Hey guys just got a question or two about westside (http://www.elitefts.com/documents/training-methods.htm article by Louie Simmons).
Firstly - Where hes talking about reversal strength with stretch reflexes (2-4 second reflex) he mentions how you should relax the muscles for eg when sitting on a box during a box squat. I understand the ideas of a stretch reflex but i always was under the impression that the muscle had to still have isometric tension in it while its at that end of the eccentric phase position (eg sitting on the box) however he mentions you should relax whilst on the box? Can muscles retain the stretch reflex for 2-4 seconds after the eccentric portion even if they are relaxed at the end of the eccentric?
Secondly - He gives a few examples of movements to relax at the end of the eccentric with, the box squat and the board press are two of them. Is it actually possible to fully relax your squatting muscles when you sit on a box? I know its possible to relax your muscles while the weight sits on the boards in a board press however from personal experience i find it near impossible to relax when on a box, i would imagine my form going to ****.
Ive been box squatting for a while however ive always kept myself tight round the core and glutes whilst on the box before exploding off (guess its lucky i reread some articles for when is start training again!).
Anyway, any opinions on these questions are greatly appriciated.
Thanks guys
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Thread: Westside Theory Question
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04-25-2006, 10:41 AM #1Norse Force
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Westside Theory Question
"In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
Fryed Chykenz for lyfe: mcxk
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04-25-2006, 10:48 AM #2Registered User
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What he means is that you fully sit on the box and relax your hips. Your quads, hamstrings back abs etc should still be tight. Think about sitting back onto the box then you relax onto it rock back then forward and get back up. Correct me anyone if I am wrong here. There are others who just sit onto the box without the rock then get back up. Whatever feels more comfortable to you but make sure you are fully sitting onto the box.
"Powerlifters put it deeper in the hole."
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04-25-2006, 03:17 PM #3Where do I go from here?
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Never rock forward to get up. You push back with the head and back to start the movement. Your ass then follows. Good assesment though.Originally Posted by Mateo_66
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04-26-2006, 10:18 PM #4Norse Force
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bump
"In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
Fryed Chykenz for lyfe: mcxk
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04-27-2006, 05:01 AM #5bat country
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Good post. When box squats first became poplar it was normal to rock a little. Everything I've read that was written recently says not to rock forward but do relax your hips while the rest of you stays tight.Originally Posted by Mateo_66Training Journal:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=142931161
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04-28-2006, 09:53 AM #6Norse Force
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Thanks for the replies but can anyone help me out with my questions, thanks.
"In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
Fryed Chykenz for lyfe: mcxk
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04-28-2006, 11:41 AM #7Registered User
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You are thinking too much
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04-29-2006, 10:46 AM #8Norse Force
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Possibly... but nothing wrong with understanding what you are doing and preaching :P
"In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
Fryed Chykenz for lyfe: mcxk
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05-01-2006, 03:31 AM #9Norse Force
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bump. Someone has to know.
"In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
Fryed Chykenz for lyfe: mcxk
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05-09-2006, 08:25 AM #10Norse Force
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*gives thread CPR*
"In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
Fryed Chykenz for lyfe: mcxk
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05-09-2006, 10:42 AM #11Registered User
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Can you maintain a stretch reflex in a relaxed muscle, no. can you even have a stretch reflex in a relaxed muscle, no. Are you mis-interpreting the quote, yes. The stretch reflex is about storing and releasing elastic potential energy in your muscles, obviously this cant happen when a muscle is relaxed. (*Mini Rant*This(this being the theory crap) truly has no practical application to your lifting. If you want to spend a lot of time thinking about what will make you stronger, constantly evaluating your form and your strengths and weakness is what will help, not pondering questions of exercise physiology.)
When he says to relax on the box he means dont just lightly touch the box with your glutes and stand up. You sit to the box, pause on the box for a moment while maintaining tightness in your torso, glutes, hamstrings, feet, etc. and then explode off the box while still maintaining that tightness in your body.Charlie Telesco
220lb Junior Powerlifter
1757 total
661 sq
518 b
578 dl
University of California at Santa Cruz
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05-09-2006, 11:12 AM #12Banned
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Yes, you have to have isometric contraction to use the stretch reflex.
the whole point of relaxing on a box is to remove the stretch reflex i believe. Therefore this builds power out of the hole and when you do squat without the box, you will have a stretch reflix PLUS the power out of the hole which gives you the ability to lift much more weight
at least i think
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