Frustrated===venting

[wabney]

I am so ****in pissed ! !
I don't know what is going on. i have been trying to cut for seems like forever and no weight loss.
You may have read some of my threads a while back when i was on keto diet. Well here is my story::
I started bulking in January went for three months hard,
supplemented with the regulars (protein ,creatine) added some
19 nor in Feb for about 3 weeks then 1-test for 2 weeks. In march started keto diet to lose weight. In Jan I was 180lbs at the end of march when I stopped keto I was 195lbs and went from a 34 waist to 36 waist. April i started to cut and I still am cutting. right now I am 192lbs still at 36 waist. At the begining of may i stopped lifting so I could have more energy for cardio because I can't stand these phuckin 36 pants. Well anyway I have been doing 1 hour of cardio at least 5 times a week. (with no weight loss) The only way i skip a day is if i need to recover....
I am taking

ripped fuel
l- glutimine
multi / vit
protein shake

I feel that my diet is correct.. I have just started using the spread sheet from kendo to track my nutrients.
I have ordered some usnic acid and plan on starting those as soon as I get them. I mean something has to phucking give
"right"

Seems like I have been over this a million times in my head and i can't figure why my body won't let go of this phuckin weight ! !

Anyway just had to get it off my head.....

peace

[ctgblue]

Keep at it.
Remember that more people have gained fat on the KETO diet than just about any other. It is not for everyone and is extremely restrictive and difficult to stay on 'perfectly'. Problem is, if you don't stay on just about 'perfectly' fat gets stored like a Dow Jones selloff.
Stop trying to find the quick fixes like Usnic and concentrate on getting your calories in a healthy proportion, getting your meals into a 5-8x day eating pattern, and conttinue to put on lean mass. That is what is going to help you kill the fat.

[wabney]

Hey Bro

I must sound like a phuckin pussy but beleive me i am working my ass off..

what is 5-8x eating pattern..

[ctgblue]

read it again, 5-8 x day
I eat 5000 calories in 6-8 meals and stay the same weight, if I were to try those levels in 3 meals, I would be more of a doughboy than I am already.
Increasing the frequency and decreasing the quatity per meal ramps your metabolism up and gives you a more efficient running body. Hence you are never really "too hungry", so you are less likely to snap and pig out when on a lower calorie diet.

[wabney]

Hly **** 5000 cal a day.....

I am lucky to get 2000

Hey but what i will do is make sure i break my meals up into
at least 6 seperate times
but i don't think i want to go aver 2000 cals

[Dorian]

Originally posted by wabney
I am so ****in pissed ! !
I don't know what is going on. i have been trying to cut for seems like forever and no weight loss.
You may have read some of my threads a while back when i was on keto diet. Well here is my story::
I started bulking in January went for three months hard,
supplemented with the regulars (protein ,creatine) added some
19 nor in Feb for about 3 weeks then 1-test for 2 weeks. In march started keto diet to lose weight. In Jan I was 180lbs at the end of march when I stopped keto I was 195lbs and went from a 34 waist to 36 waist. April i started to cut and I still am cutting. right now I am 192lbs still at 36 waist. At the begining of may i stopped lifting so I could have more energy for cardio because I can't stand these phuckin 36 pants. Well anyway I have been doing 1 hour of cardio at least 5 times a week. (with no weight loss) The only way i skip a day is if i need to recover....
I am taking

ripped fuel
l- glutimine
multi / vit
protein shake

I feel that my diet is correct.. I have just started using the spread sheet from kendo to track my nutrients.
I have ordered some usnic acid and plan on starting those as soon as I get them. I mean something has to phucking give
"right"

Seems like I have been over this a million times in my head and i can't figure why my body won't let go of this phuckin weight ! !

Anyway just had to get it off my head.....

peace

I have had a similar situation at times. i found my metabolism has slowed. I took in less cals and busted my ass. But I couldn't lose. I decided to experiment a bit and tried to do something different for awhile. I used a diet consisting of carbs and protiens for the first few meals of the day. then the rest was fats and proteins. I used alot of omega 3's while I did this. I also changed my workout to more of a circuit style training. I was careful as to not over work myself but just enough so I could do it again a few days later. i lost the weight. I am starting to cut again being I was out of it for 3 months so i have some fat to cut and I will be using this format.

[kendo]

I have spent the past few months doing 60 min cardio sessions whilst adjusting carbs to suit bodyweight. Without changing my cals significantly I switched recently to higher intensity cardio sessions for 30 - 35 mins working around 80%mhr. Previous 60 mins sessions were about 60%mhr and have I seen an increase in fat loss and definition since changing. I've also been getting to work on time!

Heart rate link http://www.janatrains.com/ebzhrm.htm

220 - Age = Maximum Heart Rate
Max Heart Rate X .60 = Minimum Target Heart Rate (low end of zone) for 1 minute (divide by 6 for 10 sec figure)
Max Heart Rate X .80 = Maximum Target Heart Rate (high end of zone) for 1 minute (divide by 6 for 10 sec figure)

eg 38 yr old

220-38 = 182
182 x .60 = 109.2 bpm
109.2/6 = 18 beats in 10 sec for 60%

220-38 = 182
182 x .60 = 145.6 bpm
145.6/6 = 24 beats in 10 sec for 80%

just stop count your pulse beats for ten secs and you'll know what zone you are in

Cant help with Keto wabney and u know how my diet works with 60/30/10 p/c/f ratios relating to bodyweight adjusting cals with weight loss.

I find cheat days help, and I agree with the guys on 6 meals per day.

If your cals are too low for your bodyweight your metab will slow down and you'll end up in ojs cortisol loop that I have found well explained and interesing http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...threadid=33781

[wabney]

Check the math.... please\


220-42=178

178 x .8= 142

142 / 6 = 23.7 thats 80 % right



220-42=178

178 x .6 = 106.8

106.8 / 6 =17.8 thats 60 % right

So what i am looking to acheive is to keep my heart rate between
17 to 23 beets per 10 seconds. Closer to 23 would be better, am I right . And i should do this for the whole time of cardio???

thanks

[kendo]

Your calcs are spot on. Allow 5 mins warmup/cooldown either side and try to stay in the zone for the remaining time. You may find your length of time spent at 80% increasing with fitness but dont go over say 40 mins. Keep us posted Wabney!

[wabney]

Hey Thanks to all

I will post an update...

[wabney]

hey guys

What is your opinion on a cheat day??

I don't take any, do you think I should??

[wabney]

OK

i weighed myself at the gym today 189lbs

**** yeh thats 2lbs..

I also got a heart rate monitor so I can make sure i stay in the zone..

I will update later.....

[MAX MADMAN]

Wabney:

Cheat day is good, provided you're not looking to compete too soon. Up the fats, watch the sugars on that day.

Otherwise, you may want to consider cycling your calories by manipulating carb intake (but don't drop protein level that works for you) and slightly increase unsaturated fat intake as well. At the same time maybe increasing your cardio intensity may help put the frosting on the cake.

Take care, keep the faith and don't let this get you down. It happens to most of us at one time or another.

[wabney]

Hey bro , now from what I understand from Kendo and other guys on this board is that increasing cardio intensity isn't going to do the trick. that is why i got the heart rate monitor. I used it for the first time today and kept my heart rate at 80% of the max
for 40 mins, and to tell the truth i had to lower my intensity to keep that pace..

While lowering the pace , what I did notice is>> by keeping the rate constant through my whole session seemed to be harder in a way than regular , plus i sweat allot more.



I am not looking to compete with anyone exept myself , which is prob my worst competetor.

So you think 80 % of max is too low...

peace

[MAX MADMAN]

Wabney:

80% of max is OK, and not too low.

I realize many of the guys here feel that cardio intensity justy doesn't do it. However, for me, when getting ready to compete, I did just that twice daily @ 20 min. each, while dropping carbs a bit during the same tiome period. It worked for me, however do what works for you. Kendo and the other guys are sharp and know their stuff as well. The one thing that I've learned in ALL this stuff is that differnt approaches work differently for many people.

Stay strong, bro.

[wabney]

hey thanks bro ! !

Beleive me , I get all my support from this board and the people on it. It really helps me stay motivated..

What i am going to do Is give it a shot at 80% and see what happens. If the results don't come in ,I will increase..

I am starting to think that one main thing is to keep a steady heart rate for the duration of the exercise.

Like if I was to raise to 85 % , keep that rate throughout....

See another thing , i jump rope for like a half hour before i get the elipitical cycle, and thats where I get my intensity at.. i don't monoter that exercise because it is very hard to keep a constant H,R while jumping.



peace

[gymstud2002]

I'm gonna be the contrarian here and say that 40 minutes of cardio at 80% is too much and counterproductive... you're likely to burn more muscle than fat. Try high intensity, interval cardio.
Warm up for a couple of minutes, and jump back and forth between moderate intensity (appx 60 % max heart rate) for a minute followed by high intensity (80-85%) for a minute. Do this in one-minute intervals for 20 minutes with a couple of minutes cool down. I find it works well, it's shorter and more interesting.
I try to do it first thing in the morning on an empty stomach.

How about posting your diet for suggestions? Good luck and hang in there!

[wabney]

Hey bro

At this point of the game I am willing to sacrifice a little muscle to
lean up. I know thats a mortal sin, but **** seems like it is easier for me to put on a little muscle than to loose fat. So what i am thinking now is>>> Loose this damn fat and start building again after that....

later

[gymstud2002]

Go for it and good luck. I've got the opposite problem...cutting up isn't a problem, but mass gains come oh so slow. But don't rule out HIT interval cardio -- it's been proven to be highly effective at burning fat .

[bf6067]

Wabney,

I know what you mean. Although I am not taking anything to help me lose weight, I am having major frustrations trying to lose. It seems as though everything I eat goes straight to fat. I have had moments where I think I have gaineed alot of muscle but then I can't see it too well because of all of the fat. I am now terrified to gain any more weight and muscle until I can seriously reduce my bodyfat.

It is starting to irritate me that I spend so much time in the gym and there are actually guys who do not workout at all who look better than I do. I know that part of my problem may be due to the fact that I have Type II Diabetes but it is very frustrating not to be able to trim down.

I see guys all of the time who bulk up but yet they look muscular. They lose their cuts but they still look muscular. Me, I look fat. Not obese fat but definately overweight fat. I look in the mirror and I can see flab aound my mid-section.

I am caught between not eating hardly any food at all, to whether it is better to overdose on ab workouts or aerobics. The end result is that I can understand your frustration. I am actually starting to feel the opposite effect of working out. Working out makes most people gain confidence and feel better about themselves. I am starting to feel totally inferior because I can not get myself to look good. And I want to not just be thin, I want to be muscular.

- Bob from Pennsylvania

[wabney]

Hey Bro

I HEAR YOU.

Well What i have done now , since Kendo was kind enough to reply about the heart rate issue, is I got a "heart rate monitor".
I have been using it for about 1 week and I love it. It really makes me feel better because when i am finished my cardio i feel
like I know i am doing everything right. As far as muscle goes , right now i am saying "phuck it". I am not lifting and am dedicating all my time to cardio. Right now lifting will not leave me with enough strenght to get in enough cardio. I am trying my hardest to go every day 40 min at 80% max heart rate. In reality the way it's been working out is I get about 5 days a week in. Beleive me the 40 min really takes a tole. the only time i miss a day is if i need to recover. I am determined to lose this fat before trying to put on any more muscle....
Iam 42 yrs old 5'7" 189lbs..... I don't know Bf
I need to be 175lbs to 170 lbs

peace

[kendo]

Dont give up on the weight training Wabney - I do cardio every morning when cutting and hit the gym 4 times per week time to fit that in aint a prob with a large family to support and irregular working hours. If your cals are way to low for the amount of cardio and training you need to do you can shut your metab down and won't lose fat. I've been there myself and seen it many times really low cals too much cardio and training = system shutdown! Ojs has discussed this before with cortisol kicking in and muscle loss becomes more prevalent. Dieting too hard could be your prob espec if theres no cheat day - becoming really depleted and tired. List your current diet and weight an you'll certainly get feedback on the board but I think your prob is your cals are too low if your around 190lbs! Should be around 2200/2300 maybe more but i know you said u wouln't go over 2000. I can lose weight on 2000 cals at 140lbs 5'3"!

[wabney]

Hey Bro

Pretty impressive for one hand typing ! ! LOL

OK he we go

1st meal Special k with skim milk- 1bowl
protein shake/ skim milk
2nd meal chicken breast / 1 slice of whole wheet bread
3rd meal chicken breast / 1 slice of whole wheet bread
4th meal chicken breast / 1 slice of whole wheet bread
5th meal whole wheet pasta / tomato sauce 2 bowls
WORKOUT
last meal Special K / skim milk 1 maby 2 bowls..

supps:
protein shake
l - glutimine
multi / vit
ripped fuel
ZMA

thing is kendo it looks and feels like i am getting leaner, my pants are getting looser, clothes seem to be getting bigger, but on the damn scale the weight don't want to move. i mean it may move 2lbs one way or the other. but nothing substantial..

peace

[kendo]

I was cutting a few years ago taking pasta and breads and came to a standstill. I don't use pasta, breads or dairy products when dieting and prefer pots, rice and oatmeal as carb sources unrefined/processed - lower glycemic. Pasta and bread when bulking I also found attached themselves around my mid-section. Special-K contains hidden sugar and I think they are a con! Look at the nutrition info on the pack and see how much of the carbs are actually simple sugar. Corn Flakes have less - I just use oatmeal and mix in low fat whey+water. I think u need post workout protein - essential! not so much carbs if you train so late - lots of competing guys drop carbs evening time even after 3pm one guy I know! my last meal is protein only. Using purer carb sources might allow more volume in your meals curb hunger and better fuel workouts. Not too sure what your cals are but I'm sure u feel hungry with 1 slice bread each meal! Jusy my 2c worth don't change anything if your happy as things are!

[wabney]

Hey bro..

of course i am not totally happy with whats happinig right now. i am trying to get it right. now i thought the whole wheet bread and the whole wheet pasta were low GI carbs. Am i wrong with this. Please explain purer carb sources??
And what about rice i thought rice was also high GI.

Beleive it or not what i have been trying to acheive is a low GI diet , but looks like i got the wrong foods????

[kendo]

Wholewheat bread and pasta aren't too bad and there are just negligible differences with say rice but these differences prob only would come into effect say if you were close to contest which in your case are not. More personal experience I found them a prob and with competing guys u wont see them in post-contest plans. As long as you are in calorie deficit and coming down don't get too hung up about it. I just see breads and pasta as refined/processed carb sources slightly more glycemic that can make the difference

Some links

http://www.allnaturalbodybuilding.co...alcomposition/

http://www.aminoactive.com.au/cut.htm keto info though i haven't tried or know enough about!

http://www3.telus.net/Body_Rush/fitness_au_natural.htm

Good article here from "The Beast"

http://www.teenbodybuilding.com/derek8.htm

[oceanbaby]

I still don't understand why you'd give up the weights completely. If you increase your cardio, tighten up your diet, and continue with the weights you should actually see better results than by cutting out the weights completely. I am a single mom with a full-time job and I do my cardio first thing in the morning on an empty stomach (for 30-45 minutes, depending on how I feel). Then I work all day, go home, help the kids with homework, get supper ready and head back to the gym to weight train. Then it's home to shower (again), do the family thing, put the kids to bed at 9 and then I'm in for the night at 9:30. When I'm looking to drop some weight, I increase my protein and cycle my carbs (3-4 days at around 50g and then 1 day where it's around 150 g - keep in mind, I'm not a 200lb man but a 120lb woman). It's a commitment, but most of us should probably be committed anyhow, right? That's just my opinion, but I don't think I'd stop lifting weights to lose weight and I'm pretty sure none of the pro's do that. From everything I've ready, they just tighten up their diets and increase or add cardio into the mix.

[Charger]

Originally posted by kendo
If your cals are way to low for the amount of cardio and training you need to do you can shut your metab down and won't lose fat. I've been there myself and seen it many times really low cals too much cardio and training = system shutdown! Ojs has discussed this before with cortisol kicking in and muscle loss becomes more prevalent. Dieting too hard could be your prob espec if theres no cheat day - becoming really depleted and tired. List your current diet and weight an you'll certainly get feedback on the board but I think your prob is your cals are too low if your around 190lbs! Should be around 2200/2300 maybe more but i know you said u wouln't go over 2000. I can lose weight on 2000 cals at 140lbs 5'3"!

I'll second that!! Ojs & Kendo gave me the advice when I actaully went backward by over doing it. I dropped one day of cardio and uped carbs slightly and uped my metab, got right back on track.

I would also add the list of reply's that said DON'T STOP LIFTING!!. You'll regret it in the end.
As for type of cardio training, I second Max, go with what works. If you like what your doing and see results, go for it,we are all different. I understand Gymstuds theory and agree. You don't see too many big long distance runners who run at a steady pace but look at a sprinter and he will always resembel a bodybuilder.
But even so, I beleive if you limit your cardio to under 40 min either will work. Anything after that and you are burning muscle, unless you want to look like a skinny long distance runner, Ha ha

[wabney]

Hey all

I know you are right about the weights ! ! ! I will start lifting again this week because i can already notice a loose feeling, It' s just that i got so upset and was willing to try anything to loose this damn fat. I havent lifted for two weeks and only did cardio but now i am starting to feel loose and flaby. i know it's time to start lifting again, i just dont want to effect the cardio. i think i will look into HIT training. I think the main thing was getting my diet in order. Kendo has been helping me with that so with this new diet and start lifting again I am looking forwart to next workout...

Thing is i know in the past i have lost weight with lifting and dieting right , with no cardio at all ...

OK OK OK LIFT LIFT LIFT " STOP BEING A PUSSY""

I GET IT

THANKS ALL ! ! !

[wabney]

Hey Bro's

Well after all the support and the new diet plan from Kendo. i am glad to announce that along with the cardio, i started lifting again. The first day in while I was lifting I started wandering (why did I even stop). All i can figure is , "burn out" or "diet" but something was holding me down without realizing it. Now for some reason I have enough energy to do both cardio and lift.
What i think now is I was cutting my cal too much and combined with the wrong foods, result = too tierd....
or maby just needed the break...

So lets see what results this will bring?/


Well any way thanks to all the support.


see ya