Complex Carbs + Protein

[Manteca]

sorry to put this on a board about sups but couldn't get a response in the nutrition section:

I had never heard any thing like this before but I recently read in BC's anabolic nutrition article that when you consume complex carbs and protein at the same time that neither are digested properly. Why then to weight gainers like N Large II have complex carbs in their formula? Should I worry about seperating the consumption of the two as big cat advises? Some help would be appreciated as I'd like to get some more opinions on the subject, thanks.

[William]

Big Cat's article, in the portion in question, reads...

"In a meal that contains both proteins and carbs, you should take care to make sure that most of the carb sources, if not all of them, are simple carbs like mono- and di- saccharides."

After further explanation, he later states...

"And you should avoid as much complex carbs in post-workout nutrition as well since this is the time you need more protein. If you do take complex carbs, use maltodextrin because it is broken down easier and much more efficiently..."

Prolab's N-Large2 uses maltodextrin (complex) and fructose (simple) as carb sources. So, although it doesn't completely agree with Big Cat's assesment to "avoid as much complex carbs" (for certain reasons stated), N-Large2 does use maltodextrin as its complex carb source, as he suggests, "because it is broken down easier and much more efficiently..."

I took a look at other similar products, from TwinLab, Universal, and Champion...with one or two exceptions (among the 8 or so "gainer" products, they all use maltodextrin and speficially state, as a benefit of their product, the use of complex carbs.

The Prolab product, at least, seems to fail another of Big Cat's measures mentioned in the article...

"...the best mix is still your protein requirement (35-50) with an equal amount or higher in simple carbs and some clean fats."

Prolab N-Large2 does claim to contain some clean fats, but while its label states that it contains 52g of protein and 86g total carbs, only 28g is listed for sugars.

I don't know if that's useful information to you. I think you'll have to get a reply from Big Cat to get a complete explanation. Perhaps there are other things to consider that are not in the article, or perhaps the ready-made weight gainers out there are not the best way to go. I'll leave it to BC and others to draw the conclusions.

[Manteca]

Thank you for trying to help but I understood all of that, I want to try and understand, however, the discrepency between what big cat has said and the dozens of sup companies that include complex carbs in their weight gainers.

[William]

Yeah, I get you Manteca...mostly I posted all that for others who read your thread who have not read Big Cat's article. I thought others may have either something to contribute, and/or an interest in knowing the details behind your question as well as the answer.

[Mr.Lean]

From what I understand you need simple carbs with your protein post-workout. At other times, apart form the morning maybe , it doesnt really matter if you have complex carbs with your protein.

[JimRW]

Mr. Lean,
I understand it the same way as you. I know that you need simple carbs post-workout for the insulin spike, but at o ther times during the day I thought you could take complex carbs with protein. I always have thought that you were supposed to take complex carbs and protein together. Damn, I hope I haven't been negating the effects of either one all this time. Maybe BC can come and clear it all up.

[Manteca]

well I started eating whole wheat breads with nearly every meal about a month, month and a half ago, and still making sure to get 35 g of protein w/ each meal. From aprox. that time I have been stuck at about 205(please no one tell me I need more calories). I also had a lot of gas leading me to believe my protein intake may have been to high. After reading that article last week I've cut out complex carbs from my normal meals and substituted OJ, dextrose, sports drinks, whatever but making sure I got 50-60g simple carbs. My gas has all but dissapeared, indicating I may be absorbing more protein. I no I haven't been doing this long but no indication I'm gaining fat, but in fact my workouts seem to have been more intense and I am noticably more vascular. I am also up to 208 from last weeks 205(I realize that there can be large daily changes due to water, but still indicates progress). I know all of this is a little early to be sure about, I was pointing this bit in his article out so that others might read it. It seems everyone else was just as oblivious to this as I was. Still I'd like to hear a bit more from some nutrition experts that may be wandering aboot the board.

[Manteca]

OK and one more question that I have about this. I really hate not to get my protein in every 2-3 hours. When I am eating/drinking a complex carb meal what if I included amino acid caps which don't need to be digested. This is following the same reasoning that says it's ok to take simple carbs with protein since they require little to no digestion. Do you guys think that is a good idea?

[Big Cat]

Originally posted by Manteca
Thank you for trying to help but I understood all of that, I want to try and understand, however, the discrepency between what big cat has said and the dozens of sup companies that include complex carbs in their weight gainers.

Because it times and prolongs glycogen recovery as well as promotes insulin related uptake of nutrients in cells. Its not all bad of course. And to achieve this maltodextrin is a perfect source because unlike most complex carbs it doesn't largely interfere with the systemic absorption of protein by hindering digestion.

I tell you to "largely" avoid complex carbs with protein, but of course I'm not saying spaghetti and meatballs will kill you or that putting tuna and eggs between rye is bad. But a lot of people are hung up on too much pasta, eat potatoes every day and have a tendency to take processed products like white flour (white bread) and white rice over the more beneficial originals.

[ROB041]

A great post workout is Dymatize - Recoup (not the bcaa recoup they make). they make a recoup mainly for college football and other sports. Important ingredients- whey protein concentrate, maldextron, sun flower oil

1 scoop- 200 calories 14g sugar 15 g protein
2 scoop 400 28 30

greta for post workout, would not take it anytime else other then possibly breakfast

[rhadam]

Strong 10 year bump.