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View Full Version : Another One on Gates.



hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:05 PM
Ok, so after having read

http://www.amnation.com/vfr/Police%20report%20on%20Gates%20arrest.PDF

This is my conclusion.

I don't know if it was a race issue, maybe, maybe not. Gates does sound like he has an ax to grind, and maybe he deserves to. I don't care.

HOWEVER, the real issue is, why in Gods name should the police be able to arrest him for yelling at them in his own house? That's the issue. They should have apologized for the inconvenience and just walked off, no matter what he called them. I hear time and time again how we need new bonds for jails, for police cruisers, to hire more police but then this happens. How much time, energy and effort would have be wasted (even if Gates couldn't make this a national story) on this misunderstanding?

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:08 PM
If someone wants to argue impropriety, it should be about the law that allows a cop to arrest someone for this type of thing. However, the cop was clearly within the limits of the law when he arrested Gates. Whether the law itself is right is a whole different issue, but the law is there.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:10 PM
If someone wants to argue impropriety, it should be about the law that allows a cop to arrest someone for this type of thing. However, the cop was clearly within the limits of the law when he arrested Gates. Whether the law itself is right is a whole different issue, but the law is there.

Really? It's the law you're not allowed to call police officers mean names in your house?

Can I see that?

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:11 PM
Really? It's the law you're not allowed to call police officers mean names in your house?

Can I see that?

http://tinyurl.com/npuht9

JBjunior
07-23-2009, 10:12 PM
He followed the cop out onto the porch, it then became a public issue.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:12 PM
http://tinyurl.com/npuht9

Haha. I think it's pretty obvious to ANY objective observer that the officer in question could easily, and should have, just walked off. It would have solved all the problems, but nooooo. He had to get all penis-measuring-contest with the guy.

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:14 PM
Haha. I think it's pretty obvious to ANY objective observer that the officer in question could easily, and should have, just walked off. It would have solved all the problems, but nooooo. He had to get all penis-measuring-contest with the guy.

That might well be true, but he was within the law to arrest the guy. I'm not saying the law is right, but the law is there.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:15 PM
He followed the cop out onto the porch, it then became a public issue.

Well, I hardly call a the man's own porch a 'public issue.' But again, the officer could have just walked away.

"Thank you for your time sir, have a good evening.'

BOOM, ALL DONE. This is what should be the norm.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:16 PM
That might well be true, but he was within the law to arrest the guy. I'm not saying the law is right, but the law is there.

Yea, it might be that he was within the letter of the law. That still doesn't mean he acted appropriately. I think a lot of people are taking sides just because they ruffle at Gate's making a race thing.

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:16 PM
Well, I hardly call a the man's own porch a 'public issue.' But again, the officer could have just walked away.

"Thank you for your time sir, have a good evening.'

BOOM, ALL DONE. This is what should be the norm.

The reason it becomes a public issue is that it creates a public disturbance. It's designed to keep people from inciting riots and that type of thing. I don't think there was much worry about the few old white folks rioting about Gates being hauled off, but you never know. :p

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:19 PM
The reason it becomes a public issue is that it creates a public disturbance. It's designed to keep people from inciting riots and that type of thing. I don't think there was much worry about the few old white folks rioting about Gates being hauled off, but you never know. :p

I find it highly ironic that you (a guy who always argues for limiting government power) is totally OK with the police being able to arrest an old dude on his porch for yelling at them.

Anyway, while I disagree with you often, I do respect your posts. And I can respect where you are coming from on this one. I just wanted to add my two cents on the issue. I'll be curious to see if anyone else thinks the problem was just police over-reaction.

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:24 PM
I find it highly ironic that you (a guy who always argues for limiting government power) is totally OK with the police being able to arrest an old dude on his porch for yelling at them.

That's what you got from my post? I'm not anti-law anarchist type libertarian. The rule of law is needed, and the justice system is one of the few powers that government should hold. I don't know if that law is a good one or not, I haven't looked into it. I would guess that it is probably an overstepping of police power.

It's just like when people cry about being arrested for smoking pot though. The law is on the books, if you break it all you can do is cry. If you want to change the law more power to you.

*edit* I feel the same with your position. I might not agree, but I can understand it. Really, if this was just a question of Gates rationally saying "I should not have been arrested for yelling at a cop" I probably would have supported him. I just hate the "racism!" card, and the fact that Gates had to lie to make a point that wasn't worth making. He wasn't just yelling at the cop, he was accusing him of racism and attacking him personally, which is career ending and damaging to the officer, who is clearly NOT a racist. Without that aspect to the case, the whole thing kind of just... doesn't even matter.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:27 PM
That's what you got from my post? I'm not anti-law anarchist type libertarian. The rule of law is needed, and the justice system is one of the few powers that government should hold. I don't know if that law is a good one or not, I haven't looked into it. I would guess that it is probably an overstepping of police power.

It's just like when people cry about being arrested for smoking pot though. The law is on the books, if you break it all you can do is cry. If you want to change the law more power to you.

No, I don't see you as an anarchist, but I DO see you speaking out against new taxes and all the other panoply of government power. It's just, in this case, you're actively supporting broad, ill-defined and far reaching police power.

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:32 PM
No, I don't see you as an anarchist, but I DO see you speaking out against new taxes and all the other panoply of government power. It's just, in this case, you're actively supporting broad, ill-defined and far reaching police power.

I edited my previous post, and kind of addressed that already. I don't necessarily support the law, but the cop's job isn't to decide what law is good or bad, it's to enforce those laws on the books. I don't know enough about that specific law to say if it a good law or not, but I have the feeling it probably isn't. That's my opinion on the law itself.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:33 PM
Read your additions/edits and I think we can find relatively common ground.

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:39 PM
Read your additions/edits and I think we can find relatively common ground.

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/funny-pictures-kitten-hug.jpg

(no homo)

:D

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:43 PM
http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/funny-pictures-kitten-hug.jpg

(no homo)

:D

Hey, given my location the no homo tag is warranted. Not that I find anything wrong with it ... but I do see funny stuff.

Melkor
07-23-2009, 10:44 PM
Hey, given my location the no homo tag is warranted. Not that I find anything wrong with it ... but I do see funny stuff.

lol didn't notice that before. I bet you've seen some crazy stuff out there.

hooked4life
07-23-2009, 10:47 PM
lol didn't notice that before. I bet you've seen some crazy stuff out there.

Yea, I'm right downtown too next to the courthouse and stuff. WhoooAaa!!