Has anyone experienced or have knowledge of a direct correlation between increased protein intake and kidney stones? I've had kidney stones for 30 years (probably passed upwards of 100 or so and have been to many urologists over the years), and the last time I increased my protein intake for a sustained period of time, I ended up with a kidney full of them. Three lithotripsies (the medical blasting regimen that breaks them up) later, I was fine, but I'm hesitant to increase my protein intake again to that extent. Obviously, this could be a big determining factor in whether I decide to go the BB route (I joined Gold's last week and am starting up after a long hiatus) or just try to stay fit using a mixture of cardio and weights. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Stephen
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Thread: Protein and kidney stones
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12-26-2005, 07:18 AM #1
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Protein and kidney stones
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12-26-2005, 07:32 AM #2
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12-26-2005, 02:05 PM #3
the correlation usually happens when one ups their protein and does not compensate by upping their water intake as well.
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12-26-2005, 02:43 PM #4
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12-26-2005, 04:00 PM #5
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12-26-2005, 04:08 PM #6
I have problems with Kidney Stones, and the only thing that has helped me, is increasing my water intake.
I am in agreement with most of these guys.
Never substitute a protein drink for water.
Several years ago, I started taking a 1-liter water bottle with some granulated Gatorade in it, and I consume the entire bottle throughout my 1 hour or less workout. I have not had a Kidney Stone in 5 years, as a result.
Do not depend on the drinking fountain at the gym for your water intake, or you will never get enough.
BTW, I do not believe the correlation of more protein = higher rate of Kidney Stones, as I also drink 1/2 gallon of Skim Milk per day.
Being dehydrated is your worst enemy, and you are just asking for a Kidney Stone(s). When the little tubes get dehydrated, the moisture in them crystalizes and forms Kidney Stones. If you are properly hydrated, you will lessen your chances for stones forming, because you are flushing your system properly. No guarantee you won't get them. Probably just less.
Don't blame it on protein.Last edited by Mark1T; 12-26-2005 at 04:55 PM.
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12-27-2005, 05:47 AM #7
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Thank you: and how to increase water consumption?
Thanks for the tips! I've had kidney stones long enough to know that water intake is especially important, but despite having heard it again and again, I still resist it. I don't resist it for any other reason than it's just so hard--for me at least--to consume that much water and still lead a normal life.
Consuming a lot of water for me means: (1) going to the bathroom constantly (sometimes as often as every twenty minutes, but usually every 30-40 min), and (2) feeling very full all the time. In the morning when I wake up, it's easy to drink a quart of water very quickly. But as the day wears on, water consumption is harder. As I "feel" hydrated, drinking more water becomes a struggle. It's easy to substitute sugarless teas etc., but I know they don't hydrate--if anything, they dehydrate. Perhaps water with some gatorade in it is the answer to keep me going.
If anyone knows how to increase water consumption, I'd love to hear it. I was reading the forums the other day and read about a way to increase your appetite by feeding your stomach every hour for a while until it gets used to the need for food. Somehow this doesn't seem to work with water though.
Any more tips?
Stephen
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12-27-2005, 07:05 AM #8
Yes, it is more difficult as the day wears on, but which is worse (1) The inconvenience of drinking water; or (2) Having the worst pain you can possibly imagine with a stone???
Yes, Gatorade helps replinish the salts and electrolytes that are lost either form exercising and just living.
Get on it!!
Originally Posted by musclecrunchHelping one person may not change the world, but it could change the world for one person.
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12-27-2005, 10:45 AM #9
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12-27-2005, 11:29 AM #10
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12-27-2005, 11:42 AM #11Originally Posted by ExCompetitor
Agree, and space out your drinking of those two gallons of water over the course of the day, rather than trying to pound it down a quarter or a half a gallon at a time, or you run the risk of dilluting your electrolytes to unhealthy levels.
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12-27-2005, 11:56 AM #12
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12-27-2005, 01:00 PM #13
This time of year I drink 1.5 gallons. It's not that hard to do and the pissing constantly abates after awhile. I pissed a few of those little pocupines, NEVER AGAIN!! I'd rather be shot again than pass another stone, there's no comparason in the pain level bro. The pain from a stone leads by a country mile!!!
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12-27-2005, 01:16 PM #14
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Originally Posted by GREENFEATHER
I'm gonna trust you on the "getting used to it" part. I'm on my third quart of water today and I'm going to the bathroom every 25-30 minutes. (Luckily, I don't have to work for a few weeks, so we'll see how this goes.) I can't even imagine drinking triple what I've already drunk so far today.
I guess if I want to up my protein intake though, this is what I'll have to do.
Stephen
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12-27-2005, 08:02 PM #15
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Originally Posted by jaguarr
I hope you guys are right that one's body gets used to to drinking this much water! The rug is worn between my office and the bathroom.
Tomorrow may be easier since it's a gym day.
Thanks for the encouragement.
Stephen
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12-28-2005, 06:49 AM #16
you can train your body to not be so sensitive to a full bladder if you want.
try to drink some water just before you sleep, your bladder will expand in your sleep but you wont feel the need to go until the morning, this will help stretch your bladder a bit. dont do it too much mind or youll wake up in the night.
try to hold it for a while longer, so you body gets used to the full bladder. that way, when you feel the need to go, youll soon be able to ignore it and cary on with your day.
these measures will help your body get used to a fuller bladder, so you can drink more water and not feel the need to be 10 yards away from a toilet at any given time.
hope this helps.
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12-28-2005, 09:34 AM #17
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Originally Posted by bxa121
I think I'll just try to drink a gallon+ each day for a while and see if that helps.
Thanks for your suggestion though!
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12-29-2005, 05:23 PM #18
This has been a concern of mine for quite a while too. I had my first kidney stone four years ago (spent a couple of days trying to pass it, but it got stuck in my ureter and wouldn't drop into my bladder. I had to have it removed in a rather uncomfortable "procedure" which by all accounts is worse than the pain of the stone itself.) -they told me I had one in my other kidney as well. I still have yet to pass that one, and hope it's not growing any larger in my kidney.
The doctor put me on diruetics to treat me for hypercalciurea, but it didn't seem to help, so I'm off them. He suggested that too much protein could be the culprit, but the most effective treatment was to drink a lot of water. Since then, that's been my priority. What I use as a rule of thumb for water intake (I try for about a gallon a day) is to try and keep my urine as clear as possible. If it starts getting cloudy I up the water. -and yes, late night bathroom visits are typical.
I would like to think that sweating during a workout is also a good way for my body to expell the excess sodium which causes hypercalciuria.
-mike
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12-29-2005, 05:36 PM #19
Good info, mbeck. When I had to go to the Emergency Room about 4 years ago, they gave me all kinds of things for pain, including low-dose morphine. No relief, until they gave me some kind of anti-inflamation drug. Maybe it was cortisone? Whatever it was, it gave me instant relief.
Originally Posted by mbeckHelping one person may not change the world, but it could change the world for one person.
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12-29-2005, 05:47 PM #20
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I get kidney stones. The first time I went to hospital & the doctor there could not diagnose it, they eventually phoned a surgeon & he was able to diagnose it without talking to me!
Kidney stones are usually composed of calcium oxalate. So moderate your calcium intake (milk, whey). I was on Zyloprim and a diuretic for a while. Now I make surr I have a bottle of water at my desk at work, at home I drink water flavoured with a little diet cordial or diet soft drink.
As you grow older, your thirst sensors diminish especially if you are male. I once tried not drinking all day & didn't feel thirsty till 4pm. So make drinking water a habit.
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12-30-2005, 07:18 AM #21
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Originally Posted by mbeck
In the meantime, I'm increasing my protein consumption gradually. But if I can't see into my kidney, I won't know what's happening until an X-Ray shows me.
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12-30-2005, 07:21 AM #22
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12-30-2005, 07:29 AM #23
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Originally Posted by johnnyironboard
If you're not prone to making stones, then you won't--no matter how much protein you consume.
It's the luck of the draw.
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12-30-2005, 07:35 AM #24Originally Posted by johnnyironboard
Last edited by bulletman; 12-30-2005 at 07:38 AM.
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12-30-2005, 07:40 AM #25
High protein does not necessarily lead to kidney stones. Kidney stones are commonly developed from small amounts of calcified material in the kidney.
The kidney stones that are made of proteins, are cuased because of a deficiency of the ability of the kidneys from being able to filter out the protein. High protein intake can exacerbate the problem, but just consuming high amounts of protein is just not enough to cause them. It is a rare kidney disorder if your stones are made from proteins.One party system; Most Republicans are Democrats, but no Democrats are Republicans.
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12-30-2005, 08:05 AM #26
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Originally Posted by Kraken
Mine, like most people, are made of calcium oxylate. So what is the relationship between high protein consumption and kidney stones? What do increased amounts of protein have to do with not being able to filter calcium out of the kidney?
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12-30-2005, 08:50 AM #27Originally Posted by musclecrunchOne party system; Most Republicans are Democrats, but no Democrats are Republicans.
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12-30-2005, 10:26 AM #28
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12-30-2005, 11:07 AM #29
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12-31-2005, 03:10 PM #30
This may help
IJSNEM, 10(1), March 2000, Copyright © 2000
Do Regular High Protein Diets Have Potential Health Risks on Kidney Function in Athletes?
Jacques R. Poortmans; Olivier Dellalieux
Full Article Table of Contents for Vol. 10, Iss. 1
Abstract
Excess protein and amino acid intake have been recognized as hazardous potential implications for kidney function, leading to progressive impairment of this organ. It has been suggested in the literature, without clear evidence, that high protein intake by athletes has no harmful consequences on renal function. This study investigated body-builders (BB) and other well-trained athletes (OA) with high and medium protein intake, respectively, in order to shed light on this issue. The athletes underwent a 7-day nutrition record analysis as well as blood sample and urine collection to determine the potential renal consequences of a high protein intake. The data revealed that despite higher plasma concentration of uric acid and calcium, Group BB had renal clearances of creatinine, urea, and albumin that were within the normal range. The nitrogen balance for both groups became positive when daily protein intake exceeded 1.26 g · kg–1 but there were no correlations between protein intake and creatinine clearance, albumin excretion rate, and calcium excretion rate. To conclude, it appears that protein intake under 2.8 g· kg–1 does not impair renal function in well-trained athletes as indicated by the measures of renal function used in this study.
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