Hating fat people, Hating fit people, and Hating yourself

[lifequest]

Hating fat people, Hating fit people, and Hating yourself:

As I was sitting here eating my chicken and rice I came across this thread:

“Is it normal to hate fat people?”

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=779342

And it got me thinking…uh oh here comes another LQ psycho babble thread….

First I’d like to say I don’t hate anyone…it’s a mentally draining emotion. But it seems like it’s been brought up a lot that lots of people are fat, they aren’t doing anything about it and it’s getting worse…and it annoys, frustrates, and aggravated many people who have made an effort to change…why? So while I’m waiting for a query to run I’m going to throw together a lot of things I’ve seen here and try to tie it all together.

I link to a lot of threads to save space, all you need to do is read the first post, if it interests you by all means read more but at least read the first post.

I admit this thread is long but it might shed some light on things, and I mean what else am I gona do…work?…let me know what you guys think

First let’s look at both sides from a first person point of view, Raz nj posted this awhile ago, I’m not sure if he oringinaly wrote it

Persons point of view who made a transformation:

"So, what are you doing for a living these days?" Bob asked me. We're sitting on the couch at one of those tedious holiday get-togethers, you know, the ones where you're supposed to be nice to family members you never see except during major holidays and funerals. I think Bob is my wife's brother-in-law's second cousin or something.

"I'm the assistant editor and a writer for Testosterone magazine," I say. Bob looks at me with a blank expression on his face, as if I'd just told him I sell handmade testicle warmers beside the freeway and was looking to open franchises across the nation.

"It's a bodybuilding magazine," I say.

Blank expression. Deer caught in the headlights. Ronnie Coleman doing trigonometry.

"Oh," Bob finally says, "I heard you were, like, one of those bodybuilder guys or something. So, what's that like, you know, working out every day and stuff? I just don't have time to lift weights all day, but I have been meaning to get rid of this beer belly." He takes another sip of beer. "What do you suggest?" Sip.

At first I was a little offended. I wanted to grab him up and say, "You can't tell I'm a bodybuilder?! Look at my ass! Now, if that's not a nice round squat-built piece of sirloin, I don't know what is! You think that comes naturally? I can crack walnuts with this puppy! Wanna see? Huh, punk? Do ya? Do ya?"

Then I realize this just might cause a scene and could cost me several Christmas presents. I was planning on returning any presents I got and using the money to buy a power rack, so I didn't want to jeopardize this gift getting opportunity. I also realized that old Bob probably had a certain preconceived image of a bodybuilder and I just didn't fit that image. I'm not gorilla huge; I weigh about 205 at 5'11" right now. (When I first started lifting I was a pudgy 159, so that's not too shabby.) Also, I wasn't wearing clown pants, a fluorescent string tank top, a hanky on my head and one of those little fanny packs. And isn't that what real bodybuilders are supposed to wear?

Bob continued to sit there drinking his Natural Light, smoking a cigarette and waiting for an answer, oblivious to the fact that he'd come this close to seeing some serious walnut- crunching ass power. I tried to figure out how I could explain to the average guy what the typical T-Man does and why he does it. How could I get him to understand what it is we do, how we feel, how we live? So I took a deep breath and told him something like this:

"Well, Bob, I guess you could use the term bodybuilder if you really need a label for what it is we do. Most of us actually don't stand on stage and compete, though. We lift weights and manipulate our diets so that we'll look good naked. Sure, it's healthy too, and we'll probably live a longer and more productive life than the average guy, but mostly it's about the naked thing. Truthfully, it goes beyond even that.

"Let's be honest here. We do it because of people like you, Bob. We look at you sitting there with your gut hanging over your belt and we watch you grunt and groan just getting out of a chair. Guys like you are our inspiration, Bob. You're better than Anthony Robbins, Bill Phillips, Deepak Chopra, and Zig ****ing Ziglar all wrapped up into one. We love it when guys like you talk about not having time to exercise. Every time we see you munching on a bag of potato chips, you inspire us. You're my shot in the arm, Bob, my living and breathing wake-up call, my own personal success coach.

"You want to know what it is we do? We overcome. We're too busy to train, too, but we overcome. We're too busy to prepare healthy meals and eat them five or six times a day, but we overcome. We can't always afford supplements, our genetics aren't perfect, and we don't always feel like going to the gym. Some of us used to be just like you, Bob, but guess what? We've overcome.

"We like to watch 'normal' people like you tell us about how they can't get in shape. We smile and nod sympathetically like we feel your pain, but actually, we're thinking that you're a pathetic piece of **** that needs to grow a spine and join a gym. You smile sheepishly and say that you just can't stay motivated and just can't stand that feeling of being sore. (For some reason you think that admitting your weaknesses somehow justifies them.) We listen to you ***** and moan. We watch you look for the easy way out. Because of people like you, Bob, we never miss a workout.

"You ask us for advice about diet and training and usually we politely offer some guidance, but deep inside we know you won't take our advice. You know that too. We smile and say, 'Hope that helps. Good luck,' but actually we're thinking, 'Boy, it would suck to be you.' We know that 99% of people won't listen to us. Once they hear that it takes hard work, sacrifice and discipline, they stop listening and tune us out.

"We know they wanted us to say that building a great body is easy, but it just isn't. This did not take five minutes a day on a TorsoTrack. We did not get this way in 12 short weeks using a Bowflex and the Suzanne Somers' 'Get Skinny' diet. A good body does not cost five easy payments of $39.95.

"We like it that while you're eating a candy bar and drinking Mountain Dew, we're sucking down a protein shake. You see, that makes it taste even better to us. While you're asleep we're either getting up early or staying up late, hitting the iron, pushing ourselves, learning, succeeding and failing and rising above the norm with every rep. Can you feel that, Bob? Can you relate? No? Good. This wouldn't be half as fun if you could.

"We do it because we absolutely and totally get off on it. We do it because people like you, Bob, either can't or won't. We do it because what we do in the gym transfers over into the rest of our lives and changes us, physically, mentally, maybe even spiritually. We do it because it beats watching fishing and golf on TV. By the way, do you know what it's like to turn the head of a beautiful woman because of the way you're built? It feels good, Bob. Damned good.

"When we're in the gym, we're in this indescribable euphoria zone. It's a feeling of being on, of being completely alive and aware. If you haven't been there, then it's like trying to describe color to a person who's been blind since birth. Within this haze of pleasure and pain, there's knowledge and power, self-discipline and self-reliance. If you do it long enough, Bob, there's even enlightenment. Sometimes, the answers to questions you didn't even know you had are sitting there on those rubber mats, wrapped up in a neat package of iron plates and bars.

"Want to lose that beer belly, Bob? I have a nutty idea. Put down the ****ing beer. I'll tell you what, Bob. Christmas morning I'm getting up real early and hitting the iron. I want to watch my daughter open her presents and spend the whole day with her, so this is the only time I have to train. The gym will be closed, so I'm going out in my garage to workout. You be at my house at six in the morning, okay? I'll be glad to help you get started on a weight training program. It'll be colder than Hillary Clinton's coochie in there, so dress warm.

"But let me tell you something, Bob. If you don't show up, don't bother asking me again. And don't you ever sit there and let me hear you ***** about your beer belly again. This is your chance, your big opportunity to break out of that rut. If you don't show up, Bob, you've learned a very important lesson about yourself, haven't you? You won't like that lesson.

...more

[lifequest]

"You won't like that feeling in the pit of your stomach either or that taste in your mouth. It will taste worse than defeat, Bob. Defeat tastes pretty goddamned nasty, but what you'll be experiencing will be much worse. It will be the knowledge that you're weak, mentally and physically. What's worse is that you'll have accepted that feeling. The feeling will always be with you. In the happiest moments of your life, it'll be there, lying under the surface like a malignant tumor. Ignore it at your own peril, Bob.

"Don't look at me like that either. This just may be the best Christmas present you'll get this year. Next Christmas, Bob, when I see you again, I'm going to be a little bigger, a little stronger, and a little leaner. What will you be? Will you still be making excuses? This is a gift, Bob, from me to you. I'm giving you the chance to look fate in those pretty eyes of hers and say, 'Step off, *****. This is my party and you're not invited.' What do you say, Bob? Monday, Christmas morning, 6am, my house. The ball's in your court."

Okay, so maybe that's not the exact words I used with Bob, but you get the picture. Will Bob show up Monday? I don't know, but I kind of doubt it. In fact, Bob will probably take me off his Christmas card list. He probably thinks I've got "too much Testosterone," like that's a bad thing. I think Bob is just stuck in a rut, and as the saying goes, the only difference between a rut and a grave is depth

Now the other side of the spectrum:

“What being fat is to me”
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=531263

Sorry if this is a little weird or out of place, mods can delete it if they want, but i wanted to write this because i feel it best explains how i feel and why i'm trying to change it.

I wake up in the morning feeling extremely lethargic, and all i can think about is just staying in bed the entire day and forgetting about everything in the world for a while. I glance down to the floor next to me and see 3 bags of chips, 2 large soda bottles, 4 empty burger packs, 10 cans of diet coke....why? because i dont want to throw them away in the garbage that the rest of the family uses, because i dont want them to see how much i eat.

I check my phone and notice i have a message from my girlfriend. "I love you" she says. I think to myself...why? She is beautiful, gets guys asking for numbers and asking for dates all the time, yet she is with me. I'm fat, why would she be with me? Thats all i can think...i'm fat. i'm fat. i'm fat. I send her a message back, "I love you too sweetie, and i never want to lose you". I mean that too...99% because i love her to death and want to spend my life with her, and 1% because i'm scared if she does leave me i'll die alone. Why? I'm fat.

I get up and make my way to the bathroom, passing a mirror as i go. Great. Looking like **** today buddy....What else is new. I get in the bathroom and brush my teeth in front of the mirror. "Jesus i have tits....and stretch marks, and hair, and my face is fat and...****". I have a shower and get changed, then i head out the door.

I'm tugging at my shirt every 3 seconds because i dont want my tits to show through it. I'm pulling up my pants every 3 seconds because i like baggy clothing...tight clothing makes me want to kill someone. I meet my gf and have a great day...I tell her how i want to be Huge, like vin diesel! i specifically say i dont want to be a pretty boy...not a brad pitt....but more of a manly looking kinda buff like ...vin diesel. Its great dreaming about what i'd look like and how i'd act if i were big like that....

I admire my gf's physique and think about how lucky i am to have found someone so understanding, and someone that just clicks with me on every level, and on top of it she's gorgeous....and it feels wrong. It feels wrong that something so beautiful is with something so ugly. She deserves better...she deserves someone that respects themself, someone that will be alive in 5 years...someone that can live to be a father to her children...not a fatass. I want that guy to be me.

I drop my girlfriend off at work and kiss her on the cheek..."see you later" i say. I take out my ipod and turn on something adrenaline rushing...usually metallica or something hiphop related. I zone out for a minute and picture walkign around town in baggy pants and a black tank top, buff as hell. I see girls looking at me, and i like that they like me, but i also know i have my girl and that'll never change. I like feeling that power. I picture walking up to every bully i ever came across in my life and slapping his beer belly and laughing at him. "Who's a fat **** now, buddy?".

I get to the gym...Yeah i'm psyched, i'm gonna lift my ass off today man. I'm 260lbs, sure, but i got a good solid base of muscle...i'm not weak...nah, i can become buff in no time. I look around and notice everyone is muscular. ****. Suddenly the fantasy is over and i'm tugging at my shirt....my shorts are too short, you can see my fat legs. ****, i'm not lifting enough. **** i'm lifting too much, dont be an idiot. My girlfriend surprises me by showing up at the gym, and comes up to the free weights section to say hi...All the guys are checking her out, as she walks up to me, the fat guy, and kisses him and says hi.

I feel i dont match up. ****, that buff guy could take her from me. ****, that SKINNY guy could take her from me. "Hey honey...uh..i gotta lift, but i'll come to the treadmill in a bit ok?". I kiss her on the cheek and watch her leave....mostly to make sure no one walks up to her to hit on her. What would i do? Most of them are huge buff guys anyways...I gotta get buff, For myself...Gotta stop feeling pity. Gotta look good for me, and for her. She deserves it.

So i lift. The guy next to me smiles....i cant tell if its a good thing, or if he's laughing at the fat guy with the dumbbells. **** him. I lift more. I do my chest, my tri's. I work everything till i'm numb. Then i find my girl and i get on the treadmill next to her and i run. I'm running for my life. I dont want to be 35% bodyfat anymore....She doesn't deserve that, and i dont need to die just yet. This is why i do it....This is why.

So wow quite a difference right?

[lifequest]

Onward!!

This then inspired a ton of people to help Seandon, a quick glance through his journal shows how hard we all tried to help him achieve his goals

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=536297

he was given more support then anyone ever has on here (that I’ve seen) none the less as far as I can tell he failed…

This is one reason fit people don’t like over weight people. We have all ahd the experience of being asked “hoed you lose all that weight?” and then being ignored as we explained. Many fat people contradict themselves. They are unhappy they are fat yet they stuff themselves with crap. They ask how to lose their beer gut while drinking a beer. It’s an insult to us when all our hard work is not respected. When we try to help someone and they lose interest once they realize we didn’t just take a pill, it annoys us. This is one part of the puzzle.

Because Seandon remains fat he’ll have to deal with things Skel talks about in

The social truth about being fat:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=510451

but why the resentment of the over weight?

one excellent point was:

Skel - “Anyone who hates fat people after losing weight does so because they HATE THEMSELVES. You hate the fact that you were like that, you hate the fact that you could possibley 'fall off the wagon' and go back to being like that. You're insecure with your own self image to ridicule someone else's who's an easy target. All that hate you think you have for 'fat people' really just comes full circle because the source of that hatred is your own uncomfort of yourself.”

This is very true and self explanatory.

But there’s another element

The people who were fat and now skinny are a vast minority to those who are just naturally skinny. Why do these people resent fat people. I think it comes down to what Kingofchaos brings up when he says:

“What I love is the irony of racism and discrimination in general. Its perfectly okay to make fun of a fat person, make their lives a living hell for years on end, but if you make a comment about a person's race or mental status and people are ready to linch your ass from a tree like you committed murder or something.”

why?

It is wrong to make fun/judge a person based on race or mental status because these are things one is born with, you can’t change that you are black, white, asian or whatever. But being fat is seen as a CHOICE.

1) Societies view that fat people must be lazy to let themselves get fat
2) Because of this the majority of fat peoples have a total lack of confidence (re-read Seandons post…this is the definition of insecure, now read the BB’s post…can’t you tell how confident he is?)
3) No one likes/wants to be around lazy depressed insecure people(fat, skinny or otherwise).

IMO people who go from fat to fit see such a change in their lives due to their change in attitude. They gain confidence and self respect…this is the major reason they see a change in how they are treated.

Why is it considered lazy to be fat? It’s a matter of perspective. A naturally skinny person says to him self “I would have to eat all day and be a complete slob to ever get that fat.” In his experience it’s rather difficult to gain fat (for now) and to see someone with SO MUCH fat it is assumed that they are created equal and were just lazy to get this way.

In actuality most overweight people hate the way they are, it’s all they think about they have tried to diet a thousand times but always fail

Exhibita - “Most obese people -know- they can lose weight. Most have tried more times then many on the outside know. There is almost a daily ritual which starts with "Today I start my diet" and ends with "Oh well..screwed it up..I'll try again tomarrow."

Rachel - “i used to weigh 215, and i was painfully aware of it, it was in my mind every second, to the point where i was embarrassed to walk down the street. for obese and significantly overweight people, it is very different and affects all aspects of your life to where it cannot be ignored or blocked.”

Also another element is that over weight people resent fit people. They think they were just born blessed and hate that they naturally have what they have tried so hard to get. Fat people think skinny people were just made skinny and skinny people think fat people are lazy…all due to their own perspective.

I’m reading this book that shed some light on this:

“A schema (frame) implicitly selects what will be noted and will not. By directing attention to one pattern of meaning, it ignores others. In this sense, even the most innocuous schema filters experience on the basis of relevancy. This filter of perception becomes a censor when it suppresses available information on the ground that it is not just irrelevant, but forbidden. “ – Vital Lies Simple Truths

This quote has changed how I look at everything in my life…the book is awesome but that’s another story…how does the quote aply to fat people?

Lets say there are two people are a pizza place…
a fat guy (Frank) who has tried to diet a million times but doesn’t have the knowledge base to succed. He failed again and is depressed and goes out to eat…to “feel better”

A fit guy(Bob) who has just finished a 3 month cut and is rewarding himself with a cheat meal at his favorite pizza joint.

When the Frank sees Bob eating a piece of pizza it activates his frame that “skinny people are born this way”. “look at the prick, he can eat what ever he wants and be ripped as hell, I hate him”. However Bob has worked his ass off to get the way he is he is having his one cheat in months. Bob sees this and gets even more depressed and by framing the way he has he justifies accepting his fate “it’s out of my hands I was born to be fat” and eats the whole pizza. The “forbidden thought” the quote refers to would be, “I am responsible for my weight”

Meanwhile the fit guy eating his one cheat meal looks over at the obese guy and fits it to the frame that the fat guy is weak and lazy. Thinking “that guy is eating the whole pizza Jesus what a slob” Bob doesn’t see that Frank has tried for years to lose weight…just the wrong way…if we see a fat person get a chicken sandwhich and a diet coke we frame that as “they’re just fooling themselves, they will faill because they are weak and lazy” what we don’t note is often they try very hard to lose weight but just don’t know how best to.

I feel like I didn’t explain that well but my point is our minds have frames on things and we take the information that reinforces our frames and reject that which does not.

This is all from here:
“Vital Lies and Simple Truths” why so many people are overweight yet do nothing about it

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=807201

[lifequest]

Next:

Our society preaches perfection and overwhelms us with perfect people on TV. These people are about .01% of what the human race actually looks like but we become obsessed with looking like them (case and point: MTV’s “I want a famous face”). If we don’t look like this .01 % we think we are ugly…which can result in a total lack of confidence and self worth. I am starting to see that in life a confident, head up, chest out attitude is the key to happiness and success. Not the “I’m the ****” attitude, but “I am perfectly ok with who and what I am”. I’m sure we all know people like this…and we like them. If you are like this, people like you more, they respect you more, they are happier around you …

Who would you hire, date, want to be friends with?

A person who was lazy, depressed and insecure

A person who looks you right in the eye and projects confidence in who and what they are…think about it...

So being fat produces an attitude that is conducive to undesirable character traits. Most people love the jolly fat kid, who didn’t love Chris Farly...it’s the pessimist we don’t like.

But why is an over weight person insecure?

There was a whole show on this on the discovery channel that I got sucked into watching…I think the scariest study they did was on children in kindergarten. They gave them 10 cards with different pictures of other kids on them. A white kid, and asian, and African, Mexican, Eskimo…and a smiling fat white kid, among others.

They asked children from all over the world to place the cards in order of who they would most like to be friends with. Most of the time the child chose the picture that looked most like them as number one and it varied from there but without fail the fat kid was dead last. The tester would then ask why they put them in that order.

The kids said things like “he is fat, and he is lazy so I wouldn’t want to be his friend.”

“He doesn’t seem nice”

scary sh*t to think even at 5 years old we hate fat people…

So if since you were 5 people treated you poorly because you were over weight how could you not be insecure. It’s a terrible cycle.

A child is born into a family with parents who fill the house with junk food, an over weight family. He has no choice in his fate, with an upbringing like this one is sure to become fat. So now he goes to school and is ridiculed and hated because of his weight. he grows to hate himself and becomes depressed, he tries all he knows to lose weight but fails because food=comfort (because of his upbringing). The more depressed he gets the more he eats. It takes a huge life changing break from their reality to make a conscious change.

So what the hell can be done about it? here’s my theory.

Treat the dangers of obesity like the dangers of cigarettes.

Smoking a cigarette eating a candy bar…same thing?

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=527688

Lets look at it from another angle…smokers

Whenever someone sees a friend smoke they automatically turn into a psycho…

“OMG do you know what that does to your body!??!”
“you know your slowly killing yourself??!?!”
“that’s a disgusting habit”
“why would you smoke?? There’s nothing to gain from it but a short-lived high!!”
“have you not read the heath risk involved with smoking!??!”

And all of this is great and true and totally acceptable(unless your the poor smoker that gets b*tched at 24/7), you should tell your friend these things and after training people from near birth in DARE education and health class and strict law against cigarettes there are now signs of improvements

Now…every thing I said above can be said about obesity…re-read them.

“OMG do you know what that does to your body!??!”
“you know your slowly killing yourself??!?!”
“that’s a disgusting habit”
“why would you over eat/eat unhealthy?? There’s nothing to gain from it but a short-lived high!!”
“have you not read the heath risk involved with obesity!??!”

But if you ever said something like that to a fat person you would ether make them cry or be labeled as a complete ass. When really IMO over eating is as much a choice as Smoking and just as difficult to quit yet many more people are quitting smoking and more and more people are getting fatter(I guess all we need is a fat patch and we’d be set…)

It is completely retarded. And the worst part is that childhood obesity is the number that really starting to clime. Just something to think about…

Many people will not agree with me here but in reality the statistics show that the lowering of your life exspectancy from obesity and smoking is the same…so a fat person will die just as soon as skinny smoker.

Some facts comparing smoking deaths to obesity:

http://www.nih.gov/news/pr/mar2005/nia-16.htm

According to the NEJM report, studies suggest that two-thirds of American adults are overweight (having a body mass index — BMI — of 25 or more) or obese (having a BMI of 30 or more)**. One study cited by the authors indicates that the prevalence of obesity in U.S. adults has increased about 50 percent per decade since 1980. Additional research has shown that people who are severely obese — with a BMI greater than 45 — live up to 20 years less than people who are not overweight. Some researchers have estimated that obesity causes about 300,000 deaths in the U.S. annually. In addition, obesity is fueling an epidemic of type 2 diabetes, which also reduces lifespan.

http://www.efmoody.com/estate/lifeexpectancy.html

Explosion of child obesity predicted to shorten us life expectancy
http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releas...-eoc031605.php
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7209499/


Life expectancy for the fatties. People who were overweight at age 40 really shorten their lifetimes by about 3 years on average. For those who were obese, the losses were 7.1 years for women and 5.4 years for men. It's about the same as seen for smokers. Also, they will die badly.

http://www.bupa.co.uk/health_informa...0604smoke.html

Men who kicked the habit before the age of 30 increased their life expectancy by 10 years, ie they lived as long as if they had never smoked.

So what is my point. Obesity is just a big a problem as smoking and it’s soon going to pass it. I would say legislation should be supported where in D.A.R.E class where we are taught how terrible smoking is it should also be taught how eating nothing but **** food and not exercising is just as much a health risk.

…and that’s all I have to say about that…hahaha

LQ

[Startinup]

Ive been reading alot of your posts and threads and just to tell you, your babble makes my day, I have printed this post and stuck it on my bedroom wall so every morning I wake up and think of the Bob I was, and the LQ I wish one day to become

props bro

[Rachel_n_SD]

great post LQ. the other day at work, I was in the breakroom eating my lunch of fish and veggies, and all the girls from my work came in with a bunch of takeout, i mean, an enormous amount. they put a big plate of cornbread in front of me, which i ignored.

one girl said "god, rachel, how you can you just sit there and not have a piece?"

"because it's not worth it."
"yeah, that's so true, it's really not."
"then why are you eating it? you don't have to. just put it down, there's chicken salad right there."
i got a bunch of blank stares and dirty looks, then they all proceeded to discuss their various diets and how bad they all want to be skinny.

i get so frustrated with these people, when all they do all day is talk about their diets, which they never stay on for longer than 3 days.

you captured my sentiments exactly!

[Mango]

lmao "look at my ass"!! Hahaha!! That made my day!!

[AphtaLyfe]

As I person who went from being 5'6" 180lbs with probably over 30% body fat.
To where I am now at 5'9.5" 157lbs with under 9% body fat.

I can personally relate to the first 2 parts.

The rest of the post was very enlightening and not only that but they were very well organized and interesting reads.

Best post(s) I've ever read on bb.com

Thank you for typing all of that out.

[DAVO17]

This post has made my day. Im fighting the fight right now, and its so nice to know that others are in it too and keeping at it. Perhaps this should be a sticky.

[JaeGee]

Very good read. Thanks LQ. I enjoyed reading the first part the best.

[bleeder]

Great Post LQ!

Coming from being 5'6" @ 230 25+%bf and now being 190 @ 11% cutting, i completely relate to all points of view. --

I WAS the fat guy w/ the hot g/f! A breakup like that i think will push anyone to better themselves. Thats what it took for me to.

[Staberella]

great post LQ. the other day at work, I was in the breakroom eating my lunch of fish and veggies, and all the girls from my work came in with a bunch of takeout, i mean, an enormous amount. they put a big plate of cornbread in front of me, which i ignored.

one girl said "god, rachel, how you can you just sit there and not have a piece?"

"because it's not worth it."
"yeah, that's so true, it's really not."
"then why are you eating it? you don't have to. just put it down, there's chicken salad right there."
i got a bunch of blank stares and dirty looks, then they all proceeded to discuss their various diets and how bad they all want to be skinny.

i get so frustrated with these people, when all they do all day is talk about their diets, which they never stay on for longer than 3 days.

you captured my sentiments exactly!

I don't know how you put up with that on almost (what I'm assuming) a daily basis and not go bat**** crazy. Last week this girl said to me, "Wow your stomach is so flat, I want to lose my pot belly and have abs, how can I do it?" Well, I went on to explain to her that spot reduction is not possible and how she needs to hit the gym 6 days a week and eat 6 small lean protein and low GI carb meals on training days. I could tell from the blank look I lost her somewhere between "Lift weights hard and no more soda and unhealthy snacks." After listening half heartedly to me for about 5 minutes she just blurts out in this nasty tone (You'd have thought that I told her to eat **** from her reaction), "OH MY GOD! 6 DAYS A WEEK! NO F'N WAY! I AM NOT LIFTING WEIGHTS LIKE A MAN! THAT'S GROSS!"

Oh well.

[acd]

LQ, you need to write a book or something. LOL, great post.

Speaking from experience, learned behavior is probably one of the hardest things to deal with. I grew up with an obese family with no interest in health or physical activity. Now that I am a parent and realize all that I've been through b/c of this, it's made me change for the better. I want my children to be healthy so I'm going to show them through example. It's been a bumpy road but I'm getting there. Only 30 more pounds to go, I've lost 60 already.

Nothing in this world can bring me more joy to know that b/c I decided to break this unhealthy pattern, my kids will have a healthier life. Not so long ago I offered my son a sandwich, white bread b/c there was no wheat bread(we were away from home), and he rejected it. He only eats whole wheat bread Boy did that feel good. My little man is well on his way to a healthy life.

[Rachel_n_SD]

I don't know how you put up with that on almost (what I'm assuming) a daily basis and not go bat**** crazy. Last week this girl said to me, "Wow your stomach is so flat, I want to lose my pot belly and have abs, how can I do it?" Well, I went on to explain to her that spot reduction is not possible and how she needs to hit the gym 6 days a week and eat 6 small lean protein and low GI carb meals on training days. I could tell from the blank look I lost her somewhere between "Lift weights hard and no more soda and unhealthy snacks." After listening half heartedly to me for about 5 minutes she just blurts out in this nasty tone (You'd have thought that I told her to eat **** from her reaction), "OH MY GOD! 6 DAYS A WEEK! NO F'N WAY! I AM NOT LIFTING WEIGHTS LIKE A MAN! THAT'S GROSS!"

Oh well.

terrible, isn't it? it is literally several times a day with me. i am going crazy, i've started to be really blunt with them. i used to smile sympathetically, like LQ said, and say "yeah, i understand, it's hard, but..."
one time I even went so far as to make these girls a spreadsheet in excel with workout plan and diet. they didn't do it, and instead, stuck to their routine of walking 20 minutes, twice a week, like that's going to do anything.

now, i've gotten to the point where i say stuff like above (why don't you just stop eating it, then?) or worse. the other day I flat out said "you know what, i'm not giving you any more advice because you don't listen anyways."

or a couple weeks ago. "you aren't ON south beach. you are TRYING to do south beach. you are not on a diet unless you actually stick to it for more than a day at a time"

[Staberella]

terrible, isn't it? it is literally several times a day with me. i am going crazy, i've started to be really blunt with them. i used to smile sympathetically, like LQ said, and say "yeah, i understand, it's hard, but..."
one time I even went so far as to make these girls a spreadsheet in excel with workout plan and diet. they didn't do it, and instead, stuck to their routine of walking 20 minutes, twice a week, like that's going to do anything.

now, i've gotten to the point where i say stuff like above (why don't you just stop eating it, then?) or worse. the other day I flat out said "you know what, i'm not giving you any more advice because you don't listen anyways."

or a couple weeks ago. "you aren't ON south beach. you are TRYING to do south beach. you are not on a diet unless you actually stick to it for more than a day at a time"

Haha, I might have to start taking the blunt approach. I just kind of sucked it up and told her, "Yeah if lifting weights isn't your thing, I don't know what else to tell you." What I should have said was, "It isn't any grosser than walking around with a muffin top."

[lifequest]

Wow glad to see people agly approve…I’m waiting for the eminent flame…

Also… I forgot something, Damnit!!. It’s what Rachel was talking about.

I also constantly get harassed at work and school for what I eat and how often I work out(4 times a week ::GASP:: .)

Socially rude not to accept food…

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=808132

That is also another cause of resentment I forgot to bring up. Nobody that has worked hard for a goal that is very important to them likes it when they are ridiculed for it. Not 10 minutes ago I was offered a tootsie roll pop and I said
“oh thank you but I just ate” the response was a frown and a
“oh common it’s just a lolly pop!!”
“really I’m fine but thank you”
::Scoff:: “oh you are no fun”

Now as it was put this drives me “bat **** crazy” and over time would cause most people to disassociate themselves from people who belittle things that are so important to them.

You can see how Rachel is just fed up with the ladys at work.

I went through something similar at my fraternity in college. I left for 8 months to intern a fat smoking pessimistic jerk. I came back at 7% bf with 20 more lbs of muscle with a completely different attitude. People went nuts and wanted to know what my “secret was”, was I on steroids, what fat burner did I take? The first few times I went into an in depth explanation of macronutrient ratios, max-ot, HIIT cardio and they immediately lost interest. I soon gain the reputation of being “obsessed” and got the nick name “roid” which annoyed me because it was trying to demean what I had done. So I realize people don’t want to be preached at about health…they have to make the decision to change for themselves. I now no longer waste my time on trying to show people the light. When I’m asked for help/advice I give them my BFFM (Burn the fat feed the muscle) to read and say after you read this well sit down and write out a plan for you…to date I’ve asked about 200 people I know to read it and 3 have…all of who are now substantially healthier…go figure.

Some might take what Rachel and I do as a “Holier then thou” attitude but it’s really just avoiding being ridiculed. I don’t want to be told what I’m doing is strange or “obsessive” and be accused of being on steroids it pisses me off so I resent those who ridicule me…fit people don’t like over weight people making fun of them for eating “cat food/bird food/cow food” and fat people don’t like it when skinny people are “on a diet”, thinking “why are they on a diet if they are so skinny, they can eat anything and be skinny, why won’t they eat the damn lollypop!?!?!?...make sense?

[rmhildeb]

That first post was awesome. If it was shorter, or paraphrased or something, it should be on a t-shirt. i'd buy one.

that article was awesome, kudos LQ

[acd]

Since we're on this topic which I think is very important b/c it deals alot with the physcological area of weight loss, what information do you have about learned behavior? I'm going through the process of changing this but I would appreciate more info. Thanks.

[JaeGee]

LQ mind takin a look at my journal and give me some tips on anything you see wrong with my diet, lifting routine, and lifting exercises?

I dunno how you could get flamed for this, to most here it makes sense and it really is aggrevating trying to help people or when people ask how you can lose so much weight and when you say anything that involves health, protein, gym, they gasp and sort of create a 10sec one liner out of the conversation so they don't have to listen to it anymore. Also link to your BFFM, not sure what the acronym stands for.

[Dave P]

That thread was the perfect length. Gave me just enough time to slowly munch on my breakfast and down a couple cups of water. As always...great thread LQ. I cant think of a single point I disagree'd with you on.

[kaplanfx]

"You want to know what it is we do? We overcome. We're too busy to train, too, but we overcome. We're too busy to prepare healthy meals and eat them five or six times a day, but we overcome. We can't always afford supplements, our genetics aren't perfect, and we don't always feel like going to the gym. Some of us used to be just like you, Bob, but guess what? We've overcome.

This is inspiration, I'm going to print it out and put it on my wall. Thanks!

-Kap

[P01Shooter]

LQ, you've mentioned it before but what do that gives you time to write out some of the best posts on bb.com? What end goal do you have with the psychology? I'm just curious since this topic seems to drive you.

I'm at the point that if people ask what I do or if I'll help them I tell them where my gym is and if they're serious I'll see them at 5 am with a free pass before they go to work. It weeds them out better than anything else I've said to people.

Edit:

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to lifequest again. Ugh.


I also believe that in order for one to change we must be able to see ourselves in that future role. If we think we're a fat and lazy slob we will be. If we think we're a lean mean sex machine it will be. If we believe that we'll always be poor and that the man will always keep us down we'll always be poor. I'm a firm believer that the body is built in the mind before the gym and kitchen.

[DJohnson]

Poor SeanDon, maybe we'll catch him back here in a couple years and he'll be ready.

I'm getting to the point where I look pretty lean in a tight shirt and I've been feeling guilty if I go out for a cheat meal. I mean what if I'm in some fast food place and a 7 year old kid looks at me and thinks "OK, there's the strongest guy I've seen all day, and he's at McDonalds" and instantly, getting strong is subconciously associated with eating McDonalds.

Overthinking it a bit but imagine the message that would get across if every single person in the McDonalds was 400lbs. It'd probably drill in McDonalds=Fat so hard into the 7 year old he'd have nightmares about McDonalds.

[Staberella]

Poor SeanDon, maybe we'll catch him back here in a couple years and he'll be ready.

I'm getting to the point where I look pretty lean in a tight shirt and I've been feeling guilty if I go out for a cheat meal. I mean what if I'm in some fast food place and a 7 year old kid looks at me and thinks "OK, there's the strongest guy I've seen all day, and he's at McDonalds" and instantly, getting strong is subconciously associated with eating McDonalds.

Overthinking it a bit but imagine the message that would get across if every single person in the McDonalds was 400lbs. It'd probably drill in McDonalds=Fat so hard into the 7 year old he'd have nightmares about McDonalds.

*LOL* I've had similiar thoughts as you, I usually go to Hooters though for my cheat meals and I do wonder if I'm somehow sending the wrong message by eating complete and total crap in large quantities. I'm sure there are some who would look at me and look at what I eat on my cheat days and think to themselves, "Hmmm it must be genetic so there's no point in me even trying." or "Hey, she's eating pure junk and it's obvious that she works out, maybe I can eat whatever I want as long as I get some exercise in."

[P01Shooter]

Also link to your BFFM, not sure what the acronym stands for.

Burn the Fat, Feed the Muscle by Tom Venuto
www.burnthefat.com

[JaeGee]

Ah thanks man, I was thinking in context of a forum post. I was looking into that last week when a post was made about it. My gf said she would buy it for me as part of my bday present

Thanks again!

[Rachel_n_SD]

*LOL* I've had similiar thoughts as you, I usually go to Hooters though for my cheat meals and I do wonder if I'm somehow sending the wrong message by eating complete and total crap in large quantities. I'm sure there are some who would look at me and look at what I eat on my cheat days and think to themselves, "Hmmm it must be genetic so there's no point in me even trying." or "Hey, she's eating pure junk and it's obvious that she works out, maybe I can eat whatever I want as long as I get some exercise in."

Actually, people have actually approached me during cheats, or family members have asked me how i stay so thin when i just ate like 12 tacos and two pieces of flan, or an extra large value meal or whatever. i always explain that i only do this once every two weeks or so, and the rest of the time i am good. they dont really understand.

i was thinking about the 'holier than thou' thing LQ mentioned-i bet they do think of me like that, actually I know for a fact they do, just from the look on their fat faces, because i do have that attitude, but I say, F it. losing 90 lbs was such a feat that i think a little smugness is justified!

[Staberella]

Actually, people have actually approached me during cheats, or family members have asked me how i stay so thin when i just ate like 12 tacos and two pieces of flan, or an extra large value meal or whatever. i always explain that i only do this once every two weeks or so, and the rest of the time i am good. they dont really understand.

i was thinking about the 'holier than thou' thing LQ mentioned-i bet they do think of me like that, actually I know for a fact they do, just from the look on their fat faces, because i do have that attitude, but I say, F it. losing 90 lbs was such a feat that i think a little smugness is justified!

Hell yeah you deserve to be smug, I saw your recent pic when you had it in your sig and I thought to myself, "HOLY MOLY! She looks like Tomb Raider." . What I hate on my cheat days is when someone who forgets that I allow myself cheat days looks all smug and says, "Is THAT allowed on your diet?!" I usually tell them, "Even God takes off on Sundays."

[P01Shooter]

Actually, people have actually approached me during cheats, or family members have asked me how i stay so thin when i just ate like 12 tacos and two pieces of flan, or an extra large value meal or whatever. i always explain that i only do this once every two weeks or so, and the rest of the time i am good. they dont really understand.

i was thinking about the 'holier than thou' thing LQ mentioned-i bet they do think of me like that, actually I know for a fact they do, just from the look on their fat faces, because i do have that attitude, but I say, F it. losing 90 lbs was such a feat that i think a little smugness is justified!

This is too funny! We all have our cheat stories that make people go hmmm. I go out to dinner with a bunch of people from Habitat every two weeks or so and I'm always the one ordering an appetizer, one or two entrees, and dessert. They think I eat like that all the time but it's only with them and I always make it a leg day so it's alright.

[Rachel_n_SD]

This is too funny! We all have our cheat stories that make people go hmmm. I go out to dinner with a bunch of people from Habitat every two weeks or so and I'm always the one ordering an appetizer, one or two entrees, and dessert. They think I eat like that all the time but it's only with them and I always make it a leg day so it's alright.

a few weeks ago, i cheated at work. i was wearing workout clothes and covered in sweat, after running 5 miles. so im eating, and they're all like "where do you put it all, you must have a hollow leg..."

i love how they came to the conclusion that i have a fast metabolism, overlooking the fact that i am red, panting, and perspiring.