Back pain and core strength.

[bigboy15]

Whenever I deadlift or squat, I feel like my back is staying flat, but when I get done my back feels kind of irritated, and the next day I will wake up with a really sore/stiff lower back. It seems like I keep my back flat (as best as I can tell) and was wondering if the pain could be caused from a lack of abdominal strength? I currently do no ab training, and rely on heavy squats/deads and other heavy compounds for abs.

[aqua-beowulf]

Whenever I deadlift or squat, I feel like my back is staying flat, but when I get done my back feels kind of irritated, and the next day I will wake up with a really sore/stiff lower back. It seems like I keep my back flat (as best as I can tell) and was wondering if the pain could be caused from a lack of abdominal strength? I currently do no ab training, and rely on heavy squats/deads and other heavy compounds for abs.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't get these kinds of posts. Deadlifts and squats are very taxing on the core and lower back... soreness and stiffness are highly likely. I think too many people confuse these feelings with injury.

As far as ab work... I think it is a great idea to help strengthen your core, which will assist you in strengthening your core even more, by doing lots of deads and squats

And the main thing on deads is to keep a slight arch to your back (meaning shoulders back), and don't round your spine. On squats, try not to lean forward to the point you're goodmorning the weight up.

[Brown Pile]

Whenever I deadlift or squat, I feel like my back is staying flat, but when I get done my back feels kind of irritated, and the next day I will wake up with a really sore/stiff lower back. It seems like I keep my back flat (as best as I can tell) and was wondering if the pain could be caused from a lack of abdominal strength? I currently do no ab training, and rely on heavy squats/deads and other heavy compounds for abs.

good morning good idea

[Horseradish]

Whenever I deadlift or squat, I feel like my back is staying flat, but when I get done my back feels kind of irritated, and the next day I will wake up with a really sore/stiff lower back. It seems like I keep my back flat (as best as I can tell) and was wondering if the pain could be caused from a lack of abdominal strength? I currently do no ab training, and rely on heavy squats/deads and other heavy compounds for abs.

Man, I feel for ya. Ever since I injured my back in wrestling in 7th grade (11 years ago or so) I've been having off and on trouble with my back. It's guaranteed to out about once a year whether or not I am lifting. Here's a few suggestions that have helped me or people I know:

1. Get yourself a Tempur-Pedic pillow and mattress pad. I bought the pillow and I haven't woken up with neck pain ever since. However, I still wake up with lower back pain every once in a while. I'm going to get the mattress pad very soon. My mother recently bought one (she had two vertebrae fused in her lower back), and she said it was one of the best investments ever. If you can't afford these, then you can sleep with a pillow under your knees (if you sleep on your back) or between your legs (if you sleep on your side) to take stress off your lower back. And if your neck is causing you problems, you can roll up a towel and put it behind your neck.

2. Get back to basics with your squats and deads. I did this a while back in order to start lifting without a weight belt, and I really learned how to protect my back while lifting. Reduce your weight to 135 pounds but pretend it's 405. Make sure your squat and deadlift are textbook perfect and done with intensity and concentration. Pay attention to everything that's going on during the lift, and re-learn what it feels like to execute the motion of the lift and what the sequences of muscle contractions feel like. There is nothing wrong with revisiting the fundamentals.

3. Give your back a break during workouts (as in vacation, not 'snap'). I noticed that if I stay standing for the entire duration of my squat and deadlift workouts my lower back will start to cramp up and my subsequent sets are hell on the back. To counteract this, l sit down on a bench every once in a while to let my back relax. I actually got this idea from watching a powerlifter do a deadlift workout when I was at the university -- he would sit down and sometimes even lay down on a bench between sets.

4. Get some abdominal and core training into your routine. You want to both strengthen your core as well as learn what it feels like to use it for lift assistance.

5. Never risk throwing out your back just to get in one extra set. It's better to have missed one set of squats than to miss an entire week or month because you were too tired or not focues enough to protect your back during the lift.

Best of luck to you!

[JOHN GARGANI]

Horseradish: that was EXCELLENT advice, especially this part:

Reduce your weight to 135 pounds but pretend it's 405. Make sure your squat and deadlift are textbook perfect and done with intensity and concentration.

REPS TO YOU MY FRIEND!!!

Also, I agree with Aqua, in that since the movements described do affect the back and core muscles, then, stiffness may just be normal "soreness" not unlike that we get when we work our other body parts....

if your lats are "sore" the next day after a lat workout, you put out the flag, but if your lower back is sore, you get concerned! LOL....

the trick, as always, is to learn the difference between Good Pain and bad Pain, and for that matter, Good soreness and Bad soreness....and there IS a difference!!!! But soreness, just by itself, may not necessarily be a bad thing.....

[bigboy15]

Horseradish: that was EXCELLENT advice, especially this part:




REPS TO YOU MY FRIEND!!!

Also, I agree with Aqua, in that since the movements described do affect the back and core muscles, then, stiffness may just be normal "soreness" not unlike that we get when we work our other body parts....

if your lats are "sore" the next day after a lat workout, you put out the flag, but if your lower back is sore, you get concerned! LOL....

the trick, as always, is to learn the difference between Good Pain and bad Pain, and for that matter, Good soreness and Bad soreness....and there IS a difference!!!! But soreness, just by itself, may not necessarily be a bad thing.....

Only thing is I'm pretty sure that this is a BAD kind of soreness. It's not too severe, and mostly only bothers me if I bend over to pick something up or am in the same position a while and move then I have pain in my lower back (almost like a kind of pressure type pain). Kind of like my disks are irritated. The pain really isn't that bad though, just like it's always there, and I'm concerned that it might get worse. It did before, when I injured in when I got in a minor car wreck about 6 months ago and deadlifted anyways, because I though I was fine. Threw out my back and next day I could barely move and I was out of action for 2 weeks.

I think I may start doing ab training, and stop being lazy along with doing every thing light for a while and getting my form down solid again. I guess I never did ab training because my abs have always been a strong point even with no work.

[bigboy15]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't get these kinds of posts. Deadlifts and squats are very taxing on the core and lower back... soreness and stiffness are highly likely. I think too many people confuse these feelings with injury.

As far as ab work... I think it is a great idea to help strengthen your core, which will assist you in strengthening your core even more, by doing lots of deads and squats

And the main thing on deads is to keep a slight arch to your back (meaning shoulders back), and don't round your spine. On squats, try not to lean forward to the point you're goodmorning the weight up.

When you say soreness/stiffness do you mean in the muscles, or more in the spine/disks? Also when you say shoulders back do you mean like scapular retraction? or just the standard chest out, back flat, hips low and back drill?(which I already do)

[God Gifted]

what does "don't round your spine" mean? got a pic ?

[JOHN GARGANI]

I think I may start doing ab training, and stop being lazy along with doing every thing light for a while and getting my form down solid again. I guess I never did ab training because my abs have always been a strong point even with no work.

you have given yourself the best advice possible!!!!!

[Dark Phoenix]

what does "don't round your spine" mean? got a pic ?

Means if you bend at your waist, the high point of your back should NOT be above your shoulders and waist.

[Dark Phoenix]

Only thing is I'm pretty sure that this is a BAD kind of soreness. It's not too severe, and mostly only bothers me if I bend over to pick something up or am in the same position a while and move then I have pain in my lower back (almost like a kind of pressure type pain). Kind of like my disks are irritated. The pain really isn't that bad though, just like it's always there, and I'm concerned that it might get worse. It did before, when I injured in when I got in a minor car wreck about 6 months ago and deadlifted anyways, because I though I was fine. Threw out my back and next day I could barely move and I was out of action for 2 weeks.

I think I may start doing ab training, and stop being lazy along with doing every thing light for a while and getting my form down solid again. I guess I never did ab training because my abs have always been a strong point even with no work.

It is not just AB training, it is CORE training. A group of muscles around the spine.

Here,I posted this in anohter thread

Your core is a group of muscles around your spine to help keep it in place.

To strengthen, do pelvic tils, planks using a medice ball and crunches on a swiss ball with no more than 6 inches of ROM.

http://www.webmd.com/hw/health_guide_atoz/zm2806.asp for the tilts

Plaanks are ehre, don't worry about the site I got it from, it will help you as well.

http://www.mommymuscles.com/2004/10/...ck_your_p.html

And you should know how to do a cruch.

[RxMoose]

what does "don't round your spine" mean? got a pic ?

Here is an example of a rounded spine

[bigboy15]

Here is an example of a rounded spine

LMFAO if I did something like that I'd probably be paralyzed from the waist down for the rest of my life since I get pain already.


Edit: One other question; how do you weight your crunches? I was just trying to weight mine and was using like 30lbs on my chest. This was difficult, because I did them at home, and not at the gym, and I only have 10lb plates, so it was hard to balance them.