Any mormans here?

[Macrobolic]

The mormon religion was based on the charlatan Joseph Smith. Its obvious that he completely made up the entire book of mormon and it is clearly a scam. That said, the LDS has created a very good religion out of that phonies teachings. Mormons are all very cool people with close families and great morals. I dont belong to any faith, but really admire all the mormons that I know. If Smith wasnt such a fraud and liar, and I could believe at least a scintilla of what he wrote, then I would join the LDS. My problem is that I cant turn my mind off and accept his teachings.

Wow, you are unaware. *shakes head*

[Li_Bai_Dantes]

I'm technically still a mormon, BIC. Although I've only been a couple of times in the past two years and no longer believe. It's tough biting my tongue when family members or friends start talking about the church and I just want to get into an argument with them about it but know that it's not worth losing friends and family over. I respect their decisions although the overwhelming majority have never truly questioned whether it's true or not but it's tough when none of your family has arrived at the same conclusions as you have.

Wow, you are unaware. *shakes head*

Is he now? Have you ever seriously questioned your faith? If you have, then I fully respect your decision but if he has looked into the church and come to a different conclusion than you, it's highly arrogant for you to say that just because he came to the conclusion that Joseph is a liar.

[anotherguy11]

Jesus came to America guys. Just sayin.






















lulz

[bmy-]

Is he now? Have you ever seriously questioned your faith? If you have, then I fully respect you but if he has looked into the church and come to a different conclusion from you, it's highly arrogant for you to say that just because he came to the conclusion that Joseph is a liar.

I thought it was fairly well established that he was a scammer when young.. ill tempered as a man, and extremely egotistical.. bad with money to boot -- doesn't change the good he did.

Plenty of Biblical time prophets were screwups. I'm starting to think it goes with the job.

[Macrobolic]

Is he now? Have you ever seriously questioned your faith? If you have, then I fully respect your decision but if he has looked into the church and come to a different conclusion than you, it's highly arrogant for you to say that just because he came to the conclusion that Joseph is a liar.

Ok, maybe he is not unaware, but he provided no reference as to why he believes that Joseph Smith was a liar or charlatan.

He never said he has been mormon or even looked into the church at all. He can have his opinion on the matter, but the fact remains that he is probably getting his info from anti-mormon, bigotry-laden websites and pastors who purposely distort the truth so as to confuse people.

I have heard every argument, story, etc. about Joseph Smith being a "liar or charlatan or blah blah blah" and every single one that I've heard or read of is unfounded or made up. At times it gets really amusing at how far some will go to distort the truth.

[1devil]

Ok, maybe he is not unaware, but he provided no reference as to why he believes that Joseph Smith was a liar or charlatan.

He never said he has been mormon or even looked into the church at all. He can have his opinion on the matter, but the fact remains that he is probably getting his info from anti-mormon, bigotry-laden websites and pastors who purposely distort the truth so as to confuse people.

I have heard every argument, story, etc. about Joseph Smith being a "liar or charlatan or blah blah blah" and every single one that I've heard or read of is unfounded or made up. At times it gets really amusing at how far some will go to distort the truth.

This concerns me: http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/ldsagree.html

[Macrobolic]

This concerns me: http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/ldsagree.html

The church stopped this practice after there were objections to it. Just to be clear, no living person had these rites performed. Only those who were deceased. It goes along with our belief of baptisms for the dead, like those practiced in biblical times (1 Corinthians 15:29-30).

[QuicksandATL]

I thought it was fairly well established that he was a scammer when young.. ill tempered as a man, and extremely egotistical.. bad with money to boot -- doesn't change the good he did.

Paul was a persecutor and murderer of Christians. David was a fornicator, murderer, and a liar. And Job was egotistical and a coward.

That doesn't change the fact that these men changed their ways, constantly sought repentance, and always tried to walk with God.

While I have very little knowledge about Joseph Smith or the factuality of his teachings, I do know that there are great examples to be taken away from people who stand up for what they believe in, especially (and in reality, only) when done in the name of right.

And one thing I certainly know is that there are a seemingly infinite amount of half-truths and lies about nearly all religions, especially with the advent of the internet. You must take EVERYTHING you read with a grain of salt.

[1devil]

The church stopped this practice after there were objections to it. Just to be clear, no living person had these rites performed. Only those who were deceased. It goes along with our belief of baptisms for the dead, like those practiced in biblical times (1 Corinthians 15:29-30).

There was actually a fairly recent contoversy over this because this was still being practiced. I think that baptizing dead Jews, especially Holocaust victims, is beyond disrespectful. I have no issue with Mormons practicing their religion so long as they show other religions respect.

http://www.rickross.com/reference/mormon/mormon152.html

[stella summers]

My older brother converted to LDS about 3 years ago when he was dating a Mormon girl at the time. He told me he can't consume anything with caffeine because "the Prophet said so".



.....really?

[b.spencer]

My older brother converted to LDS about 3 years ago when he was dating a Mormon girl at the time. He told me he can't consume anything with caffeine because "the Prophet said so".



.....really?

No. Your brother has been listening to LDS "oral traditions" that are not doctrines, but things added on to the doctrines by overzealous members. The Word of Wisdom, the Mormon dietary code, does not forbid anything with caffeine in it. The real "rule" is not eating/drinking/using coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco products.

[legacyguy]

No. Your brother has been listening to LDS "oral traditions" that are not doctrines, but things added on to the doctrines by overzealous members. The Word of Wisdom, the Mormon dietary code, does not forbid anything with caffeine in it. The real "rule" is not eating/drinking/using coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco products.

I believe some people confuse caffeine in with the Word of Wisdom for the reason that caffeine is addictive, and the LDS Church believes in keeping all things in moderation and avoid addictive substances and substances that will harm the body.

[b.spencer]

This concerns me: http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/ldsagree.html

There was actually a fairly recent contoversy over this because this was still being practiced. I think that baptizing dead Jews, especially Holocaust victims, is beyond disrespectful. I have no issue with Mormons practicing their religion so long as they show other religions respect.

http://www.rickross.com/reference/mormon/mormon152.html

Doing temple work for the dead is part of their religion, an integral part, in fact. That is the reason with the LDS Church is so involved in genealogical research.

The Church itself did stop name extraction baptisms in 1995. What you are seeing is basically a conflict between Jewish LDS converts (and a few overzealous members) and other Jews. The Church does not use a central cleaing house to approve names for temple work (at least yet. Such a computer system is in development.) Individual members submit who they wish, even though they are supposed to limit to family members.

It becomes more problematic when Jewish converts submit their family names. Other Jews take offense to seeing the names on the IGI, but when it is Jewish converts, submitting the names of their own family members, the Church will do nothing to stop it ever, as long as familial relationships are provable. It is no different than when I submitted the names of my Protestant ancestors when I was LDS.

[1devil]

Doing temple work for the dead is part of their religion, an integral part, in fact. That is the reason with the LDS Church is so involved in genealogical research.

The Church itself did stop name extraction baptisms in 1995. What you are seeing is basically a conflict between Jewish LDS converts (and a few overzealous members) and other Jews. The Church does not use a central cleaing house to approve names for temple work (at least yet. Such a computer system is in development.) Individual members submit who they wish, even though they are supposed to limit to family members.

It becomes more problematic when Jewish converts submit their family names. Other Jews take offense to seeing the names on the IGI, but when it is Jewish converts, submitting the names of their own family members, the Church will do nothing to stop it ever, as long as familial relationships are provable. It is no different than when I submitted the names of my Protestant ancestors when I was LDS.

Well until, they have such a cental clearing house they should refrain from such activities. It is simply offensive. The Jews involved did not have their names submitted by family members.

[Fidelis]

ey im mormon
radiomaniac = negged

lol... way to resurrect a 6 month old thread

[b.spencer]

I believe some people confuse caffeine in with the Word of Wisdom for the reason that caffeine is addictive, and the LDS Church believes in keeping all things in moderation and avoid addictive substances and substances that will harm the body.

While I agree, some members are again overzealous in the application. Caffeine is in aspirin and chocolate. Using that interpretation, anything can be forbidden, as potentially addictive. I've seen members propound veganism based on the word or wisdom. Several LDS leaders have cautioned against that interpretation, instead sicking to what they have taught it means in official Church publications.

[legacyguy]

While I agree, some members are again overzealous in the application. Caffeine is in aspirin and chocolate. Using that interpretation, anything can be forbidden, as potentially addictive. I've seen members propound veganism based on the word or wisdom. Several LDS leaders have cautioned against that interpretation, instead sicking to what they have taught it means in official Church publications.

I find more overzealous LDS members in the Provo area than anywhere else. It has a massive bubble there. Most of those members haven't truly live outside of that bubble to really appreciate life and grow up. And because of that, to me, many lack a "common sense" to the interpretation to those teachings.

[stella summers]

No. Your brother has been listening to LDS "oral traditions" that are not doctrines, but things added on to the doctrines by overzealous members. The Word of Wisdom, the Mormon dietary code, does not forbid anything with caffeine in it. The real "rule" is not eating/drinking/using coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco products.

I believe some people confuse caffeine in with the Word of Wisdom for the reason that caffeine is addictive, and the LDS Church believes in keeping all things in moderation and avoid addictive substances and substances that will harm the body.

Ah I see.

I plan on reading up more on this later, but wanted to ask one last thing....why is it a requirement to wear the special garment? What's the point of that?

[b.spencer]

Ah I see.

I plan on reading up more on this later, but wanted to ask one last thing....why is it a requirement to wear the special garment? What's the point of that?

The specific reasons why have to do with the LDS temple ceremonies. Many LDS are very offended at having those things discussed in a public forum. So, I have always respected their beliefs and not done so, beyond generalities.

The easiest way for you to think about is to think of a Catholic priest or nun. These people wear clerical clothing, vestments, a habit, as an outward symbol of office and a reminder to themselves of the promises they have made to the Church and to their God and the blessings they receive if faithful to them.

The LDS temple garment is a similar reminder to wearer of the promises they have made in the temple and the blessings they will receive if they are faithful to them.

[mntbikedude]

The specific reasons why have to do with the LDS temple ceremonies. Many LDS are very offended at having those things discussed in a public forum. So, I have always respected their beliefs and not done so, beyond generalities.

The easiest way for you to think about is to think of a Catholic priest or nun. These people wear clerical clothing, vestments, a habit, as an outward symbol of office and a reminder to themselves of the promises they have made to the Church and to their God and the blessings they receive if faithful to them.

The LDS temple garment is a similar reminder to wearer of the promises they have made in the temple and the blessings they will receive if they are faithful to them.

You answered that very well.

[Ultimus]

The specific reasons why have to do with the LDS temple ceremonies. Many LDS are very offended at having those things discussed in a public forum. So, I have always respected their beliefs and not done so, beyond generalities.

The easiest way for you to think about is to think of a Catholic priest or nun. These people wear clerical clothing, vestments, a habit, as an outward symbol of office and a reminder to themselves of the promises they have made to the Church and to their God and the blessings they receive if faithful to them.

The LDS temple garment is a similar reminder to wearer of the promises they have made in the temple and the blessings they will receive if they are faithful to them.

hey man just wanted to say that I respect you and thank you for still being respectful to mormons even after you stopped being one.

[Macrobolic]

Ah I see.

I plan on reading up more on this later, but wanted to ask one last thing....why is it a requirement to wear the special garment? What's the point of that?

It is a reminder of covenants made in temple ceremonies. Temples are different than the regular church houses in that only members of the church who obtain a recommend from their leaders are allowed inside.

hey man just wanted to say that I respect you and thank you for still being respectful to mormons even after you stopped being one.

agreed.

[anthrofighter]

My older brother converted to LDS about 3 years ago when he was dating a Mormon girl at the time. He told me he can't consume anything with caffeine because "the Prophet said so".



.....really?

did he marry her?

[Teenytinyboo]

ey im mormon
radiomaniac = negged

I thought you were supposed to turn the other cheek? Well it's too l8 now buddy hell is comming for joo!

[anthrofighter]

[Teenytinyboo]

mormons are actually really nice people in general, i really think they have good intentions, of course their worldview in my opinion is seriously seriously skewed, but no different than any major religion really.

I totally agree with you, I grew up with another Mormon family friends of my parents, some of the stuff they believed I found to be a little out there, but they were some of the warmest people i met in my childhood.

[anthrofighter]

I totally agree with you, I grew up with another Mormon family friends of my parents, some of the stuff they believed I found to be a little out there, but they were some of the warmest people i met in my childhood.

wow, is warm a term in british english to describe how nice someone is?

in german it means gay. and in american english...thats just rare. heh.

[bmy-]

I personally don't see the LDS baptizing dead Jews as disrespectful or wrong..

Nobody is 'forcing' them to accept anything. If they want to accept it.. they can. If not.. they aren't forced by any means. That's my understanding at least.

It's more of a -- do you accept baptism by water?

The mormon is strong in this thread

[Macrobolic]

I personally don't see the LDS baptizing dead Jews as disrespectful or wrong..

Nobody is 'forcing' them to accept anything. If they want to accept it.. they can. If not.. they aren't forced by any means. That's my understanding at least.

It's more of a -- do you accept baptism by water?

That's exactly what it is. We do it as a proxy and the person is able to accept it or not accept it.

The mormon is strong in this thread

[Melkor]

Well until, they have such a cental clearing house they should refrain from such activities. It is simply offensive. The Jews involved did not have their names submitted by family members.

I can understand you being upset, but once you understand what it actually means it may not be upsetting. When someone is "baptized for the dead" all that means is that should they so choose they have the option of accepting that baptism and becoming LDS in the hereafter. Mormons believe that all people will eventually hear the entire gospel, and have the right to choose for themselves whether to accept it. This includes baptism, and that's why we do what we do. It's not like those people are added to the church rolls, or are listed as "Mormon" somewhere. It's simply offering them the choice, and they still have full control over whether or not they accept it.