exercises for martial artist

[lukestkd]

hi there, i just moved back to my old gym, its much better, wandering if ppl could give me some hints an tips. there's plenty of cardio equipment and im pretty happy with what i can work on there.
i dont want to bulk up loads an loads, i would far rather use the weights to improve my martial arts training. i need explosive power, high jumping, speed, and endurance! there isnt a barbell so that drops out some exercises instantly, but there is a cable machine, free dumbells, EZ bar, smith machine and a few lower body machines (adductor, abductor, leg raise, sitting leg curl)
any advice as to what exercises to do?
due to my martial arts training i am limited on time due to recovery, i was planning on working my legs and abs on a friday with weekend recovery, and have to do a whole upper body session on a tuesday night with wednesday for recovery. cardio imbetween somewhere! cheers people

[BOWIE]

Bodybuilding is probably not going to help your martial arts training (though it depends on what style you are training in and your intensity). You will likely loose flexability and increase the risk of injury. However, if you stick to low weight exercises you can strengthen your tendons (VERY important in martial arts) and muscle endurance.
Although it's highly debated, working your abs may not be good for your MA training either. If you practice a form where breathing is emphasised (as in most of the chinese forms) large abs can press against your diaphragm, restricting your chi and full breath. If you want abs, shed fat.
You can PM me if there's anything specific you'd like to know.

[Dominik]

Not sure about the exact exercises--in terms of specificity it'd depend on the style of martial arts.

You said you want to develop explosive power. You could try dynamic effort work. For example, on bench after a warmup you could stack the bar with around 50% of your 1 rep max and perform around 5 reps explosively before racking the bar and resting 45-90 seconds. Increase the weight slightly, and do it again. Keep adding a small amount of weight and repeat it until you can't accelerate the bar as fast as you did at the start, which might be around 70%. Then move on to a different exercise.

[Brutarian]

It's a myth that lifting weights will make you slow. You aren't bodybuilding; what you want are functional exercises.

Actually you should post this in the Sports Training forum.

One exercise you can do with the cable machine is the Woodchopper, or Woodcutter. Grab one handle of the cable machine, and stand as if you are cutting down a tree with an axe. By setting the cable to different heights - if possible - you can add variety to your workout.

[Dominik]

It's a myth that lifting weights will make you slow. You aren't bodybuilding; what you want are functional exercises.

Actually you should post this in the Sports Training forum.

One exercise you can do with the cable machine is the Woodchopper, or Woodcutter. Grab one handle of the cable machine, and stand as if you are cutting down a tree with an axe. By setting the cable to different heights - if possible - you can add variety to your workout.

Brutarian, I have heard that lifting extremely heavy weights can negatively affect your speed and remember reading an interesting example on force-velocity in a book on strength training about the differences in resistance training for javelin throwers and shotputters. They're both trying to throw objects as far as possible (shotput around 15lbs, javelin almost 2lbs) but because of the significant difference in weight of the object they train with weights quite differently. Dynamic effort work is intended to help correct that.

[Leeburn]

Buy Bruce Lees Expressing the Human Body nuff said ......

[Brutarian]

Brutarian, I have heard that lifting extremely heavy weights can negatively affect your speed and remember reading an interesting example on force-velocity in a book on strength training about the differences in resistance training for javelin throwers and shotputters. They're both trying to throw objects as far as possible (shotput around 15lbs, javelin almost 2lbs) but because of the significant difference in weight of the object they train with weights quite differently. Dynamic effort work is intended to help correct that.

Every book I have read on plyometrics recommends developing a certain level of strength before even beginning a plyo program, which is exclusively designed to increase speed. I'm referring to Donald Chu's and James Radcliffe's works on plyo.

I would be interested in seeing your reference.

In a fight, I'd rather be a shot-putter than a javelin-thrower.

[Dementia Warrio]

Buy Bruce Lees Expressing the Human Body nuff said ......

I'm going to have to agree here. I just finally got to the section on jogging, and this book is increadibly helpful if your a martial artist. It tells you about all types of exercises and how to do them, to develop functional strength.

[BruceLee_is God]

Buy Bruce Lees Expressing the Human Body nuff said ......

Word.

[Dominik]

Every book I have read on plyometrics recommends developing a certain level of strength before even beginning a plyo program, which is exclusively designed to increase speed. I'm referring to Donald Chu's and James Radcliffe's works on plyo.

I would be interested in seeing your reference.

In a fight, I'd rather be a shot-putter than a javelin-thrower.

I'm a fan of plyometric work however the reason it's included in sports programs is to develop explosive power. There's a point where consistently using very heavy weights to increase mass and force output will begin to compromise explosive power/speed. Plyometrics and/or dynamic effort training in the 50-70% range helps address this. Obviously 100m sprinters do a lot of heavy resistance work and they're the fastest men on Earth, but they're no doubt doing a lot of speed-strength work to build their explosive power.

I agree about the fight situation

[_BigJoe_]

Do post squats. Stand with all your weight on one leg. Put the unweighted leg across and in front of the weighted leg. Squat all the way down, ass to the grass, then stand up, simple. Go down slow and up fast. Do five sets of twenty on each leg and you'll be there.

[Brutarian]

explosive power: The Olympic lifts are good for this, as are plyo drills, such as box jumps and medicine ball passes.

high jumping: Plyo box jumps should increase your jumping height.

speed: Again we're looking at plyos.

endurance: Don't know if you mean local muscle endurance or cardio - or strength-endurance etc.

These books might be of some help:

Training for Speed, Agility, and Quickness:
http://tinyurl.com/7ey93

Explosive Power: Plyometrics for Bodybuilders, Martial Artists & Other Athletes
http://tinyurl.com/dsg8y

And, yeah, I agree the Bruce Lee book was very interesting.

[Drew1200]

I'm not sure about tkd as I've never taken it but I would think lots of lightweight high rep leg stuff would be ideal. imho, if you're only doin tkd you'd be better off doin yoga and a ton of cardio, and of course lots of sparring.

When I was crosstraining muay thai and bjj I only worked out 2-3 times a week and did a push-pull workout program. if you search here I'm sure you'd find some variations, and I know the Strength and POwer section at sherdog.com is full of info on it. that had alot to do with all the grappling I was doin tho, if you're just doin striking its not really necessary.

[Xtopher]

I'm guessing you do TKD [from your screen name], in that case you don't really need to weight train as you'll mostly be sparring no contact.

If you want to be able to hurt ppl [in self defence] though, you should def lift weights.

[bigshadow]

I train in Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu. I am lifting weights (but not body building) and doing cardio. Due to the type of martials I practice, I have to be careful of tension. I need all the flexibility I need.


Also, looking for workout info as well. Coach Scott Sonnon has some really good stuff! He has articles on BB.com. I do some of his ground work and body flow exercises.

Train safe,
David

[day_cix]

bump *Buy Bruce Lees Expressing the Human Body nuff said ......

[HulkHagen]

Depends on what martial art you're doing. If it's ground based and you need lots of strength I'd stick with basic compound stuff. I'd probably base my routine off squats, deadlifts, and cleans and go from there.

[paul_v]

Anyone remember Bolo Young? He was huge and could kick some ass. He's the big chinese guy in Bruce Lee's Enter the Dragon. Watching him tells me it's possible to have a body builder physique and practise martial arts. Van Damme is pretty built and flexible (whether or not he is a true martial artist is debatable from what I've heard)

[psinide]

How does bodybuilding affect flexiablity? Lots of the big guys do splits and stuff on posing.

[Josiah]

Size inhibits speed.

Simple as that.


The more mass you need to move, the more energy needed to move it a given speed. There will come a point of no return where the muscle size won't be able to move itself as fast as the same muscle a smaller size.

That will change with each person.



Don't expect to be the size of Arnold and mvoe like Bruce did. Bruce had incredible speed!! He was also a very small person, he was shorter, skiny and thin.

He was very powerful, not because of his brute strength, but in how be applied what strength he did have.



I'd recomend simply checking out a any normal weight lifting program and simply keep your bodyweight/mass gains in check. If you are getting too big, your blocks are slowing down, etc.. then either back off on the weight training, or increase your speed training.
As mentioned, at some point you will just get too big to move as fast as you want.

Just be aware of your body, your goals and keep constent monitering of the different factors that place into the equation of your physical condition.

I'd thinkin compound movements will be a bigger part as you want to train the muscles more as a unit then isolated.

[Da Main Man]

any bridging type excersizes, hindu squats and explosive pushups, running up and down stairs with a punching bag carried on your shoulders, handstand pushups

medicine ball and a kettlebell will help you greatly,

if u can get hold of matt furey workouts they are good for what they are,

use bodyweight excersizes for most of your workouts,

PM me and i can get talk you through some great workouts

[bigshadow]

I believe that joint mobility and flexibility are most important to the martial artist.. Also, I believe this is possible while lifting.

[Brutarian]

Many posters seem to assume that raw speed is the only thing needed by a martial artist.

True, it's important, but - depending on the art and the purpose to which it is put, many other factors can come into play.

[bigshadow]

Many posters seem to assume that raw speed is the only thing needed by a martial artist.

True, it's important, but - depending on the art and the purpose to which it is put, many other factors can come into play.

Very good point! I didn't want to elaborate too much about that since I do not have experience with other martial arts. But for me, control of timing and distance far outweigh the need for speed. You don't have to be super fast if you have good timing.