Want bigger arms and increase bench....this workout ok???

[Bobyota]

Monday = chest and tricepts

Tuesday = bis and back

Wednesday = legs

Thursday = chest and tricepts

Friday = off day

Saturday = bis and shoulders

Sunday = off day

I was just working every muscle group once a week, but figured I'll go twice a week on chest/tris/bis to try and get more results from them. Does this sound like a good plan?

Also, anyone got any tips for maxing out on flat bench press? Like how much should you warm up, or how often you should try it, or just any other useful info.

Thanks for any help and ideas.

[OJ Simpson]

Monday = chest and tricepts

Tuesday = bis and back

Wednesday = legs

Thursday = chest and tricepts

Friday = off day

Saturday = bis and shoulders

Sunday = off day

I was just working every muscle group once a week, but figured I'll go twice a week on chest/tris/bis to try and get more results from them. Does this sound like a good plan?

Also, anyone got any tips for maxing out on flat bench press? Like how much should you warm up, or how often you should try it, or just any other useful info.

Thanks for any help and ideas.

What exercises are you doing ?

How many sets per muscle group ?

How many reps ?

You will not grow faster or bigger by training each muscle group 2 or 3 times a week, then you would by training once a week.

[Dolfan_714]

Bicepts are one of those muscles that recover faster than other muscles...

I've worked my Bicepts twice a week for a while now, and found bigger gains than doing it once a week.

[Dolfan_714]

You will not grow faster or bigger by training each muscle group 2 or 3 times a week, then you would by training once a week.

That's not nessisarily true.

The body doesn't know Monday from Friday.

As long as the muscle is fully recovered... hit it again.

[OJ Simpson]

That's not nessisarily true.

The body doesn't know Monday from Friday.

As long as the muscle is fully recovered... hit it again.

If you want to train 1970 style. If you train very hard it will take your muscles a week to recover. I know of no pro bodybuilder who trains each muscle group 2x a week.

[trail of dead]

More is not better. Why does everyone think that?

[Dolfan_714]

I guess this is one we are gonna agree to disagree.

again don't misunderstand what I'm saying.

I'm not saying hit the same muscle group every other day. What I am saying though is it's ok to do it again once it's recovered.

If that means 7, 10, or 4 days.

Everybodies recovery time is different.

Construction workers lift heavy weighted material everyday, working there biceps and backs. Think about it people. (I don't know if that is a good example or not)

again this is not meant to be disrespectful in any way. so we cool!

[Bobyota]

Well working out is really my only physical activity....so I'm not tearing my muscles down any other way (have do some contrusction work and know how that can be).

I've been doing a 10-8-6-4-2 rep plan that my uncle has used. 10 reps of pretty light weight just for a warm up. Then add a little weight each set.

For chest we do that set/rep deal on flat, incline, and decline bench. Also do flies. Then we do tris which is one arm pull downs, 2 arm pull downs, skullcrushers, then another machine that I don't know the name of (sit in it with your arms 90 degrees bent up and extend your arms out while holding on to 2 handles to work tris).

For bis we do preacher curls, standing curls, hammer curls, and a machine curl. Then we do rows and pulldowns for back.

On shoulder day I just do military press, shrugs, and a dumbell raise where you have the weight at your side then raise your arm to shoulder height both in front of you and beside you.

[Bobyota]

BTW, I've seen some arguement over how many times a week things should be worked. I've been under the impression that 3 times for a body part is just too much, but 2 is ok and the most you'd want to do.

[Dolfan_714]

I guess the best test is... if your making gains by doing it twice a week and you continue to get results... continue doing what your doing till you hit a pleatue, then that's when you re-avuluate what your doing, and change things up.

[OJ Simpson]

BTW, I've seen some arguement over how many times a week things should be worked. I've been under the impression that 3 times for a body part is just too much, but 2 is ok and the most you'd want to do.

There are a few people who train some muscle groups 2x a week. But they train very few sets ( 2-4) . For example you go to the gym and do 1 set of bench, 1 set of incline and 1 set of flys, and you are done with chest. Some powerlifters have a speed day for ( a second day in the same week they train a muscle again) but they train very light and only a few sets on the speed day. But most of the top amature and pro bodybuilders train each muscle once a week.

[FortifiedIron]

What exercises are you doing ?

How many sets per muscle group ?

How many reps ?

You will not grow faster or bigger by training each muscle group 2 or 3 times a week, then you would by training once a week.

Your post should at best be ignored.

Kc

[OJ Simpson]

Your post should at best be ignored.

Kc

Please expand on your opinion, it's unclear what you are saying.

[FortifiedIron]

Please expand on your opinion, it's unclear what you are saying.

Frequency

Kc

[OJ Simpson]

Frequency

Kc

Yes that is an interesting opinion, looks like the jury is still out. It might be more helpfull to help this young man with you're advise or opinion, rather then attacking mine....Peace

[Madcow2]

Here's another on frequency (i.e. depends totally on what you are doing): http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/sh...&postcount=386

I'll just add that I know tons of people who squat in some form 3x per week and make excellent gains. Even a total novice can do this providing one adjusts the intensity (% 1RM or weight being used) and volume appropriately. This particular program is known to put 30-40lbs on high school kids within 6 months. http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/sh...&postcount=235


Here is a sample of what some US Olifters were doing previous to nationals. Keep in mind this is DELOADING and volume is significantly down from the previous period. And yes, that's 3 heavy back squat sessions, 3 heavy front squat sessions, 6 heavy sessions in the full lifts, and that does not include the 70-80% lifts the other 3 days nor the assistance work. If you think this is a lot, you should read up on what the Greeks and Bulgarians can handle:

our lifters training for mens and womens nationals are doing their last month of training now, here is the program they are using, fairly typical for us before a meet.

monday, wed, fri in the mornings
heavy snatch
heavy clean and jerk
heavy back squat

monday, wed, friday in the evenings
heavy snatch
heavy clean and jerk
heavy front squat

tuesday, thursday, sat.

one workout, lighter weights, work on speed and technique on clean and jerk with 70-80% weights and any specific problems from day before, as well as some lighter remedial work like glute-ham or reverse hyper.

and kyle or susan, if you are interested, donnys workout from monday went like this

monday morning

snatch up to 155kg
clean and jerk up to 190kg
back squat up to 255kg

monday evening

snatch up to 160kg
clean and jerk up to 195kg
clean 200kg and missed jerk
front squat to 215kg

[powerlifter70]

More is not better. Why does everyone think that?

And sometimes less is not better either. You have to find out what works for you. My best split is this

heavy bench and triceps
deadlifts and biceps and shoulders
off
speed bench and triceps
legs and biceps
off
off

[prospero]

There is no such thing as a tricept.

[Bobyota]

There are a few people who train some muscle groups 2x a week. But they train very few sets ( 2-4) . For example you go to the gym and do 1 set of bench, 1 set of incline and 1 set of flys, and you are done with chest. Some powerlifters have a speed day for ( a second day in the same week they train a muscle again) but they train very light and only a few sets on the speed day. But most of the top amature and pro bodybuilders train each muscle once a week.

Well I should have clarified a little more. We do one heavy day and one light. We don't do less sets or reps on the light day, just less weight. So I guess this may be similar.

I wanted to try this because I think I have hit a platuea after 3 years and gaining about 40 lbs.

[Jay Juliano]

If you want to train 1970 style. If you train very hard it will take your muscles a week to recover. I know of no pro bodybuilder who trains each muscle group 2x a week.

I agree 100%.

Training particular muscles twice a week ISN'T going to deliver results faster. In fact, it may set you up for over training which in return can cause muscle loss. 90% of the people here are uneducated when it comes to training. They think more is more disregarding that less is more because your muscles need time to recover (even beyond when there is no more soreness) and they will grow during rest not at the gym...

[Rocky_Maivia]

Oh brother...

[OJ Simpson]

Here's another on frequency (i.e. depends totally on what you are doing): http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/sh...&postcount=386

I'll just add that I know tons of people who squat in some form 3x per week and make excellent gains. Even a total novice can do this providing one adjusts the intensity (% 1RM or weight being used) and volume appropriately. This particular program is known to put 30-40lbs on high school kids within 6 months. http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/sh...&postcount=235


Here is a sample of what some US Olifters were doing previous to nationals. Keep in mind this is DELOADING and volume is significantly down from the previous period. And yes, that's 3 heavy back squat sessions, 3 heavy front squat sessions, 6 heavy sessions in the full lifts, and that does not include the 70-80% lifts the other 3 days nor the assistance work. If you think this is a lot, you should read up on what the Greeks and Bulgarians can handle:

Olympic athletes train with the most modern computer systems and medical

Doctors available. We on the other hand do not have those luxuries. I have

trained with many amature and professional athletes, and not one ever

trained a muscle group 3x a week with weights. It might be an interesting

theory but that is all it is. When someone is advanced in there training with

years of experiance as well as education, then they can play around with the

experimental theorys of the day.

[FortifiedIron]

Olympic athletes train with the most modern computer systems and medical

Doctors available. We on the other hand do not have those luxuries. I have

trained with many amature and professional athletes, and not one ever

trained a muscle group 3x a week with weights. It might be an interesting

theory but that is all it is. When someone is advanced in there training with

years of experiance as well as education, then they can play around with the

experimental theorys of the day.

1. I have a whole forum full of competitive olympic weightlifters and coaches and not a single one has a whole medical team at their every becken call.

2. Expand on these 'athletes' please? I know several well respected strength and conditioning coaches/performance coaches who will dissagree with you. Im not talking people who train 'amature' athletes, Im talking professional and high level college athletes.

3. Suggesting that a pro bodybuilders doesnt train a muscle group twice a week is somewhat idiotic.

4. Your assumption about the 1970 lifters leads me to think you are not educated about hypertrophy and recovery.

5. I know where this will lead to. Science is only theory correct? It has no application to bodybuilding because after every study you find 10 different studies to disprove it? Again that would lead me to think you are not educated in the field. Hopfully I'm wrong on this one, because I've supplied several studies to people who claim there are so many different studies to disprove it yet they never supply those 'disproving' studies, they just assume that w/ their lack of knowledge in exercise science they exist.

6. Lets discuss

Kc

[FortifiedIron]

I agree 100%.

Training particular muscles twice a week ISN'T going to deliver results faster. In fact, it may set you up for over training which in return can cause muscle loss. 90% of the people here are uneducated when it comes to training. They think more is more disregarding that less is more because your muscles need time to recover (even beyond when there is no more soreness) and they will grow during rest not at the gym...

So you take biopsy studies of your tissue to determine when you have recovered? Or are you assuming this because you've ready tons of peer review research and know this as fact? Or possibly you take metabolic profies to determine when IGF and other signals are returned to near baseline? Overtraining is bad? Since when was it bad? Ever heard of overreaching?

Kc

[Madcow2]

Olympic athletes train with the most modern computer systems and medical

Doctors available. We on the other hand do not have those luxuries. I have

trained with many amature and professional athletes, and not one ever

trained a muscle group 3x a week with weights. It might be an interesting

theory but that is all it is. When someone is advanced in there training with

years of experiance as well as education, then they can play around with the

experimental theorys of the day.

You don't know what you are talking about and your experience obviously hasn't gotten you much out of the BBing voodoo world. The people using that program are training in a basic room in Wichita not in the Training Center at Colorado Springs (to which I think you are giving far far too much credit ).

Anyone can tolerate 3 days of squatting per week, it's all a matter of adjusting volume and intensity appropriately. You walk 7 days a week without problem, it's a combination of high volume and very very low intensity. There is middle ground in squatting to make it tolerable and very result producing. No absolutes with regard to frequency other than it has to be greater than zero or you aren't training. And this **** isn't rare either. It's common to some of the most famous programs around. **** - the Smolov Squat Cycle has you squat 4x per week with massive volume above 85% at times and it's considered to be the holy grail of squat programs. http://www.ontariostrongman.ca/Resou...squatcycle.htm

Look at the very popular and classic program here from Bill Starr: http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/sh...4&postcount=15. Starr is one of the most famous strength and conditioning coaches ever. He coached mutliple Pro football teams, served as the coach at multiple universities, held records in both OL and PL, and is widely regarded as one of the finest coaches to walk the earth. His BASIC offseason football program for college and HIGHSCHOOL athletes has squatting 3x per week - and since it was written in the 1970s there is no assumption about computer aided training or any such nonsense other than a bar and plates. This program has been used in one form or another for over 30 years and variants are still in use today by elite athletes in a variety of sports for at least part of their training year.

If this is all new, you might consider the possibility that there is a whole world of training outside what you might have seen and read about. To be honest, this is the way training is done everywhere except in BBing at least once you get out of the doofus realm. It has produced absolutely massive powerful athletes. You can't make blanket rules about frequency. Frequency distributes volume/total load over a period of time - it is not an absolute nor should it be considered as such.

[OJ Simpson]

1. I have a whole forum full of competitive olympic weightlifters and coaches and not a single one has a whole medical team at their every becken call.

2. Expand on these 'athletes' please? I know several well respected strength and conditioning coaches/performance coaches who will dissagree with you. Im not talking people who train 'amature' athletes, Im talking professional and high level college athletes.

3. Suggesting that a pro bodybuilders doesnt train a muscle group twice a week is somewhat idiotic.

4. Your assumption about the 1970 lifters leads me to think you are not educated about hypertrophy and recovery.

5. I know where this will lead to. Science is only theory correct? It has no application to bodybuilding because after every study you find 10 different studies to disprove it? Again that would lead me to think you are not educated in the field. Hopfully I'm wrong on this one, because I've supplied several studies to people who claim there are so many different studies to disprove it yet they never supply those 'disproving' studies, they just assume that w/ their lack of knowledge in exercise science they exist.

6. Lets discuss

Kc

#1 Well first of all when you refer to Olympic weight lifters I would think you are talking about the top lifters in the world....those who compete in the Olympics and like events....and yes they do have acess to the top medical doctors and extensive computer training experts.

#2 I am unclear as to what you are asking

#3 I trained in LA at Golds Venice with and around the top body builders in the world. And as I said very few if any trained 2x or 3x a week for any muscle group ( except ABBS)

#4 Hypertrophy. Growth of an organ or tissue due to an increase in the size of its cells. Hypertrophy is a normal response of skeletal muscle cells when they are challenged to lift excessive weight. This is a wonderfull term but it would be better if you explained in detail how long each muscle needs to recover from heavy weight lifting. Any Physiology Professor will tell you training with heavy weights 3x a week is counterproductive, and will result in injury.

#5 The bottom line is you feel the need to attack me because I have a differant opinion than you. The science of sports training changes very often and I respect others opinions. You need to offer your knolledge without feeling the need to put down others who do not agree.........Peace

[Ifn-gamma]

I guess the best test is... if your making gains by doing it twice a week and you continue to get results... continue doing what your doing till you hit a pleatue, then that's when you re-avuluate what your doing, and change things up.

Amen to that. You should do whatever works for you (until it stops working).

FWIW, I'm doing the HST program where I squat, bench, etc, 3x/week, 2-3sets/workout, and I'm happy with my progress. Oh, and back in college, I was working out a bodypart 1x/week, and guess what? I grew. The volume has relatively stayed the same though. 9-12 sets total per week for a given bodypart.

[Jay Juliano]

Overtraining is bad? Since when was it bad?

uh let's see genius... when you lift you do damage. So why on earth would you think it is NOT bad to do MORE damage while your muscles are trying to repair? If you don't give your muscles enough time to recover YOU WON'T gain muscle... Ofcourse over training is bad... Why would you think otherwise?

[m27]

So you take biopsy studies of your tissue to determine when you have recovered? Or are you assuming this because you've ready tons of peer review research and know this as fact? Or possibly you take metabolic profies to determine when IGF and other signals are returned to near baseline? Overtraining is bad? Since when was it bad? Ever heard of overreaching?

Kc

overtraining is inherently bad
that's why it's called OVERtraining

you must be really dense (and I don't mean muscle mass)

[OJ Simpson]

uh let's see genius... when you lift you do damage. So why on earth would you think it is NOT bad to do MORE damage while your muscles are trying to repair? If you don't give your muscles enough time to recover YOU WON'T gain muscle... Ofcourse over training is bad... Why would you think otherwise?

Right on brother F.....Iron is just preaching the fad of the moment.