Oh boy, vegans...

[KrushR]

ahem - supersize me morgan spurtlock 2001 a vegan couldnt eat that ****e! being a vegan means you take an interest in your diet unlike some people who simply fuel up at maccy d's EACH DAY I GUESS THATS THE POINT BEING MADE sorry for caps!

ahem - Spurlock's girlfriend was a vegan, not him. Facts, facts, facts.

[ChocoChick]

Can you link me to the studies?

Tufts University School of Medicine, New England Medical Center Hospital, Boston, MA 02111.

Recent studies of vegetarian diets and their effects on morbidity and mortality are reviewed... Data are strong that vegetarians are at lesser risk for obesity, atonic constipation, lung cancer, and alcoholism. Evidence is good that risks for hypertension, coronary artery disease, type II diabetes, and gallstones are lower. Data are only fair to poor that risks of breast cancer, diverticular disease of the colon, colonic cancer, calcium kidney stones, osteoporosis, dental erosion, and dental caries are lower among vegetarians.

As well, the September 2003 issue of the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition featured a supplement on vegetarian diets and presented finding from several studies on health and longevity.

Some studies:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum

There's more, but that's all I have time for now.

[A_C]

Ok, I am considering taking a big step and going vegan. However, I know that getting the proper nutrition will be VERY tough, especially since I eat so often at the school cafeteria.

All you vegans (and even those who aren't), what are some common foods that people don't know have animal products in them? What is a good replacement for protein since I lift weights? What do I need to make sure I eat to get all of my nutrition?

Thanks,
Fallen

For every cow u dont eat, ima eat 2.
For every chicken you dont eat, ima eat 4.
And etc,
Good luck.

[Jamesstout]

i didnt say he was a vegan i said a vegan couldnt eat the ****e he did and thus couldnt do that to his body.

[KrushR]

ahem - supersize me morgan spurtlock 2001 a vegan couldnt eat that ****e!

i didnt say he was a vegan i said a vegan couldnt eat the ****e he did and thus couldnt do that to his body.

arrugh?

Perhaps if you use punctuation, we could understand you. Maybe. Throw in some sentence structure and you might just have a point.


or not.

[bonbonsrgood]

Hey, I'm a lot like you in the sense that I'm a happy vegetarian going against the norm , and honestly wish I would have been all my life. I admire your desire to remain strong in your beliefs even when they are at odds with the majority, WITHOUT putting down those who think differently than you. A huge thumbs up....Anyhoot, I get my proteins from beans and soy mock type of burgers. But I mostly get it from beans. There are soOooOOoOO many different types of beans out there that it isn't even funny.

However, I do eat yogurt, but ONLY organic made dairy products. They treat the animals better there also because they like actually give the animals foods they were meant to eat and don't inject them with growth hormones. Which is the same with soy products and meat products that are not natural/organic. These are one of those you don't want to know what happens with these foods kind of situations. But, I won't get into that.

I've used Tempeh. It's a grain type of substance. You can break it into ground crumbles or slice it lenthwise and place into sandwhiches. It doesn't matter. I've only had it once, but i'm going to send you a private message with other alternatives to veggie protein.

Also for a f.y.i, long term speaking, toOo much protein is bad for your kidneys.
But then again, just about anything (except for water maybe?) in excess is bad for you.

For another f.y.i, Bill Pearl, a2 X Mr. Universe, was a vegetarian!!! So he repped very well didn't he?

Yes, that is true. Originally there had been studies done that said the only way to get complete proteins was from meat sources, but a doctor in the early 1990's refuted that...

As for an earlier question, I am a vegetarian because I don't believe it is necessary to kill living things to stay alive. I am considering becoming a vegan because I have recently seen how dairy producing animals are treated...

Also, does anyone have any information on tempeh and what it does? (I have never even heard of it...)

Finally, I am looking into not being a vegan, but making sure I use dairy products only from companies that treat their animals fairly. Sure, I sound like a pussy animal lover, but I don't give a crap. Anyone know any good places to buy from legitimate 'nice' companies?

[Jamesstout]

arrugh?

Perhaps if you use punctuation, we could understand you. Maybe. Throw in some sentence structure and you might just have a point.


or not.

Maybe, but then its an internet forum! If i was going to make a point on someone's punctuation i WOULD start it with a capital letter....

[butthash]

As for an earlier question, I am a vegetarian because I don't believe it is necessary to kill living things to stay alive. I am considering becoming a vegan because I have recently seen how dairy producing animals are treated...

I never really got vegetarians who don't eat meat because they want living things to stay alive. If you really followed that, about all you'd be able to eat would be rocks. I'm not aware of to many plants that were never alive. Why does one form of life have so much more right to continue living than another.

Pretty much every animal that is killed for food now adays only existed in the first place because it was going to be used for food. That animal owes its life to the very fact that someday it will be killed and eaten. Would you rather live and die, or never have lived at all?

In reality, most normal people could benefit from a little less meat in their diet. With bodybuilding its a different story. I design nutritional programs for all different kinds of people and vegans are a pain in the ass. I think most people can get buy just fine with eggs, dairy, and fish though.

So, in conclusion. If you want to be a vegan, go ahead. There is nothing wrong with it and it is not impossible to be a vegan and be healthy. Look at how unhealthy most americans who eat meat are. But don't expect to every excel in bodybuilding on a strict vegan diet.

[KrushR]

vegans are a pain in the ass.

IMHO, you could have stopped right there.

[KrushR]

Maybe, but then its an internet forum! If i was going to make a point on someone's punctuation i WOULD start it with a capital letter....

You don't seem to understand. When you wrote "morgan spurtlock 2001 a vegan...", you're saying he's a vegan. Had you written "morgan spurtlock 2001. A vegan..." and started a new sentence, then we would have understood.

and yeah... I bet you would also capitalize your "I"s as well. I quit being a grammar/spelling nazi except when people have no clue how to communicate in a thread; take yourself for example. Punctuation, capitalization and spaces are your friends. Live it, learn it, love it.

[chronicpsb]

Tufts University School of Medicine, New England Medical Center Hospital, Boston, MA 02111.

Recent studies of vegetarian diets and their effects on morbidity and mortality are reviewed... Data are strong that vegetarians are at lesser risk for obesity, atonic constipation, lung cancer, and alcoholism. Evidence is good that risks for hypertension, coronary artery disease, type II diabetes, and gallstones are lower. Data are only fair to poor that risks of breast cancer, diverticular disease of the colon, colonic cancer, calcium kidney stones, osteoporosis, dental erosion, and dental caries are lower among vegetarians.

As well, the September 2003 issue of the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition featured a supplement on vegetarian diets and presented finding from several studies on health and longevity.

Some studies:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum

There's more, but that's all I have time for now.

Thanks, there is some interesting info in there.

It seems like one major advantage vegetarians have is that their diet is much higher in fiber than the average "normal" person. Also most vegetarians are much more health concious.

[chronicpsb]

Also for a f.y.i, long term speaking, toOo much protein is bad for your kidneys.
But then again, just about anything (except for water maybe?) in excess is bad for you.

This is wrong. Unless you have preexisting kidney problems, a relatively high protein intake is fine given adequate water intake.

Also in case you weren't aware, hypoatraemia (water intoxification) is a possibility.

[butthash]

IMHO, you could have stopped right there.

I meant, vegans are a pain in the ass to design nutritional programs for.

[Jamesstout]

I understand what was wrong, just can't be arsed to change it. The thing with the I is because word does it for me!

I reckon the fact that vegans HAVE to read labels etc will make them more food aware at least

[melon]

This is wrong. Unless you have preexisting kidney problems, a relatively high protein intake is fine given adequate water intake.

Also in case you weren't aware, hypoatraemia (water intoxification) is a possibility.

I take it that was a typo, I assume you meant hyponatraemia, just to clear things up.

You are correct in saying that a relatively high protein intake is fine for the kidneys providing adequate water intake. However, anything above 1.5g/lb is unneccessary if you ask me, so kidney damage shouldn't really be an issue.

However, hyponatraemia really isn't a possibility unless they are diabetic, an endurance athlete or drink over 3 gallons of water a day.

[ironman1964bc]

If you want to become a vegan, at least do alot of reading on both sides of the subject and make an informed decision without outside pressure. Don't do it because its the "in" thing to do.

The last girl I argued with about this subject had a mink coat on with leather pants and shoes, and she had a ton of makeup on her face. Do you know how many animal products are in those things? Are you going to be able to give up shoes and walk barefoot the rest of your life. Are you ready to give up football forever, at least until they start using a soy football instead of a pigskin?

This arguement reminds me of the moose hunt arguements that happen every year up here in Maine. Alot of people feel sorry for the moose and would like to do away with moose hunting. The problem is if the moose are left alone, they become overcrowded and disease wipes alot of them out. The hunt actually protects the moose population. This is why you need to do some research and make an informed decision, not because you are trying to please your new hot girlfriend who loves yoga and hugs trees.

By the way, plants are alive too. I am sorry, but if you want to eat, you are going to have to kill it.......plant or animal.

[ironman1964bc]

Also, man only has one stomach, doesn't use its appendix, and doesn't chew cud, unlike plant eating animals. We can't eat grass or hay and turn it into protein like a cow or horse. We need to eat the animal itself to get the protein we need. Our digestive systems mostly resemble a wolf and we all know what would happen if a wolf or a lion was fed a vegetarian diet. They would die within a month.

[Stander, Emile]

3 of my friends are vegetarians and they all look like they could die at any moment.

[Jamesstout]

look its clearly not the case that we are wolves! we can live on a vegan diet its just not as easy. I agree with the "trendy" vegan thing though!


there are people who only eat fruits which do not kill the plant in picking i.e. apples but not yams and they wont cook anything at over 180 degrees but ig uess they dont do much sport!you can get away with a poor diet if you are inactive

[TexAss]

Also, man only has one stomach, doesn't use its appendix, and doesn't chew cud, unlike plant eating animals. We can't eat grass or hay and turn it into protein like a cow or horse. We need to eat the animal itself to get the protein we need. Our digestive systems mostly resemble a wolf and we all know what would happen if a wolf or a lion was fed a vegetarian diet. They would die within a month.

OK, if we are going to get into physiology...

You are completely wrong. Yes, we only have one stomach but lets look at overall intentinal length. True carnivores, your wolf for example, have an intestinal tract that is only 3-4 times the length of their body. Animals with a plant based diet is much longer, like you said to digest plant material better. Guess what, human intestins are 12 times the length of our bodies, basically about 3 times longer than your wolf.

[TexAss]

Are you ready to give up football forever, at least until they start using a soy football instead of a pigskin?

NERF!

[butthash]

We evolved from a long line of omnivores. Or if you prefer, god made us omnivores. So you can't really say, Man was meant to eat meat, or Man was meant to eat grass.

With today's industrial society, the ideal diet for a human is much different than if would have been when our digestive system developed into its present state. Hence why we crave foods that are bad for us, its really just that they are bad for us in quantities we have available.

I've known several vegans and have never meet one that I would consider healthy. But I would consider 80% of the population around me unhealthy, so that is not saying a lot.

[KrushR]

I've known several vegans and have never meet one that I would consider healthy. But I would consider 80% of the population around me unhealthy, so that is not saying a lot.

I believe that pretty much sums up the thread. Good job.

*cheers*

[bonbonsrgood]

3 of my friends are vegetarians and they all look like they could die at any moment.

Attacking this with a blind eye (a.k.a. forgetting I'm a vegetarian)


A common myth about vegetarianism/veganism is that one must automatically be healthy if you convert to veganism or whatnot. Totally false! You can be a healthier meat eater in fact. The key is to examine your diet. If you're eating nothing but junk foods and/or simple carbs (exclude veggies and fruits) that are all "vegan" then you will surely gain weight and be malnutrition, than a meat eater who adds fruits and veggies and grains into their diets.

Another myth is that if you are really skinny, you are not strong nor healthy. Totally false. You can be overweight and be malnutrition, and you can be very lean and be totally healthy. It depends on your total build up of vitamins and calories. A way to determine if someone is tooOo skinny for their frame is to observe their face. If it has the "sunken in" look, then they are too low for their body type; but some of my friends are very thin, vegetarians, but eat loads of good sources of veg protein, fruits, veggies, grains, and EXERCISE. And with healthy glowful faces.

I believe anyone can be healthy on a vegan, vegetarian, and meat based diet. The key is to watch your proportion sizes depending on the item and exercise. And, I can't stress enough how important organic based meats, veggies, fruits, dairy, etc are. I've convinced my family who still eat meat to buy only organic meats; it's much better for the animals and their health.

Bottom line, you can unhealthy with any diet, if you approach it the wrong way; just do what you believe in and don't judge others.

[1devil]

3 of my friends are vegetarians and they all look like they could die at any moment.

I am a lifetime vegetarian. Here is a picture of me. I certainly don't think that I look like I'm about to die.

[TexAss]

I am a lifetime vegetarian. Here is a picture of me. I certainly don't think that I look like I'm about to die.

Nice. Lookin large.

OK, I need to start a new thread for SHAVED-HEAD VEGETARIANS!

[1devil]

Just trying to shake up the stereotype a bit. I could care less if some is vegetarian or eats meat. However, it frustrates me to no end when people assume that being vegetarian or vegan equates being scrawny and unhealthy.

[TexAss]

Just trying to shake up the stereotype a bit. I could care less if some is vegetarian or eats meat. However, it frustrates me to no end when people assume that being vegetarian or vegan equates being scrawny and unhealthy.

I agree.

[Stander, Emile]

I am a lifetime vegetarian. Here is a picture of me. I certainly don't think that I look like I'm about to die.

whats ur diet?

[1devil]

Whey protein, eggs, oatmeal, bagels,flax oil olive oil, various nuts( cashews, peanuts etc.)multi vitamin pak, creatine. I also try to get my fruits and veggies in. It might sound strange coming from a vegetarian but I'm not a huge fan of vegtables. I really just try to keep it simple and consistant.

People tend to be surprised that I'm a vegetarian. But I honestly don't feel that I am at a disadvantage being a vegetarian.