Holy Bible of Cutting - Cutting Science with Supplementation Guide AMEN!!

[600538411]

This is a work "in progress" by me... I will work in subsections and it will constantly get edited. I figured I will just add more stuff to it by editing as I go along rather than do one big whole document then just drop it on... Please Feel free to mention areas worth discussing or any short-comings of this whole thing... Otherwise enjoy! (p.s. Please don't move from supps science thread just yet! I am getting there!!! lol)

(some of the) TOPICS THAT WILL BE COVERED:
-FOOD DIGESTION
-HOW FAT IS UTILIZED/MANAGED BY OUR BODIES
-FAT STORAGE/MOBILIZATION (Lipogenesis/Lipolysis)
-METABOLISM OF ENERGY SUBSTRATES (inc. ROLE OF THE ELECTRON TRANSPORT CHAIN)
-IMPORTANCE OF PROTEIN IN CUTTING (inc ref to PROTEIN TURNOVER) AND CORRECT PROTEIN CHOICES
-SUPPLEMENTATION - HOW TO BRING THESE CONCEPTS TOGETHER

Holy Bible of Cutting - Cutting Science with Supplementation Guide AMEN!!

by 600538411

"YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT"
- DIET (THE KEY TO CUTTING)

Lets start with one of the most fundamental principles of science that in its conventional sense is the basis for which alot of other princples rely on... It's called "The Law of Conservation of Matter" which states that matter cannot be created or destroyed by ordinary means. Now your probably asking yourself, why? What the hell has this got to do with cutting... Well alot! Let me explain...

When we digest food, it certainly does not come out the other end looking like what we digested (in most cases!)... So what happens to this food along the way? Well most of the bonds are broken down in the multiple phases of digestion yielding substrates which are absorbed by the body through the small & large intestine whilst all the undigestable materials (fibrous material) are then excreted as feces. OK so how does this tie into the law of conservation you may ask? You would weigh the same if you were holding the food in your hand as if you ingested that same food and then digested and it left your body as fecal matter as long as the fecal matter was also on the scales with you (neglecting at this point loss of water via sweat & metabolism of energy, just for now so chill science buffs)... So the old adage "you are what you eat" has some home truths to it...

With this in mind, it is important that we put the right substrates into the body to best promote the loss of adipose (fat/lipid) tissue from our bodies... One thing that must be made clear is that not all energy substrates are created equal when it comes to cutting... This will present itself further through this guide.

"RENDER THEREFORE UNTO SUET THE THING THAT WAS BEEF FAT"
- METABOLISM (UNDERSTANDING THE WAY OUR BODIES DEAL WITH FAT)

Our bodies really are a marvel! Their abilities to turn one thing into another are what give us the ability to stay alive every day... Without this adaptability it would be almost impossible to maintain the stringent requirements necessary to proper function at a cellular level...

Completely disregarding all of the vitamins, minerals, trace elements, etc. that the body requires to function properly, there is one primary thing that all cells share in common that is required for proper function.... ENERGY! Without ENERGY the cells will undergo necrosis (cell death) so it is kind of important in the scheme of things...

If there is one thing that the body does well, it is find sources of energy... Why does you body store fat, because it likes to store energy which it can call upon when your body is in a state of fasting.... This doesn't mean that fat is the only calling point for energy though in times of fasting... It can also use protein found from degrading muscle tissue and by utilizing muscles carbohydrate stores called glycogen... The body can change nearly all substrates into another substrate which it may require more urgently... Fat <-> Carbohydrate <-> Protein ... It is not some much one blob of fat turns to one blob of prtein so forget that concept... Once the food has been digested and has been absorbed through the intestines and is then further scrutinized by the first pass of the liver, substrates then make their way into the bloodstream in the form of branch chain amino acids, sugars and fatty acids.... So BCAA can be converted to Carbohydrates and visa vera, same with sugars can be converted to fats, etc etc... This is with exception to the Essential fatty acids (smallest units of fat) & Essential amino acids. They CANNOT be synthesized by the body hence why they are called "essential" because it is essential that they are found in your diet.

STARTED (BUT NO WHERE NEAR FINISHED) SUPPLEMENTATION GUIDE
1. Via adrenergic pathways
-Beta 2 Agonist - (DIRECT) Clenbuterol HCl, etc. (INDIRECT) Ephedrine/PEA
-Alpha 2 Antagonist - Yohimbine HCl

2. Decarboxylating Oxidative Phosphorylation/Proton Leakage
-Thyroid Hormones (DIRECT)3,5-T2 (INDIRECT)T4/T3/3,3'-T2
-2,4-DNP

3. Promoting Lipolysis/Inhibiting Lipogenesis

ADRENERGIC PATHWAY OVERVIEW
BEST OTC CHOICES :

DECARBOXYLATORS
BEST OTC CHOICES :

ANTI-LYPOLYSIS/PRO-LYPOGENESIS AGENTS
BEST OTC CHOICE :

[600538411]

CONSTANTLY BEING EDITED!!

TOPICS THAT WILL BE COVERED:
-FOOD DIGESTION
-HOW FAT IS UTILIZED/MANAGED BY OUR BODIES
-FAT STORAGE/MOBILIZATION (Lipogenesis/Lipolysis)
-METABOLISM OF ENERGY SUBSTRATES (inc. ROLE OF THE ELECTRON TRANSPORT CHAIN)
-IMPORTANCE OF PROTEIN IN CUTTING (inc ref to PROTEIN TURNOVER) AND CORRECT PROTEIN CHOICES
-SUPPLEMENTATION - HOW TO BRING THESE CONCEPTS TOGETHER

Holy Bible of Cutting - Cutting Science with Supplementation Guide AMEN!!

by 600538411

"YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT"
- DIET (THE KEY TO CUTTING)

Lets start with one of the most fundamental principles of science that in its conventional sense is the basis for which alot of other princples rely on... It's called "The Law of Conservation of Matter" which states that matter cannot be created or destroyed by ordinary means. Now your probably asking yourself, why? What the hell has this got to do with cutting... Well alot! Let me explain...

When we digest food, it certainly does not come out the other end looking like what we digested (in most cases!)... So what happens to this food along the way? Well most of the bonds are broken down in the multiple phases of digestion yielding substrates which are absorbed by the body through the small & large intestine whilst all the undigestable materials (fibrous material) are then excreted as feces. OK so how does this tie into the law of conservation you may ask?

You would weigh the same if you were holding the food in your hand as if you ingested that same food and then digested and it left your body as fecal matter as long as the fecal matter was also on the scales with you (neglecting at this point loss of water via sweat & metabolism of energy, just for now so chill science buffs)... So the old adage "you are what you eat" has some home truths to it...

With this in mind, it is important that we put the right substrates into the body to best promote the loss of adipose (fat/lipid) tissue from our bodies... One thing that must be made clear is that not all energy substrates are created equal when it comes to cutting... This will present itself further through this guide.

"RENDER THEREFORE UNTO SUET THE THING THAT WAS BEEF FAT"
- METABOLISM (UNDERSTANDING THE WAY OUR BODIES DEAL WITH FAT)

Our bodies really are a marvel! Their abilities to turn one thing into another are what give us the ability to stay alive every day... Without this adaptability it would be almost impossible to maintain the stringent requirements necessary to proper function at a cellular level...

Completely disregarding all of the vitamins, minerals, trace elements, etc. that the body requires to function properly, there is one primary thing that all cells share in common that is required for proper function.... ENERGY! Without ENERGY the cells will undergo necrosis (cell death) so it is kind of important in the scheme of things...

If there is one thing that the body does well, it is find sources of energy... Why does you body store fat, because it likes to store energy which it can call upon when your body is in a state of fasting.... This doesn't mean that fat is the only calling point for energy though in times of fasting... It can also use protein found from degrading muscle tissue and by utilizing muscles carbohydrate stores called glycogen...

The body can change nearly all substrates into another substrate which it may require more urgently...
Fat <-> Carbohydrate <-> Protein ...

SO WHY IS THE COMPOSTION OF WHAT I EAT SO IMPORTANT?

Because once the body has any of these substrates in abundance in the bloodstream, it sets of a cascade of other changes in the body that affect whether were storing fats (lipogenesis) or whether were burning them (lypolysis).

Once the food has been digested and has been absorbed through the intestines and is then further scrutinized by the first pass of the liver, substrates then make their way into the bloodstream in the form of branch chain amino acids, sugars and fatty acids....

So BCAA can be converted to Carbohydrates and visa vera, same with sugars can be converted to fats, etc etc... This is with exception to the Essential fatty acids (smallest units of fat) & Essential amino acids. They CANNOT be synthesized by the body hence why they are called "essential" because it is essential that they are found in your diet.

Fat is stored in the body in the form of triglycerides. Fat can also be stored as droplets within skeletal muscle cells. These fat droplets are called intramuscular triglycerides and they may hold 2000-3000 kcals of stored energy. In addition to the stores of fat, some fat travel freely in the blood.

Carbohydrate ingestion inhibits lypolysis and promotes lipogenesis so high GI food in cutting is a definate no-no...

TWO IMPORTANT CONCEPTS TO UNDERSTAND HERE....

1. The mobilization of fat refers to the process of releasing fat from storage sites in the body,

whereas,

2. metabolism of fat is the complete biological breakdown or oxidation of fat into energy that can be used by the body.

SO WE NEED TO GET FAT MOBILISED FIRST BEFORE WE CAN METABOLISE IT?

HELL YEAH we need to get fat from these fat cell stores and into the bloodstream which in turn allows our bodies the opportunity to metabolise them...

SO LETS LOOK AT THE KEY TO FAT MOBILIZATION (Lipolysis)
What is the key, increasing our bodies levels of epinepherine. Epinephrine, which is released by the sympathetic nervous system during exercise, is the primary stimulator of lipolysis. During aerobic exercise the bodies respone to epinephrine is enhanced. In an endurance-trained individual the responsiveness to epinephrine is further enhanced.

The two main types of epinephrine receptors are alpha and beta receptors, these are better know as the alpha- & beta- adrenergic receptors. Epinephrine can stimulate lipolysis through the beta receptors and can inhibit lipolysis through the alpha receptors. So the key to getting fat mobilized is to increase stimulation of the beta receptors & limit stimulation of the alpha receptor. OK so we can moderate these levels naturally through aerobic exercise BUT the down side to this is long bouts of exercise are normally needed for lipids to be the primary source of energy in aerobic exercise & that means increases in cortisol levels too which means bye bye muscles... So how do you mobilize lipids without aerobic exercise. Supplementation of course!

IS THERE A SUPPLEMENT THAT DOES THIS?
YES! That is why people use beta2-adrenergic agonists (stimulators) like clenbuterol, salbutamol, etc.

What about stopping stimulation of the alpha receptors? AGAIN YES! Yohimbine HCl is what people use to do this...

SO WHY DO PEOPLE USE IT AND STILL NOT LOSE WEIGHT LIKE THE PROS?

Two main reasons,

Reason 1 - all they are doing is getting fat mobilized, you still have to get it metabolized

Reason 2 - after 2 weeks, the bod adapts to this over & under stimulation of the receptors and starts removing these recpetors so that the response to these drugs is suppressed...

SO ARE THERE ANY OTHER WAYS TO MOBILIZE FAT?
YES, Caffeine also works on the mechanism that is causes increases in epinepherine hence promoting lypolysis... Caffeine causes increases in cyclic AMP (cAMP) in cells. Cyclic AMP participates in the messenging cascade produced by cells in response to stimulation by epinephrine, so by increasing cAMP levels with caffeine, it intensifies and prolongs the effects of epinephrine.

OK SO CAFFEINE ENHANCES THE EFFECTS OF OTHER ADRENERGIC PRODUCTS, IS THAT IT?
HELL NO! OK so caffeine, clenbuterol & yohimbine are supsected to be metabolized(broken down) in the liver by the cytochrome P450 oxidase enzyme... What about if you took Naringin found in grapefruit, which is known to inhibit the cytochrome P450 enzyme hence leading to less clenbuterol, yohimbine & caffeine being broken down hence exhasibating their effects...

Ketotifen is another product which has an effect on exhaserbating the effects of clenbuterol & yohimbine using a mechanism that stops the downregulation of adrenergic receptors hence can make firstly, clen/yoh cycles go for longer than 2 weeks and still be effective & secondly, the doses of clen/yoh can be less for the same adrenergic activity as higher doses.

OK SO LETS REGROUP!
So what have we learned about mobilization of fat into the bloodstream... We basically want increases at cAMP at the end of the day and how do we go about it... With a four prong attack...

1. Adrenergic Beta2 Stimulation/Alpha2 Inhibition
2. Increases in cAMP
3. Inhibit the breakdown of these actives
4. Inhibit down-regulation of adrenergic receptors

SO a great stack for mobilization would be Clenbuterol HCl/Yohimbine HCl/Caffeine/Ketotifen


UNFINISHED SUPPLEMENTATION GUIDE
1. Promoting Lipolysis/Inhibiting Lipogenesis
***Via adrenergic pathways***

-Beta 2 Agonist
(DIRECT) Clenbuterol HCl, etc.
(INDIRECT) Ephedrine/PEA

-Alpha 2 Antagonist
(DIRECT) Yohimbine HCl

-Non-Specific Lypolysis Promoters
Caffeine

OTC CHOICES : Yohimbine HCl(A2)/Phenethylamine(B2)/Caffeine
NON-OTC : Clenbuterol(B2)/Salbutamol(B2),etc


2. Decarboxylating Oxidative Phosphorylation/Proton Leakage
***Via oxidative metabolism***
-Thyroid Hormones (DIRECT)3,5-T2 (INDIRECT)T4/T3/3,3'-T2
-2,4-DNP

OTC CHOICES : 3,3'-T2 & 3,5-T2
NON-OTC : T3 & T4 & 2,4-DNP

3. Miscelaneous Mechanisms
***Cytochrome P450 inhibition***
-Naringin

OTC CHOICES : Grapefruit lol OR Nutramerica Ultra CitruSPA will do

[DRP7]

nice work! keep on!

[600538411]

Originally Posted by Dr.P

nice work! keep on!

Its a labour of love lol

It is so hard to comunicate what you know and understand into concise short statements that could be understood by laymen and educated alike... Don't know where I am going with this lol... Hope it all comes together like it is in my head

[Conciliator]

The author states that "Carbohydrate ingestion inhibits lypolysis and promotes lipogenesis so high GI food in cutting is a definate no-no..." That ignores all the research showing that fat loss is identical if you swap out all your low GI carbs for an isocaloric quantity of high GI cabrs. While high GI foods generally inhibit lipolysis to a greater extent than lower GI foods, they're also digested more quickly so that this inhibition is for a shorter duration. Lower GI foods suppress lipolysis to a lesser extent, but for a longer duration. The important point is that the net effect is the same. As long as you can control your caloric and protein intake, it's make no difference on fat loss if you eat high GI foods instead of low GI foods. The glycemic index is a pretty worthless tool for the healthy bodybuilder.

Also, it's "exacerbate", not "exhasibate"

[Kernkraft]

Originally Posted by Conciliator

The author states that "Carbohydrate ingestion inhibits lypolysis and promotes lipogenesis so high GI food in cutting is a definate no-no..." That ignores all the research showing that fat loss is identical if you swap out all your low GI carbs for an isocaloric quantity of high GI cabrs. While high GI foods generally inhibit lipolysis to a greater extent than lower GI foods, they're also digested more quickly so that this inhibition is for a shorter duration. Lower GI foods suppress lipolysis to a lesser extent, but for a longer duration. The important point is that the net effect is the same. As long as you can control your caloric and protein intake, it's make no difference on fat loss if you eat high GI foods instead of low GI foods. The glycemic index is a pretty worthless tool for the healthy bodybuilder.

Also, it's "exacerbate", not "exhasibate"

Interesting post. What about for someone who is hypothyroid such as myself. Wouldn't the intake of high GI foods as opposed to low GI foods be a bad idea despite eating the same amounts of food?

I'd like to see some science or studies behind your post. I'm not doubting you, I'm just curious and up for some more reading into it.

[WannaBbig!]

Excellent work in progress, I disagree with your point made about fat only being used as a source of fuel during times of starvation.

Fat is used as a fuel constantly, it just depends on the relative work intensity and force output by the muscles that determines how much it can contribute to ATP resynthesis because it requires oxygen to convert triglycerides to gylcerol and free fatty acids. Therefore it is usless at maximal force output/high intensity work rates since most of these activities are anaerobic or too brief in duration to use any other source of fuel than phosphagens.

Hence, I can be sitting here eating a meal (not fasting) and doing very little and I'm mainly using fat as a fuel. That doesn't suggest that I'm buring many total calories but it does contradict your point.

Sorry to be picky, but my Msc. is in Sports Nutrition!

[600538411]

Originally Posted by Conciliator

The author states that "Carbohydrate ingestion inhibits lypolysis and promotes lipogenesis so high GI food in cutting is a definate no-no..." That ignores all the research showing that fat loss is identical if you swap out all your low GI carbs for an isocaloric quantity of high GI cabrs. While high GI foods generally inhibit lipolysis to a greater extent than lower GI foods, they're also digested more quickly so that this inhibition is for a shorter duration. Lower GI foods suppress lipolysis to a lesser extent, but for a longer duration. The important point is that the net effect is the same. As long as you can control your caloric and protein intake, it's make no difference on fat loss if you eat high GI foods instead of low GI foods. The glycemic index is a pretty worthless tool for the healthy bodybuilder.

Also, it's "exacerbate", not "exhasibate"

Don't mind the typo.... lol WIll be fixing them soon...

Ummm although I made reference to the use of low GI foods in preference to high GI foods during a cut... My point wan't that the GI is going to affect lipolysis... More so I was going to point out (and one day I may get there at this rate lol, out of words in that post so i am going to have to break it into parts...)... Any carbohydrate ingested enter into glycolysis and that inhibits lipolysis via G6PK etc... The very next thing I am going to talk about is all of this so stay tuned so you can tear it apart then lol....

At the end of the day there is going to be conflicting evidence to alot of things that anyone claims so maybe I should have ref/cited stuff along the way but really this wasn't meant to be a scientific paper, more so a laymens explaination to pretty norm stuff...

Originally Posted by WannaBbig!

Excellent work in progress, I disagree with your point made about fat only being used as a source of fuel during times of starvation.

Fat is used as a fuel constantly, it just depends on the relative work intensity and force output by the muscles that determines how much it can contribute to ATP resynthesis because it requires oxygen to convert triglycerides to gylcerol and free fatty acids. Therefore it is usless at maximal force output/high intensity work rates since most of these activities are anaerobic or too brief in duration to use any other source of fuel than phosphagens.

Hence, I can be sitting here eating a meal (not fasting) and doing very little and I'm mainly using fat as a fuel. That doesn't suggest that I'm buring many total calories but it does contradict your point.

Sorry to be picky, but my Msc. is in Sports Nutrition!

I don't think I stated that fats are only used during fasting... If I did then I didn't mean too.... I better re-read what I have there lol... It is actually completely the opposite... I think I was saying that fasting does not promote the use of lipids as a fuel source... Will check after work lol... Like I personally consume 6-7 small meals a day during a cut, primarily based on a whole food protein... Again I will discuss this further and fix up anything that is wrong if I have made mistakes along the way... sorry to all... like I said work in progress...

ON ANOTHER NOTE.... HMMM WHY IS IT THAT YOU CANT EDIT POSTS AFTER A WHILE!!! I CAN'T FIX IT ANYMORE!!!

Stuff it... I am just going to write it all and post it over several post at once in a new thread and get a mod to close this lol.... ARRGGHHH

[Conciliator]

Originally Posted by Kernkraft

I'd like to see some science or studies behind your post. I'm not doubting you, I'm just curious and up for some more reading into it.

Reduced glycemic index and glycemic load diets do not increase the effects of energy restriction on weight loss and insulin sensitivity in obese men and women:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...=pubmed_docsum

No difference in body weight decrease between a low-glycemic-index and a high-glycemic-index diet but reduced LDL cholesterol after 10-wk ad libitum intake of the low-glycemic-index diet:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...=pubmed_docsum

And this is a good article on the limited usefulness of the glycemic index: http://www.alanaragon.com/elements-c...mic-index.html

[DRP7]

with regards to glycemic index (DISCLAIMER: no, I do not specifically refer to Conciliators post, nor do I try to represent or misrepresent anything he has said), it is important to note that meals with high GI will lead to substantial oscillations of blood glucose levels and insulin levels: at first, blood glucose jumps high, followed by a large release of insulin, followed by a pronounced drop in blood glucose levels. these up-and-downs, especially the rapid drop of blood glucose levels is something that greatly triggers the feeling of hunger and craving. in such a state one will have an extremely hard time to refrain from taking more calories (second meal etc).
in contrast, low GI meals will widely avoid such gross blood glucose fluctuations and cause much more steady and longer lasting feeling of satiety. result: less sugar cravings. As a result, people eating low GI carbs have MUCH less problems with sticking to a defined caloric intake when comapred to people eating high GI carbs. and we don't even started with potential further endocrine and metabolic consequences of large blood glucose fluctutations.

[Conciliator]

Originally Posted by Dr.P

with regards to glycemic index (DISCLAIMER: no, I do not specifically refer to Conciliators post, nor do I try to represent or misrepresent anything he has said), it is important to note that meals with high GI will lead to substantial oscillations of blood glucose levels and insulin levels: at first, blood glucose jumps high, followed by a large release of insulin, followed by a pronounced drop in blood glucose levels. these up-and-downs, especially the rapid drop of blood glucose levels is something that greatly triggers the feeling of hunger and craving. in such a state one will have an extremely hard time to refrain from taking more calories (second meal etc).
in contrast, low GI meals will widely avoid such gross blood glucose fluctuations and cause much more steady and longer lasting feeling of satiety. result: less sugar cravings. As a result, people eating low GI carbs have MUCH less problems with sticking to a defined caloric intake when comapred to people eating high GI carbs. and we don't even started with potential further endocrine and metabolic consequences of large blood glucose fluctutations.

No disagreement here. Lower GI foods will typically be more satiating. That's why I make sure to say "As long as you can control your caloric and protein intake..." Keep in mind, though, that there are plenty of high GI foods that also have a high satiety index, like potatoes, which are very satiating. Just like there's a dissociation between the glycemic index and the insulin index of foods, there's also dissociation with the satiety index.

[methodice]

I'd like to find more about satiety. I remember reading an index where boiled potato had high satiety performance, whereas the baked potato low. Anyone have good info on satiety/foods?

I find myself satieted by high and low GI foods at different times. From my personal experience I disagree that low GI foods are more satiating. Though Dr. P piqued my interest on the endocrine and metabolic ramifications of blood glucose swings.

[G_nius]

Originally Posted by Conciliator

The author states that "Carbohydrate ingestion inhibits lypolysis and promotes lipogenesis so high GI food in cutting is a definate no-no..." That ignores all the research showing that fat loss is identical if you swap out all your low GI carbs for an isocaloric quantity of high GI cabrs. While high GI foods generally inhibit lipolysis to a greater extent than lower GI foods, they're also digested more quickly so that this inhibition is for a shorter duration. Lower GI foods suppress lipolysis to a lesser extent, but for a longer duration. The important point is that the net effect is the same. As long as you can control your caloric and protein intake, it's make no difference on fat loss if you eat high GI foods instead of low GI foods. The glycemic index is a pretty worthless tool for the healthy bodybuilder.

Also, it's "exacerbate", not "exhasibate"

What about insulin sensitivity?

[Conciliator]

Originally Posted by G_nius

What about insulin sensitivity?

When you're dieting and when there's a caloric deficit, insulin sensitivity is going to improve no matter what the GI of your carbs. If you look at the first paper I linked to above, they compared the low GI diet group to the high GI diet group. They found that "All groups improved in insulin sensitivity at the end of the feeding phase of the study... Weight loss and improved insulin sensitivity scores were independent of diet composition. In summary, lowering the glycemic load and glycemic index of weight reduction diets does not provide any added benefit to energy restriction in promoting weight loss in obese subjects." The second paper found the same thing: "No significant differences were observed between groups in fasting serum insulin, homeostasis model assessment for relative insulin resistance, [etc]..."

[600538411]

I have nearly finished the whole thing now but I am going to start it in a new thread and call it something different... Stay posted... Holy Koran of Cutting - Jihad against adipose tissue lol.... Had to start a new one because of the whole can't edit after a while thing and the fact that I had to break it into parts because of the word limit on posts... This way I can put it all into one spot then let everyone tear it apart lol ;-)

On the topic of insulin sensitivity... Sensitivity is one of those things... If you deprive anything too long.. your going to be more sensitive... and visa versa.. you overstimulate things and you will become less sensitive/responsive... Your body is always looking for homeostasis, just in its nature... Cutting is really all about interupting homeostatis, especially if your genetically predisposed to being a fat prick lol...

The whole point of me starting on this journey basically was to educate that no matter what your genetic predisposition is, you can manipulate your body to do what it doesn't want to do if you are educated in the art of it...

Carbs on the whole, Personally, I don't think there is a place for much carbs in a cut at all unless your going natural.... The only reason one would consume carbs is because of the fact that without carbs, your thyroid hormone production falls away so if you weren't relying on natural production of that and you were supplementing it, then there really isn't much of a need for carbs at all... With that being said you can only run thyroid hormones so long before your shut down to the hilt then your rooted hence why IFBB pros are basically all hypothyroidic and take T3/T4 all year round for the rest of their natural lives... Again though.. This is all discussed in greater detail in the new writeup....

I will drop a link here when it's done...

[smssambear19]

Great job man...lots of great detailed info. Keep up the good work!

[rott69]

dude, I just added you as a friend... I think your the man I need to talk to about cutting.....

[dance2trance]

Nice thing u got goin 600538411.

Question...I do recognise this is a "work in progress", and you have already mentioned caffiene, yohimbine and clenbuterol as efficacious in lipolysis, will you add a section about how much is enough?

Perhaps this research is not available, or maybe I havent searched enough through bb.com forums. Although to be honest i havent really made a proper attempt at looking for this info, since obesity is not my area of research (although i have touched on leptin in theses, and the role of cytokines in obesity-induced T2DM).

The other thing, i saw that there were no references were cited in the piece that you've put up. I do realise what a bitch this is when your writing such a large piece, but it may be something to consider for those here who are involved in research or simply pubmed-savvy.

Overall, nice work so far, lookin fwd to updates and finished product.

[600538411]

Originally Posted by dance2trance

Nice thing u got goin 600538411.

Question...I do recognise this is a "work in progress", and you have already mentioned caffiene, yohimbine and clenbuterol as efficacious in lipolysis, will you add a section about how much is enough?

Perhaps this research is not available, or maybe I havent searched enough through bb.com forums. Although to be honest i havent really made a proper attempt at looking for this info, since obesity is not my area of research (although i have touched on leptin in theses, and the role of cytokines in obesity-induced T2DM).

The other thing, i saw that there were no references were cited in the piece that you've put up. I do realise what a bitch this is when your writing such a large piece, but it may be something to consider for those here who are involved in research or simply pubmed-savvy.

Overall, nice work so far, lookin fwd to updates and finished product.

Thanks dude... Umm I was acutally reading some stuff on leptin and UCP the other day... Leptin is very interesting... I actually did a paper on it too for my honours lol...

Yeah as for dosing of adrenergic manipulators and stuff.. Was going to do so also.. I am still working on it but I decided because ofthe way the posting works, it will actually be easier to do it all at once rather than cover stuff and then discuss, cover more stuff kind of thing... Is going along nicely though now... BUT with mroe discussion I find more stuff I would like to real cover lol...

As for referencing... Yeah I probably should be referencing all of it BUT most of it is just like rolling out off the top of my head from knowledge bank lol... Occasionally I pull up a wiki here but most of it isn't as such from Pubmed articles, well ones from the last 100 years kind of thing cause its now common knowledge lol and I dont have access to Pubmed anymore so that sucks too... I will however need to reference the methodology of the supplementation protocol and why it works best this way etc etc... So after all the explaining of how the body sort of runs as such, I will get into some nitty gritty BUT I am trying to keep it in laymens terms as much as possible too rather than it becoming a scientific paper as such....

[DRP7]

Originally Posted by 600538411

...lol and I dont have access to Pubmed anymore so that sucks too... .

Pubmed is freely accessible for everyone.
click on the link below and you'll have it.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...d=search&term=

[icetrauma]

Subbed to further my education.

[rott69]

Originally Posted by 600538411

This is a work "in progress" by me... I will work in subsections and it will constantly get edited. I figured I will just add more stuff to it by editing as I go along rather than do one big whole document then just drop it on... Please Feel free to mention areas worth discussing or any short-comings of this whole thing... Otherwise enjoy! (p.s. Please don't move from supps science thread just yet! I am getting there!!! lol)

(some of the) TOPICS THAT WILL BE COVERED:
-FOOD DIGESTION
-HOW FAT IS UTILIZED/MANAGED BY OUR BODIES
-FAT STORAGE/MOBILIZATION (Lipogenesis/Lipolysis)
-METABOLISM OF ENERGY SUBSTRATES (inc. ROLE OF THE ELECTRON TRANSPORT CHAIN)
-IMPORTANCE OF PROTEIN IN CUTTING (inc ref to PROTEIN TURNOVER) AND CORRECT PROTEIN CHOICES
-SUPPLEMENTATION - HOW TO BRING THESE CONCEPTS TOGETHER

Holy Bible of Cutting - Cutting Science with Supplementation Guide AMEN!!

by 600538411

"YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT"
- DIET (THE KEY TO CUTTING)

Lets start with one of the most fundamental principles of science that in its conventional sense is the basis for which alot of other princples rely on... It's called "The Law of Conservation of Matter" which states that matter cannot be created or destroyed by ordinary means. Now your probably asking yourself, why? What the hell has this got to do with cutting... Well alot! Let me explain...

When we digest food, it certainly does not come out the other end looking like what we digested (in most cases!)... So what happens to this food along the way? Well most of the bonds are broken down in the multiple phases of digestion yielding substrates which are absorbed by the body through the small & large intestine whilst all the undigestable materials (fibrous material) are then excreted as feces. OK so how does this tie into the law of conservation you may ask? You would weigh the same if you were holding the food in your hand as if you ingested that same food and then digested and it left your body as fecal matter as long as the fecal matter was also on the scales with you (neglecting at this point loss of water via sweat & metabolism of energy, just for now so chill science buffs)... So the old adage "you are what you eat" has some home truths to it...

With this in mind, it is important that we put the right substrates into the body to best promote the loss of adipose (fat/lipid) tissue from our bodies... One thing that must be made clear is that not all energy substrates are created equal when it comes to cutting... This will present itself further through this guide.

"RENDER THEREFORE UNTO SUET THE THING THAT WAS BEEF FAT"
- METABOLISM (UNDERSTANDING THE WAY OUR BODIES DEAL WITH FAT)

Our bodies really are a marvel! Their abilities to turn one thing into another are what give us the ability to stay alive every day... Without this adaptability it would be almost impossible to maintain the stringent requirements necessary to proper function at a cellular level...

Completely disregarding all of the vitamins, minerals, trace elements, etc. that the body requires to function properly, there is one primary thing that all cells share in common that is required for proper function.... ENERGY! Without ENERGY the cells will undergo necrosis (cell death) so it is kind of important in the scheme of things...

If there is one thing that the body does well, it is find sources of energy... Why does you body store fat, because it likes to store energy which it can call upon when your body is in a state of fasting.... This doesn't mean that fat is the only calling point for energy though in times of fasting... It can also use protein found from degrading muscle tissue and by utilizing muscles carbohydrate stores called glycogen... The body can change nearly all substrates into another substrate which it may require more urgently... Fat <-> Carbohydrate <-> Protein ... It is not some much one blob of fat turns to one blob of prtein so forget that concept... Once the food has been digested and has been absorbed through the intestines and is then further scrutinized by the first pass of the liver, substrates then make their way into the bloodstream in the form of branch chain amino acids, sugars and fatty acids.... So BCAA can be converted to Carbohydrates and visa vera, same with sugars can be converted to fats, etc etc... This is with exception to the Essential fatty acids (smallest units of fat) & Essential amino acids. They CANNOT be synthesized by the body hence why they are called "essential" because it is essential that they are found in your diet.

STARTED (BUT NO WHERE NEAR FINISHED) SUPPLEMENTATION GUIDE
1. Via adrenergic pathways
-Beta 2 Agonist - (DIRECT) Clenbuterol HCl, etc. (INDIRECT) Ephedrine/PEA
-Alpha 2 Antagonist - Yohimbine HCl

2. Decarboxylating Oxidative Phosphorylation/Proton Leakage
-Thyroid Hormones (DIRECT)3,5-T2 (INDIRECT)T4/T3/3,3'-T2
-2,4-DNP

3. Promoting Lipolysis/Inhibiting Lipogenesis

ADRENERGIC PATHWAY OVERVIEW
BEST OTC CHOICES :

DECARBOXYLATORS
BEST OTC CHOICES :

ANTI-LYPOLYSIS/PRO-LYPOGENESIS AGENTS
BEST OTC CHOICE :

can you take a look at my bodyspace and see if you can actually give me some advice/help....?

[Incinerated]

bump...


this needs to be finished before summer...

[eagles56]

looks good.

[jl101882]

Some good stuff here. Thanks to the OP

[600538411]

Thanks to everyone for the reps and for appreciating what I started...

OK a quick update...

I have started finishing it off now.. I lost inspiration for a bit and then went to Thailand for a few weeks and lost myself completely in the goings on of that...

Inspiration is back now.. Am going to really break this whole topic open and give good explinations behind entry level to advanced cutting regeimes and their methodologies... Expect the kind of like thesis to be spit out in a week or two depending on how much it flows...

Will drop a link here for you guys to follow to the completed product when its up...

Again thank you guys for the support... It shoudl have been a masterpiece by now instead it is a inspiring start with no conclusion... Apologies to all... Lets get it finished so some of you guys can run this **** for the summer.. your going to need atleast 12-20 weeks to get the "real" results you want so I better hurry the truck up...

[rott69]

racist in the forums guys.... NEG HIS SORRY AZZ!!!!


http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...#post118698031

[LL SquatButt J]

Originally Posted by 600538411

Thanks to everyone for the reps and for appreciating what I started...

OK a quick update...

I have started finishing it off now.. I lost inspiration for a bit and then went to Thailand for a few weeks and lost myself completely in the goings on of that...

Inspiration is back now.. Am going to really break this whole topic open and give good explinations behind entry level to advanced cutting regeimes and their methodologies... Expect the kind of like thesis to be spit out in a week or two depending on how much it flows...

Will drop a link here for you guys to follow to the completed product when its up...

Again thank you guys for the support... It shoudl have been a masterpiece by now instead it is a inspiring start with no conclusion... Apologies to all... Lets get it finished so some of you guys can run this **** for the summer.. your going to need atleast 12-20 weeks to get the "real" results you want so I better hurry the truck up...

....ok?