, in part, to support from various government programs, and market functioning might deteriorate as those programs wind down.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/fomcminutes20090812.htm

In other words, we've propped up market. Now as we begin to withdrawal...Good luck to you. Our Banking friends have completed their allocated raping & pillaging.

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE5810O320090902



By Steve Eder

NEW YORK (Reuters) - As shares of bailed-out banks bottomed out earlier this year, stock options were awarded to their top executives, setting them up for millions of dollars in profit as prices rebounded, according to a report released on Wednesday.

The top five executives at 10 financial institutions that took some of the biggest taxpayer bailouts have seen a combined increase in the value of their stock options of nearly $90 million, the report by the Washington-based Institute for Policy Studies said.

"Not only are these executives not hurting very much from the crisis, but they might get big windfalls because of the surge in the value of some of their shares," said Sarah Anderson, lead author of the report, "America's Bailout Barons," the 16th in an annual series on executive excess.

The report -- which highlights executive compensation at such firms as Goldman Sachs Group Inc, JPMorgan Chase & Co, Morgan Stanley, Bank of America Corp and Citigroup Inc -- comes at a time when Wall Street is facing criticism for failing to scale back outsized bonuses after borrowing billions from taxpayers amid last year's financial crisis. Goldman, JPMorgan and Morgan Stanley have paid back the money they borrowed, but Bank of America and Citigroup are still in the U.S. Treasury's program.

It's also the latest in a string of studies showing that despite tough talk by politicians, little has been done by regulators to rein in the bonus culture that many believe contributed to the near-collapse of the financial sector.

The report includes eight pages of legislative proposals to address executive pay, but concludes that officials have "not moved forward into law or regulation any measure that would actually deflate the executive pay bubble that has expanded so hugely over the last three decades."

"We see these little flurries of activities in Congress, where it looked like it was going to happen," Anderson said. "Then they would just peter out."

The report found that while executives continued to rake in tens of millions of dollars in compensation, 160,000 employees were laid off at the top 20 financial industry firms that received bailouts.

The CEOs of those 20 companies were paid, on average, 85 times more than the regulators who direct the Securities and Exchange Commission and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp, according to the report.

(Reporting by Steve Eder; editing by John Wallace)

JuanDenver
09-02-2009, 09:16 PM
Remember when the msm couldnt stop telling everyone that obama was an economic guru?


lolz

Vitalshok44
09-02-2009, 09:19 PM
relax.

http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSTRE5693VZ20090710

lol


8N1vyoXUrOo

johnt12
09-02-2009, 09:20 PM
your productivity growth as a nation has been falling for years, you may be able to maintain so status quo, but not to the heights you have been used to.

All manufacturing and labour type jobs americans have are now in China...

That's why I don't see how you can compare different economic cycles and how they can run there course. Again, not saying I know a lot, but more and more companies will go overseas losing out on all manufacturing.

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 09:22 PM
lol


8N1vyoXUrOo

ECRI >> Peter Schiff.

check both track records.

at first schiff said that there wont be a recovery, now hes saying it a fake recovery. lol

Peter Schiff has been wrong in the past, but the ECRI has not.

reyalp
09-02-2009, 09:26 PM
relax.

http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSTRE5693VZ20090710

Why was that thread you got owned in deleted?

Oh, and go ahead and substantiate this:


Peter Schiff has been wrong in the past, but the ECRI has not.

VTheKing
09-02-2009, 09:29 PM
All the money that Obama and the Congress poured down the economy's throat will likely bring it afloat in a few months (come on, you can't go wrong with 700 billion LOL)... although considering the deficit et all, the fall will be harder next time - I'm guessing the Democrats are hoping a new recession won't in until after 2012. :)

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 09:29 PM
Why was that thread you got owned in deleted?

i dont get owned, whatever thread im in i get the last word.

what was the topic?

edit: Peter Schiff has been wrong in the past, and the ECRI has not, what dont u understand?

reyalp
09-02-2009, 09:32 PM
i dont get owned, whatever thread im in i get the last word.

what was the topic?

You got owned, and didn't get the last word. It was also about economic recovery.
I posted a very large post showing continued (and some record-setting) YoY declines in sales tax receipts across the biggest states in the Union, as well as the biggest tax receipts drop in recent US history.

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 09:38 PM
You got owned, and didn't get the last word. It was also about economic recovery.
I posted a very large post showing continued (and some record-setting) YoY declines in sales tax receipts across the biggest states in the Union, as well as the biggest tax receipts drop in recent US history.

u must have me confused with another poster lol.

i have no idea what YoY declines are and I dont debate about the economy, check my post.

are u gonna google one of Peter Schiffs mis-predictions?

reyalp
09-02-2009, 09:40 PM
u must have me confused with another poster lol.

i have no idea what YoY declines are and I dont debate about the economy, check my post.

are u gonna google one of Peter Schiffs mis-predictions?

Nope, it was you.

You make a positive claim and want me to do all the legwork? Not gonna happen. I call BS.

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 09:45 PM
Nope, it was you.

You make a positive claim and want me to do all the legwork? Not gonna happen. I call BS.

lol watever u say

back to the topic.

In 2008 Peter Schiff was wrong about:

Wrong about hyperinflation
Wrong about the dollar
Wrong about commodities except for gold
Wrong about foreign currencies except for the Yen
Wrong about foreign equities
Wrong in timing
Wrong in risk management
Wrong in buy and hold thesis
Wrong on decoupling
Wrong on China
Wrong on US treasuries
Wrong on interest rates, both foreign and domestic

The ECRI, was right about....everything they said! haha

http://www.businesscycle.com/about/record/


ECRI>> Schiff

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 09:50 PM
-M0j4eL8K18

reyalp
09-02-2009, 09:55 PM
lol watever u say

back to the topic.

In 2008 Peter Schiff was wrong about:

Wrong about hyperinflation
Wrong about the dollar
Wrong about commodities except for gold
Wrong about foreign currencies except for the Yen
Wrong about foreign equities
Wrong in timing
Wrong in risk management
Wrong in buy and hold thesis
Wrong on decoupling
Wrong on China
Wrong on US treasuries
Wrong on interest rates, both foreign and domestic

The ECRI, was right about....everything they said! haha

http://www.businesscycle.com/about/record/


ECRI>> Schiff

from the site:
Global Growth has Begun to Slow, but a U.S. Recession Looks Less Likely:

:rolleyes:
yeah they were right

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 09:58 PM
from the site:
Global Growth has Begun to Slow, but a U.S. Recession Looks Less Likely:

:rolleyes:
yeah they were right

I like how you skipped down to 2006 completely ignoring their 2007 prediction a month before the recession actually started.

http://www.businesscycle.com/files/pdfs/about/record/071221EWU_OV0711USCO.pdf

here it is^^

dude just let it go lol

Vitalshok44
09-02-2009, 10:05 PM
ECRI >> Peter Schiff.

check both track records.

at first schiff said that there wont be a recovery, now hes saying it a fake recovery. lol

Peter Schiff has been wrong in the past, but the ECRI has not.

lol are you high?

No one said all those things were going to happen tomorrow,lol

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 10:11 PM
lol are you high?

No one said all those things were going to happen tomorrow,lol

whose said anything about tommorow?

Im comparing track records

He was wrong about things, the ECRI was right about everything.

He's saying one thing, the ECRI is saying another.

hmmm, i think im gonna trust the guys who never made a wrong prediction! dont u think? :D

reyalp
09-02-2009, 10:11 PM
I like how you skipped down to 2006 completely ignoring their 2007 prediction a month before the recession actually started.

http://www.businesscycle.com/files/pdfs/about/record/071221EWU_OV0711USCO.pdf

here it is^^

dude just let it go lol

Let what go? You're the one fellating ECRI. I really don't care about Schiff.
ECRI predicts something a month before it is reported to officially happen, whooptee ****in doo. ~Q~ on photochopz called the market crash back in 2006 just fine.

Kane_89
09-02-2009, 10:14 PM
Let what go? You're the one fellating ECRI. I really don't care about Schiff.
ECRI predicts something a month before it is reported to officially happen, whooptee ****in doo. ~Q~ on photochopz called the market crash back in 2006 just fine.

ok. :)

NorthernRaZ
09-02-2009, 10:55 PM
We are headed towards a depression that will probably last millions of years. GDP will decrease by 7% each quarter. In addition, government debt will reach $999 trillion by 2012. Unemployment will reach somewhere between 95%, and we will be regressing back to the stone age for the unforeseeable feature. By 2010, China will have all our manufacturing and service jobs. Plan for the Dow, NASDAQ, and S&P to go into the negatives by the winter. There is no hope, there is no chance of success, abandon any future plans. Save yourself.


This is what the R/P wants to hear, right?

NorthernRaZ
09-03-2009, 12:48 AM
your productivity growth as a nation has been falling for years, you may be able to maintain so status quo, but not to the heights you have been used to.

All manufacturing and labour type jobs americans have are now in China...

wat?

Productivity grows at fastest pace in 6 years
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32655208/ns/business-stocks_and_economy/

dizi24
09-03-2009, 01:41 AM
Wrong about hyperinflation
Wrong about the dollar
Wrong about commodities except for gold
Wrong about foreign currencies except for the Yen
Wrong about foreign equities
Wrong in timing
Wrong in risk management
Wrong in buy and hold thesis
Wrong on decoupling
Wrong on China
Wrong on US treasuries
Wrong on interest rates, both foreign and domestic


Just a thought on this.

There are many things on this list which he is far from being wrong about. High inflation rates, weak dollar, US treasuries (which I'm not even sure how you can say he's wrong about), decoupling did not happen because all of the money that was printed has essentially been sitting in bank reserves.

Once there is positive economic growth (actual job increases, YoY and WoW growth, GDP growth w/o government driving it) and banks start lending and there is a greater demand for dollars, that is when the questions about the dollar become legitimate. No one is going to feel the symptoms of massive monetary increase while no one is spending.

The fact is real interst rates are at about 0 right now and we're still experiencing growth in the savings rate. That should tell you all you need to know about Americans feelings of the future finacial picture.