upperbody strength for baseball

[johnnyob1356]

im 13 and ive been lifting every other day for maybe half a year now. i have gotton some improvment but i need some more for baseball because im moving up onto the real diamond this year. every other day im doing dumbell curls and 21s and on the off days im doing 100 push-ups. im 5'9"/5'10" 140 pounds and my body fat percentage is around 9%. can anybody give some advice on how to get more upper body strength??

[WEAKA5HELL]

You clearly have not used the search button, but keep reading, I'm not going to bash you for anything that you haven't done that you should have done by now. However, at the same time I'm not going to treat you like you're two and half and spoonfeed you everything you need. You have a major advantage over your teammates and your competition by finding this site at 13. That being said, there are a few things you can change.

- DROP THE FU(KING CURLS, you're an athlete, not a bodybuilder, there are better exercises with more athletic carryover than curls
- PUSHUPS ARE GOOD, but using different variations would be better than just doing 100. At the same time, you should add pullups and chinups to what you're doing right now, try and work your way up to doing a BW set of 15-20 for pull-ups
- UPPER BODY STRENGTH IS OVERRATED FOR BASEBALL, if you develop more power in your legs by squatting, deadlifting, cleans, and olympic movements, and find a coach that will help teach and correct mechanics for hitting and throwing. You'll find that upperbody strength isn't quite what you need.

If you didn't understand something I said, search.

Right now I'm hard pressed for time, if you want to know something, feel free to PM me and pick at my brain. I'd be glad to help you instead of letting someone who doesn't know what they are talking about teach you a bunch of myths and bull****.

[randomhero97]

Dude, for baseball you need to work on lowerbody strength and core work, upperbody should come secondary. Core lifts are a must and since your 13 I wouldn't recommend you going very heavy on anything you do. You could do lower back work (hyperextensions, reverse hypers, etc.), some ab work (decline situps, roman chairs, leg raises, and wood choppers for the obliques), squats, deads, benches, and rows should compromise the bulk of your workout.

[bxbombers]

do the basics. squat, deadlift, and lunges are a great movement for baseball. if your upperbody is lacking strength then you should incorporate some moves. and dont worry about going to the big field. unless your a pitcher its to your advantage. no 13 yr old is going to dominate when they just went from 46' to 60'

[Lieutenant Non]

You are weak and your skills at baseball are terrible.

Kneel before Non.

[WEAKA5HELL]

Go back to fu(king your sister.

[hardwork08]

you will love the larger field when you have more bloop singles.

work core/legs/RC and flexibility and you'll be fine

[Zac Robinson]

What you have been doing isn't entirely terrible, but everybody is right in suggesting you do a lot of lower body, core and RC exercises. However, at the age of 13 you need to focus on strengthening the joints and preparing your body for further more challenging work. As well as improving intermuscular coordination (making the muscles work together more efficiently) Therefore, I would suggest keeping the push ups and curls, adding dips, bodyweight squats, supermans, various abdominal exercises, all the rotator cuff exercises with a focus on external rotation, pull ups, lunges, and a variety of general physical preparedness exercises like burpees, squat thrusts, jump rope, mountain climbers, cross country skiers, etc. Do the above weight training exercises for 1 or 2 sets of around 20 reps, then follow it up with all of the GPP exercises each for 30 seconds to a minute, this will allow for you to gain some strength and size, as well as lay the groundwork for future more strenuous training. Perform this type of training for 6 months or so. Good luck

[Lieutenant Non]

This forum is a joke, and so are its members.

Non is the only one here who consistently trains. ****ing pussies.

I guarantee 90% of the people on this board aren't over 150lbs, LMAO

[Zac Robinson]

This forum is a joke, and so are its members.

Non is the only one here who consistently trains. ****ing pussies.

I guarantee 90% of the people on this board aren't over 150lbs, LMAO

Thank you for the very informative post! All of the athletes on here can really take this information and improve greatly.

[Lieutenant Non]

Thank you for the very informative post! All of the athletes on here can really take this information and improve greatly.

Of course, because I am Non.

[sheerpoundage]

And an absolute twat. Everyone knows why you want them kneeling infront of you, you simply can't get it from anyone around you so you have to ask people on a forum.

......told

[Lieutenant Non]

And an absolute twat. Everyone knows why you want them kneeling infront of you, you simply can't get it from anyone around you so you have to ask people on a forum.

......told

I hope this "told" remark wasn't an attempt to belittle my intelligence. You, in fact, did not "tell" anyone. But what you did do is prove to this puerile message board full of feeble-minded weaklings that your pathetic excuse for a brain has very few wrinkles, and you are inferior to even the most "ladylike" male.

Bow down to Non.

[coolness]

I hope this "told" remark wasn't an attempt to belittle my intelligence. You, in fact, did not "tell" anyone. But what you did do is prove to this puerile message board full of feeble-minded weaklings that your pathetic excuse for a brain has very few wrinkles, and you are inferior to even the most "ladylike" male.

Bow down to Non.

What the hell?

Anyways... what you SHOULD do, is for base-ball, focus on some shoulder training! Unlike most sports... Base-ball ACTULLY uses the bicep in it, not odd when you think about it. Also... squatting is good for any sport. Basically... do compound bicep lifts, don't neccisarily work on your curling. As you may see... throwing a base-ball or swinging a bat isn't atully a curling motion, but to foot-ballers, doing a clean or jammer is the same motion he has as his starting position. So... with this in mind, do some compound bicep movements.

Day 1
Squat/ Calf Raise- 6 x 8, / 6 x 20
Clean- 3 x 2
Snatch- 3 x 2

Day 2
Bench press/ Push-ups- 4 x 8, 4 x failure
Over-head press/ Hammer grip over-head press- 4 x 8, 4 x 8
Barbell row/Chin-up- 4 x 8, 4 x failure
Close-grip bench press/ French press- 3 or 4 x 6
Wrist curl/ Reverse Wrist curl- 2 x 10

Day 3- rest

Day 4- rest (if you need it)

Day 5
Squat/ Calf Raise- 8,8,6,6,3,3, 20, 15, 10, 8, 6, 20
Straight leg dead lift- 2 x 8 or 10, maybe 15
Clean- 2 x 2

Day 6
Bench press/ Push-ups- 5 x 6, 4 x failure
Barbell row/Chin-up- 5 x 6, 4 x failure
Front raise/ Side Raise/ Bent over side raise- 4 x 8 or 6
Dips- 1 x failure, weighted with about 10 pounds, 5 reps
Wrist curl/ Behind the back wrist curl yes- 2 x 12
(there is a reason why those are 2nd last... )

As for the deadlifts... you can live without them. You don't REALLY need to tackle someone, and leg speed as for driving up won't help TOO much. Just basically, if you want them, or need them, switch them on and off every week.

Do whatever ab work you want. THAT is important. But... if you want some, just throw it in on whitch ever day, 2 or 3 times a week.

Crunches/Elbow to knee crunches- 4 x whatever, or weighted
Captains chair/ Leg lifts- 4 x whatever failure
Hyper Extension/ Oblique crunch- 4 x whatever, or weighted.

[WEAKA5HELL]

Anyways... what you SHOULD do, is for base-ball, focus on some shoulder training! Unlike most sports... Base-ball ACTULLY uses the bicep in it, not odd when you think about it. Also... squatting is good for any sport. Basically... do compound bicep lifts, don't neccisarily work on your curling. As you may see... throwing a base-ball or swinging a bat isn't atully a curling motion, but to foot-ballers, doing a clean or jammer is the same motion he has as his starting position. So... with this in mind, do some compound bicep movements.

As for the deadlifts... you can live without them. You don't REALLY need to tackle someone, and leg speed as for driving up won't help TOO much. Just basically, if you want them, or need them, switch them on and off every week.

1. All sports "actually use the biceps", actually, all sports use the biceps, as well as everyother muscle in the human body.

2. Deadlifts are a great posterior chain movement for any sport and this includes baseball. The fact that they work several major muscle groups that are critical for baseball (hams, low back, forearms, lats, shoulders, etc) makes them a great lift for baseball.

Dammit.

[coolness]

1. All sports "actually use the biceps", actually, all sports use the biceps, as well as everyother muscle in the human body.

2. Deadlifts are a great posterior chain movement for any sport and this includes baseball. The fact that they work several major muscle groups that are critical for baseball (hams, low back, forearms, lats, shoulders, etc) makes them a great lift for baseball.

Dammit.

Yeah.. but he's 13! I have trouble on the technique of the deadlift! I have to use a mirror, and deadlift in front, to see myself, and then when I get my technique wrong, I go over to this wooden poll and practice, and then come back to the weight. YOU CAN live without the deadlift, but it's hard to deadlift and squat in the same week (it really is more taxing that squatting or deadlifting twice a week) So I reccomend an on off thing. Besides, it could throw his back off too, a bad thing in your early years.

[WEAKA5HELL]

Yeah.. but he's 13! I have trouble on the technique of the deadlift! I have to use a mirror, and deadlift in front, and when I get my technique wrong, I go over to this wooden poll and practice, and then come back to the weight. YOU CAN live without the deadlift, but it's hard to deadlift and squat in the same week (it really is more taxing that squatting or deadlifting twice a week) So I reccomend an on off thing.

After you posted this I really hope no one here takes your advice on any topic besides maybe a review of the next Hawthorne Heights CD.

- If your form is bad, your back is sore, etc, PRACTICE! Use the bar with 10 lb. plates, or even a broomstick would work

- I got great gains off of squatting and deadlifting in the same DAY as a beginner. Why? Huge GH stimulation by doing two big compound movements in one session. If you can't handle PWO soreness (the worst only should last a few weeks anyway), please, stop pulling/pushing all heavy objects immediately.

[coolness]

After you posted this I really hope no one here takes your advice on any topic besides maybe a review of the next Hawthorne Heights CD.

- If your form is bad, your back is sore, etc, PRACTICE! Use the bar with 10 lb. plates, or even a broomstick would work

- I got great gains off of squatting and deadlifting in the same DAY as a beginner. Why? Huge GH stimulation by doing two big compound movements in one session. If you can't handle PWO soreness (the worst only should last a few weeks anyway), please, stop pulling/pushing all heavy objects immediately.

hell but he is a kid! He doesn't need some fancy super-workout, he just needs a begganers workout. For crying out loud... he isn't an intermediate, or even a special person, and this will help get him started- he doesn't need to go in and improve and get a mega-super huge bench and squat yet or anything, just a decent workout.

[cardcatcher2]

A work out program can only get you so far though. If you want to get better at throwing and hitting, you have to throw and hit. If you want to increase arm strenght, lifting will help some, but long toss will help a lot more. Weighted balls can also be good, but you have to be careful with them. Make sure you lift because it is very important, but dont forget to actually work on your skills as well.

[WEAKA5HELL]

hell but he is a kid! He doesn't need some fancy super-workout, he just needs a begganers workout. For crying out loud... he isn't an intermediate, or even a special person, and this will help get him started- he doesn't need to go in and improve and get a mega-super huge bench and squat yet or anything, just a decent workout.

If he wants a beginners workout, he can go to the workout program section on this, very, fukking forum and look at a nearly endless total of Rippetoes Starting Strength pages, specifically the one by Matta114 (sp?). This is not a super-fancy intermediate/advanced workout, and it uses only compound lifts, which is beneficial to any athlete. The workouts are short, but they do not lack intensity, so they shock the CNS and lead to neuromuscular development, unlike some beginner 3x10 program. A few points:

- All athletes can benefit from all compound movements done correctly
- The easiest way to get bigger/add mass is to get stronger, so instead of doing a 3x10 routine, do a routine that will make your CNS stronger, your body will adapt, and you muscles will grow. In a nutshell, anytime someone tells you to get bigger, they're really saying get stronger
- Anyone who still believes that lower reps will stunt growth needs to jump off a cliff, so that I don't have to kill you myself and go to jail for ridding your useless ass off the face of the earth
- The truth is, when done with proper form and supervision low reps are great for any athlete, this is not an advanced technique, it's just the truth

[WEAKA5HELL]

A work out program can only get you so far though. If you want to get better at throwing and hitting, you have to throw and hit. If you want to increase arm strenght, lifting will help some, but long toss will help a lot more. Weighted balls can also be good, but you have to be careful with them. Make sure you lift because it is very important, but dont forget to actually work on your skills as well.

If you have proper technique when throwing, a mix between long toss and lifting would be the best thing you can do to get the most out of your efforts.

Think about it, one spends most of his time in the weight room following a good routine with deadlifts, squats, maybe rotational core work, olympic movements with correct form, and shoulder press to maintain a healthy shoulder gridle. These lifts would deveop the core, and make it easier for a player to rely on his hips when he throws. If you rely more on your hips, the shoulder soreness you have or any chance of injury should be greatly reduced. The problem is, most athletes do not have enough core strength and others have ****ty mechanics (me).

[coolness]

Look... I can flip over cars and lift up boats, and my bench is okay. BUT, I probably weigh more, and lift more than the last time I checked. So I don't know how much I lift. But, basically, any super-athlete dude DIDN'T start with deadlifts, squats, and benches, I'll assure you that. And... it doesn't mean much if your fast but can't catch, and strong but can't hit or tackle in sports. WHAT you need... is just to work. MAYBE if he does some easy workout, and gets ready, then he can start on that stuff. The truth is... he needs to get back on the correct path. You see... he didn't have much work or intensity, just continues workout. Doing a super-heavy intense workout right off the bat is going to make him probably not want to continue. I even quit crap that’s way too stupid- working out hard is one thing, but doing crazy stuff is just stupid. Just… fine, I KNOW my program would be crap for anybody that was in the pro’s, but hell, is he? He just needs to get started- and if your in base-ball as 13, you don’t NEED to bench 200 pounds and squat 350, or 315, because most 13 year olds barley bench 95 pounds!

[Lieutenant Non]

hell but he is a kid! He doesn't need some fancy super-workout, he just needs a begganers workout. For crying out loud... he isn't an intermediate, or even a special person, and this will help get him started- he doesn't need to go in and improve and get a mega-super huge bench and squat yet or anything, just a decent workout.

Silence, fool. Your argument is weak.

[WEAKA5HELL]

Look... I can flip over cars and lift up boats, and my bench is okay. BUT, I probably weigh more, and lift more than the last time I checked. So I don't know how much I lift. But, basically, any super-athlete dude DIDN'T start with deadlifts, squats, and benches, I'll assure you that. And... it doesn't mean much if your fast but can't catch, and strong but can't hit or tackle in sports. WHAT you need... is just to work. MAYBE if he does some easy workout, and gets ready, then he can start on that stuff. The truth is... he needs to get back on the correct path. You see... he didn't have much work or intensity, just continues workout. Doing a super-heavy intense workout right off the bat is going to make him probably not want to continue. I even quit crap that’s way too stupid- working out hard is one thing, but doing crazy stuff is just stupid. Just… fine, I KNOW my program would be crap for anybody that was in the pro’s, but hell, is he? He just needs to get started- and if your in base-ball as 13, you don’t NEED to bench 200 pounds and squat 350, or 315, because most 13 year olds barley bench 95 pounds!

You're a fu(king rediculous. Some easy workout? BULL****. All super human athletes can start with looking at weights and grow, the easiest way for the rest of us humans to grow is by performing compound lifts that stimulate the neuromuscular system by overloading the capacity of large and small muscle groups, causing the body to adapt and make them grow. Whether or not your Abercrombie and Bitch ass agrees with me, fine, keep on being a tool.

I truly don't care if most 13 year olds can hardly bench press 95 lbs. for 5 reps. Where ever you got the impression that heavy means the numbers you suggested, please stop reading, listening, talking with this person about training advice. The truth is, heavy is relative. That 95 lbs. bench could be heavy for a 13 year old in his specific plan and it's only because it is specific to him. A professional powerlifter wouldn't even warm up doing 95 lbs. Why? Because this is no longer heavy enough for a warmup set, so why waste his time. Again this is all relative to the lifter. What I can tell you though, is that the professional powerlifter probably was most likely once the 13 year old who could hardly press 95 lbs. We all need to start somewhere and sometime, and if the original poster starts lifting correctly at a younger age, then he will be more advanced than his competition.

If you would quit doing Rippetoe's S.S, Starr's 5x5, Madcow's 5x5, or any other formation of these workouts for beginners, you are mentally weak, and you are too afraid of overtraining. How the words on some of your posts haven't left the screen and hung themselves truly amazes me, it really does. This goes for anyone else.

I'm thinking about bumping this thread everytime you post so that people can see that if they follow your advice they will see a decrease in performance, get, hurt, lift like a little b*itch, or all of the above.

[Zac Robinson]

This has become an interesting thread...weaka5hell and coolness, you both make some interesting points, but I don't completely agree with either. Coolness, the workout you posted wasn't bad, but doing exercises like cleans, snatches, and overhead press are probably more difficult to learn than the deadlift. Maybe not as challenging, but harder to learn. Also, the biceps are important for stabilization of the elbow to decrease injury, but wont' help you a great deal when it comes to throwing harder or swinging faster. However, you do include a lot of good exercises. Coolness, I like your approach with the whole lift heavy, compound movements, and you are right that everybody has to start somewhere, but at 13 with little training experience, he isn't ready for even a beginner weight training program yet. He can still do a lot of challenging exercises relative to his current strength, but he isn't ready to lift with weight that is heavy for him.

I think my post was discounted, but I believe that what he needs to do is focus on doing a large variety of exercises for fairly high reps to allow for strengthening of joints, as well as muscles (at this age and experience level higher reps will add strength adequately), as well as improve intermuscular coordination, but more importantly it will prepare him for future lifting. Therefore, after maybe 6 to 8 months of this type of work, he would be ready to start focusing on more strenuous external resistance type training. He is smart because he is starting out fairly young, so it is very important for him to develop a rock solid base to further develop his physical abilities.

Cardcatcher, you are right a workout can only take you so far, you have to work on the technical skills, but please don't ever lose focus on the physical aspect and work on making your body as strong as possible over the next 3 or 4 years. I unfortunately, spent pretty much all of my time working on the technical aspects, it allowed me to have a successful collegiate career, but now I realize that what was holding me back was my physical attributes, if I would have worked harder at getting stronger and bigger, who knows what would have happened...

[cardcatcher2]

If you have proper technique when throwing, a mix between long toss and lifting would be the best thing you can do to get the most out of your efforts.

I agree. I was just reminding him that he should do something like long toss as well. I've been doing WS4SB and i've already gained strength. I combined that with a throwing program and a bat speed program and right now, i am throwing with more velocity than i ever have. Now i just need a reliable offspeed pitch. haha. But lifting combined with skill work is much better than doing just one or the other.

[coolness]

I agree. I was just reminding him that he should do something like long toss as well. I've been doing WS4SB and i've already gained strength. I combined that with a throwing program and a bat speed program and right now, i am throwing with more velocity than i ever have. Now i just need a reliable offspeed pitch. haha. But lifting combined with skill work is much better than doing just one or the other.

Exactley! But... my programs have to have over 12 sets per body part, becuase I start losing or stop gaining strength when I don't do 12 sets or more... so, I GUESS that system that I made is okay, I know it's not GREAT. But... it does have deadlifts in it. Just... squatting and deadlifting on seperate weeks. NORMALLY I do squats and deadlifts on the same day. But.... this workout is diffreant. IF eithier of you have any things I should add or do to the workout... I'll correct it. Only problem is... it is supposed to be a low set program. So... adding deadlifts in, I'll have to take out some stuff.

[cardcatcher2]

Exactley! But... my programs have to have over 12 sets per body part, becuase I start losing or stop gaining strength when I don't do 12 sets or more... so, I GUESS that system that I made is okay, I know it's not GREAT. But... it does have deadlifts in it. Just... squatting and deadlifting on seperate weeks. NORMALLY I do squats and deadlifts on the same day. But.... this workout is diffreant. IF eithier of you have any things I should add or do to the workout... I'll correct it. Only problem is... it is supposed to be a low set program. So... adding deadlifts in, I'll have to take out some stuff.

I think you should add some tricep work to that program. Other than your core, which does most of the work, your tri's also play a role when swinging the bat. Close grip bench has worked very well for me, as well as other people i have seen, and so have skull crushers. If you dont like that, maybe tri pushdowns. Might wanna add some wrist work to that as well because when you make contact, your wrists absorb most of the blow, and when throwing, its important to have good grip and strong wrists as well

[coolness]

I think you should add some tricep work to that program. Other than your core, which does most of the work, your tri's also play a role when swinging the bat. Close grip bench has worked very well for me, as well as other people i have seen, and so have skull crushers. If you dont like that, maybe tri pushdowns. Might wanna add some wrist work to that as well because when you make contact, your wrists absorb most of the blow, and when throwing, its important to have good grip and strong wrists as well

Thank you! I edited a little... but chin-ups, squats, deadlifts, and push-ups work fore-arms well. And as for wrists, I didn't add TOO much, becuase dips, close-grip bench press, and skull-crushers, actully work your wrist REALLY hard- becuase they are supporting the weight the WHOLE time. I KNOW that sounds a little stupid, but, actully in most lifts you are using fingers more than your wrist, becuase in most tricep excersises, your arm is bent in such a way that since your wrist are straight, they support the weight.

[cardcatcher2]

Thank you! I edited a little... but chin-ups, squats, deadlifts, and push-ups work fore-arms well. And as for wrists, I didn't add TOO much, becuase dips, close-grip bench press, and skull-crushers, actully work your wrist REALLY hard- becuase they are supporting the weight the WHOLE time. I KNOW that sounds a little stupid, but, actully in most lifts you are using fingers more than your wrist, becuase in most tricep excersises, your arm is bent in such a way that since your wrist are straight, they support the weight.

I just went from pesonal experience with the wrist curls and things like that. push ups do nothing, at least for me, except after a chest workout, to just fatigue it a little more. But what works for me might not work for you. And i forgot to mention, you might want to do something like a russian twist with a medicine ball . That works the obliques well and imitates the swinging and part of the throwing motion.