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ChronicGuy
08-27-2008, 08:19 PM
www.ObamaTaxCut.com

I just found this site, it's pretty cool, it lets you know how much of a tax cut you would get.

53% of Americans think Barack Obama will raise their taxes, which means at least 52% of Americans don't know anything about his tax policies. In fact, 95% of Americans will see a tax cut from Obama, and 80% of Americans will get a bigger cut than they'd get from McCain. Calculate your Obama Tax Cut at ObamaTaxCut.com!


In my case:
Your Obama Tax Cut is: $480.98
John McCain would tax you $456.11 MORE than Barack Obama.

Cramerica
08-27-2008, 08:21 PM
LOL...my taxes will be raised by roughly 28% after he rapes my capital gains and allows the previous tax cut to expire.

At least I live in Florida where I pay less taxes than most states.

Not to mention I do a lot of consulting for corporations and I'd like to keep that work if possible. So I'd appreciate it if they didn't get raped on taxes and had some cash flow to employ me.

ChronicGuy
08-27-2008, 08:24 PM
LOL...my taxes will be raised by roughly 28% after he rapes my capital gains and allows the previous tax cut to expire.

At least I live in Florida where I pay less taxes than most states.

Not to mention I do a lot of consulting for corporations and I'd like to keep that work if possible. So I'd appreciate it if they didn't get raped on taxes and had some cash flow to employ me.

Really? Damn!

I only make $25k a year right now cause I am still in college and just work a basic job to pay the bills.

Cramerica
08-27-2008, 08:25 PM
Really? Damn!

I only make $25k a year right now cause I am still in college and just work a basic job to pay the bills.

I live on a relatively small portion of what I actually make, so a lot of my money goes into retirement funds and other stock options.

adoniscomplex
08-27-2008, 08:27 PM
LOL...my taxes will be raised by roughly 28% after he rapes my capital gains and allows the previous tax cut to expire.

At least I live in Florida where I pay less taxes than most states.

Not to mention I do a lot of consulting for corporations and I'd like to keep that work if possible. So I'd appreciate it if they didn't get raped on taxes and had some cash flow to employ me.

you make over 250k a year?

ChronicGuy
08-27-2008, 08:29 PM
Just for kicks, I entered some numbers for if I ever have kids, and my expected starting salary when I get my degree, and I acaully get a $1000 tax cut, not too bad.

I put in 2 kids, married two earners, and 75k a year.

ELMOstl
08-27-2008, 08:31 PM
Your Obama Tax Cut is: $757.40
John McCain would tax you $743.66 MORE than Barack Obama.

wow...oh what i could do with 757.40


and my parents would be getting

Your Obama Tax Cut is: $980.92
John McCain would tax you $179.33 MORE than Barack Obama

=D

lol and 500k pluss...Your Obama Tax Cut is: You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut lol

Cramerica
08-27-2008, 08:32 PM
you make over 250k a year?

Like I said, I live on a fraction of what I make...most of it is put in stock options and various funds and markets.

You also have to consider Obama's pan to allow the expiration of the previous tax cuts I've thoroughly enjoyed.

But no, I do not make 250K. I don't have to to have my finances affected by his plans. A lot of people don't.

HitItHard
08-27-2008, 08:33 PM
just because he says it doesn't mean it will happen the way he lays it out for you



lol at anyone who blindly believes anything a politician says, EVER.


unless its ron paul

Norse
08-27-2008, 08:43 PM
Wow a random internet website said Obama will save me on my taxes!!!! I WILL NOW VOTE FOR THE COMMUNIST BECAUSE I AM A GREEDY IDIOT WHO WANTS TO TAKE THE MONEY OF MORE SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE THAN ME! I HOPE TO BRING EVERYONE DOWN TO MY LOWER-MIDDLE CLASS LEVEL BECAUSE I AM SO ENVIOUS OF THE RICH!!!! WHOOO CLASS WARFARE!!!!

Morons.

ChronicGuy
08-27-2008, 08:47 PM
Wow a random internet website said Obama will save me on my taxes!!!! I WILL NOW VOTE FOR THE COMMUNIST BECAUSE I AM A GREEDY IDIOT WHO WANTS TO TAKE THE MONEY OF MORE SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE THAN ME! I HOPE TO BRING EVERYONE DOWN TO MY LOWER-MIDDLE CLASS LEVEL BECAUSE I AM SO ENVIOUS OF THE RICH!!!! WHOOO CLASS WARFARE!!!!

Morons.

The website uses Obama's tax plan to calculate the numbers, moron.

leafs43
08-27-2008, 08:56 PM
How will the taxes be paid when you are unemployed?

rea99
08-27-2008, 09:02 PM
lol @ the huge gap between 200k-500k, not to mention the fact that this does not inc. capital gains taxes which will be raised across the board regardless of income.

ElMariachi
08-27-2008, 09:08 PM
This thread is chock full of some naive, confused, and downright gullible people. The two-party system thrives because of people like you.


Nothing like a bunch of suckers debating a tax cut that will never happen.

NorthMass
08-27-2008, 09:43 PM
Lolz @ people actually believing Obama will cut your taxes.

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 09:44 PM
"You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut "


:rolleyes:

SilverSpork
08-27-2008, 09:45 PM
"You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut "


:rolleyes:

Or it will tell you the tax cut, but won't tell you what Mccain will do........but if you go real low it will tell you your loss from Mccain. Such brilliant marketing lol!

de_barathrum
08-27-2008, 09:47 PM
"You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut "


:rolleyes:

thats what it should say for everyone.

de_barathrum
08-27-2008, 09:47 PM
The website uses Obama's tax plan to calculate the numbers, moron.

apparently the whole college thing isnt really working out for you

SilverSpork
08-27-2008, 09:48 PM
Also why does are there no 4 and 5 options for number of dependents?

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 09:49 PM
I like how it says McCain would tax people making $10,000-$15,000 when under the eeeevill Bu$h tax cuts they don't pay a cent.


Also why does are there no 4 and 5 options for number of dependents?

Probably because those people would not recieve a mythical cut.

indian23
08-27-2008, 09:51 PM
http://no2nuclear.googlepages.com/ObamaBarack.jpg/ObamaBarack-full;init:.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/0d/Joe_Biden%2C_official_photo_portrait_2-cropped.jpg/423px-Joe_Biden%2C_official_photo_portrait_2-cropped.jpg

de_barathrum
08-27-2008, 09:52 PM
Also why does are there no 4 and 5 options for number of dependents?

because nobody in the US actually has 4 or 5 kids.

SilverSpork
08-27-2008, 09:53 PM
http://no2nuclear.googlepages.com/ObamaBarack.jpg/ObamaBarack-full;init:.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/0d/Joe_Biden%2C_official_photo_portrait_2-cropped.jpg/423px-Joe_Biden%2C_official_photo_portrait_2-cropped.jpg

The saviors of the universe and quantifiers of dark matter. All praises and moneys to them.

SilverSpork
08-27-2008, 09:54 PM
because nobody in the US actually has 4 or 5 kids.

yeah 4 or 5 is so tacky.

Organichu
08-27-2008, 10:14 PM
You know for all the people who mockingly say "oh yes Messiah Obama!!!", mocking the bromides of hope and change... many people did the exact same thing with RP, essentially e-sucking his cock, e-slobbering all over his small government phallus and then e-jerking him to climax.

Almost none of you complained back then, though.

de_barathrum
08-27-2008, 10:22 PM
You know for all the people who mockingly say "oh yes Messiah Obama!!!", mocking the bromides of hope and change... many people did the exact same thing with RP, essentially e-sucking his cock, e-slobbering all over his small government phallus and then e-jerking him to climax.

Almost none of you complained back then, though.

except ron paul actually had a ****ing plan and you could see how he would attempt to impliment policy. and you knew exactly where he stood on his policies.

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 10:22 PM
because nobody in the US actually has 4 or 5 kids.

But they have 6? The options it gives are the following:

- 1
- 2
- 3
- 6

Organichu
08-27-2008, 10:25 PM
except ron paul actually had a ****ing plan and you could see how he would attempt to impliment policy. and you knew exactly where he stood on his policies.

Obama is very similar in this sense. Disagreeing with Obama's stances does not mean that they have not been declared.

Ben76
08-27-2008, 10:26 PM
You know for all the people who mockingly say "oh yes Messiah Obama!!!", mocking the bromides of hope and change... many people did the exact same thing with RP, essentially e-sucking his cock, e-slobbering all over his small government phallus and then e-jerking him to climax.

Almost none of you complained back then, though.

because scaling back the government makes sense, while cutting everyone's taxes while recklessly spending more money doesn't really seem to solve our economic crisis. lol @ people thinking raping business owners and investors with taxes will help. Your income taxes will be the same with obama as with mccain when you don't have a job.

devire1
08-27-2008, 10:27 PM
Obama is very similar in this sense. Disagreeing with Obama's stances does not mean that they have not been declared.

Ron Paul's voting record actually does support his declared stances, as far as I know.

I don't think that one can say the same thing about Obama, however.

Edit: Atleast on certain issues, such as these proposed tax cuts.

Organichu
08-27-2008, 10:28 PM
because scaling back the government makes sense, while cutting everyone's taxes while recklessly spending more money doesn't really seem to solve our economic crisis. lol @ people thinking raping business owners and investors with taxes will help. Your income taxes will be the same with obama as with mccain when you don't have a job.

It really doesn't matter whether his proposed solutions are the best. What matters is that people constantly mock Obama for having 'devoted' fans and so call him the 'Messiah' and the 'Savior' and say 'all praise', etc.- like Obama fans are the only ones who really love their candidate and won't listen to anything to the contrary.

Many of the people who are doing this said nothing when the exact same situation occurred but revolved around RP. That is the point.

de_barathrum
08-27-2008, 10:32 PM
It really doesn't matter whether his proposed solutions are the best. What matters is that people constantly mock Obama for having 'devoted' fans and so call him the 'Messiah' and the 'Savior' and say 'all praise', etc.- like Obama fans are the only ones who really love their candidate and won't listen to anything to the contrary.

Many of the people who are doing this said nothing when the exact same situation occurred but revolved around RP. That is the point.

its not the exact same situation though. ron pauls platform was based off of change, but with substance to back it up. obamas is based off of hope and change with more hope and change to delude stupid people into thinking he should be president.

Mr. Man Milk
08-27-2008, 10:32 PM
that's funny because I just found this site, it's pretty cool, it lets you know how much of a tax cut you would get.

53% of Americans think Barack Obama will raise their taxes, which means at least 52% of Americans don't know anything about his tax policies. In fact, 95% of Americans will see a tax cut from Obama, and 80% of Americans will get a bigger cut than they'd get from McCain. Calculate your Obama Tax Cut at ObamaTaxCut.com!


In my case:
Your Obama Tax Cut is: $480.98
John McCain would tax you $456.11 MORE than Barack Obama.

devire1
08-27-2008, 10:35 PM
LOL...my taxes will be raised by roughly 28% after he rapes my capital gains and allows the previous tax cut to expire.

At least I live in Florida where I pay less taxes than most states.

Not to mention I do a lot of consulting for corporations and I'd like to keep that work if possible. So I'd appreciate it if they didn't get raped on taxes and had some cash flow to employ me.

Capital gains tax increases would hurt me as well. How much does Obama want to increase it?

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 10:42 PM
Capital gains tax increases would hurt me as well. How much does Obama want to increase it?

He wants to essentially double it, so the rate would be 28%

And it really doesn't help when you have the Soviet Republic of Californistan proposing adding "wealth" and "exit" taxes which would effectively double your tax rate, under the current structure. Once Obama rolls back the 01/03 Tax Cuts and the Reagan Tax Cuts you'd have a 75%+ tax rate

devire1
08-27-2008, 10:46 PM
He wants to essentially double it, so the rate would be 28%

Damn. I remember hearing that the last time the capital gains tax was increased it actually resulted in LOWER tax revenue from the capitial gains tax. Is this true.

Luckily, I don't have to pay it now since I trade with my fathers retirement plan account, but that will change soon probably.

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 10:47 PM
Damn. I remember hearing that the last time the capital gains tax was increased it actually resulted in LOWER tax revenue from the capitial gains tax. Is this true.

Luckily, I don't have to pay it now since I trade with my fathers retirement plan account, but that will change soon probably.

Every time it was raised it lowered revenue, every time it was lowered it raised revenue.

If the tax structure is not appealing to investors they simply won't cash out their stocks.

Spetsnazos
08-27-2008, 10:48 PM
just because he says it doesn't mean it will happen the way he lays it out for you



lol at anyone who blindly believes anything a politician says, EVER.


unless its ron paul

ron paul said he was going to win the nomination

= fail

MisterChase
08-27-2008, 10:50 PM
http://alchemytoday.com/obamataxcut/taxsummary.png

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 10:54 PM
http://alchemytoday.com/obamataxcut/taxsummary.png

So the people that pay either no taxes or the least amount will get even more back and the people who we rely on to pay 3/4 of our tax revenue will be stuck with an even heavier burden.

Wow strong wealth redistrobution :rolleyes:

Gmoney23
08-27-2008, 10:57 PM
How will the taxes be paid when you are unemployed?

Do you expect the unemployment rate to increase under Obama?

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 11:00 PM
Do you expect the unemployment rate to increase under Obama?

I expect the corporate tax rate to increase, because he said it will. Even Charlie Rangel the Chairman of the Ways and Means Committe said it's a bad idea and that Obama won't listen to him that it's not only a bad idea but that they should be lowered.

This is very simple:

Explain how a corporation that is getting taxed more will be able to create more jobs?

TheLasher
08-27-2008, 11:03 PM
Wow a random internet website said Obama will save me on my taxes!!!! I WILL NOW VOTE FOR THE COMMUNIST BECAUSE I AM A GREEDY IDIOT WHO WANTS TO TAKE THE MONEY OF MORE SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE THAN ME! I HOPE TO BRING EVERYONE DOWN TO MY LOWER-MIDDLE CLASS LEVEL BECAUSE I AM SO ENVIOUS OF THE RICH!!!! WHOOO CLASS WARFARE!!!!

Morons.

Politicans always come through with their promises

randomhero97
08-27-2008, 11:10 PM
Read this:

http://www.american.com/archive/2008/august-08-08/the-folly-of-obama2019s-tax-plan


Edit: Link fixed

Gmoney23
08-27-2008, 11:12 PM
I expect the corporate tax rate to increase, because he said it will. Even Charlie Rangel the Chairman of the Ways and Means Committe said it's a bad idea and that Obama won't listen to him that it's not only a bad idea but that they should be lowered.

This is very simple:

Explain how a corporation that is getting taxed more will be able to create more jobs?

Well Bush didnt do much taxing of huge corporations and they still managed to cut millions of jobs. Yet Clinton taxed corporations more and the unemployment rate decreased under him.

Morbid_Mind
08-27-2008, 11:19 PM
Well Bush didnt do much taxing of huge corporations and they still managed to cut millions of jobs. Yet Clinton taxed corporations more and the unemployment rate decreased under him.

Because of the advent of the internet there was a massive job creation during the Clinton administration. Neither he nor any of his policies had anything to do with that.

The corporate tax rates around the globe have been dropping during Bush's administration, which is why jobs are leaving.

You still are yet to answer the question...

devire1
08-27-2008, 11:23 PM
Explain how a corporation that is getting taxed more will be able to create more jobs?

Hmmm... Maybe it will create more government jobs... lol. :)

Gmoney23
08-28-2008, 12:22 AM
Because of the advent of the internet there was a massive job creation during the Clinton administration. Neither he nor any of his policies had anything to do with that.

The corporate tax rates around the globe have been dropping during Bush's administration, which is why jobs are leaving.

You still are yet to answer the question...

I disagree. I read a stat a few months ago that those employed with computer based jobs have increased every single year through the 90's and the 00's (Bush era). The computer industry is still creating jobs.

Id say most people who were unemployed during the Reagan/Bush years and became employed during the Clinton years were usually not the ones grabbing the internet/computer based jobs.

There were also many corporations leaving the USA under Clinton for cheaper labor overseas, so I dont buy that corporate tax rate excuse for Bush.

FIVE OAKES
08-28-2008, 12:51 AM
This is very simple:

Explain how a corporation that is getting taxed more will be able to create more jobs?

...not to mention competition with international businesses who already pay far less corporate taxes.

Morbid_Mind
08-28-2008, 12:56 AM
I disagree. I read a stat a few months ago that those employed with computer based jobs have increased every single year through the 90's and the 00's (Bush era). The computer industry is still creating jobs.

Source?

Bush was never in office during the 90s BTW

The computer industry may still be creating jobs, but not nearly at the scale of during the dot-com boom.

Look at the number of computer, internet and technology companies that came into existance during the 90s. How do you think they got their product out? Wishes and dreams? It was from employing people.

You do not see that kind of job creation now because there aren't any companies sprouting up like there were then because it's an old market.


Id say most people who were unemployed during the Reagan/Bush years and became employed during the Clinton years were usually not the ones grabbing the internet/computer based jobs.

Try again

"People choose the reality that -- that flatters their partisanship. For example, in the Reagan years, unemployment went from 13 percent to 5 percent. If you asked Democrats, at the end of that, did unemployment go up or down under Reagan, 60 percent said it went up. Republicans said down."

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/political_wrap/jan-june06/bo_3-17.html


There were also many corporations leaving the USA under Clinton for cheaper labor overseas, so I dont buy that corporate tax rate excuse for Bush.

You may not buy it but it's the truth, nearly every G7 country cut their tax rates from 1996 to 2006, China significantly lowered theirs, Germany lowered theirs by almost half.

Duckenheimer
08-28-2008, 02:01 AM
For example, in the Reagan years, unemployment went from 13 percent to 5 percent.

13%?

http://www.bls.gov/cps/prev_yrs.htm

Annual average unemployment rate, civilian labor force 16 years and over (percent)

1980 7.1
1981 7.6
1982 9.7
1983 9.6
1984 7.5
1985 7.2
1986 7.0
1987 6.2
1988 5.5

Morbid_Mind
08-28-2008, 02:10 AM
13%?


Yes, I see that too, it must have been a typo. My appologies.

nutsy54
08-28-2008, 03:31 AM
www.ObamaTaxCut.com

I just found this site, it's pretty cool, it lets you know how much of a tax cut you would get.(a) Not only is he a politician who openly buys your vote with other people's money, but now you know exactly how much the bribe is. Great "change" :rolleyes:

(b) Does that site also include a calculator for determining your odds of getting fired, after investment dollars dry up and/or business expenses skyrocket?

(c) How about a calculator for the deficit and debt after his massive new spending plans gets piled onto a reduced tax base, where all the money magically comes from the "evil rich" who are already paying wildly more than everyone else.

SpiderSense
08-28-2008, 03:49 AM
Wow a random internet website said Obama will save me on my taxes!!!! I WILL NOW VOTE FOR THE COMMUNIST BECAUSE I AM A GREEDY IDIOT WHO WANTS TO TAKE THE MONEY OF MORE SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE THAN ME! I HOPE TO BRING EVERYONE DOWN TO MY LOWER-MIDDLE CLASS LEVEL BECAUSE I AM SO ENVIOUS OF THE RICH!!!! WHOOO CLASS WARFARE!!!!

Uhh yeah, those same guys have no problem taking our money so eye for an eye.

FIVE OAKES
08-28-2008, 04:47 AM
Uhh yeah, those same guys have no problem taking our money so eye for an eye.

Rich people forcefully take your money? You have no choice in the matter?

FranchiseKid
08-28-2008, 05:47 AM
www.ObamaTaxCut.com

I just found this site, it's pretty cool, it lets you know how much of a tax cut you would get.

53% of Americans think Barack Obama will raise their taxes, which means at least 52% of Americans don't know anything about his tax policies. In fact, 95% of Americans will see a tax cut from Obama, and 80% of Americans will get a bigger cut than they'd get from McCain. Calculate your Obama Tax Cut at ObamaTaxCut.com!


In my case:
Your Obama Tax Cut is: $480.98
John McCain would tax you $456.11 MORE than Barack Obama.

100% of the media conducted polls fail to represent the median American 60% of the time (yes, take off on Anchorman line). Seriously though, nearly every American I have spoken with, and I will make a blanket statement here, almost 100% of the people that read this post, have no idea how to properly analyze tax policies and what a tax "cut" actually means, nor, and more importantly, do they understand how to actually measure what the true individual tax on Americans are each year.

badbart
08-28-2008, 06:02 AM
That calculator is BS, it won't work for me. It will not show the increase I pay on capital gains. Which is a larger percentage of my income.

I love the answer if you make too much money: Your Obama Tax Cut is: You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut

badbart
08-28-2008, 06:03 AM
100% of the media conducted polls fail to represent the median American 60% of the time (yes, take off on Anchorman line). Seriously though, nearly every American I have spoken with, and I will make a blanket statement here, almost 100% of the people that read this post, have no idea how to properly analyze tax policies and what a tax "cut" actually means, nor, and more importantly, do they understand how to actually measure what the true individual tax on Americans are each year.

If they did the average American would be outraged.

devire1
08-28-2008, 06:05 AM
That calculator is BS, it won't work for me. It will not show the increase I pay on capital gains. Which is a larger percentage of my income.

Are you a day trader, by chance?

badbart
08-28-2008, 06:07 AM
Are you a day trader, by chance?

No, investor

ElMariachi
08-28-2008, 06:58 AM
It really doesn't matter whether his proposed solutions are the best. What matters is that people constantly mock Obama for having 'devoted' fans and so call him the 'Messiah' and the 'Savior' and say 'all praise', etc.- like Obama fans are the only ones who really love their candidate and won't listen to anything to the contrary.

Many of the people who are doing this said nothing when the exact same situation occurred but revolved around RP. That is the point.




Because his whole candidacy IS based off the Cult of Personality. The vast majority of his supporters can't tell you a damn thing as far as details policywise other than soundbites they've heard on the news.........most of the time people simply state that they like the guy because of A. His personality B. His ability to give speeches or C. His charisma.

There are plenty of people who are great orators or have great charisma, that doesn't necessarily make them qualified to be president.

HoosierBoy
08-28-2008, 07:30 AM
"You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut."

I'm surprised it didn't add: "You rich bastard. How dare you succeed financially when so many others are struggling. You will burn in Hell and Barack Obama doesn't need your vote. Hope and change."

FIVE OAKES
08-28-2008, 07:39 AM
"You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut."

I'm surprised it didn't add: "You rich bastard. How dare you succeed financially when so many others are struggling. You will burn in Hell and Barack Obama doesn't need your vote. Hope and change."

Or just automatically divert you to his donations page.

SaviorSix
08-28-2008, 07:39 AM
Woohoo, magic money out of thin air!! yeaaaaaa Obama go go go

MISTERDUDE
08-28-2008, 07:47 AM
Wow a random internet website said Obama will save me on my taxes!!!! I WILL NOW VOTE FOR THE COMMUNIST BECAUSE I AM A GREEDY IDIOT WHO WANTS TO TAKE THE MONEY OF MORE SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE THAN ME! I HOPE TO BRING EVERYONE DOWN TO MY LOWER-MIDDLE CLASS LEVEL BECAUSE I AM SO ENVIOUS OF THE RICH!!!! WHOOO CLASS WARFARE!!!!

Morons.



The first thing I thought of when I saw this thread was:
[set to music of Hallelujah]
PROPAGANDA. PROPAGANDA. PROPAGANDA, PROPAGANDA, PRO-PO-GAN-DAH!!!!


I bet that site was put up by an independent party though, in all seriousness. AND I WAS THE ONE WHO KILLED MANBEARPIG, NOT Al Gore, just for the record :D

cawagner01
08-28-2008, 07:49 AM
Does anyone use the snopes web site to deciminate what is good and bad information? Here is what they said about Obama and McCain's Tax cuts. I have not had time to read through all of it, but it is interesting to say the least.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/taxes.asp

Clean
08-28-2008, 07:52 AM
Or it will tell you the tax cut, but won't tell you what Mccain will do........but if you go real low it will tell you your loss from Mccain. Such brilliant marketing lol!

No, its true. McCain will not give as much back to the Middle Class, hence the Bush Tax Cuts for the wealthy which are supposed to "trickle down" to the Middle Class, hence "Trickle Down Economics."

9fbxpMw4mco

JUSA
08-28-2008, 09:40 AM
You know for all the people who mockingly say "oh yes Messiah Obama!!!", mocking the bromides of hope and change... many people did the exact same thing with RP, essentially e-sucking his cock, e-slobbering all over his small government phallus and then e-jerking him to climax.

Almost none of you complained back then, though. The thing of it was that Ron Paul's record backed up what he said. Obama is all smoke and mirrors.

Lion of Zion
08-28-2008, 09:47 AM
"Your Obama Tax Cut is: You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut "


**** you Obama.

grup910
08-28-2008, 09:50 AM
www.ObamaTaxCut.com

I just found this site, it's pretty cool, it lets you know how much of a tax cut you would get.

53% of Americans think Barack Obama will raise their taxes, which means at least 52% of Americans don't know anything about his tax policies. In fact, 95% of Americans will see a tax cut from Obama, and 80% of Americans will get a bigger cut than they'd get from McCain. Calculate your Obama Tax Cut at ObamaTaxCut.com!


In my case:
Your Obama Tax Cut is: $480.98
John McCain would tax you $456.11 MORE than Barack Obama.

excellent link. this won't help with the haterz, though. they will hate and believe the right wing propaganda no matter what the facts actually are.

grup910
08-28-2008, 09:53 AM
"Your Obama Tax Cut is: You will probably not get an Obama Tax Cut "


**** you Obama.

so you're either a 90 year old guy who has less than $15,000 in annual income, or you make over $500,000.

right. :p

Chowboy
08-28-2008, 09:54 AM
Does anyone use the snopes web site to deciminate what is good and bad information? Here is what they said about Obama and McCain's Tax cuts. I have not had time to read through all of it, but it is interesting to say the least.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/taxes.asp

Thanks for the link!

Everyone should go read this before they get all exicted about some bogus give away. It is an obvious assault on the middle class.

Lion of Zion
08-28-2008, 09:57 AM
so you're either a 90 year old guy who has less than $15,000 in annual income, or you make over $500,000.

right. :p

Single, 22, 113,000$ in taxable income last return.

HoosierBoy
08-28-2008, 10:00 AM
so you're either a 90 year old guy who has less than $15,000 in annual income, or you make over $500,000.

right. :p

27 years old with an adjusted gross income of $121K last year from all sources. Obama would rather I just died and gave all my money to the government.

grup910
08-28-2008, 10:06 AM
Single, 22, 113,000$ in taxable income last return.

so you're not working hard enough. why should we reward failure and punish success? if you made $200,000 you'd get a tax cut of $2,775.62. I can't see blaming Obama for your own shortcomings. ;)

Lion of Zion
08-28-2008, 10:08 AM
so you're not working hard enough. why should we reward failure and punish success? if you made $200,000 you'd get a tax cut of $2,775.62. I can't see blaming Obama for your own shortcomings. ;)

Seriously, **** the middle class.

Morbid_Mind
08-28-2008, 10:33 AM
No, its true. McCain will not give as much back to the Middle Class, hence the Bush Tax Cuts for the wealthy which are supposed to "trickle down" to the Middle Class, hence "Trickle Down Economics."

9fbxpMw4mco

:rolleyes: Are you trying this **** again?


Under the Bush tax cut plan, 92 million taxpayers would receive, on average, a tax cut of $1,083 in 2003. Taxpayers in the lowest tax brackets would receive the largest percentage reduction in their taxes.



# 3 million moderate-income families would see their income tax burden eliminated entirely.

Example:
A family of four with an income of $40,000 would see their federal income taxes fall from $1,178 to $45 under the President's plan.



More than 40 percent of people who receive dividends make under $50,000 a year - and three-fourths make less than $100,000 a year.

Example:
A married couple, both aged 65, with income of $40,000 (of which $2,000 is dividends and $15,000 is Social Security benefits) would see their taxes decline under the President's growth package by $380 (from $930 to $550) in tax year 2003 ? a decline of 41 percent.

http://usgovinfo.about.com/cs/taxes/a/bushtaxcuts.htm

Since the eeeevilll Bu$h tax cuts came about, the rich are paying more than ever

http://www.dailynews-record.com/photos/chart1wsj_6014.jpg


As The Wall Street Journal reported early this week, ?the top 1 percent of taxpayers, those who earn above $388,806, paid 40 percent of all income taxes in 2006, the highest share in at least 40 years. The top 10 percent in income, those earning more than $108,904, paid 71 percent.?

http://www.dailynews-record.com/opinion_details.php?AID=30073&CHID=36
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121659695380368965.html?mod=special_page_campaig n2008_mostpop

http://www.american.com/graphics/2007/november/RIch%20Pay%20More%20Under%20Bush%20Tax%20Cut.jpg

http://www.american.com/archive/2007/november-december-magazine-contents/guess-who-really-pays-the-taxes

SpiderSense
08-28-2008, 12:03 PM
Rich people forcefully take your money? You have no choice in the matter?

Essentially. How about wen jobs relocate overseas or Mexico? How about my friends dad, who was 2 years from retirement, company closed down and he doesn't see a dime of his pension because owner took the money and ran. How many people has automation put out of a job? More people than it has created jobs for, I can guarantee that.

As I said in another thread which conveniently wasn't replied to why should we care about rich guys. The lose money and they'd rather just fire a few workers who's money is for his family living hand to mouth, so their yachts can still be 100' instead of 95'.

And my heart should bleed for them?

But I guess everything was just hunky dory when Bush was giving out all these kickbacks that lead to no new jobs.

Spetsnazos
08-28-2008, 02:26 PM
27 years old with an adjusted gross income of $121K last year from all sources. Obama would rather I just died and gave all my money to the government.

did you finally find a girlfriend or are you still a closet homo?(serious)

HitItHard
08-28-2008, 02:28 PM
did you finally find a girlfriend or are you still a closet homo?(serious)

you still a dumbass troll with a gay avatar and a stupid name from a stupid country?

Spetsnazos
08-28-2008, 02:37 PM
you still a dumbass troll with a gay avatar and a stupid name from a stupid country?

Ron Paul lost

Organichu
08-28-2008, 02:43 PM
Ron Paul lost

I'm not gonna' lie... I lol'd.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 03:28 PM
You know for all the people who mockingly say "oh yes Messiah Obama!!!", mocking the bromides of hope and change... many people did the exact same thing with RP, essentially e-sucking his cock, e-slobbering all over his small government phallus and then e-jerking him to climax.

Almost none of you complained back then, though.

Wow.

Ron Paul never spouted empty rhetoric, thats why Obama zealots get mocked with those statements. It doesn't have so much to do with Obama's message, which is actually a good one, but more with the fact that its an empty message, backed by nothing.

The average Ron Paul supporter can discuss issues. Obama zealots give responses like 'well he's not Bu$h' and 'what we need is hope...and CHANGE!'

Yes, they are somewhat similar in how motivated their supporters are. But the similarity ends there, and the argument with Obama's legion isn't their level of motivation, but the reasoning behind that motivation.

HitItHard
08-28-2008, 03:37 PM
Ron Paul lost

russia sucks...

Organichu
08-28-2008, 03:40 PM
Stizzel: you guys are creating straw men, plain and simple.

jackamo2887
08-28-2008, 03:40 PM
Ron Paul lost

The Soviet Union did as well.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 03:43 PM
Stizzel: you guys are creating straw men, plain and simple.

Please elaborate.

HitItHard
08-28-2008, 03:44 PM
Please elaborate.

x2....

Organichu
08-28-2008, 03:45 PM
Please elaborate.

"Paul supporters know what they're talking about, Obama supporters don't, they all just rely on 'hope' and 'change'".

The millions of serious Obama fans know exactly what he stands for. I hear constantly that people can't discuss Obama intelligently but literally every person I know who is excited about Obama knows about his stances.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 04:07 PM
"Paul supporters know what they're talking about, Obama supporters don't, they all just rely on 'hope' and 'change'".

The millions of serious Obama fans know exactly what he stands for. I hear constantly that people can't discuss Obama intelligently but literally every person I know who is excited about Obama knows about his stances.

I'd love to meet one. (serious)

ChronicGuy
08-28-2008, 04:08 PM
Woah Woah Woah, why are people negging me for this thread? I never said I supported him, this is for informational purposes. ****ers.

Organichu
08-28-2008, 04:16 PM
I'd love to meet one. (serious)

I doubt you're really looking for them. Have you ever gone to a Democratic party meeting? Are you a member of any forums (certainly not this one) who don't despise anything other than the free market?

I'll help you out, go check the penny-arcade forums. There are dozens- hundreds, probably- of folks over there who love Obama and know as much as bout him as you guys know about Paul.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 04:18 PM
I doubt you're really looking for them. Have you ever gone to a Democratic party meeting? Are you a member of any forums (certainly not this one) who don't despise anything other than the free market?

I'll help you out, go check the penny-arcade forums. There are dozens- hundreds, probably- of folks over there who love Obama and know as much as bout him as you guys know about Paul.

Check out the somethingawful.com forums, good luck surviving those political threads without being a hard core socialist.

Organichu
08-28-2008, 04:25 PM
Check out the somethingawful.com forums, good luck surviving those political threads without being a hard core socialist.

I don't understand, why are you telling me to check out the SA forums? Are you saying that's a good example of people who like Obama without knowing what he stands for?

I'm not denying those people exist. I'm saying that the others exist in great numbers, too, and if you're looking for them you can find them easily.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 04:33 PM
I don't understand, why are you telling me to check out the SA forums? Are you saying that's a good example of people who like Obama without knowing what he stands for?

I'm not denying those people exist. I'm saying that the others exist in great numbers, too, and if you're looking for them you can find them easily.

No, I'm just saying thats another forum I go to, and that one is full of pro Obama people. They're real Obama supporters, not just partisan Democrats. And I see the same crap there that I see here, just with less opposition.

Yeah, they can identify Obama's policies. But they can't discuss them any better than anyone here on this forum.

I'm not saying ALL Obama supporters are clueless. There are some intelligent socialists here and I don't mind discussing things with them. But the majority of Obama's support, in my experience, comes from people who literally have no idea or concept of what they're talking about beyond 'Bush is a Republican so Republicans are evil, time for change!'

KhanPaulsen
08-28-2008, 04:37 PM
Most Obama supporters have a working idea of what his policies are, but they have no clue at all how those ideas would actually work in real life. They just sound good to them, and that's good enough as far as they're concerned.

Pay reality no mind. :)

Organichu
08-28-2008, 04:42 PM
No, I'm just saying thats another forum I go to, and that one is full of pro Obama people. They're real Obama supporters, not just partisan Democrats. And I see the same crap there that I see here, just with less opposition.

Yeah, they can identify Obama's policies. But they can't discuss them any better than anyone here on this forum.

I'm not saying ALL Obama supporters are clueless. There are some intelligent socialists here and I don't mind discussing things with them. But the majority of Obama's support, in my experience, comes from people who literally have no idea or concept of what they're talking about beyond 'Bush is a Republican so Republicans are evil, time for change!'


Most Obama supporters have a working idea of what his policies are, but they have no clue at all how those ideas would actually work in real life. They just sound good to them, and that's good enough as far as they're concerned.

Pay reality no mind. :)

I guess I hang with a different crowd than you people.

Those haven't been my experiences at all.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 04:44 PM
I guess I hang with a different crowd than you people.

Those haven't been my experiences at all.

There are some interesting videos on youtube of people going to Obama supporters with cameras and asking them what they think of Obama and his plans. Most of them don't actually know where Obama stands on issues and the ones that do don't have any idea how his ideas are just supposed to work.

The answer you hear over and over again is 'we need change in Washington'. Thats been my experience as well.

KhanPaulsen
08-28-2008, 04:48 PM
I guess I hang with a different crowd than you people.

Those haven't been my experiences at all.

Well, since you seem to be among the Obama supporters that apparently know how his policies will actually work, maybe you can enlighten me.

How in the hell is his tax plan going to help the middle class when the extra taxation of the rich is going to result in jobs being lost?

After that, we'll go over the joke known as his energy plan.

Organichu
08-28-2008, 04:53 PM
Well, since you seem to be among the Obama supporters that apparently know how his policies will actually work, maybe you can enlighten me.

How in the hell is his tax plan going to help the middle class when the extra taxation of the rich is going to result in jobs being lost?

After that, we'll go over the joke known as his energy plan.

Sorry, not interested in slitting my wrist in a pool full of sharks.

Maybe closer to the election when more Obama fans come out of the woodwork and it's not me against fifty five thousand people, I'll consider it. As is, I'm not going to argue why I'm voting Obama in a forum full of soft and hard Libertarians- which is ironic considering that I place myself as a Libertarian, rather than a democrat.

What you propose is a much heavier and more time consuming topic which I am not interested in at the moment.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 04:57 PM
Sorry, not interested in slitting my wrist in a pool full of sharks.

Maybe closer to the election when more Obama fans come out of the woodwork and it's not me against fifty five thousand people, I'll consider it. As is, I'm not going to argue why I'm voting Obama in a forum full of soft and hard Libertarians- which is ironic considering that I place myself as a Libertarian, rather than a democrat.

What you propose is a much heavier and more time consuming topic which I am not interested in at the moment.

I figured it was going to come to this. Don't take that crap about Obama being a messiah personally. I hate to collectively mock a group because there are always people like you and your friends that are the exception rather than the rule, but you have to agree that it can be a little frustrating to talk to someone that responds to very simple questions with a blank stare and the word 'change', and then act like you're either an idiot or a racist if you don't play along. Its disturbing.

Try talking to an average, run of the mill Obama supporter and get them to discuss in detail how Obama is going to bring his plans around, and you'll see what I mean.

I didn't start out with a bias against Obama or his supporters, but I think people like Grup have me a little jaded.

Sorry about that.

KhanPaulsen
08-28-2008, 04:58 PM
As is, I'm not going to argue why I'm voting Obama in a forum full of soft and hard Libertarians- which is ironic considering that I place myself as a Libertarian, rather than a democrat.


Ridiculous.

Organichu
08-28-2008, 05:07 PM
I figured it was going to come to this. Don't take that crap about Obama being a messiah personally. I hate to collectively mock a group because there are always people like you and your friends that are the exception rather than the rule, but you have to agree that it can be a little frustrating to talk to someone that responds to very simple questions with a blank stare and the word 'change', and then act like you're either an idiot or a racist if you don't play along. Its disturbing.

Try talking to an average, run of the mill Obama supporter and get them to discuss in detail how Obama is going to bring his plans around, and you'll see what I mean.

I didn't start out with a bias against Obama or his supporters, but I think people like Grup have me a little jaded.

Sorry about that.

No problem.

There are always people like that. No offense to you, since I know you're a 9/11 Truther, but I think a good example is all of the associated **** that comes with it. I don't think you're into the Lizardmen and all, but back when I was big for RP I used to hate discussing it (the issues in general) because there were other RP (and Constitutional Party) fans who ran off with all of these incredibly absurd ideas. It sucks to feel like you can't even proudly proclaim your beliefs without them being associated with talking Lizardmen and all sorts of psyops this and Jews that.


Ridiculous.

Your face is ridiculous and I like it.

Stizzel
08-28-2008, 05:23 PM
No problem.

There are always people like that. No offense to you, since I know you're a 9/11 Truther, but I think a good example is all of the associated **** that comes with it. I don't think you're into the Lizardmen and all, but back when I was big for RP I used to hate discussing it (the issues in general) because there were other RP (and Constitutional Party) fans who ran off with all of these incredibly absurd ideas. It sucks to feel like you can't even proudly proclaim your beliefs without them being associated with talking Lizardmen and all sorts of psyops this and Jews that.



Once you break that mental barrier and become accept that there is something more out there than what you've been told, its easy to get swept up into speculation. That happens to a lot of people. Personally I like to stick to what can be proven because there's enough out in the open that there's no reason to speculate, in my opinion.

Anyway, thats probably what was going on with those people.

'Truthers' get a lot of hate from the Ron Paul camp too. We're basically blamed for Ron Paul not being president, which is pretty silly.

KhanPaulsen
08-28-2008, 05:31 PM
Your face is ridiculous and I like it.

ROFL!

Touche, well done. I respect thick-skinned people. :)

When I can rep you again, I'm repping you for that.