My Doctor says not to use creatine because there is no long term safety data.

[ChicagoGreg]

So what do you guys say?
He's at a leading teaching institution.

[bookv]

Just look into some of the many articles in this site. Creatine mono is proven to work and is safe. Creatine Ethyl Ester (CEE) on the other hand, is a little iffy. That could be what he's referring to. But creatine mono is perfectly fine.

[tupac101]

hahaha well the funny thing is, THERE ARE NO long term studies of creatine use with the amounts that we use today.
YES all the current studies say its safe, BUT whats to say in 15 years from now? Hell maybe using creatine for to long well stop the bodies natural production of it, then your F*Cked, but hey if they say its safe, then it might be.. but who knows?lol

Im not raggin on it, i use it(greenbulge for life) but to answer your question, your doctor is perfectly right.

[mbcrump]

I say its time to find a new doctor...he can read all of his studies all day long, i doubt he even knows a person whose been using it for 1-2 months.

[DaveGabe24]

Originally Posted by tupac101

hahaha well the funny thing is, THERE ARE NO long term studies of creatine use with the amounts that we use today.
YES all the current studies say its safe, BUT whats to say in 15 years from now? Hell maybe using creatine for to long well stop the bodies natural production of it, then your F*Cked, but hey if they say its safe, then it might be.. but who knows?lol

Im not raggin on it, i use it(greenbulge for life) but to answer your question, your doctor is perfectly right.

I'm pretty sure that in 2008 there's gotta to be tons of lifters who've been supplementing with creatine mono for well over 10-15 years.

[BigBen85]

tell ur doctor to quit bein a p*ssy and man up, everything is bad for u and u could die at any time so take some risks, especially one as small as taking creatine.

[onehawaiian]

Originally Posted by GregoryAsh

So what do you guys say?
He's at a leading teaching institution.

no steak for u!

[uhockey]

I guess it depends on your definition of 'long term safety,' but in general I would say that he is correct......then again, there is long term 'safety' on coumadin and aspirin, and they have side effects as well.

[Rigit23]

Originally Posted by onehawaiian

no steak for u!

hahah exactly.

Your doctor is basically saying not to eat steak or any other meat with creatine in it because you don't know the long term effects. You're fine

[mwballbanger]

Originally Posted by Rigit23

hahah exactly.

Your doctor is basically saying not to eat steak or any other meat with creatine in it because you don't know the long term effects. You're fine

I would rather listen to the doctor...

he probably payed 100,000+ for his education...


and it IS TRUE that no one knows exactly the long term effects of creatine...

[ChicagoGreg]

The FDA can't even determine all the unknown side effects of well tested, clinically researched drugs: ie pulled from the market celebrex, bextra, baycol etc. Do you really believe ingesting supernormal amounts of this substrate is safe long term with no data?

And quit quoting steak etc as the creatine amounts are neg. compared to the amounts were discussing wth supplements.

[MBSowards]

Everyone who drank water 150 years ago is dead. I bet they wish they had a study showing the long term effects of water consumption.

[norcalsfinest]

i just read in muscular development, that an indavidual has taken creatine once a day since 1981 and he has no problems with kidney issues.

[mwballbanger]

Originally Posted by norcalsfinest

i just read in muscular development, that an indavidual has taken creatine once a day since 1981 and he has no problems with kidney issues.

creatine didn;t come out till 1992...

[uhockey]

Originally Posted by norcalsfinest

i just read in muscular development, that an indavidual has taken creatine once a day since 1981 and he has no problems with kidney issues.

n=1 = broad evidence?

[Mr. Aries]

if you believe your doctor, then don't use creatine.


if you dont' believe your doctor, then use creatine.

[MarcL]

tell ur doctor to quit bein a p*ssy and man up, everything is bad for u and u could die at any time so take some risks, especially one as small as taking creatine.

Agreed above... And also I would have to say that the only reason I find that it somewhat is safe is because it is in food, so then by eating that food it would kill us? But then again everything we do technically kills us.

[pushinweightwi]

Originally Posted by mwballbanger

I would rather listen to the doctor...

he probably payed 100,000+ for his education...


and it IS TRUE that no one knows exactly the long term effects of creatine...

IMO the cost of an education does not equal the knowledge of the person who recieved said education.

[CognitiveNutrition]

Originally Posted by GregoryAsh

So what do you guys say?
He's at a leading teaching institution.

I will have our MD talk to him if you like. I'm in chicago.

[EMartNJ]

it costs a lot more than 100gs to go through all of undergrad and all of grad school -_-

[CognitiveNutrition]

1 year

Int J Sports Med. 2005 May;26(4):307-13. Links
Few adverse effects of long-term creatine supplementation in a placebo-controlled trial.

Groeneveld GJ, Beijer C, Veldink JH, Kalmijn S, Wokke JH, van den Berg LH.
Department of Neurology, University Medical Centre Utrecht, The Netherlands.

Although oral creatine supplementation is very popular among athletes, no prospective placebo-controlled studies on the adverse effects of long-term supplementation have yet been conducted. We performed a double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of creatine monohydrate in patients with the neurodegenerative disease amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, because of the neuroprotective effects it was shown to have in animal experiments. The purpose of this paper is to compare the adverse effects, and to describe the effects on indirect markers of renal function of long-term creatine supplementation. 175 subjects (age = 57.7 +/- 11.1 y) were randomly assigned to receive creatine monohydrate 10 g daily or placebo during an average period of 310 days. After one month, two months and from then on every fourth month, adverse effects were scored using dichotomous questionnaires, plasma urea concentrations were measured, and urinary creatine and albumin concentrations were determined. No significant differences in the occurrence at any time of adverse effects due to creatine supplementation were found (23 % nausea in the creatine group, vs. 24 % in the placebo group, 19 % gastro-intestinal discomfort in the creatine group, vs. 18 % in the placebo group, 35 % diarrhoea in the creatine group, vs. 24 % in the placebo group). After two months of treatment, oedematous limbs were seen more often in subjects using creatine, probably due to water retention. Severe diarrhoea (n = 2) and severe nausea (n = 1) caused 3 subjects in the creatine group to stop intake of creatine, after which these adverse effects subsided. Long-term supplementation of creatine did not lead to an increase of plasma urea levels (5.69 +/- 1.47 before treatment vs. 5.26 +/- 1.44 at the end of treatment) or to a higher prevalence of micro-albuminuria (5.4 % before treatment vs. 1.8 % at the end of treatment).

[MarcL]

Originally Posted by uniquenutrition

1 year

Int J Sports Med. 2005 May;26(4):307-13. Links
Few adverse effects of long-term creatine supplementation in a placebo-controlled trial.

Groeneveld GJ, Beijer C, Veldink JH, Kalmijn S, Wokke JH, van den Berg LH.
Department of Neurology, University Medical Centre Utrecht, The Netherlands.

Although oral creatine supplementation is very popular among athletes, no prospective placebo-controlled studies on the adverse effects of long-term supplementation have yet been conducted. We performed a double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of creatine monohydrate in patients with the neurodegenerative disease amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, because of the neuroprotective effects it was shown to have in animal experiments. The purpose of this paper is to compare the adverse effects, and to describe the effects on indirect markers of renal function of long-term creatine supplementation. 175 subjects (age = 57.7 +/- 11.1 y) were randomly assigned to receive creatine monohydrate 10 g daily or placebo during an average period of 310 days. After one month, two months and from then on every fourth month, adverse effects were scored using dichotomous questionnaires, plasma urea concentrations were measured, and urinary creatine and albumin concentrations were determined. No significant differences in the occurrence at any time of adverse effects due to creatine supplementation were found (23 % nausea in the creatine group, vs. 24 % in the placebo group, 19 % gastro-intestinal discomfort in the creatine group, vs. 18 % in the placebo group, 35 % diarrhoea in the creatine group, vs. 24 % in the placebo group). After two months of treatment, oedematous limbs were seen more often in subjects using creatine, probably due to water retention. Severe diarrhoea (n = 2) and severe nausea (n = 1) caused 3 subjects in the creatine group to stop intake of creatine, after which these adverse effects subsided. Long-term supplementation of creatine did not lead to an increase of plasma urea levels (5.69 +/- 1.47 before treatment vs. 5.26 +/- 1.44 at the end of treatment) or to a higher prevalence of micro-albuminuria (5.4 % before treatment vs. 1.8 % at the end of treatment).

Very interesting...

[Insulin Ihsaan]

Originally Posted by MarcL

Very interesting...

your 16

[EMartNJ]

Originally Posted by ihsaank

your 16

lol thats harsh

[Muscle Mania Malky]

In humans, approximately half of stored creatine originates from food (mainly from fresh meat and fish).

We've been taking in creatine since the stone age.. does that answer your question?

[CognitiveNutrition]

Originally Posted by MarcL

Very interesting...

So it's as safe as safe gets. He needs a new job teaching Mcdonalds.

[ChicagoGreg]

310 days?
And only renal function was tested for adverse events.

However, you are the only one that has come close to answering the question with intelligence and some data. Thank you.

My doctor would ask to see alot more than 310 days.

[CognitiveNutrition]

Originally Posted by GregoryAsh

310 days?
And only renal function was tested for adverse events.

However, you are the only one that has come close to answering the question with intelligence and some data. Thank you.

My doctor would ask to see alot more than 310 days.

I'm sure your doctor would make the same statement for any food as well. Which is insane. Creatine is both a naturally occuring compound in the body and is consumed daily with no problems. A 1 year study (which not many drugs even get) showed no sign of toxic effects (I'm sure if there was any concern it would have been noted).

[SupaFly78]

Originally Posted by Malky

In humans, approximately half of stored creatine originates from food (mainly from fresh meat and fish).

We've been taking in creatine since the stone age.. does that answer your question?

your point actually makes little sense, because the amount of creatine you get from food isn't even close to the amount that most people supplement on a daily basis.

that would be like saying having one alcoholic drink a day would have the same effect on your liver as having ten.

[CognitiveNutrition]

5 years

Sports Med. 2000 Sep;30(3):155-70.Links
Adverse effects of creatine supplementation: fact or fiction?
Poortmans JR, Francaux M.
Physiological Chemistry, Higher Institute of Physical Education and Readaptation, Free University of Brussels, Bruxelles, Belgium. jrpoortm@ulb.ac.be

The consumption of oral creatine monohydrate has become increasingly common among professional and amateur athletes. Despite numerous publications on the ergogenic effects of this naturally occurring substance, there is little information on the possible adverse effects of this supplement. The objectives of this review are to identify the scientific facts and contrast them with reports in the news media, which have repeatedly emphasised the health risks of creatine supplementation and do not hesitate to draw broad conclusions from individual case reports. Exogenous creatine supplements are often consumed by athletes in amounts of up to 20 g/day for a few days, followed by 1 to 10 g/day for weeks, months and even years. Usually, consumers do not report any adverse effects, but body mass increases. There are few reports that creatine supplementation has protective effects in heart, muscle and neurological diseases. Gastrointestinal disturbances and muscle cramps have been reported occasionally in healthy individuals, but the effects are anecdotal. Liver and kidney dysfunction have also been suggested on the basis of small changes in markers of organ function and of occasional case reports, but well controlled studies on the adverse effects of exogenous creatine supplementation are almost nonexistent. We have investigated liver changes during medium term (4 weeks) creatine supplementation in young athletes. None showed any evidence of dysfunction on the basis of serum enzymes and urea production. Short term (5 days), medium term (9 weeks) and long term (up to 5 years) oral creatine supplementation has been studied in small cohorts of athletes whose kidney function was monitored by clearance methods and urine protein excretion rate. We did not find any adverse effects on renal function. The present review is not intended to reach conclusions on the effect of creatine supplementation on sport performance, but we believe that there is no evidence for deleterious effects in healthy individuals.