Losing fat. Confused with carb source

[NLNFunKti0nz]

Ok guys Im an endomorph making it harder for me to lose fat. I am 5'9 and 196 lbs id say about 30% bodyfat.

I would need about 2200 calories to lose 2lbs a week.

My fat sources will be: Olive oil, Eggs, Peanut butter

Protein: Chicken breast, tilapia, flank steak

Carbs: White rice, maybe broccoli. (HATE veggies)

Any advice on carbs here? Will i still lose fat if i stay at my calorie count by eating white rice?

[magician27]

if you hit your caloric target you lose weight , it doesnt matter what you eat. but make a habit of eating vegetables, they are crucial for optimizing your hormones and health

[kaygell]

Also carbs lower on the GI-are better for your insulin sensitivy. So try to stick to carbs that are low on the GI-index mostly.

[Ondle]

Also carbs lower on the GI-are better for your insulin sensitivy. So try to stick to carbs that are low on the GI-index mostly.

Lol no. If ur already in a deficit u shouldn't even worry about insulin. And there is no such thing as good carbs or bad carbs. With that said a persons diet should mainly consist of whole foods, but if u want some ice cream or cake that's fine as long as it fits macros.

[dmacdonal9]

Carb sources are irrelevant for fat gain or loss. The difference lies solely in how they make you feel. A carb-heavy meal will often make an overweight and insulin resistant person feel sleepy and bloated and may cause a crash and unreasonable hunger afterwards. The same carb-heavy meal will often make a leaner person feel energized.

But in a calorie deficit with good macros, you are unlikely to be able to fit in a carb heavy meal at all. It's kind of self-correcting in that way. Certainly having a little white rice is not going to make a difference.

[ReyJay]

Carb sources are irrelevant for fat gain or loss. The difference lies solely in how they make you feel. A carb-heavy meal will often make an overweight and insulin resistant person feel sleepy and bloated and may cause a crash and unreasonable hunger afterwards. The same carb-heavy meal will often make a leaner person feel energized.

But in a calorie deficit with good macros, you are unlikely to be able to fit in a carb heavy meal at all. It's kind of self-correcting in that way. Certainly having a little white rice is not going to make a difference.

Wrong, there's clearly a difference in which kind of carb crashes faster than the other e.g eating glucose/fructose vs oats. Choosing low-glycemic index carbohydrates over high-glycemic carbohydrates can result in dramatically slower absorption of the carbohydrates. 100 grams of oats will not crash like sugar, everyone knows that.

"Carb sources are irrelevant for fat gain or loss." Have you tried this yourself or are you only speaking in theory?

[dmacdonal9]

Wrong, there's clearly a difference in which kind of carb crashes faster than the other e.g eating glucose/fructose vs oats. Choosing low-glycemic index carbohydrates over high-glycemic carbohydrates can result in dramatically slower absorption of the carbohydrates. 100 grams of oats will not crash like sugar, everyone knows that.

Tell me how that impacts fat loss or gain.

[Znik]

Wrong, there's clearly a difference in which kind of carb crashes faster than the other e.g eating glucose/fructose vs oats. Choosing low-glycemic index carbohydrates over high-glycemic carbohydrates can result in dramatically slower absorption of the carbohydrates. 100 grams of oats will not crash like sugar, everyone knows that.

"Carb sources are irrelevant for fat gain or loss." Have you tried this yourself or are you only speaking in theory?

How does 400kcal worth of energy being released in a 2 or 4 hours make a difference for the energy balance ?

[ReyJay]

Tell me how that impacts fat loss or gain.

Maybe not directly but there is an indirect impact on fat loss. You can't deny that.
How? Because insulin and leptin, and possibly ghrelin function as key signals to the central nervous system. Having the system more balanced leads to better satiety levels, mood and energy and therefore easier fat loss.

[ReyJay]

How does 400kcal worth of energy being released in a 2 or 4 hours make a difference for the energy balance ?

Not really much. But I'm pretty sure you'll have a better workout by eating oats than table sugar.

[csb5731]

Not really much. But I'm pretty sure you'll have a better workout by eating oats than table sugar.

Who the hell eats table sugar for breakfast? Let's inject a dose of reality to these kinds of arguments.

[dmacdonal9]

Maybe not directly but there is an indirect impact on fat loss. You can't deny that.
How? Because insulin and leptin, and possibly ghrelin function as key signals to the central nervous system. Having the system more balanced leads to better satiety levels, mood and energy and therefore easier fat loss.

First, your claim that "Having the system more balanced leads to better satiety levels, mood and energy" is meaningless. How do you define balance and what system are you even talking about?

Are you saying high GI carbs make people hungry and therefore they eat more and get fat? Well, looking at food porn on pinterest makes me hungry. Therefor by your logic, pinterest makes people fat. Which is of course completely untrue unless I choose to eat more calories.

If I eat 200g of sugar today versus 200g of oatmeal there will be a difference in how I feel and function, but there will be absolutely no difference in fat stores. That's the point.

[dmacdonal9]

Not really much. But I'm pretty sure you'll have a better workout by eating oats than table sugar.

You know what, I'll even question that statement. Whats your basis for claiming this? What quantity would be required to make such a difference and how would it manifest itself in terms of performance while lifting?

[ReyJay]

You know what, I'll even question that statement. Whats your basis for claiming this? What quantity would be required to make such a difference and how would it manifest itself in terms of performance while lifting?

You can try it yourself

[Znik]

Not really much. But I'm pretty sure you'll have a better workout by eating oats than table sugar.

Some of my best workouts have been on this stuff which is pretty much pure sugar and butter.

[MrM27]

You can try it yourself

And I'm pretty sure Dmacdonal has tried it, I know Znik has tried it and I know I for sure have.

Your claims are beliefs. Not facts. Spouting the whole GI scale is cute and all but largely irrelevant when you start mixing fats and proteins into the equation. And I don't know about you but I'm not sitting around all pathetic eating a single baked potato or just a bowl of brown rice.

Insulin response? You are aware provide can provide just as large an insulin response as carbs do? You are also aware that insulin plays a vital role in building/maintaining muscle?

Leptin? Come on now. Most of the people who are here seeking advice don't even need to worry about that and chances are neither do you. Most have no clue what it is and I'd suspect you're not as well versed on that topic as you think you are.

Grehlin. Now you're just grasping straws.

[ReyJay]

Some of my best workouts have been on this stuff which is pretty much pure sugar and butter.

Fat inhibits gastric emptying and slows digestion. Yeah if you take like that it's okay. Fat isn't bad, low fat is. When we take fat out of our diet and replace it with carbs (sugars), the glycemic index of the food we eat goes up dramatically.

[ReyJay]

And I'm pretty sure Dmacdonal has tried it, I know Znik has tried it and I know I for sure have.

Your claims are beliefs. Not facts. Spouting the whole GI scale is cute and all but largely irrelevant when you start mixing fats and proteins into the equation. And I don't know about you but I'm not sitting around all pathetic eating a single baked potato or just a bowl of brown rice.

Insulin response? You are aware provide can provide just as large an insulin response as carbs do? You are also aware that insulin plays a vital role in building/maintaining muscle?

Leptin? Come on now. Most of the people who are here seeking advice don't even need to worry about that and chances are neither do you. Most have no clue what it is and I'd suspect you're not as well versed on that topic as you think you are.

Grehlin. Now you're just grasping straws.

I am kind of grasping straws haha. I'm aware and I agree that most people are just starting the fat loss journey and never ever have to worry about these things.
Sometimes little things matter. But mostly not.

[ReyJay]

http://www.gnolls.org/index/ Interesting read for all you guys.

[Znik]

http://www.gnolls.org/index/ Interesting read for all you guys.

No offense to you, but I do prefer to get my information from unbiased sources. Not cherry picked studies/information that fits a selling point (in this case Paleo diet).

I've tried low carb,high carb, low GI, high GI, extremely high protein, moderate protein etc. during my bulks, and I have not felt or seen much of a difference from them. If anything the worst is limiting food choices, it gets boring. But everyone are different, some will respond better psychologically to one diet than someone else.

Never get any crashes from when I binge on sugary energy drinks either (love my Monsters), makes a pretty good PWO.

[ReyJay]

Just found it out of curiosity, someone might be interested in what this site has to say.
I'm not a paleo follower or anything out of ordinary.
And yep everyone has their own style of doing things, let's not get under anyone's skin about that matter. Everyone just needs to find what works best for themselves.

[MrM27]

Just found it out of curiosity, someone might be interested in what this site has to say.
I'm not a paleo follower or anything out of ordinary.
And yep everyone has their own style of doing things, let's not get under anyone's skin about that matter. Everyone just needs to find what works best for themselves.

This^^^^

Is why this the below isn't really so valid.

Not really much. But I'm pretty sure you'll have a better workout by eating oats than table sugar.

I know I have experienced some of my best lifts after 3 servings of Cocoa Krispies. Mmmmmmmm sugar.

[ReyJay]

This^^^^

Is why this the below isn't really so valid.



I know I have experienced some of my best lifts after 3 servings of Cocoa Krispies. Mmmmmmmm sugar.

Fat slows down the digestion of sugar as I stated earlier. Taking pure sugar vs sugar with fat are 2 whole different stories.
Who would eat only sugar lol

[MrM27]

Fat slows down the digestion of sugar as I stated earlier. Taking pure sugar vs sugar with fat are 2 whole different stories.
Who would eat only sugar lol

If you're implying who would sit there with a bag of sugar and a spoon then no one that I know. When was the last time you saw that happen? You are attempting to use an extreme example to make a point but it's just so far out there that it doesn't work.

Now if you want to say "Who would eat a bunch of Gummi Bears or a Bagel" then I would say that I would. And have. And have never "crashed" while lifting.

Sometimes making a blanket statement could. However, sometimes you do and get called out on it and you might have to come to the realization that your original statement wasn't valid and it's time to concede.

[baffledgenius]

If you're implying who would sit there with a bag of sugar and a spoon then no one that I know.

Well technically you know me online and i adore Fun Dip which is literally a sugar stick used to scoop up flavored sugar lol. Im not adding to or subtracting from anyones argument though :-)

[MrM27]

Well technically you know me online and i adore Fun Dip which is literally a sugar stick used to scoop up flavored sugar lol. Im not adding to or subtracting from anyones argument though :-)

Damn you!!!!!!

Fun dip is pretty awesome. Damn semantics.

[baffledgenius]

Damn you!!!!!!

Fun dip is pretty awesome. Damn semantics.

Haha sorry but you were discounting a childhood favorite :-P. Also they came out with watermelon flavored fun dip, but it unfortunately sucks..

[ReyJay]

If you're implying who would sit there with a bag of sugar and a spoon then no one that I know. When was the last time you saw that happen? You are attempting to use an extreme example to make a point but it's just so far out there that it doesn't work.

Now if you want to say "Who would eat a bunch of Gummi Bears or a Bagel" then I would say that I would. And have. And have never "crashed" while lifting.

Sometimes making a blanket statement could. However, sometimes you do and get called out on it and you might have to come to the realization that your original statement wasn't valid and it's time to concede.

I'm not changing my original statement :P. I see that you don't care much about what I have to say anyway so there's no point continuing. You just keep ridiculing all my views. You have your own strict beliefs that gummi bears and bagels work for you. Let it be then.

[Jnewman011]

I've always had a question about the GI scale, this seems like a good place so ill go ahead and ask it. i understand it is largely irrelevant bc it only works when eating carbs by themselves. but what exactly does that mean? does it mean over the course of a day, or in the context of a single meal? how many proteins and fats are required to make it a non issue. for example, if you were to eat 2 pop tarts (10 fat 80 carb 4 protein) before a workout, and then not eat again for a few hours, would it come into play? are the 10 grams of fat and 4 grams of protein enough to make it a non issue?

[dmacdonal9]

are the 10 grams of fat and 4 grams of protein enough to make it a non issue?

You can't quantify that easily because there's a lot of variability between individuals. It basically depends on your ability to clear glucose from your blood (some of which is genetic, but a lot of which is controlled by your activity levels, current body composition and metabolic health).

A lean individual with a fair bit of muscle mass can clear glucose like a champ. As soon as it comes in, it's shuttled off to replenish glycogen, or metabolized for energy. This is especially true if the person is in an energy deficit or energy balance. An athlete would have to go to ridiculous lengths to feel "bad" from a large glycemic load. Like a half dozen donuts kind of thing. And if he eats some protein or fat with those donuts, it's even less of an issue.

An obese sedentary individual has an impaired ability to clear glucose. He's probably in an energy surplus and his rather small glycogen stores are likely full, so the conversion of carbs to fat is activated (de novo lipogenesis). Because his fat cells are full, they tend to "push away" the incoming calories, which requires more insulin to do the same work (this is some of what causes the subsequent crash). Even a relatively small glycemic load is likely to be a problem for this guy, making him feel sleepy and crappy.

We're all somewhere in the middle between those extremes.