the horrors of the biden bill

[Patrick Arnold]

read this article. it is scary. for real roiders and prohormone aficionados the biden bill means the end of everything. ARe people aware of this yet??



Recent steroid furor prompts two senators to propose crackdown
By Dick Patrick
USA TODAY

The furor over the budding THG steroid scandal has prompted lawmakers to
take action.

Last week Sens. Joseph Biden (D-Del.) and Orrin Hatch (R-Utah) introduced
the Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2003, which would ban THG, the recently
discovered designer steroid tetrahydrogestrinone, as well as derivatives of
another controversial substance, androstenedione.

Andro was popularized by the 1998 admission by baseball star Mark McGwire
that he used the substance, which can be purchased over-the-counter but is
banned by the Olympics, the NFL and the NCAA though not MLB.

''Despite some of the misgivings I have, this law on balance is an enormous
step forward in the fight against steroids,'' says Gary Wadler, a physician
who has written extensively about drugs in sport. ''This has potential for
major, major impact assuming the act is not eviscerated in the legislative
process.

''In a global view, andro is a bigger story than THG because of the numbers,
the sheer ubiquity of it. The fact is a kid can currently get andro legally.
They don't have to go to the back door of a chemist.''

In Wadler's view, the proposed legislation's biggest flaw is that
androstenedione is not banned directly unless there is a special ruling by
the Food and Drug Administration. The bill does include all known andro
derivatives as controlled substances. ''The lack of clarification on andro
is a concern,'' Wadler says. ''The caveat on andro doesn't make sense.''

Wadler's other concern: DHEA, like andro an over-the-counter substance that
breaks down into testosterone in the body, remains on the bill's exempt list
though it's banned by sports bodies including the Olympics. ''Biologically
and chemically, this is inconsistent,'' he says. ''It's considerably
disingenuous, if you think about it.

''This is part of the political horse trading. They wanted to leave
(supplement makers) with something on the shelf. DHEA is marketed to the
older, aging population to make up for natural decline. Andro is marketed
toward the younger, more athletic population.''

There are important provisions in the bill, Wadler says, including a less
stringent definition of a steroid. No longer does a substance have to be
proved to promote muscle growth to be classified as an anabolic steroid.

Moreover, there are recommendations to review and toughen sentencing
recommendations for violations of the steroid act.

The combination of a less stringent definition of a steroid and the promise
of stiffer sentencing is likely to produce more prosecutions.

Wadler calls the current steroid law, which includes significantly less
harsh penalties for steroids than ******* or heroin, a case ''of unintended
consequences.''

''The U.S. attorney's office basically said that we can't take our limited
resources and go after steroids for a short-term jail sentence,'' he said.
''It costs too much, and we don't get enough penalty time. Now there will be
motivation to prosecute these cases. That could be the sleeper part of this
legislation.''

The U.S. attorney's office in San Francisco is holding grand jury
proceedings regarding THG, which the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency says has been
provided to track athletes by Victor Conte, who founded BALCO Laboratories
and provided supplements and dietary advice to many high-profile athletes.

Five track athletes tied to Conte have tested positive for THG, recently
discovered by testers after they were given a sample by an anonymous
tipster. The latest to be named, by the Chicago Tribune, is U.S. hammer
thrower John McEwen, who joins middle-distance star Regina Jacobs, shot
putter Kevin Toth and British sprinter Dwain Chambers as ''A'' positive. If
confirmation tests also are positive and the athlete loses an appeal, the
penalty is a two-year ban from competition. Conte denies he is the source of
the THG.

In a related matter, the Los Angeles Times named sprinter Calvin Harrison, a
Conte client, as positive for modafinil, a stimulant that carries no ban for
a first offense.

The San Francisco grand jury is expected to focus on Conte's finances, with
the IRS leading the probe. ''If the proposed law was on the books,'' Wadler
says, ''it could be pursued as a steroid case, not just an IRS case.''

[bananapunk]

There are important provisions in the bill, Wadler says, including a less
stringent definition of a steroid. No longer does a substance have to be
proved to promote muscle growth to be classified as an anabolic steroid.

Sheessh, talk about broadening the definition. So how long does everyone think ph will be on the shelves?

[size]

If or when you decide to write or call a Senator or Congressman, make your statement articulate and to the point. Keep out anger and make it clear that you are a law abiding citizen who will soon be demonized as a criminal if these legislations pass. Also remind them that if they vote YES for this you will give your vote to another candidate when election time comes around.

[Jedi Master]

Im not sure, but I could easily say by the beginning of January all ph's will be banned. It looked like we had a chance, but the whole THG scandal is bringing more unwanted attention to ph's.

I would recommend stocking up no later than the mid december, of course I dont know for sure, but its better to be safe than sorry.

[bananapunk]

Originally posted by Jedi Master
Im not sure, but I could easily say by the beginning of January all ph's will be banned. It looked like we had a chance, but the whole THG scandal is bringing more unwanted attention to ph's.

I would recommend stocking up no later than the mid december, of course I dont know for sure, but its better to be safe than sorry.

LOL, so I guess "Dear Santa, I've been a good kid all year. For Christmas please hook me up with a year's worth of Andro products because the bad bad men are taking them away." will be on many a wishlist next month.

[size]

Originally posted by Jedi Master
the whole THG scandal is bringing more unwanted attention to ph's.

The sports industry and olympic committes should NOT dictate the laws that apply to the average citizen.

I urge you all to write and complain. When the outrage becomes great enough and votes are threatened, some officials who are undecided may vote no. This message board has over 30,000 members. If everyone who used these products stood up and made a statement things may take a different turn. However, it seems more people are just willing to accept the outcome before it has even arrived.

Make your voice heard: http://mygov.governmentguide.com/myg...ials/congress/

Enter your zip and compose a letter.

[sicosico]

every time i visit the congress wbsite i find many letters for the congressmen from people that want to stop the bill , but it is already too late , so we might need a lawyer to challenge this ! this might work if we saw the people introducing the bill , lol !

[ThaPeoplesChamp]

Originally posted by size
However, it seems more people are just willing to accept the outcome before it has even arrived.

Some people will only fight the fights they know they can win.
We need to fight the fights that need fighting. And this one needs fighting. I am doing my part, holler if you are doing yours!

[dito]

Originally posted by size
The sports industry and olympic committes should NOT dictate the laws that apply to the average citizen.

I urge you all to write and complain. When the outrage becomes great enough and votes are threatened, some officials who are undecided may vote no. This message board has over 30,000 members. If everyone who used these products stood up and made a statement things may take a different turn. However, it seems more people are just willing to accept the outcome before it has even arrived.

Im going to write congress now. I had mentioned to Pat about getting the Men's magazines to do an article but he said that they wanted money for an article. Maybe if enough of us pester them they will.

[milk dud]

the scariest thing about this bill is that the people who will be going to jail is the average joe. when a athlete gets busted on steroids he gets suspended blasted by the media. in 3 months no one cares hes forgiven he doesnt go to jail . average joe gets arrested

[petefox]

I sent yet another letter.. I've been sending them emails, snail-mail, and phone calls since this all started..

Here's my letter, so what I lied in the "Illicit anabolics" part, I just started..

Good Day!

I happen to be an employee of a large corporation in the nutritional supplement business. I feel the unfair treatment on all dietary supplements is un-ethical, unfounded, and quite foolish if thought out.. Understandable, many tend to come to my store looking for the "magic pill" to lose weight, or gain muscle.. I'm a competitive bodybuilder who doesn't use prohormones or illicit anabolics, so I understand both sides.. I feel that educating them, other than pawning off the newest fad, will help.. We need more education on these products, simply because many will abuse these products, and blame will be on the companies who manufacture them.. The companies do have health disclaimers on their products, hopefully to sway those with medical issue to not use the product, but we are "free" to do so if need be.. This bill will end that freedom, and possibly my employment in a field I hold dear to me.. I may be one insignificant person writing this, but I do with emotion, and pride in hopes that the right thing will be done.. That right thing should be to aloow me to continue reaching the 40+ customers on a daily basis who need to know how these products work, and to keep them from doing something dangerous with these products.. Centuries have passed, many herbal products have been used with no known fatalities.. I only try to reach those who may go too far, and we no longer need statistics.. I urge you to not vote on this bill, many jobs held by your voters will depend on this..

Cheesy, no?

[pu12en12g]

Originally posted by size
Make your voice heard: http://mygov.governmentguide.com/myg...ials/congress/

Enter your zip and compose a letter.

DONE !

Thanks for the link !

[sicosico]

USFA should post some ads in the friendly magazines and publications to push people to write and they should try to to people on every message board for bb , and a lawyer might help , actually if you use a lawyer to challenge it the people will support it from the media!

[size]

Originally posted by sicosico
USFA should post some ads in the friendly magazines and publications to push people to write and they should try to to people on every message board for bb , and a lawyer might help , actually if you use a lawyer to challenge it the people will support it from the media!

There are many supporters from the supplement industry for this cause, and there have been articles in magazines such as Flex. However, it can't hurt for each person who stops by this forum who is of voting age to respond. It only take a few minutes and since you are already online why not take that extra time.

R.Collins is a lawyer who has been VERY helpful for this cause.

[NO MERCY]

Originally posted by petefox
I sent yet another letter.. I've been sending them emails, snail-mail, and phone calls since this all started..

Here's my letter, so what I lied in the "Illicit anabolics" part, I just started..



Cheesy, no?

good sht Pete

[size]

^

[Sldgehmr]

what everyone also needs to understand is the moment they start banning andro under no specifics, what is keeping them from banning any other supplement. If they wanted to they could say that protein shakes cause muscle growth and there for should be considered drug like. This isnt just about andro and Phs, it is about all supplements. can you imagine having to go to your Dr. to get a RX for and MRP. Once you give them an inch they will want a mile. SO EVERYONE should be sending them emails, not just phs users.

D P S, 1 f ast 400, N et rition, BB.com
everytime someone orders any suppelment, you should have a program automatically send an email to the congressman in their state. you have to enter a credit card number, which means there is a valid address, how hard could it be. so it is sent evertime someone orders something. cant be too hard. that would be an insane amount of signatures to congress.

[Patrick Arnold]

Originally posted by ThaPeoplesChamp
Some people will only fight the fights they know they can win.
We need to fight the fights that need fighting. And this one needs fighting. I am doing my part, holler if you are doing yours!

It is improbably that the bill can be stopped, but it may be able to be modified. I would like to see at least 4-AD spared and also I would like to see the increased sentencing terms for steroid offenders abolished

Good lord, giving steroid users and sellers the same kind of punishments as those that involve in pot and coke? What is going on here?

[Patrick Arnold]

Originally posted by Sldgehmr
what everyone also needs to understand is the moment they start banning andro under no specifics, what is keeping them from banning any other supplement. If they wanted to they could say that protein shakes cause muscle growth and there for should be considered drug like. This isnt just about andro and Phs, it is about all supplements. can you imagine having to go to your Dr. to get a RX for and MRP. Once you give them an inch they will want a mile. SO EVERYONE should be sending them emails, not just phs users.

creatine is next. The main message that the anti-andro people are using is that kids are under pressure to use prohormones to stay competitive. When prohormones are gone then they are goiing to say that kids are under pressure to use creatine to stay competitive. Couple that with misinformation about creatine being dangerous and causing people to drop dead during practice and you will see a move by the same folks to control creatine. the road will be paved by the andro bill so it won't be too tough

[Cam75]

This is kind of O/T, but here goes.

If/when PH's are banned, do you think 6 oxo will be banned as well.

Im about to stock up on some PH's, and I dont want to have to purchase all the 6 oxo I would need as well at this time. But if the concensus is that 6 oxo would be banned as well, I might have to.

What does everyone think?

[Patrick Arnold]

Originally posted by Cam75
This is kind of O/T, but here goes.

If/when PH's are banned, do you think 6 oxo will be banned as well.

Im about to stock up on some PH's, and I dont want to have to purchase all the 6 oxo I would need as well at this time. But if the concensus is that 6 oxo would be banned as well, I might have to.

What does everyone think?

I really hope its not. 6-OXO is not a prohormone or an anabolic steroid. Those bastards don't care about technicalities though so you never know

[NPursuit]

Originally posted by Cam75
This is kind of O/T, but here goes.

If/when PH's are banned, do you think 6 oxo will be banned as well.

Im about to stock up on some PH's, and I dont want to have to purchase all the 6 oxo I would need as well at this time. But if the concensus is that 6 oxo would be banned as well, I might have to.

What does everyone think?

Feel free to stock up but even if the ban goes through Nolvadex and Clomid would still be available for research purposes.

[Kledz]

realistically when should we all start worrying and begin stocking up? and as for banning creatine.... that would be both terrible and absurd

[NPursuit]

Originally posted by Kledz
I'll be 21 in a few months. and EVENTUALLY someday(a year or two) I want to try a cycle of PHs. so realistically when should we all start worrying and begin stocking up? and as for banning creatine.... that would be both terrible and absurd

If they ban creatine than I think we should all spend our time stocking up on weapons because it's going to get ugly around here.

[dito]

Originally posted by NPursuit
If they ban creatine than I think we should all spend our time stocking up on weapons because it's going to get ugly around here.

I agree to that.

[Sldgehmr]

of course they will try to ban 6-oxo, as well a 7 keto dhea (no anabolic activity), and anything else they deem in that realm. everyone has to remember there would be A LOT of money to be made by drugs companies if you have to pay for a RX for 4ad. Technically they could perscribe it for low T levels in men just like you could with regulart T replacement. the more people who email, call and fax is the more people they have to listen to. It take up a lot of time out of the day if the congressmans phone is ringing off the hook.

I dont see why there isnt a way for evertime someone signs up for or buys something that is related to BB that a email and or fax is automatically sent. i have no idea how many people buy a product from Mike, but if 100 people bought something from him everyday, that is an extra 100 emails everyday that senators would have to see.

[NPursuit]

Good point Sldge.

I'm not sure if anyone has ever brought this up but lately I have been thinking that some regulation would be OK. The only regulation I am speaking of is quality and purity checks to make sure the consumers are getting good supps. The outright banning of supplements though goes against our constitutional rights and when the goverment isn't working right it's time to start a new one.

[Patrick Arnold]

Originally posted by Sldgehmr
of course they will try to ban 6-oxo, as well a 7 keto dhea (no anabolic activity), and anything else they deem in that realm. everyone has to remember there would be A LOT of money to be made by drugs companies if you have to pay for a RX for 4ad.

No offense, but let me point out the silliness of this statement. I own the patent for 4-AD. If there was a motivation to have it be prescription only then I would be the one behind its ban! It will never be prescription only however because for me to get it approved by the FDA would require millions of dollars, and even then it would be slim that it would be approved. Slim is probably optimistic

Same with 7-keto DHEA. Humanetics owns the patent. They in fact started off with the intentions of gettting it approved as drug and went through the preliminary phase I studies. They had to make some money though so they were forced to sell it as a supplement while waiting for the approval process to be complete. If indeed it does get approved as a drug someday then they may withdraw it from the supplement market and sell it only as a drug. Until then however their companies existence depends on its continued sale as a supplement. Thats where all their income comes from. If its banned then humanetics will cease to exist, and they will probably have to sell the rights to 7-keto to someone else. I dunno who would want to buy it though, considering it will then be a CIII controlled substance.

Bottom line is this bill is NOT motivated by pharmaceutical industry interests at all. It is motivated primarily by sports governing bodies and their tyrannical drug testing organizations - that and to a small extent certain medical industry groups such as Blue Cross / Blue Shield

[size]

Originally posted by Patrick Arnold
Bottom line is this bill is NOT motivated by pharmaceutical industry interests at all. It is motivated primarily by sports governing bodies and their tyrannical drug testing organizations -

This is where the pressure is coming from.

Do not let the Sports Industry dictate the laws applied to citizens of this country.

Think about it.
Sports star tests positive for drug he is suspended. Not a big deal when you make $250k to $1million which are common salaries for pro athletes.
Average Joe, who makes $40k a year, gets caught with a drug he spends time in jail and his life is screwed.

Obviously, I am implying sports enhancing drugs. So does it make sense to pass such legislation when its major impact will be felt on the average joe who is concerned about living healthy?

[weltweitefurcht]

Ok, i guess its easy for me to say, and i might not know what i'm talkin about but here goes.

Ok, if prohormones are banned, do you people actually think everyone is going to say, " o well I dont agree with it being banned, but since its banned I guess I'm gonna stop taking prohormones or steroids"

no they arent, infact if people believe strongly enough that Prohormones shouldnt be banned, they will go and get them illegally. (not all, some might be deterred by the fear of illegal activity)

and then people might say, well since i'm doin somethin illegal, i might as well go the whole 9 yards, and get steroids.
I mean steroids are illegal now, but look at that whole forum dedicated to them, i actually think this is gonna make things worse, for both parties.

(how come cigarrettes and drinkin alcohol arent banned???, kids are smoking, kids are drinking alcohol, how come it isnt banned then??? Lung cancer, liver problems, drunk driving...no cigs and drinks are meant for responsible adults, not kids) haha.

It goes the same for Prohormones as well. Research should be done, measures to prevent kids from getting prohormones.

I just wish the main politicians backin this ban, could answer those questions. They won't, because they know the answer.