What if there was a magic pill?

[kycat2007]

I have recently invested some speculative money into a stock that is doing some good things with obesity research.
Arena Pharm. has a drug in the pipeline its most advanced candidate is lorcaserin, a selective 5-HT2C serotonin receptor agonist that is under investigation for the treatment of obesity.
They are doing a trial on 3000 people which is in phase 3 testing.
It seems to have shown in the phase 2 testing to eliminate 5% body fat at like 20 mg.
They have to make sure that the heart valves do not experience any problems during the trials.

If this is anywhere near as good as a Phen Phen, do you guys think this will be as big as I do?

Would you take such a drug if it comes to market?

[Djankie]

never, I work for results, it like steriods for losin fat

[miss_carrie]

people need to stop being so lazy... if you could take a pill and all of a sudden be ripped, then everyone would do it and it would take all the fun out of being that way in the first place.

[por2geez]

I'd take it. Sure, anyone can be skinny and show off a six-pack. Doesn't mean they will be strong, or quick. My goals are part appearance, but mostly about performance. You won't get that from any pill, but less fat certainly helps.

[heathershubby]

after years of it being in use and no side effects showing then yes if I though it was totaally safe I would I dont think that would stop me from working out now that I really enjoy working out but I would take the pill sorry to those who think its wrong but lol I would.

[Aquilius]

It seems to have shown in the phase 2 testing to eliminate 5% body fat at like 20 mg.

In which timeframe? At which cost? How does it compare to Rimonabant/Acomplia? How are the reimbursement prospects? What is the risk for approval from the FDA?

If this is anywhere near as good as a Phen Phen, do you guys think this will be as big as I do?

The problem is: even if it works, if there is no reimbursement by health insurances in the major countries, it's going to be a dud - this is what currently happens to Sanofi-Aventis with Rimonabant/Acomplia.

Rimonabant/Acomplia was recently (19. October) denied reimbursement by german health insurance and classified as a "lifestyle drug" as it's effects (average loss of 5kg/11lbs in the studies) were not considered good enough to justify the cost (estd. $1000/year). In Sweden, Denmark and Finland, as contrast, reimbursement was granted.

If your companies product is also classified as such (prescription required, but no reimbursement by health insurance) in several of the major countries, this may negatively affect the stock. There are also always delays with FDA approval possible (especially after the Fen-Phen fiasco), etc.

Would you take such a drug if it comes to market?

This is an interesting question. I am always toying with the idea of taking Rimonabant/Acomplia, but

1. It's horribly expensive (about twice the average gym membership rate), even in the world of hugely overpriced supps.
2. There are some reported side effects.
3. It's to new, the Fen-Phen disaster has shown that those kind of drugs, if taken long-term, may have as of yet unforeseen sides.
4. I was able to make good progress without that stuff so far, and 10lbs/year is nothing I shouldn't be able to do without that (I hope).
5. It will not help build muscle/LBM.
6. Effectivity would equal about 3 hours of cardio/month (or 9 minutes of cardio per workout session with 20 sessions/month). Seems not worth the money.

if you could take a pill and all of a sudden be ripped, then everyone would do it and it would take all the fun out of being that way in the first place.

Unfortunately, those type of drugs will just cause the loss of a few lbs of body fat, but not muscle buildup. If you were obese and take those without working out in addition, you'd just become somewhat less obese. Take John (HH) - he lost more in the last 3 months with exercise and diet than the average Rimonabant/Acomplia result would have been - in a 1000 $ year... If you were simply somewhat overweight, and took those, they still would not give you muscle, you'd still simply be skinny-fat afterwards. As drugs for bodybuilders seeking to get cut from 8% to 6% they'd be largely useless, because they act in such a long timeframe (i.e. 11lbs/year on average...) when you want to get cut for competition in weeks.

The main issue with this type of product is that it won't change the lifestyle of the client, sooner or later he'll just get back any fat he lost with this product as soon as he stops taking it.

Regards,
Aquilius

[MrSinister]

Originally Posted by Djankie

never, I work for results, it like steriods for losin fat

absolutely... ive worked my arse off to get to this point and though sometimes u just wanna die its a love/hate relationship... even if there was a quick easy drug to take to get the same results i'd prefer the hard way, comes with greater benefits (fitness, healthier respiratory and cardiovascular systems).. just like you can take steroids to help build muscle mass, no thanks.

[user903890348904]

May one day be a magic pill to lose fat, but Im sure that pill will chew some form of muscle also!

And there will never be a pill for building muscle!! So the lazy people will just look thin... if thats their goal, cool.. but u cant take magic pills forever, sooner or later it will affect your health in someway!

[kycat2007]

This drug is not meant for people to get pipped. We have a growing epidemic here in the US and it is called obesity. Health care cost are on the rise and will continue to rise. The US eats mostly because we like the taste of foods and are always tryong to make stuff taste better rather than use food as energy to run these bodies we live in. I believe this drug will be used in focused groups to incorporate exercise and diet to help in th eloss of weight.
Right now if you are obese the solution that the world sees as the answer is not the on ethat we know. We bust our ass and hit the gym and eat better. They are being told to get bypass surgery or other surgery. We know the answer and what needs to be done but most extremely overweight people will not have the will power and some can't because they have gone too far fat to get back on track.
I know I bust my ass and found it hard to lose 5% body fat over the course of several months. If I could bust my ass and have a pill I could take to help me I would take it if it was available.

[rlund25]

Well personally i can post on this and because i was 222 pounds at 6 foot with no muscle and just a lazy ass. I was sick of being a statistic so i lost the weight and now i love eating healthy. If people would just cut out sugar and eat furits and vegtables they would be so much happier. The amount of food I eat now is alot more then when i was fat but its low in calories and good for me. Even if a magic pill came out people would still eat sugar and bad fats "trans fats, saturated fats" and bad crap and probably develop diabetes or a heart condition.

[bigboy67]

haha, i love how righteous everybody has gotten all of a sudden. if its safe and affordable, of course i would take it, and i bet most of us here would. I love the "steroids for losing fat" comment. well lets say it is. you have to work your ass off to get results with steroids, you dont just get huge with no work. i personally think it would be great . it's like rlund25 said, lazy people are gonna be lazy people no matter what pill they can shove down their throats, but for those of us that work our asses off, it would be awesome.

[Aquilius]

If I could bust my ass and have a pill I could take to help me I would take it if it was available.

Then take Rimonabant/Acomplia. However, in many cases the patients simply skip the "bust my ass" part. And will sooner or later regain any fat they had if they stop taking that IMHO very expensive stuff.

if its safe and affordable

Here comes the crux: why should they make it "affordable"? What exactly is "affordable"? Is $1000/year affordable? Is the amount of fat lost worth the cost?

The "Magic Pill" IS here and available (at least in europe, may take some more months for US). Is it safe? That's what "they" say. Is it affordable? Thats a question to be answered by your account.

http://www.acompliaresources.com/

Now, are you going to take it?

Regards,
Aquilius

[bigboy67]

Rimonabant is no magic pill. its been available for a while in the US if you know how to shop. been there and done that. the beta 2 agonists like albuterol/clen work much better IMO.

give this a read:
Persons who took the drug for a year lost an average of 11.7 pounds, trimmed more than 2 inches off their waistline and had lower blood fats and higher HDL cholesterol readings than those taking a placebo, Scheen reported. Participants who were switched from 20 milligrams of rimonabant to a placebo gained back the weight they had lost, the researchers said. On the other hand, those who continued on the 20-milligram pill maintained their weight loss.

SOURCES: Nathaniel Clark, M.D., national vice president for clinical Affairs, American Diabetes Association, Alexandria, Va.; Janet Skidmore, spokeswoman, Merck, Whitehorse Junction, N.J.; June 12, 2005, presentations, American Diabetes Association, annual meeting, San Diego

Now, i dont know about you, 11 pounds in one year doesnt exactly ring out as a magic pill to me.

[Aquilius]

Participants who were switched from 20 milligrams of rimonabant to a placebo gained back the weight they had lost

Do you think it will be different for the serotonin antagonist stuff? No pill that does not also permanently change behavioral patterns will provide lasting success.

Also, I understand that clen & co. are illegal for use with humans, but Rimonabant isn't (and in fact will be reimbursed in various countries).

Now, i dont know about you, 11 pounds in one year doesnt exactly ring out as a magic pill to me.

Even compared to the more-or-less worthless "fat burners" advertised in the muscle mags? Are there people who have lost 11lbs on any of those without changing diet & exercise? 11lbs are like 5% for anyone around 200lbs. Probably not so bad for anyone borderline diabetic and whatnot.

Clearly, people would love to see something like DNP without any sides. Not going to happen.

Does anyone know the purported efficiency of Fen-Phen?

Regards,
Aquilius

[thehulk24]

There currently is not and nor will there be a magic pill for lazy people, who in general tend to be overweight or obese. They usually put this down to some “thyroid” imbalance or some other useless excuse, well at least 99% of them.

The current magic pill for fat people is Xenical or Reductil, but again it doesn’t cure laziness.

[duck commander]

The problem is- people want t ocontinue in their unhealthy lifestyle, eating crap and not exercising (not people on this forum) and take a pill to get skinny, avoid cancer, etc.

the answer, for almost everybody, is in diet and exercise.

[bigboy67]

the question was, if there eas a magic pill that would make your body fat lower, and i am sayin ABSOLUTELY. nothing wrong with getting a little extra edge, as long as it is safe and not cost prohibitive. all this talk about lazy people doesnt apply to me and i am sure it doesnt apply to most of you since you post on a bodybuilding website.

[empresscat]

5% fat loss for someone who is morbidly obese... assuming it takes more than a couple of months to achieve that, then you'd have better and faster results with a slight reduction in calories and moderate exercise (like daily 3-mile walks)

I lost 11% body fat in four months.
But when you're over 50%, that's not really so amazing.


But it sounds great to people who are looking for an easy solution, and so would certainly make money.


I'd have to know a LOT more - but if there were a drug that was affordable (not much more than $20/month) and showed that it clearly increased results over exercise and diet alone, and had been on the market about ten years so that the effects of long-term use, and what happens after people stop taking it are well known - then I would not hesitate to take it, any more than I hesitate to use whey or take vitamins to help my body transformation