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View Full Version : what is the term for opposite of a libertarian?



dumac
03-05-2008, 07:46 PM
as in someone who wants a lot of government control and "big government"

sword_
03-05-2008, 07:48 PM
as in someone who wants a lot of government control and "big government"

socialist or communist

Trans_Isomer
03-05-2008, 07:48 PM
as in someone who wants a lot of government control and "big government"

neo-con

nonAtlas
03-05-2008, 07:48 PM
http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/7/U/j/dem_party_seal.jpg
http://la.indymedia.org/uploads/2003/02/liberals_20copy.jpgrqikiq.jpg
http://www.americans-working-together.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/liberals.jpg

;)

Beatitude
03-05-2008, 07:48 PM
Leninism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leninism

makshim
03-05-2008, 07:50 PM
Authoritarian.

Beatitude
03-05-2008, 07:50 PM
http://la.indymedia.org/uploads/2003/02/liberals_20copy.jpgrqikiq.jpg



rofl that is disturbing

nonAtlas
03-05-2008, 07:52 PM
Authoritarian.

...=statist=Big Government leftist=the Demonrat Party

MantisShrimp
03-05-2008, 07:54 PM
Authoritarian.

i subscribe to this model too

http://politicalcompass.org/images/composers.gif

leafs43
03-05-2008, 07:56 PM
i subscribe to this model too

http://politicalcompass.org/images/composers.gif

Damn Dvorak.


Riding the fence like a mofo!

frankenstein
03-05-2008, 07:56 PM
as in someone who wants a lot of government control and "big government"

both communism and fascism in their own ways are the polar opposite of libertarianism.

leafs43
03-05-2008, 07:58 PM
both communism and fascism in their own ways are the polar opposite of libertarianism.

And both are describable as authoritarian.

nonAtlas
03-05-2008, 08:03 PM
And both are describable as authoritarian.

...and as the same phenomenon. Fascism is a left-wing view, and Mussolini wanted to move to Vermont prior to WW2 because crazy far-left nuttiness is and was so at home there.

:eek:

LetsJustTalk
03-05-2008, 08:19 PM
http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/7/U/j/dem_party_seal.jpg
http://la.indymedia.org/uploads/2003/02/liberals_20copy.jpgrqikiq.jpg
http://www.americans-working-together.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/liberals.jpg

;)
haha that is funny

leafs43
03-05-2008, 08:32 PM
...and as the same phenomenon. Fascism is a left-wing view, and Mussolini wanted to move to Vermont prior to WW2 because crazy far-left nuttiness is and was so at home there.

:eek:

I thought facism was the actual most right wing extreme view where socialism becomes the most left wing extreme view.

For instance you put an american, a nazi and a commie all in one room and give the nazi a gun with 1 bullet who does he shoot? The commie because of opposite ends of the political spectrum.

Either way it matters very little. Even Lenin admitted for socialism to work authoritarian rule has to come into place. So both systems just end up having government take control of the individual.

-_-
03-05-2008, 08:42 PM
I thought facism was the actual most right wing extreme view where socialism becomes the most left wing extreme view.

For instance you put an american, a nazi and a commie all in one room and give the nazi a gun with 1 bullet who does he shoot? The commie because of opposite ends of the political spectrum.

Either way it matters very little. Even Lenin admitted for socialism to work authoritarian rule has to come into place. So both systems just end up having government take control of the individual.
you thought wrong. fascism and socialism are far from opposite, and the nazis are absolutely not opposed to all socialism.
Cuba for example is probably one of the most socialist and one of the biggest fascist states in the world (if not the #1 most socialist).

911medic
03-05-2008, 08:43 PM
...=statist=Big Government leftist=the Demonrat Party

Agree. reps.

frankenstein
03-05-2008, 08:43 PM
I thought facism was the actual most right wing extreme view where socialism becomes the most left wing extreme view.

For instance you put an american, a nazi and a commie all in one room and give the nazi a gun with 1 bullet who does he shoot? The commie because of opposite ends of the political spectrum.

Either way it matters very little. Even Lenin admitted for socialism to work authoritarian rule has to come into place. So both systems just end up having government take control of the individual.

That's a common misconception. Fascism is a far left economic system entailed in it. Fascism is essentially an economic system that allows for private ownership, but has governmental control. Here's a quick blurb from Wikipedia:

"A few see echoes of fascist economic policies in the modern welfare state;[3] in the expanding imperial power of U.S. based transnational capitalism;[4],in neo-corporatist relationships between the state and private enterprise.[5] and in the economic policies of Social Democracy"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_fascism

People call Hillary Clinton's current health care plan socialist when in reality by definition it is absolutely fascist from top to bottom, through and through. So is the 'nation building' that's going on in Iraq.

nonAtlas
03-05-2008, 08:43 PM
I thought facism was the actual most right wing extreme view where socialism becomes the most left wing extreme view.

For instance you put an american, a nazi and a commie all in one room and give the nazi a gun with 1 bullet who does he shoot? The commie because of opposite ends of the political spectrum.

Either way it matters very little. Even Lenin admitted for socialism to work authoritarian rule has to come into place. So both systems just end up having government take control of the individual.

I think you are right in your first paragraph. But the nazis were no fascists; "national socialism" really is all the description we need, taken literally. Commies and fascists meet at a point on that circle of the political spectrum. The nazi would shoot the American (assuming the pre-far-left condition of this country around WW2) because both the nazi and his leftist brother the communist hate freedom...which our country represents.

:)

leafs43
03-05-2008, 08:44 PM
you thought wrong. fascism and socialism are far from opposite, and the nazis are absolutely not opposed to all socialism.
Cuba for example is probably one of the most socialist and one of the biggest fascist states in the world (if not the #1 most socialist).

majr edit:


You got me all f*cked up and I corrected myself by google.


Left:socialism and communism

Right: nationalism and Fascism

fasicm and communism are economic systems versus poitical systems therefore you can have a socialist facist such as your cuba example.

-_-
03-05-2008, 08:58 PM
majr edit:


You got me all f*cked up and I corrected myself by google.


Left:socialism and communism

Right: nationalism and Fascism

fasicm and communism are economic systems versus poitical systems therefore you can have a socialist facist such as your cuba example.
fascism is more than an economic system, and keep in mind that "the right" and "the left" are vague concepts with no clear definitions. we typically call leftists those who seek social equality while right-wing politicians are the more conservative ones who tend to value freedom.

so, one could be on the extreme right without being that much of a nationalist. a person who prones absolute freedom with minimal govt. intervention would be considered a right-wing politician but probably not a nationalist.

if you look at it the other way... is a nationalist necessarily on the right? nah I also dont think that's true

leafs43
03-05-2008, 09:20 PM
fascism is more than an economic system, and keep in mind that "the right" and "the left" are vague concepts with no clear definitions.

Thats where the famous "a pussy is only an inch away from being an *******" comes from. :D