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  1. #31
    Unspoiled Monster ProBuck's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by death2all
    though he wasnt questioned for murder....
    "What whole Yale thing?

    "Well, he was probably a closet homosexual who did a lot of cocaine. That whole Yale thing."

    Hilarious!!!!!
    "I'll bet you're the kind of guy that would fcuk a person in the ass and not even have the goddam common courtesy to give him a reach-around." - Gunnery Sergeant Hartman
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  2. #32
    Official Board Barbarian The Kurgan's Avatar
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    No, he didn't kill them. And read the book; it's even better. For instance, in the book, the Kimball interview is far more funnier.

    "I'm.... at a loss," I tell him, somewhat truthfully. "He was part of that whole... Yale thing, you know."

    "Yale thing?" he asks, confused.

    I pause, having no idea what I'm talking about. "Yeah... Yale thing."

    "What do you mean... Yale thing?" Now he's intrigued.

    I pause again- what do I mean? "Well, I think, for one, that he was probably a closet homosexual." I have no idea; doubt it, considering his taste in babes. "Who did a lot of cocaine..." I pause, then add, a bit shakily, "that Yale thing."
    "... like a spring storm in an eastern wind, retiring only to return with more fury."

    - James Hogg
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  3. #33
    #33, RB Mad Dog162's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ProBuck
    Gosh...that sounds like work not entertainment. If I want to think about my entertainment I'd watch Arrested Development.
    Off topic: but that is a great great show!
    Molon Labe

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  4. #34
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    Patrick Bateman: Do you like Huey Lewis and the news?
    Paul Allen: They're OK.
    Patrick Bateman: Their early work was a little too new wave for my tastes, but when Sports came out in '83,I think they really came into their own, commercial and artistically. The whole album has a clear, crisp sound, and a new sheen of consimante professionalism that really gives the songs a big boost. He's been compared to Elvis Costello, but I think Huey has a far much more bitter, cynical sense of humour.
    Paul Allen: Hey Halberstram.
    Patrick Bateman: Yes, Allen?
    Paul Allen: Why are their copies of the style section all over the place, d-do you have a dog? A little chow or something?
    Patrick Bateman: No, Allen.
    Paul Allen: Is that a rain coat?
    Patrick Bateman: Yes it is! In '87, Huey released this, Fore, their most accomplished album. I think their undisputed masterpiece is "Hip to be Square", a song so catchy, most people probably don't listen to the lyrics. But they should, because it's not just about the pleasures of conformity, and the importance of trends, it's also a personal statement about the band itself.
    [raises axe above head]
    Patrick Bateman: Hey Paul!
    [he bashes Allen in the head with the axe, and blood splatters over him]
    Patrick Bateman: TRY GETTING A RESERVATION AT DORSIA NOW YOU ****ING STUPID BASTARD! YOU, ****ING BASTARD!
    "oh my god stop talking about fedor we have a hot girl here"
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  5. #35
    Registered User kezwar's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheSlash View Post
    This guy is on the right page.

    The murders were REAL, but not the way we saw them. We saw them through patricks eyes. We saw his imagination at work.

    Didn't you notice the ONLY time Patrick isn't on the screen is when we see his secretary find his notebook? We are seeing the movie through his eyes the entire time.

    The whole movie is about the 80's power hungry yuppies and how everyone was the same, no individuality. No one cared about anyone else. This point was overdone in some instances to show just how much people were into themselves.

    eg.. the chainsaw in the hall... That probably never existed, he killed the girls in a normal way, but that's how he played it out in his head. The fact that no one came out into the hall, was him realizing how apathetic people were, and how no one cared enough to even look out.

    People are SO alike, no one can keep names straight, thats a huge part of the movie. Not even his own lawyer knows his name. Another funny tell all was that they were all V.P's, this is all just to show that there is no individuality.

    So yes the murders were real, just not as we saw them. Even writer Bret Ellis has said in numerous interviews that the murders were real. Our view is just different then how they really happened.
    You can't say it is a fact, because that simply isn't true. It's open to interpretation, but if you watch that film and interpret that he did indeed kill those people, then I'm sorry, your either a bit stupid or want to disagree with people for the sake of sounding intelligent.

    Regardless of how it is interpreted in the book, in the film there are simply far too many dead give away's. As has been mentioned, the body bag scene, the scene at the beginning in the club where he tells the barmaid he wants to stab her, and then in the laundrette (I believe this is what he is saying in his head).

    There is the scene immediately after the chainsaw scene, where he is drawing a dead woman and a chainsaw. Then there is the ludicrous scene where he goes mental, shooting the old lady and the shoot out with the cops. The car blows up and he looks in amazement, as if he is doubting the events that are taking place.

    Then there is the scene just after where he shoots the receptionist, only for the scene to replay, this time him signing himself in. Then of course the scene where he returns to Paul's flat, and everything is gone. That's not strange at all. And finally the closing scenes where his PA finds his illustrations and then the revelation immediately afterwards that he did not kill Paul.

    Now I can accept that there are alternative explanations for some of these, but not all of them. There is simply far too much pointing to it all being in his head, and that is a fact.
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  6. #36
    Forever cutting SebastianG's Avatar
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    No he didnt.

    He only killed them in his head.

    Excellent movie
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  7. #37
    Banned b0ngman's Avatar
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    its pretty obvious it was all in his head...
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  8. #38
    Banned .aeterna's Avatar
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    strong bump, posted in this 5 yrs ago..

    my original points stand, i dont see any reason to believe the entire movie was a dream.
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  9. #39
    INTJ wulpurgis's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by dexterium View Post
    Some people say that he killed the people. Some people say he didn't.

    What do you guys think and why?
    do you mean the book or film?

    Film = yes, they are all disposable and interchangeable. the director is a feminist doing a satire.

    Book = no, i'm thinking: my read is that the author gets bored with a boring book, integrates violence into the book, mirroring the character who gets bored with life integrating violence into his life.

    ITT the book is open-ended, that is what makes it great. But I think Mary Harron was going after satire and social criticism, so them murders happened.


    edit: didn't notice epic bump..... fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu



    edit 2:
    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    my original points stand, i dont see any reason to believe the entire movie was a dream.
    the director's intent......... that wins out in this case, she had an explicit intent. it was not a dream.
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  10. #40
    Registered User sickkyknarbar's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by wulpurgis View Post
    Book = no, i'm thinking: my read is that the author gets bored with a boring book
    Lol wut? The book was pure genius and a laughing riot. Are you smoking crack?
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  11. #41
    Banned .aeterna's Avatar
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    IIRC, both the author and director CONFIRMED that the murders were real - i got to find the citation...
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  12. #42
    INTJ wulpurgis's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by sickkyknarbar View Post
    Lol wut? The book was pure genius and a laughing riot. Are you smoking crack?
    no i agree, but i get the impression that the material is kinda mundane. Bateman just doing his shiit. then some violence injects itself. then it spirals into him eating guts, gets over the top with the rat, etc.

    you can disagree with me, but i think Bateman has an unfulfilled life and turns to violence as a way to cope.

    i suspect Ellis likewise was writing something fun and all, but not terribly exciting. he writes in violence, arguably violence which makes the book. i don't know how much i'd care about the book without the violence.

    again, disagree with me if you like, but that is what i think. it is a good book.


    edit:
    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    IIRC, both the author and director CONFIRMED that the murders were real - i got to find the citation...
    in for citation. i'd like to know what Ellis says.
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  13. #43
    Know Emperiorjack's Avatar
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    The way I saw it was he fantasized about it throughout the movie but at the very end he snapped and actually went on a rampage.
    FX45: "I'm ending my debate with Lothar because I'm more mature" then ends his post with a picture of a old fat naked man(referring to Lothar).
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  14. #44
    将軍 TheAnimal_013's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LatsMakeTheMan View Post
    I think Craig Titus did it.
    lmao repped brah
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  15. #45
    Registered User Mister-Lean's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    Whoa, i think some of you guys missed a big point of this movie...

    He did kill those people, thats a fact. The part at the end when the lawyer claims he had lunch with Paul Allen proves the point of the movie that people did not give a **** about anyone else. Hence why people were constantly confusing names and whatnot. The lawyer probably believed he had lunch with Allen, but he was way wrong. Allen was long dead before that. The lawyer even messed up Patrick Bateman's name.
    This is what I was thinking.
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  16. #46
    INTJ wulpurgis's Avatar
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    lol i've found

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0144084/faq#.2.1.14

    Did Bret Easton Ellis like the film?

    Yes he did. Ellis actually wrote an extensive, and generally positive review of the film for the official site, which can be read in its entirety here. Ellis also appeared on an episode of The Charlie Rose Show, along with Christian Bale and co-screenwriter/director Mary Harron, where he said he liked the film very much, and felt it improved on the novel in certain aspects; "the film clarified the themes of the novel. It clarified that the novel was a critique of male behavior"

    Harron ultimately felt that she had gone too far with the hallucinatory approach. In an interview with Charlie Rose, she stated that she felt she had failed with the end of the film because she led audiences to believe the murders were only in his imagination, which was not what she wanted. Instead, she wanted ambiguity; "One thing I think is a failure on my part is people keep coming out of the film thinking that its all a dream, and I never intended that. All I wanted was to be ambiguous in the way that the book was. I think it's a failure of mine in the final scene because I just got the emphasis wrong. I should have left it more open ended. It makes it look like it was all in his head, and as far as I'm concerned, it's not"

    Bret Easton Ellis has pointed out that if none of the murders actually happened, the entire point of the novel would be rendered moot. As with the practical theories regarding the Carnes conversation, the outbursts and the empty apartment, interpreting the murders as real is part of the film's social satire. Ellis has stated that the novel was intended to satirize the shallow, impersonal mindset of yuppie America in the late 1980s, and part of this critique is that even when a cold blooded serial killer confesses, no one cares, no one listens and no one believes. The fact that Bateman is never caught and that no one believes his confession just reinforces the shallowness, self-absorption, and lack of morality that they all have

    huh, well there we go.
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  17. #47
    Ate girl out for 45 min jmack549's Avatar
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    Yup, and on my friends DVD he has commentary where the director talks about how the murders are real.
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    IIRC, both the author and director CONFIRMED that the murders were real - i got to find the citation...
    A few people have said that, but I've yet to see it myself, and I've been scouring the net for a couple of hours now.
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    A few people have said that, but I've yet to see it myself, and I've been scouring the net for a couple of hours now.
    lol scroll up,

    of course, IMDB has the citation, yet im here looking for an hour everywhere else...reps for wul - now my haters can shut it (altho its been 5 yrs..)
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    Strong bump and strong missing the whole point of the movie if you think the murders never happend
    A young bull and an old bull were standing atop a hill looking at a bunch of heifers in a field below.

    The young bull says "Let's run down this hill and fuk one of those heifers."

    The old bull replies "No. Let's walk down there, and fuk them all."
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    Originally Posted by ProBuck View Post
    I don't have the time and inclination to get into this right now but if you pay close attention to the last scene where the guy tell him he just saw Paul in London you'll know that it was all fantasy confirmed by his secretary finding his notebook where he doodled all the things he fantasized about.

    Yeah,he's really walking through NYC blowing up cars,shooting security guards and having helicopters circle office buildings.
    WTF?
    this

    i believe its him day dreaming
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    He didn't
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    lol scroll up,

    of course, IMDB has the citation, yet im here looking for an hour everywhere else...reps for wul - now my haters can shut it (altho its been 5 yrs..)
    sorry just seen it. I still stand by what I said though, she admits that it looks as though it was in in his head, when her intention was for it to be ambiguous. Regardless of whether that was her intention or not, it didn't turn out that way. Like I said originally though, I can see the other side, but I don't think there are reasonable explanations for all the points that I pointed out, which weren't just the obvious ones.
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    Originally Posted by wulpurgis View Post
    lol i've found

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0144084/faq#.2.1.14

    Did Bret Easton Ellis like the film?

    Yes he did. Ellis actually wrote an extensive, and generally positive review of the film for the official site, which can be read in its entirety here. Ellis also appeared on an episode of The Charlie Rose Show, along with Christian Bale and co-screenwriter/director Mary Harron, where he said he liked the film very much, and felt it improved on the novel in certain aspects; "the film clarified the themes of the novel. It clarified that the novel was a critique of male behavior"

    Harron ultimately felt that she had gone too far with the hallucinatory approach. In an interview with Charlie Rose, she stated that she felt she had failed with the end of the film because she led audiences to believe the murders were only in his imagination, which was not what she wanted. Instead, she wanted ambiguity; "One thing I think is a failure on my part is people keep coming out of the film thinking that its all a dream, and I never intended that. All I wanted was to be ambiguous in the way that the book was. I think it's a failure of mine in the final scene because I just got the emphasis wrong. I should have left it more open ended. It makes it look like it was all in his head, and as far as I'm concerned, it's not"

    Bret Easton Ellis has pointed out that if none of the murders actually happened, the entire point of the novel would be rendered moot. As with the practical theories regarding the Carnes conversation, the outbursts and the empty apartment, interpreting the murders as real is part of the film's social satire. Ellis has stated that the novel was intended to satirize the shallow, impersonal mindset of yuppie America in the late 1980s, and part of this critique is that even when a cold blooded serial killer confesses, no one cares, no one listens and no one believes. The fact that Bateman is never caught and that no one believes his confession just reinforces the shallowness, self-absorption, and lack of morality that they all have

    huh, well there we go.
    read this
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    read this
    erm I did, but we aint talkin about the book here, we're talking about the film.
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    sorry just seen it. I still stand by what I said though, she admits that it looks as though it was in in his head, when her intention was for it to be ambiguous. Regardless of whether that was her intention or not, it didn't turn out that way. Like I said originally though, I can see the other side, but I don't think there are reasonable explanations for all the points that I pointed out, which weren't just the obvious ones.
    then you're ultimately missing the point of the movie and book-

    all those scenes u referred to; its to support the simple satirical element that in the 80's yuppie culture, people were more concerned with money, wall street, etc etc... than even remembering each others names. nobody listened to neone because nobody cared (in reference to the lady in the club that thought she heard 'mergers and acquisitions'). the lawyer believed he met paul allen in london, but how would he remember if he didnt even recognize patrick bateman, one of his clients

    idk where the confusion is, both the director and author confirmed they were "real..."

    this isnt open to interpretation, its a closed-shut case

    edit: in regards to the film..heres here direct quote.. "In an interview with Charlie Rose, she stated that she felt she had failed with the end of the film because she led audiences to believe the murders were only in his imagination, which was not what she wanted. Instead, she wanted ambiguity"
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    Originally Posted by kezwar View Post
    erm I did, but we aint talkin about the book here, we're talking about the film.
    Uhhh are you retarded? The film was made from the book. Lol
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    Originally Posted by sickkyknarbar View Post
    Uhhh are you retarded? The film was made from the book. Lol
    You don't say, I believe it's called an adaptation. Adaptation's are never 100% faithful to their source material. Retard.
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    Originally Posted by .aeterna View Post
    then you're ultimately missing the point of the movie and book-

    all those scenes u referred to; its to support the simple satirical element that in the 80's yuppie culture, people were more concerned with money, wall street, etc etc... than even remembering each others names. nobody listened to neone because nobody cared (in reference to the lady in the club that thought she heard 'mergers and acquisitions'). the lawyer believed he met paul allen in london, but how would he remember if he didnt even recognize patrick bateman, one of his clients

    idk where the confusion is, both the director and author confirmed they were "real..."

    this isnt open to interpretation, its a closed-shut case

    edit: in regards to the film..heres here direct quote.. "In an interview with Charlie Rose, she stated that she felt she had failed with the end of the film because she led audiences to believe the murders were only in his imagination, which was not what she wanted. Instead, she wanted ambiguity"
    No I beleive I did not miss the point of the film. It's quite obvious, and I've read it countless times from people trying to oppose this theory. If you read my original post you can see that I didn't just point out the obvious scenes. Bateman drawing the chainsaw girl immediately after he is seen killing her. The illustrations found by his PA right after he returns to the vacant flat. The killing spree at the end, the shoot-out with the cops. Then the scene where he kills the security guard, then he appears to enter the same building and this time signs in.

    I understand that it was the author's intention that Bateman did indeed kill everyone, but in the film it is made to look like it was all in his dream in an effort to create ambiguity. Which Harron says happens in the book also, though I'm guessing it is executed better. Harron said in that quote that was the intention, but she acknoledges that she failed.
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    so...you took up your own interpretation of the film even though the director confirmed that that one is not what "she intended?"

    son, i am confuse
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