BCAA + Cardio on empty...

[FilthyPleb]

Being a student I am always in a rush in the mornings and as such I can't always catch something to eat before my morning HIIT session. However, I always down a pr shake shortly after my cardio.

I know about the "myths" of burning more fat when doing cardio in a fasted state, so I'll make it clear by saying that is not my intention.

My question is this: Will I burn muscle as a source of energy even if I am supplementing BCAA?

Appreciated,

Calvin.

P.s. If this has been answered numerous times then feel free to post a link as I couldn't find a definitive answer in my search.

[RB12]

yes, bcaa's can be beneficial in lieu of fasted cardio, but there are a number of things to consider. You should also have some carbs imo. Cortisol tends to be high upon waking and carbs can help lower it, it can also help through your workout.

why not have a shake in the morning; hell make it the night before. Mix up some water+whey+oats and perhaps some fruit, leave it in a cap in the fridge, slam before leaving for class.

Really, the best thing you can do for yourself when you wake up is provide some food to get your body going again

[FilthyPleb]

yes, bcaa's can be beneficial in lieu of fasted cardio, but there are a number of things to consider. You should also have some carbs imo. Cortisol tends to be high upon waking and carbs can help lower it, it can also help through your workout.

why not have a shake in the morning; hell make it the night before. Mix up some water+whey+oats and perhaps some fruit, leave it in a cap in the fridge, slam before leaving for class.

Really, the best thing you can do for yourself when you wake up is provide some food to get your body going again

Cheers RB, I tried that...the thing is from waking up, I am in the gym almost 10 minutes later meaning that whatever I eat/drink doesn't have time to settle. Usually meaning I feel a little ill while hitting the cardio.

But I like the idea of refrigerating a shake the night before ready for morn. However, I always find that it separates when left for too long...is there anyway around this (i.e certain containers)?

[RB12]

Cheers RB, I tried that...the thing is from waking up, I am in the gym almost 10 minutes later meaning that whatever I eat/drink doesn't have time to settle. Usually meaning I feel a little ill while hitting the cardio.

But I like the idea of refrigerating a shake the night before ready for morn. However, I always find that it separates when left for too long...is there anyway around this (i.e certain containers)?

gotcha, didnt realize you were in the gym so quickly, but i can sympathize. alternatives:

(1) get up a little earlier, like 15 min. earlier. Whey shake is usually advised 20-30 min pre workout, you alreayd have 10, so not a big leap

(2) go with something free form, bcaas are ok, i would more likely suggest and eaa formula. i am using Optium Vassive EA-8 right night and adding my own carbs, but Xtreme Formulations Vendetta is carbs+eaa, tastes/mixes absolutely fantastic. If you go with a carb free free form product like a bcaa or vassive ea8, add carbs. Cytosport Cytomax is a great carb product that tastes amazing, my fav is cool citrus

not really certain containers that will stop the separation, but what you can do is blend everything in a blender before bed, put it into a shaker cup and then refrigerate. than when you wake up, give it a couple shakes and it will be mixed up again.

[FilthyPleb]

(1) get up a little earlier, like 15 min. earlier. Whey shake is usually advised 20-30 min pre workout, you alreayd have 10, so not a big leap

(2) go with something free form, bcaas are ok, i would more likely suggest and eaa formula. i am using Optium Vassive EA-8 right night and adding my own carbs, but Xtreme Formulations Vendetta is carbs+eaa, tastes/mixes absolutely fantastic. If you go with a carb free free form product like a bcaa or vassive ea8, add carbs. Cytosport Cytomax is a great carb product that tastes amazing, my fav is cool citrus

not really certain containers that will stop the separation, but what you can do is blend everything in a blender before bed, put it into a shaker cup and then refrigerate. than when you wake up, give it a couple shakes and it will be mixed up again.

Yeah I think it might be a case of having to get up a little earlier (problematic sleeper you see, in bed @ 2-3am most nights) as the second alternative isn't viable just yet due to recent investment in supp's.

I had read that Cytosport Cytomax was something to consider, so perhaps next month I'll buy some in the place of one of my other supps (may drop N0X if it turns out to be ineffective).

P.s. Rather than me creating a separate thread...is there anything you could suggest that my help me sleep? Lack of sleep, if anything, will be the factor that could slow my gains.

Appreciated.

Calvin

[RB12]

yes, lack of sleep is a problem. do you have a real sleeping disorder or is this something stress induced or similar?

if you have a real sleep disorder, see a doc, get a script fo something like ambien or whatever else he thinks is in your best interest.

if stress related, restless nights, i know of two real viable considerations. (1) melatonin, (2) zma. for Melatonin, read some of the info on the main bb.com site, but in general, it may help you go to bed faster if you are restless.

(2) zma, which was touted as a great test producing supp, is b.s., however, it does help you remain asleep if you fall asleep and tend to wake up. ignore all the gh/test stuff said about it

[FilthyPleb]

About my sleep, I have been to the doctors on numerous occasions and they state that they prefer not to prescribe drugs to aid in sleep to "young" people. Their reasoning is that one can become dependent on them for sleep.

I believe my sleeping pattern is likely stress induced as it has been this way for near enough 6 years now. I can find myself tired but the second I am in bed my mind just races and I struggle to sleep; I have to be absolutely exhausted until I fall asleep.

After what you have said, it appears that melatonin could be a viable option. I am desperate to sort my sleeping pattern so I think I'll order some. I've read a few articles and research on melatonin, however, I have no idea if one product is better than the other (all they all made equal when it comes to this?).

Could you possibly check this link to see if it is a reasonable product? I'd really appreciate it.

http://www.agestop.net/Agestop/produ...ID=113&CID=89#

I read that valerian (sp?) root is effective when it comes to aiding sleep...any insight?

[RB12]

i have no experience with no personal experience with Valerian, but here is some info:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/val.html

You may also consider checking out phenibut:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/phen.html

I am also not familiar with the company for which you sent the link, so i cannot comment on the caliber or quality of the company. I assume you sent me that as you can get a good deal on it in Brittan, but I would suggest looking for a supplier (if not bb.com) for a company known for teh quality of their product like NOW Foods:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/now/mel.html

[FilthyPleb]

I am from Britain so if I were to order from BB.com it would cost me quite a lot with packaging etc. But what I'll do is look for a UK distributor of the NOW products.

I'll have a read through the links you provided. Again, thankyou for the well informed advice.

With any luck, I'll be sleeping in no time

[FilthyPleb]

RB, could I possibly quiz you on my stack for a second?

I am supp'ing Creatine Mono, Fish Oil, Multivit, BCAA, Man Power Body Octane and N0X; I'm looking to add a thermogenic (San Tight) but haven't as yet as I'm unsure as to whether that could mean too much caffine and thus have detrimental effects on my health/training?

Also, there is an EU and a US version of San Tight both of which are available from the store. The US version is slightly more expensive...is there any difference that you know of?

Apologies for all the questions.

[RB12]

no worries.

Creatine Mono, Fish Oil, Multivit, BCAA, Man Body Octane are good.

N0X? As in in Xyience or CEL? Xyience imo are typically overpriced and underdosed. if you have it, sure finish it; if you are considering getting it, i would lay off. IMO and as is supported by recent science, you dont really need NO products and if you are looking for that pump, the BO should suffice.

Are you cutting or bulking right now? I do not know the difference bt tight US and tight GB, I am sure there is some ingredient that is not permitted in GB, though. Tight is a good product though, as is man scorch as an alternative. but regardless, if you are bulking you dont need either.

[FilthyPleb]

The N0 product is the BSN N0 Xplode. It's just arrived so I'll finish the tub (1st day today), but I'm not expecting too much from it.

I am currently bulking (until May/Jun) but adding a little more fat than I'd like even with regular HIIT. I was considering Tight as I have a shoot coming at the end of March so ideally I'd like to continue the bulk and slow the gain in fat. My diet is 95% clean btw.

If you don't think it will have any effect then I'll probably pass and save myself wasting cash.

[RB12]

gotcha. yes, save the thermos for cutting, they will not provide the effect you want. if you are gaining more fat then you want, then you might be taking in too many cals or have your macro balance off. i would adjust diet first (there is the cleanliness, which it sounds like you have down; and the balance and timing). here are some ideas to consider:
- 6+ meals per day, focus on whole foods (chicken, fish, beef, oats, veggies, fruits, nuts, natural pb, milk, etc.)
- first thing in the mornign and pre and post workout have a shake with a scoop of whey+cup of oats+water or milk
- Use these calculators to calculate maintenance:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/issa64.htm
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/idssports3.htm
- Then go to fitday.com and input your diet. Shoot for a 40%/40%/20% macro breakdown for carbs/protein/cals for a bulk and 35/45/25 for a cut
- Start by tweaking your cals to be about 500 over maintenance and increase from there in increments of 100 or so until you break weight gain plateau for a bulk or Start at about 10% under mantenance and decrease by 100 for a cut until you start to loose

[FilthyPleb]

gotcha. yes, save the thermos for cutting, they will not provide the effect you want. if you are gaining more fat then you want, then you might be taking in too many cals or have your macro balance off. i would adjust diet first (there is the cleanliness, which it sounds like you have down; and the balance and timing). here are some ideas to consider:
- 6+ meals per day, focus on whole foods (chicken, fish, beef, oats, veggies, fruits, nuts, natural pb, milk, etc.)
- first thing in the mornign and pre and post workout have a shake with a scoop of whey+cup of oats+water or milk
- Use these calculators to calculate maintenance:
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/issa64.htm
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/idssports3.htm
- Then go to fitday.com and input your diet. Shoot for a 40%/40%/20% macro breakdown for carbs/protein/cals for a bulk and 35/45/25 for a cut
- Start by tweaking your cals to be about 500 over maintenance and increase from there in increments of 100 or so until you break weight gain plateau for a bulk or Start at about 10% under mantenance and decrease by 100 for a cut until you start to loose

Brilliant. Yeah I use fitday, but as you say I think the problem could be my macro: current PCF 40/30/30. I'll use the links/information provided and tweak my eating until I get it right.

[RB12]

Brilliant. Yeah I use fitday, but as you say I think the problem could be my macro: current PCF 40/30/30. I'll use the links/information provided and tweak my eating until I get it right.

yeah, i would say for fat% is high. i would suggest the above break downs of around 40/40/20 p/c/f or 20/60/20 p/c/f, but regardless, lower your fat%

[FilthyPleb]

Tweaked my cals on the 40/40/20. I should hopefully have more energy on this also.

However, the 20/60/20...I've never heard of a ratio like that. The protein intake seems really low and the carbs too high?

[RB12]

well, i throw it out there bc it is what is suggested according to the joint publication of the American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM), American Dietetic Association (ADA) and Dieticians of Canada (DC)

PROTEIN:
endurance athletes 1.2 - 1.4 g / kg body weight
strength trained athletes 1.6 - 1.7 g / kg body weight
author's comment
"some good references feel 1.8 - 2.0 g / kg body weight may be beneficial for some strength athletes."

CARBS:
6-10 g / kg body weight.

FAT:
15-25 % of cals.

[FilthyPleb]

well, i throw it out there bc it is what is suggested according to the joint publication of the American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM), American Dietetic Association (ADA) and Dieticians of Canada (DC)

PROTEIN:
endurance athletes 1.2 - 1.4 g / kg body weight
strength trained athletes 1.6 - 1.7 g / kg body weight
author's comment
"some good references feel 1.8 - 2.0 g / kg body weight may be beneficial for some strength athletes."

CARBS:
6-10 g / kg body weight.

FAT:
15-25 % of cals.

I'll read up on that as it sounds interesting and would completely differ to anything I have done before.