krzna made a thread in the supplement science section about using raloxifene for PCT in about august of '05 and in september he said he was gonna use it for PCT but he never got back to it.... i figured i'd ask in the main supplement section as it would get more attention. please leave input on the use of Raloxifene. heres a quote of what krzna had to say about it
Originally Posted by KrznaSERMS
SERMS are "designer" estrogen-related medications that activate the estrogen receptors, but have different effects on different tissues. There are two kinds of estrogen receptors, and after binding to receptors, the drug-receptor complex can have various conformations. Some of these will act like estrogen, others will inhibit the actions of estrogen.
Advantages of Raloxifene:
Many screening studies of related compounds have been done to search for those which act like estrogen in the desireable ways (stablize bone mass, improve lipid profile) but do not act like estrogen in undesireable ways (cause breast cancer, stimulate the endometrium). The effects on the cardiovascular system are still uncertain: when Ralox was first developed it was felt that estrogen had a beneficial action on the heart, now this is doubted and debated.
Effects on bone physiology
# Decreased bone formation and resorption
# No significant change in bone volume
# Slight increase in mineralization density
# No evidence of osteomalacia or bone toxicity
Another effect of Ralox is that users had fewer asthma attacks and less severe asthma symptoms, strongly suggesting that perhaps estrogen affects airway smooth muscle function by preventing the hyperresponsiveness characteristic of asthma and other chronic lung diseases.
Toxicology report that estrogen, as well as selective estrogen receptor modifiers (SERMs), completely abolished abnormal tracheal constriction in a carbachol test.Carbachol is often used to stimulate, or mimic, contractions of airway and other muscles.
Estrogen has a wide range of actions in the nervous system, including neuroprotection and potentiation of nerve regeneration (Toran-Allerand, 1999; Tanzer et al., 1999; McEwen et al., 2001; Islamov et al., 2002). In spite of the beneficial actions of estrogen on the nervous system, the opportunities for its wide therapeutic application are severely limited because of its adverse side effects in reproductive organs. Therefore, a search for pharmacological substances with selective estrogenic action on the nervous system is of great practical significance.
Other positive effects:
The HDL cholesterol level is considered a strong inverse predictor of cardiovascular disease .Therefore, the absence of an increase in serum HDL cholesterol levels raises concern that raloxifene may not be as effective as estrogen replacement in preventing cardiovascular disease. Although the findings of animal studies are difficult to generalize to humans, recent animal data have also raised concerns that raloxifene may not prevent the progression of coronary artery disease. Because no long-term trials have been conducted, it is impossible to determine whether the small lipid effects produced by raloxifene correlate with a smaller degree of cardioprotective activity.
Raloxifene vs Tamox
From the above we can infer that Ralox maybe a better choice over Tamox as it lends the following positive effects on use.
a)Increasing bone density
b)Prevention of asthma
c)Nerve regeneration and neuroprotection
d)No changes in serum concentrations of high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol and triglycerides, while reducing LDL levels.
I have requested Eli&Lilly Co makers of Evista if they have reports/studies of heptatoxicity of Raloxifene to compare the effects of Ralox vs Nolva on the Liver. While taking orals have a significant effect on the liver, the least heptatoxic SERM would be the better option during a PCT.
It would be nice if others can contribute to this thread with alternatives.
References:
http://www.medicalpost.com/mpcontent...06_194320_5208
http://www.annieappleseedproject.org/ralverris.html
bca.ns.ca/indice/1999/7index.cgi/noframes/read/23719
http://www.scienceblog.com/community...200115509.html
http://www.cpsp.edu.pk/jcpsp/ARCHIEV...5/Article4.pdf
http://www.drugs.com/cons/Raloxifene.html
http://www.ecu.edu/physio/labakm/SERMs.htm
http://www.acponline.org/chapters/va...ranscript.html
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Thread: Raloxifene for PCT
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06-26-2006, 03:50 PM #1
Raloxifene for PCT
krzna made a thread in the supplement science section about using raloxifene for PCT in about august of '05 and in september he said he was gonna use it for PCT but he never got back to it.... i figured i'd ask in the main supplement section as it would get more attention. please leave input on the use of Raloxifene. heres a quote of what krzna had to say about it
Originally Posted by KrznaMaybe it's hatred I spew, maybe it's food for the spirit
Maybe it's beautiful music I made for you to just cherish
But I'm debated disputed hated and viewed in America
as a motherf**kin drug addict - like you didn't experiment?
Now now, that's when you start to stare at who's in the mirror
and see yourself as a kid again, and you get embarrased
And I got nothin to do but make you look stupid as parents
You f**kin do-gooders - too bad you couldn't do good at marriage!
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06-26-2006, 03:54 PM #2
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06-26-2006, 05:21 PM #3
bizzump
Maybe it's hatred I spew, maybe it's food for the spirit
Maybe it's beautiful music I made for you to just cherish
But I'm debated disputed hated and viewed in America
as a motherf**kin drug addict - like you didn't experiment?
Now now, that's when you start to stare at who's in the mirror
and see yourself as a kid again, and you get embarrased
And I got nothin to do but make you look stupid as parents
You f**kin do-gooders - too bad you couldn't do good at marriage!
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06-26-2006, 06:02 PM #4
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06-26-2006, 07:50 PM #5
ralox good for gyno
ralox less good for htpa recovery
clomid aweosme for htpa recovery
nolva better for a balance between htpa recovery and gyno
torm awesome for htpa recovery
torm is also superior for lowering bad cholesterol and raising good cholesterol as well as bone density.
This is what I know to be true, please correct me if I'm mistaken.Originally Posted by jasonw86
I've been taking nolva from a friend now at 40mg a week and was gonna do the 40/40/20/20 thing. But my nipple is still leaking something.
BTW, we're not gay or anything, we just get bored when our girlfriends are gone and mess around with each other some. A lot of guys do it.
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06-27-2006, 08:10 AM #6Originally Posted by PieEyedPiper
thanks for your input... has anyone heard from Krzna lately?Maybe it's hatred I spew, maybe it's food for the spirit
Maybe it's beautiful music I made for you to just cherish
But I'm debated disputed hated and viewed in America
as a motherf**kin drug addict - like you didn't experiment?
Now now, that's when you start to stare at who's in the mirror
and see yourself as a kid again, and you get embarrased
And I got nothin to do but make you look stupid as parents
You f**kin do-gooders - too bad you couldn't do good at marriage!
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06-27-2006, 08:32 AM #7
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06-27-2006, 09:08 AM #8
There's a lot of new SERMs on the horizon, I made a post about it a few days ago:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=825855
To be honest I don't see Raloxifene catching on for PCT anytime soon. I certainly wouldn't use it for PCT until there was more data on it, and I think most other people are the same. Having said that I do have some (Evista) on hand incase of gyno flare-up, as it's supposed to outperform Nolva in this area. Not had to use it yet tho thankfully
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06-28-2006, 11:41 AM #9
feedback from people who have already used Ralox as part of their PCT would be appreciated. what doses are you running the Ralox at?
i heard Dr. D is already recommending ralox for pctMaybe it's hatred I spew, maybe it's food for the spirit
Maybe it's beautiful music I made for you to just cherish
But I'm debated disputed hated and viewed in America
as a motherf**kin drug addict - like you didn't experiment?
Now now, that's when you start to stare at who's in the mirror
and see yourself as a kid again, and you get embarrased
And I got nothin to do but make you look stupid as parents
You f**kin do-gooders - too bad you couldn't do good at marriage!
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