Bulking for Endomorphs Thread- Post all questions and comments here

[Beast]

I've added a 7th meal to my diet. This 7th meal is a preworkout carb meal.

my supplements with each meal are...

OLD
M1(carb) - insopro-r, alcalean, sesaminoil (1G)
M2 - fish oil(2caps), maxcla(2caps)
M3 - sesaminoil (1g)
M4 - fishoil(2caps), max cla(2caps)
M5(carb) - insopro-r (1cap), alcalean(1cap), seaminoil (1g)
M6 - fishoil(2caps), maxcla(2caps)

NEW
M1(carb) - insopro-r, alcalean, sesaminoil (1G)
M2 - fish oil(2caps), maxcla(2caps)
M3 - sesaminoil (1g)
M4 - fishoil(2caps), max cla(2caps)
M5(carb) - insopro-r(1cap), alcalean(1cap),fish oil(2 cap), seaminoil(1g)
M5(carb) - insopro-r (1cap), alcalean(1cap), seaminoil (1g)
M6 - fishoil(2caps), maxcla(2caps)

would this be optimal or you got a better suggestion?

That the fish oil with the Sesamin and CLA by itself. I recommend this because Sesamin and Fish Oil work synergistically together, so might as well take them at the same time, though not sure it will make any difference

[Kernkraft]

Hey Derek, just finished reading the book while I was waiting for my car to get fixed in the shop. Great stuff, very informative and made lots of sense.

2 questions (if I think of anymore I'll ask):

1) Can I substitute ALA with trans-resveratrol? Resveratrol just happens to be a much more powerful and beneficial antioxidant, but I didn't know if it would take anything away from the synergy of everything you have set up in conjunction with the ALA.

2) Can I substitute in place of my post-workout meal where you require a complex carb low GI food such as sweet potato (with the rest of the meal, etc) with let's say couple scoops of whey and some Waxy Maize Starch (Primaforce Carb Slam)?

I was really looking for a routine/bulking plan that emphasized lean muscle gains and growth without putting on fat (or for that matter, minimal) and I was pretty much hooked after reading the first two pages. When I finally feel like I have brought down my body fat enough from cutting I'll start up a journal mimicking what you detailed. Thanks again.

[Kernkraft]

bump...

[Beast]

Hey Derek, just finished reading the book while I was waiting for my car to get fixed in the shop. Great stuff, very informative and made lots of sense.

2 questions (if I think of anymore I'll ask):

1) Can I substitute ALA with trans-resveratrol? Resveratrol just happens to be a much more powerful and beneficial antioxidant, but I didn't know if it would take anything away from the synergy of everything you have set up in conjunction with the ALA.

2) Can I substitute in place of my post-workout meal where you require a complex carb low GI food such as sweet potato (with the rest of the meal, etc) with let's say couple scoops of whey and some Waxy Maize Starch (Primaforce Carb Slam)?

I was really looking for a routine/bulking plan that emphasized lean muscle gains and growth without putting on fat (or for that matter, minimal) and I was pretty much hooked after reading the first two pages. When I finally feel like I have brought down my body fat enough from cutting I'll start up a journal mimicking what you detailed. Thanks again.

1. I recommend ALA for its nutrient partitioning/glucose disposal properties.

2. I do not recommend high GI carbs for endomorphs. I would opt for something like oatmeal or sweet potatoes.

[LiL USMC BBer]

That the fish oil with the Sesamin and CLA by itself. I recommend this because Sesamin and Fish Oil work synergistically together, so might as well take them at the same time, though not sure it will make any difference

In the book you have sesamin by it self and fish oil/cla together. Which one do you suggest for ALL meals? Cause I will make the switch if need be..

[Beast]

In the book you have sesamin by it self and fish oil/cla together. Which one do you suggest for ALL meals? Cause I will make the switch if need be..

It probably won't make a difference but I would take the Sesamin+Fish Oil together and the CLA by itself. Again, it probably won't make a difference at all when you take these as long as you spread out the dosages.

[LiL USMC BBer]

Switched


also one more thing.


THey say in the cut diet it takes around 4-5 weeks for fat loss to actually start. And become full throttle.

Would it be a waste of time if I switched over to cut diet (same caloric intake, or tad bit higher) for like 2 maybe 3 weeks? THen back over to bulkingforendo's for 1-2 months?

[Beast]

Switched


also one more thing.


THey say in the cut diet it takes around 4-5 weeks for fat loss to actually start. And become full throttle.

Would it be a waste of time if I switched over to cut diet (same caloric intake, or tad bit higher) for like 2 maybe 3 weeks? THen back over to bulkingforendo's for 1-2 months?

You lose fat during those first 4-5 weeks, but it takes time for the upregulation/dowregulation of ezymes to occur, hence why we say fat loss really increases after a month or so on the Cut Diet. Going the Cut Diet for a couple weeks then Bulking for Endos is fine.

[LiL USMC BBer]

awesome..

would you suggest doing cut diet with same caloric intake as bulkingforendo's? or increasing cals when switching over to cut diet?

[Kernkraft]

Another question Beast. Could you just lay out the macro percentages for me on the bulking for endomorphs diet because it would be a whole lot easier for me to plan this out ahead with that than the servings and weight measurements you have going in the lists of food. It looks almost 50:30:20 ish to me.

[STLRAMS2006]

I now have two more weeks left on the 'cut diet' and following its completion I will be starting 'Bulking for Endomorphs.'

I plan to lean bulk for a good 4 months. As a college student, supplements do take a toll on the tight budget so I was just wondering what you all felt would be an ideal supplement combination for the bulking for endos program.

Would Xtend+Primal EAA be ideal for this type of bulk, while also sipping on 3-4 scoops of Xtend throughout the day?

Or Would Xtend+Vasocharge yield greater gains in size and strength?
Primal EAA and Vasocharge?

In a perfect world I would get all 3, but thats not gonna happen!

Thanks guys

[LiL USMC BBer]

Get yourslf some primal eaa +xtend. WOrks EXCELLENT! Probably the best combo I've seen yet!

For an extra 10 dollars you can include vasocharge in your supplement arsenol..

If your on a tight budget then sipping on xtend probably isn't such a good idea. Gets the job done though.

[STLRAMS2006]

Get yourslf some primal eaa +xtend. WOrks EXCELLENT! Probably the best combo I've seen yet!

For an extra 10 dollars you can include vasocharge in your supplement arsenol..

If your on a tight budget then sipping on xtend probably isn't such a good idea. Gets the job done though.

Thanks bro, how do I go about including vasocharge for only 10 bucks?!!

[Herron]

Started the Bulking for Endo's this week. I get up at 430ish AM, drink a 10oz skim milk/ON Gold Standard Protien shake. hit the gym at 530ish sipping on Xtend. I have to leave at 630ish to get home for the family. I am trying to get the lifting done and hitting the treadmill for 20minutes but not sure that is going to be accomplished since I workout with my brother and spotting some of the lifts takes up more time. But the plan is if i dont get the treadmill in during that time I will go walk for 30min at lunch. Wed-no lifting day, I am treadmilling 30min. and then ab workout.
Once i get home I eat a bowl of oatmeal and a protien shake.
then at 1030ish a 4oz piece of Chicken.
Lunch at 12ish
4ish another protien shake
and eat dinner at 6-7PM.

Going to schedule a fat comp ASAP.

Goal is to gain muscle and to loose my gut.

Also taking Sesamin 3x a day.
I have some SciFit Kre-Alk but have not taken it regularly.

Think this will work?

[Beast]

then at 1030ish a 4oz piece of Chicken.
Lunch at 12ish
4ish another protien shake
and eat dinner at 6-7PM.

What all do these meals consist of?

[Herron]

What all do these meals consist of?

Not as strict but for Lunch it could be just about anything as long as it is close to 30+ Grams of protien (chicken, subway ham 6" with double meat, schlotzky's) Lunch is not as strict as it should, I need to get back to packing this meal.
Dinner, what the wife cooks. but she does really well about getting rounded meals and we do not fry alot of foods, mostly grill or broil meats.
Assumption is i need to keep the carbs lower in the post workout meals...?

[Beast]

awesome..

would you suggest doing cut diet with same caloric intake as bulkingforendo's? or increasing cals when switching over to cut diet?

I would do less calories when you are on the cut diet and then up cals when you do bulking for endomorphs.

[Beast]

I now have two more weeks left on the 'cut diet' and following its completion I will be starting 'Bulking for Endomorphs.'

I plan to lean bulk for a good 4 months. As a college student, supplements do take a toll on the tight budget so I was just wondering what you all felt would be an ideal supplement combination for the bulking for endos program.

Would Xtend+Primal EAA be ideal for this type of bulk, while also sipping on 3-4 scoops of Xtend throughout the day?

Or Would Xtend+Vasocharge yield greater gains in size and strength?
Primal EAA and Vasocharge?

In a perfect world I would get all 3, but thats not gonna happen!

Thanks guys

I would do:
2 Scoops VasoCharge + 2 Scoops Xtend 15-30 minutes pre-workout and then sip on 4 scoops of Xtend during your workout. That's it.

[Beast]

Not as strict but for Lunch it could be just about anything as long as it is close to 30+ Grams of protien (chicken, subway ham 6" with double meat, schlotzky's) Lunch is not as strict as it should, I need to get back to packing this meal.
Dinner, what the wife cooks. but she does really well about getting rounded meals and we do not fry alot of foods, mostly grill or broil meats.
Assumption is i need to keep the carbs lower in the post workout meals...?

I would try to keep the bulk of your carbs pre and post workout and limit starchy carbs during the rest of the day, instead eating fruits and veggies. If you want to have some starchy carbs during the like, like at dinner, that is fine, just keep them under control.

[Herron]

I would try to keep the bulk of your carbs pre and post workout and limit starchy carbs during the rest of the day, instead eating fruits and veggies. If you want to have some starchy carbs during the like, like at dinner, that is fine, just keep them under control.

This is where I have some 'problems', pre workout 'meal' is tough due to getting up at 430ish and being at the gym at 530AM, i have a 15-20 min drive, this is why i have been doing the skim milk and protien before workout.
I can not get up any earlier, I am already not getting enough sleep, I am getting worn down....
And if I read that right, you are saying TO EAT Fruits/Veggies instead of 'bread like' stuff.

Thanks again for all your help here and in the PMs!

[Beast]

This is where I have some 'problems', pre workout 'meal' is tough due to getting up at 430ish and being at the gym at 530AM, i have a 15-20 min drive, this is why i have been doing the skim milk and protien before workout.
I can not get up any earlier, I am already not getting enough sleep, I am getting worn down....
And if I read that right, you are saying TO EAT Fruits/Veggies instead of 'bread like' stuff.

Thanks again for all your help here and in the PMs!

The milk + whey is fine pre-workout. You could even do something like: milk + whey + a banana + PB in a shaken made in the blender.

Then post workout have something like oatmeal or whole wheat toast as a breakfast meal. For the rest of the days eat mostly fruits and veggies for your carbs, though a little starchy carbs (like rice and sweet potatoes) is ok for dinner.

[edhunter112]

I'm a 156pound endomorph/mesomorph (score 1.67 on http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/becker3.htm). Would you reccommend a mesomorph or endomorph plan? Also, as far as caloric intake for the endomorph bulking plan, maintenance: 156*15=2340 calories per day. Do i increase this by 500 calories on training days when bulking? And decrease/increase by how much on non-training days? Sorry, I probably missed something!

[Beast]

I'm a 156pound endomorph/mesomorph (score 1.67 on http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/becker3.htm). Would you reccommend a mesomorph or endomorph plan? Also, as far as caloric intake for the endomorph bulking plan, maintenance: 156*15=2340 calories per day. Do i increase this by 500 calories on training days when bulking? And decrease/increase by how much on non-training days? Sorry, I probably missed something!

I would use the Endo's program and start at 2500 calories.

[Luis A.]

Derek,
currently cycling off the cut diet so i decided i would do 1 to 2 weeks of the lifestyle cut before switching to a full bulking for endomorphs program however i would like to know what method regarding carb intake do you think is best for this program since i know that you are fond of both.
1 - carb tapering, start with breakfast and lower your carb intake as the day goes by.
2 - timed carb intake, concentrate most of your carb intake around WO and a few at breakfast.

PS: i am refering to starchy carb intake

[Beast]

Derek,
currently cycling off the cut diet so i decided i would do 1 to 2 weeks of the lifestyle cut before switching to a full bulking for endomorphs program however i would like to know what method regarding carb intake do you think is best for this program since i know that you are fond of both.
1 - carb tapering, start with breakfast and lower your carb intake as the day goes by.
2 - timed carb intake, concentrate most of your carb intake around WO and a few at breakfast.

PS: i am refering to starchy carb intake

Just start bulking for Endomorphs with lower calories.

[LiL USMC BBer]

when you say adjust your calories

(raise them)

are you referring to raising your carb intake?

or fat/protein also?

Is this based off the same plan as cut diet where you eat a ****LOAD of protein?

[Beast]

when you say adjust your calories

(raise them)

are you referring to raising your carb intake?

or fat/protein also?

Is this based off the same plan as cut diet where you eat a ****LOAD of protein?

What/where you increase calories will vary by individual. Hard to say off hand, I would have to see exactly what they are doing/eating.

[mandat28]

The milk + whey is fine pre-workout. You could even do something like: milk + whey + a banana + PB in a shaken made in the blender.

Everything I've ever read has touted "NO FAT pre or post w/o", of course it also promotes dextrose post w/o...go figure. Any real benefit to the PB here?

[Beast]

Everything I've ever read has touted "NO FAT pre or post w/o", of course it also promotes dextrose post w/o...go figure. Any real benefit to the PB here?

The fat will slow digestion and decrease insulin output. The goal of this program is to limit fat gain as much as possible while allowing an increase in muscle mass.

[Div.II]

Please help with PWO nutrition.

I know you guys don't suggest using sugar PWO.
So Leucine can be used as effectively in it's place?

I read an article that said,

Replace the carbs with other ingredients that might have a similar effect. Carbs themselves are not anabolic; they can help muscle growth through glycogen replenishment and via an insulin spike, which prevents muscle breakdown and facilitates the uptake of amino acids in the muscle. If we can get these same benefits without using carbs, the anabolic response will be adequate too.

Leucine can spike insulin almost as well as carbs but it doesn't take you out of ketosis or prevent you from being in a fat-adapted state. Glutamine and glycine are two amino acids that have been shown to restore muscle glycogen almost as well as carbs. The 35-55g of combined G&G will almost have the same effect on glycogen replenishment as a similar dose of carbs.

The whey isolate has the same purpose as ''regular'' post-workout nutrition: to provide building blocks for muscle growth. So basically you're using individual amino acids to stimulate the effect of carbs on insulin production (leucine) and glycogen replenishment (glutamine, glycine).

This seems like a plan for Endomorphs cutting and bulking. Whats your opinion?