The next threat against our freedoms starting right now!!

[Douche_Nutz]

10K a month we been giving since the inception of USFA. which was what, a couple of years ago ?

Holy ****, much more than I expected.

I had no idea Ergo was such a hugely successful company. Great work.

[Simpultun]

Oh i forgot whats on bush's mind:


BUSH:

"Hey children its story time"


security advisor wihispers in Bush's ear:

"We need to go NOW! Terrorists have just attacked and crashed a plane into the world trade center!"

BUSH trhinks:
What should i do, goodness i wish dick cheney or daddy was here, oh well

Bush continues:

"Look at the pretty bunnies"

Right, cause had he rushed to the twin towers maybe we wouldn't have lost so many people. He would have held up those towers with his own 2 hands and let everyone escape without harm!

WTF is your point? You think he could have done something had he left that classroom??

[sicosico]

too many big companies sell craetine , they'll never ban it , it is the most used substance in the olympics and ncaa and all professional sports , it is a natural substance ( mighty as will ban meat ) and it is allowed in all sport orgnizations , so stop the hype , creatine is not endangered!

don't compare it with phs and hormones

[Simpultun]

too many big companies sell craetine , they'll never ban it , it is the most used substance in the olympics and ncaa and all professional sports , it is a natural substance ( mighty as will ban meat ) and it is allowed in all sport orgnizations , so stop the hype , creatine is not endangered!

don't compare it with phs and hormones

Except that the supplement is third party... meaning it's not one of the natural forms that we get naturally. If it's foreign it's bad! And it is compareable to PHs or dare I even say steroids? Testosterone is naturally produce by the body right?

[sicosico]

Except that the supplement is third party... meaning it's not one of the natural forms that we get naturally. If it's foreign it's bad! And it is compareable to PHs or dare I even say steroids? Testosterone is naturally produce by the body right?

if you comapre creatine to steroids then you should ******* your self

[Simpultun]

if you comapre creatine to steroids then you should ******* your self

I was making a hypothetical comparison in the eyes of politicians.

[snakebyte]

Oh i forgot whats on bush's mind:


BUSH:

"Hey children its story time"


security advisor wihispers in Bush's ear:

"We need to go NOW! Terrorists have just attacked and crashed a plane into the world trade center!"

BUSH trhinks:
What should i do, goodness i wish dick cheney or daddy was here, oh well

Bush continues:

"Look at the pretty bunnies"

Somebody really reads to much into moores stuff. First of all, read anything else besides moores stuff on that specific thing, and you will find out that his advisors wrote a message in the background saying not to get up. You think the president running out of the room makes a country feel safe? Not one media member that was there has critisized bush for waiting. He did the right thing. Watch more than michael moore ****, he has been proven in almost every movie/book made to make his **** up. As far as bush being evil, well hes not the best. Im just not one of the people that takes him seriously, because I do research and find out what he says. Bowling for Columbine, he makes up statistics in the movie, edits several speech of charlten hestons to make his say specific sentences which were never spoken by him. In farhenheit 9/11, the oil thing? biggest joke ever, if it were for oil, then whys gas so high? The oil pipe line, well clinton voted for that, not bush, bushes plan went no where near afgahn. His "vacation" why dont you check what he actually accomplished on it. Having diplomats from other countries to his country home, staying at camp david (a fully equipped center), all while his office was being redone.

As much as I want to continue on this arguement, I think we should leave this for a different thread, but if you would like to have a civilized debate about politics give me a pm and we can start a thread. I think it would be fun and interesting, as long as neither get personal. But as far as moore goes, dont bring him in to it at all, moore is the most laughable person in this country with blatant lies.


On the supplement issue, we should all write a letter at least. Some says its the companies problem. Well without the companies making these products you can buy brand name crap out their from huge companies that jack prices up. Everything would be like muscle-tech, minus the huge claims of course. But everyone knows that their products aren't great/special.



EDIT: As far as the political thing, just letting everyone know that the post is directed as mainly anti moore, not as an anti-kerry, pro-bush thing. I just dont think most people realize that bush is doing a decent job at what hes doing. This election has just become pure mud throwing where each party calls the other a liar. But the invitation was sent out for youngvet for a civilized debate, but anyone else that would like to have one, pm me and we'll start a thread.

[Patrick Arnold]

No sir...i'm not

is it just muslims you hate and blame for the worlds problems or are there other untermensch out there too?

[Patrick Arnold]

too many big companies sell craetine , they'll never ban it , it is the most used substance in the olympics and ncaa and all professional sports , it is a natural substance ( mighty as will ban meat ) and it is allowed in all sport orgnizations , so stop the hype , creatine is not endangered!

don't compare it with phs and hormones

these big companies that sell creatine are currently not contributing to any trade organization of lobbying group to stand up for their rights as far as i know.

they better start soon, cuz you don't wanna have to play catch up when the gov't goes for it

and it is not "allowed" in sports organizations so much as it is "not banned".

btw, creatine sales to minors is now illegal in california, and there are politicians there who want to prohibit its sale outright

[snakebyte]

is it just muslims you hate and blame for the worlds problems or are there other untermensch out there too?

In reality islamic fundamentalists are not really islamic. They say the koran calls for a jihad and what not, the people who read the koran and analyse it say nothing that terrorists do is even remotely related to the actual religion. The use their religion as an excuse, but in reality it isn't the reality. What patrick said about almost all of them not being terrorists is completely true. It may seem like a lot to you right now, but thats becuase of the terrorists you hear of, use their religion as a reason for their acts. Just make sure to realize people who are islamic are peaceful people such as you and me. We have many people in this world that do acts of terrorism that are not islamic.

[Patrick Arnold]

In reality islamic fundamentalists are not really islamic.

I am not really sure there is any real definition for the term "islamic fundamentalist"

there are many sects of islam, and many leaders of islam, and all have different philosophies and interpretations of the koran

i am not sure there is any real definition for christian fundamentalist either

its all one of those easy catch phrases the media likes to use i think

btw, what the hell do i know. i haven't read even one page of the koran. but i do read stuff written by others about all this

[Mass_69]

Somebody really reads to much into moores stuff. First of all, read anything else besides moores stuff on that specific thing, and you will find out that his advisors wrote a message in the background saying not to get up. You think the president running out of the room makes a country feel safe? Not one media member that was there has critisized bush for waiting. He did the right thing. Watch more than michael moore ****, he has been proven in almost every movie/book made to make his **** up. As far as bush being evil, well hes not the best. Im just not one of the people that takes him seriously, because I do research and find out what he says. Bowling for Columbine, he makes up statistics in the movie, edits several speech of charlten hestons to make his say specific sentences which were never spoken by him. In farhenheit 9/11, the oil thing? biggest joke ever, if it were for oil, then whys gas so high? The oil pipe line, well clinton voted for that, not bush, bushes plan went no where near afgahn. His "vacation" why dont you check what he actually accomplished on it. Having diplomats from other countries to his country home, staying at camp david (a fully equipped center), all while his office was being redone.

As much as I want to continue on this arguement, I think we should leave this for a different thread, but if you would like to have a civilized debate about politics give me a pm and we can start a thread. I think it would be fun and interesting, as long as neither get personal. But as far as moore goes, dont bring him in to it at all, moore is the most laughable person in this country with blatant lies.


On the supplement issue, we should all write a letter at least. Some says its the companies problem. Well without the companies making these products you can buy brand name crap out their from huge companies that jack prices up. Everything would be like muscle-tech, minus the huge claims of course. But everyone knows that their products aren't great/special.



EDIT: As far as the political thing, just letting everyone know that the post is directed as mainly anti moore, not as an anti-kerry, pro-bush thing. I just dont think most people realize that bush is doing a decent job at what hes doing. This election has just become pure mud throwing where each party calls the other a liar. But the invitation was sent out for youngvet for a civilized debate, but anyone else that would like to have one, pm me and we'll start a thread.

Very well stated. I even tried to rep you, but it said I had to spread some, 1st.

Anyhow, let's get back to the supp industry, and the politics that lye with it, rather than politics that lye with the war & election. I hope everyone is clear that the Ban would have happened, regardless of who was in office. Remember that it was introduced by Senator Joseph Biden (D-DE), so it doesn't seem to be only a single political party. (OK, sorry, I'm done with the politics)

[Phelan]

Islam is the biggest threat today,i dun wanna create any issues over here regarding wht i said(this is the truth),but since this thread has changed to be more political.i wanna say tht bush is more eligible,he's got the guts to fight terrorism,when kerry is for middle class americans(perfect).Godammit any american president(bush/kerry) kills or captures bin laden,the islamics in u.s(can u imagine their population?)will poison the water pipes all over the country,there will be plenty of human bombs etc etc (tht's wht was claimed frm islamic society during 11-09)....imagine an aeroplane hitting the gym where u guys r working out,where i'm working out...no body knows when or where untill this terrorism ends.i dunno abt washington or abt ur political views/issues.i ain't american...but if this is the case..i'll definately tell america to stop poking their nose in other countries personal affairs....can they stop...NO they can't,coz ur the greatest nation,so be like it, finish,end this terrorism this bloodshed for heavens sake....but plss DON'T BAN PH'S PLSS PLSS....i hope i'll not be banned.

Whatever you are smoking I'd like to have an oz, have your people call my people.
I have read your post 3 times, and I am still confused.
Correct me if I wrong in your logical leaps here:
Bin Ladin is captured --> millions of Islamic extremists that you say reside in the US start poisoning the water supply --> hijacked airplanes are flown into gyms all over north america
on second thought, that is completely logical what was I thinking.

Rant:
Have you ever heard of the 'War on Drugs' and the 'War on Poverty' they both have something in common with the 'War on Terrorism'. Our opponent is a concept, you can't defeat a concept...its not an item you can destroy. I believe the Kato Institute(Libertarian Thinktank) published a rather sizeable paper about the stupidity of declaring war on yet another concept.

On Edit: I just read some of the later exchange you had with PA, and I am now quite certain of one thing. You are insane and an example of failure of whatever countrys education system had the pleasure of attempting to 'educate' you.

[cute_monster]

In reality islamic fundamentalists are not really islamic. They say the koran calls for a jihad and what not, the people who read the koran and analyse it say nothing that terrorists do is even remotely related to the actual religion. The use their religion as an excuse, but in reality it isn't the reality. What patrick said about almost all of them not being terrorists is completely true. It may seem like a lot to you right now, but thats becuase of the terrorists you hear of, use their religion as a reason for their acts. Just make sure to realize people who are islamic are peaceful people such as you and me. We have many people in this world that do acts of terrorism that are not islamic.

read this: Quran: Chapter 9, Verse 5: “Then when the Sacred Months have passed, kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush. But if they repent and observe the Islamic lifestyle, then leave their way free. Verily, Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful
You dun have to talk simply stop bull****ting in here...this is just one pathetic example alrite....u want more huh???i'll give yaa much more...right frm quran

[lvtrojan]

the people who read the koran and analyse it say nothing that terrorists do is even remotely related to the actual religion. The use their religion as an excuse, but in reality it isn't the reality.

Way OT from thread but...i have heard/read that there are passages in the Koran that do justify violence against "infidels" to further the Islamic cause. (of course their are weird items in the King James Bible as well). I dont own a copy of the Koran so i cant cite any reference. But i do agree that religion is the excuse for their acts and not the cause.

On topic:

Pat, is monetary help the only/best way to help the usfa? If so what is a reasonable contribution from a consumer? $100? I assume we can donate at the Olympia Expo. Maybe usfa t-shirts (if not already made) would be a good fund raiser and a great way to gain exposure (at least around the gym), if people are encouraged to go to the website.

[cute_monster]

Whatever you are smoking I'd like to have an oz, have your people call my people.
I have read your post 3 times, and I am still confused.
Correct me if I wrong in your logical leaps here:
Bin Ladin is captured --> millions of Islamic extremists that you say reside in the US start poisoning the water supply --> hijacked airplanes are flown into gyms all over north america
on second thought, that is completely logical what was I thinking.

Rant:
Have you ever heard of the 'War on Drugs' and the 'War on Poverty' they both have something in common with the 'War on Terrorism'. Our opponent is a concept, you can't defeat a concept...its not an item you can destroy. I believe the Kato Institute(Libertarian Thinktank) published a rather sizeable paper about the stupidity of declaring war on yet another concept.

On Edit: I just read some of the later exchange you had with PA, and I am now quite certain of one thing. You are insane and an example of failure of whatever countrys education system had the pleasure of attempting to 'educate' you.

ur a moslem...right???u knw wht follow ur holy book....marry ur own 1st cousins,give birth to genetically impaired kids,kill people who dnt follow islam,have 4-5 wifes(pretty cool),spread threat....it suits islam.

[Phelan]

read this: Quran: Chapter 9, Verse 5: “Then when the Sacred Months have passed, kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush. But if they repent and observe the Islamic lifestyle, then leave their way free. Verily, Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful
You dun have to talk simply stop bull****ting in here...this is just one pathetic example alrite....u want more huh???i'll give yaa much more...right frm quran

The Bible says its okay to stone children for being disobedient and has no problem with slavery. Thats because people have the ability of rational thought, that can look at something in a document that may or may not contain a lot of truths and say: "Now wait a minute, I don't think I should do this"

Also the wonder that is google brought me to this page, http://aaiil.org/text/articles/bash/...warjihad.shtml and http://johnw.host.sk/faq/morefaq/doesnt_islam.htm
which interprets the passage.

Now, I'm going to sign off...and keep myself free from crazy anti-muslim talk until the new South Park tonight.

[Phelan]

ur a moslem...right???u knw wht follow ur holy book....marry ur own 1st cousins,give birth to genetically impaired kids,kill people who dnt follow islam,have 4-5 wifes(pretty cool),spread threat....it suits islam.

Yes, I am obviously a muslim...
Since there are so many of the blond, blue eyed variety that grew up in Berlin, Germany as a Lutherans and then immigrate to the US as muslims. For the sacrasm impaired, no I am not muslim.

But I do live in Alabama so the thing with the cousin kinda hit close to home

[cute_monster]

[QUOTE=Phelan]The Bible says its okay to stone children for being disobedient and has no problem with slavery. Thats because people have the ability of rational thought, that can look at something in a document that may or may not contain a lot of truths and say: "Now wait a minute, I don't think I should do this"

Also the wonder that is google brought me to this page, http://aaiil.org/text/articles/bash/...warjihad.shtml and http://johnw.host.sk/faq/morefaq/doesnt_islam.htm
which interprets the passage.

Now, I'm going to sign off...and keep myself free from crazy anti-muslim talk until the new South Park tonight.[/QUOT
I'M NOT A CHRISTIAN..BETTER LUCK NEXT TIME(oooo i said the same in some section)

[Rollem7778]

Who started this damn thread? Gone from supplements being banned, to Bush and politics to religion and people getting stoned and infidels and all kinds of crazy ****. Yall really messed up cause its a sticky now.

And I am with Snakebyte, I will get political just not here. And even tell you why Bush isn't a complete idiot despite popular belief.

[cute_monster]

Yes, I am obviously a muslim...
Since there are so many of the blond, blue eyed variety that grew up in Berlin, Germany as a Lutherans and then immigrate to the US as muslims. For the sacrasm impaired, no I am not muslim.

But I do live in Alabama so the thing with the cousin kinda hit close to home

so keep on fukkin 'em

[snakebyte]

read this: Quran: Chapter 9, Verse 5: “Then when the Sacred Months have passed, kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush. But if they repent and observe the Islamic lifestyle, then leave their way free. Verily, Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful
You dun have to talk simply stop bull****ting in here...this is just one pathetic example alrite....u want more huh???i'll give yaa much more...right frm quran

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/3059365.stm

Right there read that. Here is one quote from it

Extremism is the enemy of Islam. Whereas, jihad is allowed in Islam to defend one's land, to help the oppressed. The difference between jihad in Islam and extremism is like the earth and the sky," Sheikh Tantawi said.

That explains part of my post about the jihad, now about the specific quote from the koran, look at my post below.

[snakebyte]

this article is much more important, talking directly about your quote.

heres the source http://islam.about.com/library/weekly/aa090402a.htm

But what about those passages of the Qur'an that seem to promote wanton violence?* One of the verses most often quoted (2:191) seems to command Muslims to "slay them wherever you find them."* But who are "they?"* Is it any non-Muslim or "infidel?"* One merely needs to read the preceding verse to find the answer:* "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loves not the transgressors" (2:190).* In subsequent verses, Muslims are called upon to stop fighting when the opposing party ceases its aggression.

See what skimming documents does? Gotta read the whole thing to understand. Heres another part from the article talking about the koran as a whole, not just individual parts.

The entire Qur'an, taken as a complete text, gives a message of hope, faith, and peace to a faith community of one billion people.* The overwhelming message is that peace is to be found through faith in God, and justice among fellow human beings.

At the time the Qur'an was revealed (7th century A.D.), there was no United Nations or Amnesty International to keep the peace or expose injustice.* Inter-tribal violence and vengeance was commonplace.* As a matter of survival, one must have been willing to defend against aggression from all sides.* Nevertheless, the Qur'an repeatedly urges forgiveness and restraint, and warns believers not to "transgress" or become "oppressors."

as you said to me before, "u want more huh???i'll give yaa much more" but mine is interpreting the whole koran, in the sense it is meant to be taking, not from those who think a few sentences represent the whole thing.

[snakebyte]

ur a moslem...right???u knw wht follow ur holy book....marry ur own 1st cousins,give birth to genetically impaired kids,kill people who dnt follow islam,have 4-5 wifes(pretty cool),spread threat....it suits islam.

So tell me? Is ignorance really bliss?

[snakebyte]

Who started this damn thread? Gone from supplements being banned, to Bush and politics to religion and people getting stoned and infidels and all kinds of crazy ****. Yall really messed up cause its a sticky now.

And I am with Snakebyte, I will get political just not here. And even tell you why Bush isn't a complete idiot despite popular belief.

I think a thread like this would be fun just in general. Gotta love when you get heated in debate and you deliver the proof of you being right. Always makes you feel good. But its also fun when you talk about politics in general, since much of it is opinion, but just have a civilized conversation is always fun, I say if this thread keeps going on with islam/bush, w/e else, we make a new thread.

[Patrick Arnold]

Way OT from thread but...i have heard/read that there are passages in the Koran that do justify violence against "infidels" to further the Islamic cause. (of course their are weird items in the King James Bible as well). I dont own a copy of the Koran so i cant cite any reference. But i do agree that religion is the excuse for their acts and not the cause.

On topic:

Pat, is monetary help the only/best way to help the usfa? If so what is a reasonable contribution from a consumer? $100? I assume we can donate at the Olympia Expo. Maybe usfa t-shirts (if not already made) would be a good fund raiser and a great way to gain exposure (at least around the gym), if people are encouraged to go to the website.

they have a raffle, i dunno what else. OVRtrainer would know

[Patrick Arnold]

[QUOTE=cute_monster]

The Bible says its okay to stone children for being disobedient and has no problem with slavery. Thats because people have the ability of rational thought, that can look at something in a document that may or may not contain a lot of truths and say: "Now wait a minute, I don't think I should do this"

Also the wonder that is google brought me to this page, http://aaiil.org/text/articles/bash/...warjihad.shtml and http://johnw.host.sk/faq/morefaq/doesnt_islam.htm
which interprets the passage.

Now, I'm going to sign off...and keep myself free from crazy anti-muslim talk until the new South Park tonight.[/QUOT
I'M NOT A CHRISTIAN..BETTER LUCK NEXT TIME(oooo i said the same in some section)

not a christian, not a jew

can't be a buddhist

hindu?

[snakebyte]

they have a raffle, i dunno what else. OVRtrainer would know

I'd also like to know how we can donate. If you find anything out on it, please let us know. I know I will be willing to contribute something; I dont want to sit around hoping someone else does it for me.

[RSX-S]

btw, creatine sales to minors is now illegal in california, and there are politicians there who want to prohibit its sale outright

Since when did this happen? That is the 1st I had ever heard of such a thing. If they already think that creatine is such a bad substance that it needs to have an age limit, that is not a good thing. Hearing that they are IDing for creatine is the most absurd and ridiculous thing i've ever heard.

Its like they are banning things under urban legends rather than actual studies and facts. Disgusting~!

[youngvet1]

I'd also like to know how we can donate. If you find anything out on it, please let us know. I know I will be willing to contribute something; I dont want to sit around hoping someone else does it for me.

I will pm u the address and tell you who to make out the check to