BCAA and serotonin, and SSRIs?

[Buff_Daddy]

There are theories of "central fatigue" where BCAA supplementation decreases serotonin synthesis in the brain... providing more energy during your workout...this is fine and all, but Im wondering what if you take SSRIs (designed to increase synaptic serotonin). I love BCAA especially in bulk amounts, but I just want to be cautious that Im not causing imbalances.

[Billypc99]

I would definitely be mindful of BCAA overconsumption and whey if you are battling depression/anxiety and be particulary cautious about valine and isovaline. In short, trytophan is the precursor for serotonin synthesis and BCAA's compete with tryptophan at the blood brain barrier for transport into the brain. All large nuetral amino acids (LNAAs) compete with one another for the same carrier complex. The bottom line is that the amount of serotonin produced is directly related to tryptophan:LNAA ratio. The problem with BCAA's is that they escape hepatic metabolism and end up in the plasma in far greater amounts than other AA's....particulary tryptophan. This partially explains the mood-enhancing effects of testosterone because T increases protein synthesis and decreases levels of essential AA's.....specifically all the LNAAs except tryptophan. Thus, after increases in T the tryptophan:LNAA ratio goes up followed by enhancement of mood.

[Buff_Daddy]

Thanx for the detailed response

The issue is I guess, that its hard to know exactly how much BCAA you would need... Also, wouldnt it be true that you also ingest alot of tryptophan in whey products and such to balance out the competition?

Another thing, would supplementing with 5htp potentially prevent the possible effects of such competition

[Billypc99]

Buff,
The quick answer to that question is no because how much you ingest is only part of the answer. The bottom line is that it comes down to what ends up in your blood. a There are a few companies that I am aware of that are developing whey proteins with increased tryptophan content. At least one of which should be on the market right now.

[Blahzay128]

good topic...makes me wonder as I am currently on an SSRI and taking BCAA's 2x per day at 3g's each.

[Buff_Daddy]

Buff,
The quick answer to that question is no because how much you ingest is only part of the answer. The bottom line is that it comes down to what ends up in your blood. a There are a few companies that I am aware of that are developing whey proteins with increased tryptophan content. At least one of which should be on the market right now.

Thank you, would you be able to post what the protein is? Or PM me it.

[GeneGnomeX]

SSRI's would obviously affect serotonin levels much more than any food, i'm not sure BCAA's at any amount would make much difference- thoughts?

[Billypc99]

Fitnecise,
Unfortunately many are unaware of the impact that amino acids can have on mood (for better or worse). For the sake of time, below are links to the free full text of two articles: The second is a well-conducted study that demonstrates that effect of tryptophan intake and the first is a review article by Dr. Ferstrom who is an exprert on BCAA's and brain function. The takehome message is that when BCAA's are absrobed, they do indeed effect brain nuerotrasmitters.

http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/full/135/6/1539S

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/81/5/1026

[Buff_Daddy]

Fitnecise,
Unfortunately many are unaware of the impact that amino acids can have on mood (for better or worse). For the sake of time, below are links to the free full text of two articles: The second is a well-conducted study that demonstrates that effect of tryptophan intake and the first is a review article by Dr. Ferstrom who is an exprert on BCAA's and brain function. The takehome message is that when BCAA's are absrobed, they do indeed effect brain nuerotrasmitters.

http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/content/full/135/6/1539S

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/81/5/1026

I emailed Dr Ferstrom a while ago about that article relating to my situation... he replied quickly and was very nice!.. I wish I had his response saved.

I didn't notice any low mood really when megadosing (35 g /day) ...the only effect I ever seemed to notice were the positive ones... lack of fatigue and increases in endurance and energy as well as fat loss and lean muscle gain.

They know that the BCAAs will suppress serotonin, but whether or not that will lead to low mood is unpredictable. When i would go off the BCAA, i would feel the lower energy.

I also tried just supplementing with whey instead of BCAA (about 80g/ day + normal diet) , and also didnt notice any increase in energy at all or gains like the BCAAs. I also didnt notice any incraese in mood. (whey contains alot of tryptophan?)