I just had to say it......

[SDFlip]

When I started training everyone told me you should do compounds only. What will a 100 lbs barbell curl do for you if you can row 220 lbs or even 300? What good is a measly hamstring curls if you can do deadlifts with 400 lbs? What good is 20 lbs lateral raises when you can do db presses with 70 pounds? What usefulness does machinepresses have when you can lift the same thing without a machine? Is flyes any good when you can bench press so much more, the muscle fibers will get worked alot more than doing flyes with pitiful weights.

I believed all that and did it for more than two years (not understanding the differnce between intensity and total intensity). Now I have come to the conclusion that people who advocate compound only are often newbies who shouldn't be dishing out advice. IMO doing isolation exercises is VERY important if you are into BODYbuilding and not strength building. Compound exercises has their place but so do isolation exercises.

Rowing 220 lbs is good for the back but if you get tired in your arms then you are performing the lift WRONG! Doing curls will do more for the biceps and brachialis than rows ever will. This is true for MOST people. Some other will grow from compound only but they probably would grow even more if they did a little more direct work. The intensity of isolation exercises are HIGHER than compound for a SPECIFIC muscle. The TOTAL intensity on the muscles is higher with compound exercises. So an isolation exercise will work the specific muscle harder than the compound.

Why wouldn't you just do isolation then? Because the total intensity is lower. The importance of compounds is their ability to put the body under stress, this will make you grow and will help your islolation exercises, but isolation exercises will help the lagging body parts to grow.

I've been stuck with my bench press for one and a half years. Tried everything but nothing did work. Finally I tried machines along with my ordinary bench press and the bench are now finally goind upward steadily. Machines which isolate was a gold mine for my part. Excluding them just for being machines is pathetic and counter productive. You might learn alot about what you know if you knew that half of the stuff you've been feed about bodybuilding are from 145 lbs people whos been lifting for one year.

Then it comes to what rep ranges you should do. Some say low reps are best, some say 4-8, some advocate 10s. But many people seem stuck in their idea what rep range is "the best". Doing fives is not the best, eight is not best. It depends on two things. What exercise you are doing AND what your muscles respond to. After you've trained for a while you'll realize what rep range your muscles grow best in. My calves for example grow alot by doing three repetitions with very heavy weight and a ten second rest between sets. My legs respond to higher repetitions, 8-12 or even 20. Some muscles get worked better if I increase the weight each set perhaps going 12-8-6 on the sets.

The point is. If you vary your rep ranges you WILL grow better because you can adapt your training to what seem to work best. People who are stuck in a alpha"rep range" will plataeu and say their muscles are stubborn when the solution could be as simple as just lowering the weights a little and doing more reps or vice versa.

[end rant]

[SwagMorris]

Oh yeah, I totally agree. This isn't a powerlifting site, this is a bodybuilding site. More curlz 4 teh gurlz, I always say.

[Valley Dude]

Same here - I wasted 6 months with that "compounds only" stuff. My arms (and everything else I wasn't specifically targeting with an exercise) were lagging way behind, so I started with some isolation stuff for them, and within a couple of months I saw a big improvement. Bench press went up as well, after being plateaued for months.

Oh well, if people want to believe whatever trend is popular on the internet at the moment instead of actually trying different things themselves...whatever

[ZZYZX]

omfg, you're kidding right? There's a 3-page thread on this topic RIGHT NEXT TO THIS ONE.

Let the horse DIE already!

[Rachel_n_SD]

omfg, you're kidding right? There's a 3-page thread on this topic RIGHT NEXT TO THIS ONE.

Let the horse DIE already!

somebody missed the joke...

[GoJu]

AGREED. keep the bull**** to yourself already.

EDIT: OH, not a funny joke.

[TheCore]

ZZYZX weren't you green a couple of minutes ago?

[ThickAsABrick]

AGREED. keep the bull**** to yourself already.

Sounds like advice you should take.

[SwagMorris]

AGREED. keep the bull**** to yourself already.

EDIT: OH, not a funny joke.

Shouldn't you be somewhere else, giving someone bad advice?

[IRONMANN1]

omfg, you're kidding right? There's a 3-page thread on this topic RIGHT NEXT TO THIS ONE.

Let the horse DIE already!

wow your contribution to bb.com is pretty much terrible.

[GoJu]

Shouldn't you be somewhere else, giving someone bad advice?

if you mean by bad advice you mean tips that wil actually build strength and size then yes you're right I should be elsewhere.

[IRONMANN1]

ZZYZX weren't you green a couple of minutes ago?

yes i negged him. gotta problem?

[SDFlip]

wow your contribution to bb.com is pretty much terrible.

hahaha!

[TheCore]

yes i negged him. gotta problem?

Lol, just wanted to know why and by how, he was 3 pos + before...

So it had to be by either someone with a lot of reps or he was gang negged

[SDFlip]

omfg, you're kidding right? There's a 3-page thread on this topic RIGHT NEXT TO THIS ONE.

Let the horse DIE already!

you don't have a single shred of concrete evidence.

[GoJu]

Sounds like advice you should take.

hmmm, possibly.

[papi93]

yes i negged him. gotta problem?

IronMann has the power of neg.

[SDFlip]

Occupation: Customer Service Representative Assistant Instructor Neko-Do Goju-Ryu Karate-Do .

hahhaha!

so you work the front desk at a McDojo? awesome.

[IRONMANN1]

Lol, just wanted to know why and by how, he was 3 pos + before...

So it had to be by either someone with a lot of reps or he was gang negged

He is my 3rd neg of all time. And what for:

Agreed. For what it's worth, I'm also a personal trainer.

If I were you, I'd concentrate more on form, and less on impressing friends with how many plates are on the bar.

I mean who responds to vids like this?

Therefore i negged.

[GoJu]

hahhaha!

so you work the front desk at a McDojo? awesome.

there 2 seperate jobs shmuck, one I answer phones at a time share company and the other I teacher karate

[SDFlip]

there 2 seperate jobs shmuck, one I answer phones at a time share company and the other I teacher karate

sooo..... you answer phones at the McDojo?

[TheCore]

He is my 3rd neg of all time. And what for:




I mean who responds to vids like this?

Therefore i negged.

It depends...

I don't know what vid you're talking about, but if the person in question was lifing with very bad form, I would also say to lower the weights and use better form...

Than again, it sounds like the person in the vid is a personal trainer, and I doubt that he would lift in such a way...

Also I saw a thread made by ZZYZX (atleast I though it was him), in which he was bashing Rippetoe's routine without good reason, so I don't mind...

[GoJu]

sooo..... you answer phones at the McDojo?

WTF did the "Mc" come from all this?

[Defiant1]

Here it is again...for those who missed it

Almost foolproof.

I feel like a broken record saying it.

Three things make an exercise a size builder for any given individual:

Two of them are for anyone, the third, for that individual.

1. High NMA or nueromuscular activation. The nervous system must react strongly to the movement. Accomplished by doing exercises that move the body through space, or with BBs, or with DBs. Free weight isolation exercises have as high or a higher NMA than machine compounds.*

2. Maximized Actin/Myosin pairing. Muscles exert their greatest force from about 110 of joint angle. Since the more myosin/actin pairings are optimal (read, lined up) the more force the muscle can exert, this explains why some isolation exercises are size builders, and some aren't. E.G. BB curls ARE, concentration curls ARE NOT. Lying Extensions ARE, skullcrushers ARE, kickbacks ARE NOT. Shrugs ARE. Calve raises ARE. Wrist curls ARE. **

3. For an individual, the given exercise must have enough RELATIVE isolation to elicit protein degradation on the target. If you are doing rows, and not hitting your lats, you need to find a different exercise. Going through the motions doesn't work. This is why the bench press builds huge pecs in some, but not in others. ***



*explains why leg extensions, despite being more direct, do not build as much size in the quads as squats. Why leg presses don't build as much size as squats.


**explains also WHY non-optimal isos DO elicit certain targeting effects-i.e. DB flyes-outer pecs, Cable crossovers-inner pecs, etc. ALSO explains why chins and rows DON'T build great biceps for many (exercises start with biceps in or toward contracted position-not good ratcheting action for most myosin/actin pairs)

***explains why lateral raises are needed by most for lateral deltoids-presses simply don't target the area enough to elicit a strong response.

[SwagMorris]

there 2 seperate jobs shmuck, one I answer phones at a time share company and the other I teacher karate

Somebody needs to teacher engrish

Karate's cool, really cool. I mean, nothing cooler than grown men, playing Power Rangers with little kids.

[IRONMANN1]

It depends...

I don't know what vid you're talking about, but if the person in question was lifing with very bad form, I would also say to lower the weights and use better form...

Than again, it sounds like the person in the vid is a personal trainer, and I doubt that he would lift in such a way...

Also I saw a thread made by ZZYZX (atleast I though it was him), in which he was bashing Rippetoe's routine without good reason, so I don't mind...

No, the vid was of me. And its on this front page. You can find it yourself. I dont mind constructive criticism. Why in the world do you think i posted it here..but to add in the pointless stupid statements sound just like what a 'trainer know it all' would say.

By golly i negged him and it felt good LOL

[Briggsy]

the post above (by defiant) is pure quality! ^

[IRONMANN1]

Somebody needs to teacher engrish

Karate's cool, really cool. I mean, nothing cooler than grown men, playing Power Rangers with little kids.

LOLZ!!!!

[SDFlip]

Somebody needs to teacher engrish

Karate's cool, really cool. I mean, nothing cooler than grown men, playing Power Rangers with little kids.

Ah, Herro, thanka you fah carring the McDojo. Howa can I herp you?

[ThickAsABrick]

This thread is cracking me up.

lol