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  1. #61
    Registered User kezwar's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    so...you took up your own interpretation of the film even though the director confirmed that that one is not what "she intended?"

    son, i am confuse
    She intended for it to be ambiguous, but it clearly leans too much on one side, which is not what she intended, therefore she failed.
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  2. #62
    Ate girl out for 45 min jmack549's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    She intended for it to be ambiguous, but it clearly leans too much on one side, which is not what she intended, therefore she failed.
    She did fail, but it was clear the shootout/helicopter scene was imagined. The rest of the killings were real.
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  3. #63
    Banned .aeterna's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    She intended for it to be ambiguous, but it clearly leans too much on one side, which is not what she intended, therefore she failed.
    my initial thought after the final scene (like 7 yrs ago) was me second guessing everything. i ran down all the possibilities of how it could've been a dream

    then i realized, wait, this movies supposed to be satirical, and thought 'what were the themes the director imposed?'

    then i knew all the murders were real..

    regardless, the movie was very successful and probably the 1st one to blow my mind - it wasnt a failure in any sense IMO
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  4. #64
    gettin shredded grant81's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by dexterium View Post
    Some people say that he killed the people. Some people say he didn't.

    What do you guys think and why?
    He did kill them. The point of the last scene was that he lived in a world of very selfabsorbed people that didn't even care that there was a serial killer among them. I can't remember which website explained this but it did a good job of it. Hope this helps OP
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  5. #65
    Registered User kezwar's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by jmack549 View Post
    She did fail, but it was clear the shootout/helicopter scene was imagined. The rest of the killings were real.
    I totally understand it's meant to be satrical, which is why I can see the other side, and can accept some of the other explanations, but there are simply too many. What are the significance of the drawings? I can also accept that some murders may well actually occur, whilst others are a figment of his imagination.

    But ye, awesome movie.
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  6. #66
    Ate girl out for 45 min jmack549's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    I totally understand it's meant to be satrical, which is why I can see the other side, and can accept some of the other explanations, but there are simply too many. What are the significance of the drawings? I can also accept that some murders may well actually occur, whilst others are a figment of his imagination.

    But ye, awesome movie.
    Probably nothing, besides the fact that it let his assistant know he is fuked up. And he is just a bloodthirsty womanizer who puts on a fake facade daily to get through in life, and no one notices anything because they're too self absorbed to care.
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  7. #67
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    Whoa, i think some of you guys missed a big point of this movie...

    He did kill those people, thats a fact. The part at the end when the lawyer claims he had lunch with Paul Allen proves the point of the movie that people did not give a **** about anyone else. Hence why people were constantly confusing names and whatnot. The lawyer probably believed he had lunch with Allen, but he was way wrong. Allen was long dead before that. The lawyer even messed up Patrick Bateman's name.
    he didn't kill an yone in the movie you tard.
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  8. #68
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    Originally Posted by MenTaLPiRacY View Post
    My take of the last scene was that Corprate yuppies who meet eachother and always think some one is some one else all the time. didnt someone at one point in the movie call him by a name other than his own? you know how corprate yuppies are they dont care about anyone but themselves and dont remember anybody unless their important. Maybe the guy that the guy met in london 10 days ago wasnt Paul maybe he was some one else and Bateman was like wtf i got an alibye.. or maybe the guy that the guy met in london was really paul but bateman thought the guy whom he murderd was Paul.. alot to thinka bout there.
    This is right. Read the American Psycho page on IMDB motherphuccers
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  9. #69
    Banned .aeterna's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by momo5 View Post
    he didn't kill an yone in the movie you tard.
    gonna keep quoting it for the idiots

    Did Bret Easton Ellis like the film?

    Yes he did. Ellis actually wrote an extensive, and generally positive review of the film for the official site, which can be read in its entirety here. Ellis also appeared on an episode of The Charlie Rose Show, along with Christian Bale and co-screenwriter/director Mary Harron, where he said he liked the film very much, and felt it improved on the novel in certain aspects; "the film clarified the themes of the novel. It clarified that the novel was a critique of male behavior"

    Harron ultimately felt that she had gone too far with the hallucinatory approach. In an interview with Charlie Rose, she stated that she felt she had failed with the end of the film because she led audiences to believe the murders were only in his imagination, which was not what she wanted. Instead, she wanted ambiguity; "One thing I think is a failure on my part is people keep coming out of the film thinking that its all a dream, and I never intended that. All I wanted was to be ambiguous in the way that the book was. I think it's a failure of mine in the final scene because I just got the emphasis wrong. I should have left it more open ended. It makes it look like it was all in his head, and as far as I'm concerned, it's not"

    Bret Easton Ellis has pointed out that if none of the murders actually happened, the entire point of the novel would be rendered moot. As with the practical theories regarding the Carnes conversation, the outbursts and the empty apartment, interpreting the murders as real is part of the film's social satire. Ellis has stated that the novel was intended to satirize the shallow, impersonal mindset of yuppie America in the late 1980s, and part of this critique is that even when a cold blooded serial killer confesses, no one cares, no one listens and no one believes. The fact that Bateman is never caught and that no one believes his confession just reinforces the shallowness, self-absorption, and lack of morality that they all have
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  10. #70
    Registered User kezwar's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    gonna keep quoting it for the idiots

    Did Bret Easton Ellis like the film?

    Yes he did. Ellis actually wrote an extensive, and generally positive review of the film for the official site, which can be read in its entirety here. Ellis also appeared on an episode of The Charlie Rose Show, along with Christian Bale and co-screenwriter/director Mary Harron, where he said he liked the film very much, and felt it improved on the novel in certain aspects; "the film clarified the themes of the novel. It clarified that the novel was a critique of male behavior"

    Harron ultimately felt that she had gone too far with the hallucinatory approach. In an interview with Charlie Rose, she stated that she felt she had failed with the end of the film because she led audiences to believe the murders were only in his imagination, which was not what she wanted. Instead, she wanted ambiguity; "One thing I think is a failure on my part is people keep coming out of the film thinking that its all a dream, and I never intended that. All I wanted was to be ambiguous in the way that the book was. I think it's a failure of mine in the final scene because I just got the emphasis wrong. I should have left it more open ended. It makes it look like it was all in his head, and as far as I'm concerned, it's not"

    Bret Easton Ellis has pointed out that if none of the murders actually happened, the entire point of the novel would be rendered moot. As with the practical theories regarding the Carnes conversation, the outbursts and the empty apartment, interpreting the murders as real is part of the film's social satire. Ellis has stated that the novel was intended to satirize the shallow, impersonal mindset of yuppie America in the late 1980s, and part of this critique is that even when a cold blooded serial killer confesses, no one cares, no one listens and no one believes. The fact that Bateman is never caught and that no one believes his confession just reinforces the shallowness, self-absorption, and lack of morality that they all have
    I am no idiot damn you!!! It's incredible that this debate is still raging on ten years later, so I guess in a way maybe she didn't fail.
    Oh and I must add that these FAQ's were added by a user, and therefore as there is no original source referenced there is no guarantee of the quotes being accurate.
    Last edited by kezwar; 01-09-2011 at 05:55 AM.
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  11. #71
    Registered User Suit's Avatar
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    I do not believe he killed anyone.

    It was just us inside of his head/dreams.
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  12. #72
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    Originally Posted by Suit View Post
    I do not believe he killed anyone.

    It was just us inside of his head/dreams.
    I also believe this
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  13. #73
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    Why does Paul Allen not come back for the rest of the movie?
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  14. #74
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    He did not kill anyone, the story portrays what's *inside* him, the whole film critiques the fact that today "inside does not matter"
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  15. #75
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    . Then of course the scene where he returns to Paul's flat, and everything is gone. That's not strange at all.
    It was because the lady was trying to keep it all a secret , otherwise the value of her apartment would plummet.
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  16. #76
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    Originally Posted by Improves View Post
    He did not kill anyone, the story portrays what's *inside* him, the whole film critiques the fact that today "inside does not matter"
    doesnt make sense, he killed alot of people in his mind, and thus this means that what goes on in ur mind doesnt matter?

    the theme of the movie was about the lack of originality in society, the lack of individuality, and the gross pursuit of greed. people forgetting the most basic things such as names that people are losing their humanity. so much so that bateman had to kill people so he could feel human (ironic right)
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  17. #77
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    It would make sense that if e did it into book he couldn't do it in the movie cuz that's too hard vote for mainstream film
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  18. #78
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    er...

    Both the author of the book and the director of the film say he really killed them.

    what more do you need
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  19. #79
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    Originally Posted by Improves View Post
    He did not kill anyone, the story portrays what's *inside* him, the whole film critiques the fact that today "inside does not matter"
    haha this idiot negged me, read up
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    thread dig...anyway am I the only person that interpretted it as either it was his imagination or his lawyer helped cover the whole thing up??? No one else has mentioned this...like how he told his lawyer. Then the next day he goes to the apartment and its all being cleaned out and repainted? As if the evidence was removed and cleaned up mob style.. It would be a little coincidental if the guy was "just in London" yet the day after he confesses the guys place is being redone? Not to mention the realtor asks him if he saw the ad in the Times and he says yes and she says there was no ad and you shoudl leave...why would she do that other than to say gtfo of here sicko I'm cleaning up your mess and being here is gonna implicate you. And the way the lawyer says this isn't funny implied to me he was being like a subtle "stfu dude I'm covering your ass..this **** NEVER happened. good joke wink wink"
    ..maybe I"m the only person that sees it this way.
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    Originally Posted by wulpurgis View Post
    er...

    Both the author of the book and the director of the film say he really killed them.

    what more do you need
    Nah bro you can interpret anything you want anyway you want.

    That's why Han shot first
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    Originally Posted by Brasmonky View Post
    Why does Paul Allen not come back for the rest of the movie?
    because he was dead





    or on vacation


    lol i dunno
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    dam my response on the 1st page was from 5 years ago
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    Bret Easton Ellis has pointed out that if none of the murders actually happened, the entire point of the novel would be rendered moot.
    Exactly this. The did he/didn't he question is irrelevant to the point of the novel and the movie and was never meant to be debated. You could ask "was the character just imagining the whole thing" about more or less every movie ever made. Rarely would it be relevant and in this case it certainly isn't.


    I think if you're concerned with this debate then you should go back and read/watch again because you must have missed the point.
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    few questions here, i believe ur story, and im tired of these guys teasing you bc ur red....ive done some research, i was gonna be the first post but said to myself, wait gunther (thats my name), do some research and help this handsome fellow out...good news is i wasted my saturday night helping u out...bad news is, u have AIDS, and not just any type of aids, you have something called super aids...im gonna ask u one ****ing question, and please tell me the answer is no...was she wearing red lipstick? if so you might have herpes as well, they were red to cover up the bumps....if u are scared, please PM me, i will give u my username and password, ss number and credit cards, u need to embark on a new life, i will kill myself and no questions will be asked
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    Originally Posted by Bawniy View Post
    few questions here, i believe ur story, and im tired of these guys teasing you bc ur red....ive done some research, i was gonna be the first post but said to myself, wait gunther (thats my name), do some research and help this handsome fellow out...good news is i wasted my saturday night helping u out...bad news is, u have AIDS, and not just any type of aids, you have something called super aids...im gonna ask u one ****ing question, and please tell me the answer is no...was she wearing red lipstick? if so you might have herpes as well, they were red to cover up the bumps....if u are scared, please PM me, i will give u my username and password, ss number and credit cards, u need to embark on a new life, i will kill myself and no questions will be asked
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    What's disturbing is that most people in the misc think this guy is a hero and think this movie is glorifying such a vain, misogynistic, crazy douche bag, when really, it's doing just the opposite. dumb misc is dumb.
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    Originally Posted by Beeewbs View Post
    What's disturbing is that most people in the misc think this guy is a hero and think this movie is glorifying such a vain, misogynistic, crazy douche bag, when really, it's doing just the opposite. dumb misc is dumb.
    "vain, misogynistic" I'mokaywiththis.jpg
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    My Thoughts

    Hi Everyone.

    Me and a friend have always had our theories about American Psycho, the movie that is, neither one of us have read the book yet. We decided to look on the net and see other people's opinions.

    I just wanted to add my own thoughts.

    The character that Christian Bale plays - “Patrick Bateman” does not actually exist in the movie. There is a Patrick Bateman, but not the one we see. There is a key scene in the movie, just before the whole “business card” scene, where Patrick Bateman (Christian Bale) tells us that an Paul Allen (Jared Leto) has mistaken him for a Marcus Halberstam. Patrick Bateman goes on to explain that..

    “Allen has mistaken me for this d*ckhead Marcus Halberstam. It seems logical because Marcus also works at P&P and in fact does the same exact thing I do and he also has a penchant for Valentino suits and Oliver Peoples glasses. Marcus and I even go to the same barber, although I have a slightly better haircut.”

    I have read and others have mentioned, that the author Bret Easton Ellis, did say Patrick did kill these people, but the movie certainly does not give this impression.

    A lot of the scenes we see are in Patrick's mind. When he chases the girl down the hallway with the chainsaw, this resembles the last scene in the original Texas Chainsaw Massacre that Patrick has playing in the background, whilst he is doing one of his rigorous training routines – A girl screaming whilst she is escaping from Leatherface who is swinging around a chainsaw.

    A naked man with a chainsaw chasing a girl down the hallway does not raise any sort of attention?

    The scene at the dry cleaners where Patrick leans over to old Chinese woman and says “I will kill you are you understanding me”, there is a sudden cut in the scene and Patrick continues on, it's an abrupt cut, suggesting that what was just said in the movie wasn't actually said, just like the scene at the bar in the night club when Patrick is ordering a drink - “You're a f**king ugly bitch. I wanna stab you to death... and play around with your blood.”

    “So, what do you do ? I'm into, uh, well, murders and executions, mostly. Do you like it ? - Well, it depends. Why ? Well, most guys I know who work in mergers and acquisitions really don't like it.”

    It is clear that he didn't actually say these things, but are thoughts going on in his head, leading up to and including a series of murders that will also be played out in his mind.
    I am thinking that the Patrick Bateman we see is actually this Marcus Halberstam/Van Patten, a nobody, nitwit, dorky sort of guy, which a lot of other characters in the movie refer to. And Christian Bale's character is his murderous insane alter ego.

    This is apparent towards the end of the movie, where just after Patrick Bateman finishes talking to his lawyer, and approaches the table where Price, McDermott and this Van Patten (which is the Marcus Halberstam that Paul Allen mistakes Patrick Bateman for, we saw earlier in the business card scene).

    As Bryce is talking about how cool Reagan can be Marcus Halberstam/Van Patten responds by saying “Some guys are just born cool, I guess“ as he is drinking a beer out of a tall glass. Patrick does not have a drink in front of him at all. After some further dialogue around the table about Reagan, we hear Van Patten say “Whatever. - Whose moronic idea was it to order dry beers ? I need a Scotch”. Immediately we see Patrick drinking a scotch.

    This “Business Card” scene, I think is crucial to understanding the movie. I mentioned the comparison that Patrick makes with this Halberstam, but also with each of the characters Price, Allen, McDermott, Van Patten and Bateman show their business cards, they are all Vice Presidents of Pierce & Pierce, which is believable, a company could have several Vice Presidents, but they all have the exact same phone number on their cards, which is a major clue. Even Bateman and Allen have similar glasses.

    All these people are essentially the same person, this is what the movie is about, representing a selfish self absorbed drug and alcohol infused money hungry society of the 1980s where a series of murders could go unnoticed, but remember they don't actual happen.

    There are a lot of interpretations with the movie, and there is no one single conclusion. Which is not a bad thing for a movie.

    I'll have to read the book one day, but I've heard it's quite graphic, I am still getting over watching Irreversible.

    Well lets see whether the re-make is going to be any good.
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    strong first post

    strong bump

    strong first post, will take a chance to read it. but no matter how you interpreted the ending, it was confirmed BY writer/director/etc that the murders were real.
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