How Low Cal is TOO Low?

[krissi006]

Hello All. I'm stuck on my diet and cardio routine. I never know whats over training or just being hardcore. I'm willing to put in the work, but I always get told that it's over training. Any suggestions on how much cardio is really needed to get down to the 11% BF range or less? I image I'm about 15% right now.. I don't really get a period anymore. Maybe 4/5 times a year some spotting and not on birth control. I'm 5'4" and 109.4 lbs/ 25 inch waist..size 0-2 jeans?? I dunno if that helps with a mental picture at all.

I JUST want to see my abs for REAL..can you do it with cardio and calorie restriction or am I going to have to do drugs of some sort. I dont plan on going that route so someone please help!

The closest I've gotten was on a double cardio routine:
4 x a week
Cardio 2- 45 min sessions (1- AM/1 - PM) (eliptical)
3 x a week
Weights: Legs: Mondays & Fridays
Weights: Upper: Wednesdays

Now I'm doing: (because I was told I was overtraning)
Cardio 3 x a week
1 - 30 min Interval Session (carb drink before)

Weights 3 x a week
Weights: Legs: Mondays, Fridays
Weights: Upper: Wednesdays

Whats odd is I'm doing LESS of a workout and I feel more tired!

I also increased my calories to 1400 from 1100..perfectly clean diet..
15% fat..the rest is a balance of carbs and protein..depending on my energy levels...

[twinnett]

You are WAY overtraining and not eating nearly enough! You are also underweight. I venture to say that you need to focus more on building muscle if you want to see your abs. Getting and maintaining under 11% BF is not a healthy goal. Competitors are only that low for a short period of time.

[krissi006]

Yeah I hear ya.. It's that FEAR of being soft..you know? It feels so good the days that you wake up and your tummy's tight as a board. It makes it addictive to keep up the "dieting down" routine. So I guess I focus on building my legs up some more and kicking up the metabolism. If I do Legs HARD 2 x a week and one upper body circuit, how many days do you think is good for cardio in between? And should it be LOW intensity 64% MHR or High Intensity Intervals and for how long?

I love hearing everyone's opinion, so thanks in advance. My own idea's get skewed when I look into the mirror on a bad day..!

[ChplHillGymGirl]

hey krissi - there is more to getting your abs to stand out than just calorie reduction and cardio - at your height/weight i'd venture to say you don't have much of a, if at all, "belly." if i were you, i'd focus on building. you have to work your abs and build them to get them in the first place. in addition, having a bf% of 11 for an extended period of time is not healthy for women - we competitors get to that point for short periods of time - it's not something that's maintained. please understand that when you see pics of girls with ripped figures/abs, they most likely do not look like that all the time - a lot of us carry an extra 10-20lbs when we're not cutting, some of us much more.

you're already small from your description. if you want abs, you're going to have to build them and that takes time, patience, and food.

[krissi006]

Yeah, I'll follow your every word with abs like that!
and your my height, I didn't think that was possible.
How many times a week do you train your abs?
Whats your cardio like?
How long does it take you to get ready for "summer" abs.

Any help is GREATLY appreciated. Congrats on your great physique.

[sherdi]

Originally Posted by ChplHillGymGirl

hey krissi - there is more to getting your abs to stand out than just calorie reduction and cardio - at your height/weight i'd venture to say you don't have much of a, if at all, "belly." if i were you, i'd focus on building. you have to work your abs and build them to get them in the first place. in addition, having a bf% of 11 for an extended period of time is not healthy for women - we competitors get to that point for short periods of time - it's not something that's maintained. please understand that when you see pics of girls with ripped figures/abs, they most likely do not look like that all the time - a lot of us carry an extra 10-20lbs when we're not cutting, some of us much more.

you're already small from your description. if you want abs, you're going to have to build them and that takes time, patience, and food.

I totally agree....it's simply not healthy to have an uber low body fat all year round! You need to build your abs and your muscles in your body before you even think about lowering body fat with your weight/size......to have good abs and good muscle definition you need muscles in the first place....so I suggest that you don't think of it in terms of a bf% or weight or anything but how you look, you need to eat more in order to build mass....more than what you burn....I would suggest you increase your calories at about 100 calories per week until you reach a stage where your body stabilises....be aware that you might initially see a large weight increase as you are simply eat far too little and your body is going to fight you initially....once it realises that you are going to feed it properly your weight will settle down and you can concentrate on building the muscle

I am eating at least 2000 calories per day in order to build and I am only a little taller than you!!! Of course, when I diet down, I eat less, but I need to add more mass in order to look decent when I cut down again. If you are really serious about bodybuilding, you will not focus on your weight or the body fat numbers but focus your energy on trying to better yourself in every workout...focus on lifting intensely with compound movements and go easy on the cardio (you could just incorporate some 1 session that is less intense such as walking) and make sure you have 1 day off completely where you don't do any exercise (2 x per week is better).

Good luck!

[shazbanger]

u can tell from your body.....
Like belly hurting, lack of energy, cravings.....just go by what your body says. And of course if u have a low bod fat % the body don't have any fat left to burn so it starts dipping into the muscle has energy.

[sungoddesskatie]

I agree that getting down to 11% body fat for an extended amount of time is NOT healthy for women. You still seem to be overtraining, and considering your diet of 1100 cals per day, your metabolism has most likely shut down into starvation mode. The human body needs 1200 cals daily to sustain VITAL functions at optimal level. Meaning, if you were in a coma you would need to ingest 1200 calories just to breathe, maintain a healthy body temperature, and keep your heart beating at a normal weight.

If you increase your calories and get your metabolism going again- you may very well see definition in your abs sooner than you think.

[ChplHillGymGirl]

Originally Posted by sherdi

I totally agree....it's simply not healthy to have an uber low body fat all year round! You need to build your abs and your muscles in your body before you even think about lowering body fat with your weight/size......to have good abs and good muscle definition you need muscles in the first place....so I suggest that you don't think of it in terms of a bf% or weight or anything but how you look, you need to eat more in order to build mass....more than what you burn....I would suggest you increase your calories at about 100 calories per week until you reach a stage where your body stabilises....be aware that you might initially see a large weight increase as you are simply eat far too little and your body is going to fight you initially....once it realises that you are going to feed it properly your weight will settle down and you can concentrate on building the muscle

I am eating at least 2000 calories per day in order to build and I am only a little taller than you!!! Of course, when I diet down, I eat less, but I need to add more mass in order to look decent when I cut down again. If you are really serious about bodybuilding, you will not focus on your weight or the body fat numbers but focus your energy on trying to better yourself in every workout...focus on lifting intensely with compound movements and go easy on the cardio (you could just incorporate some 1 session that is less intense such as walking) and make sure you have 1 day off completely where you don't do any exercise (2 x per week is better).

Good luck!

reps on recharge for this one! Sherdi is 100% correct - do not focus on the numbers. i know that's easier said than done, esp. for women, but what's more important is focusing on how your body feels in response to changes in your diet and exercise routine.

Originally Posted by krissi006

Yeah, I'll follow your every word with abs like that!
and your my height, I didn't think that was possible.
How many times a week do you train your abs?
Whats your cardio like?
How long does it take you to get ready for "summer" abs.

Any help is GREATLY appreciated. Congrats on your great physique.

thanks i train abs approx. 5 days per week - cardio is of moderate to high intensity and is done depending on how many carbs i've eaten on a particular day - for the abs in my avatar it took 6-8 weeks of extreme cardio and exercise and diet...but it's taken years to build them, so just keep that in mind.

[krissi006]

Originally Posted by ChplHillGymGirl

reps on recharge for this one! Sherdi is 100% correct - do not focus on the numbers. i know that's easier said than done, esp. for women, but what's more important is focusing on how your body feels in response to changes in your diet and exercise routine.



thanks i train abs approx. 5 days per week - cardio is of moderate to high intensity and is done depending on how many carbs i've eaten on a particular day - for the abs in my avatar it took 6-8 weeks of extreme cardio and exercise and diet...but it's taken years to build them, so just keep that in mind.

Thanks for the help everyone...! Hard to increase calories in summertime in Florida, but Hopefully that will infact fire my metabolism back up.
I eat so darn clean anyway, so should feel guilty increasing my egg white, spinach and protein shake consuption right? Ok well you've all motivated me I'm off to train.

[girl81]

Where in FL?

[krissi006]

South Florida..
I finally hired a trainer.. And yes he told me to eat more.
So now I'm eating like 1500-1700 cals a day, or pretty much whenever I'm hungry. I eat so darn healthy anyway, If I get fat from steamed broccoli, egg whites or oats, God help me then! lol

I'll keep you all posted. I'm trying to get the nerve to post pictures. But I allways feel weird about doing that on the internet. Maybe a headless shot huh?

My man and I are both training together now with a trainer so this is going to get competitive!

[lollerskatez]

you need to eat more because of the amount of exercise you are doing. because you are exercising a lot, your metabolism is revving and burning super fast. if you dont eat enough, your body will go into shock and hold onto your fat, thus hindering what your ultimate goal is. i am looking to maintain my weight and lower BF through diet moderation. good luck =)

[Jordyn]

Originally Posted by krissi006

I don't really get a period anymore. Maybe 4/5 times a year some spotting and not on birth control. I'm 5'4" and 109.4 lbs/ 25 inch waist..size 0-2 jeans?? I dunno if that helps with a mental picture at all.

I JUST want to see my abs for REAL..can you do it with cardio and calorie restriction or am I going to have to do drugs of some sort. I dont plan on going that route so someone please help!

youre at a REALLY good size already, in my opinion. i'd say thats an ideal size, for me at least.

its not good that youre not getting your period

dont do drugs...were u thinking of illegal ones or plain ol' supplements like fat burners/appetite suppressants?

other than that im not sure what would get the abs to show. less than 2 yrs ago i was barely 100 lbs and i still didnt have much abs. maybe its genetics of where i deposit fat

good luck

[calendar]

Originally Posted by sungoddesskatie

I agree that getting down to 11% body fat for an extended amount of time is NOT healthy for women.

I agree with this. If OP is not getting her period regularly, the BF is too low.

The human body needs 1200 cals daily to sustain VITAL functions at optimal level. Meaning, if you were in a coma you would need to ingest 1200 calories just to breathe, maintain a healthy body temperature, and keep your heart beating at a normal weight.

Disagree with this. Okinawan centenarian women average around 1022 kcal/day. They make it to 100 or more. (ref Sukuzki et. al, Asia Pacific J Clin Nutr 2001) Nutrient-rich calorie sparse diets tend to extend lifespan.

[breathingsky]

Originally Posted by calendar

Disagree with this. Okinawan centenarian women average around 1022 kcal/day. They make it to 100 or more. (ref Sukuzki et. al, Asia Pacific J Clin Nutr 2001) Nutrient-rich calorie sparse diets tend to extend lifespan.

^^

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/31/he...cef480&ei=5070

Actually, my boyfriend and I have been talking about this a lot lately. Not sure how this works when you incorporate moderate to heavy exercise though. I don't think these people go to the gym 5 x per week...

To the OP: I agree with everyone that you probably need to eat more and work on building your abdominal muscles to make them more defined.

[hotterthan]

Originally Posted by sungoddesskatie

I agree that getting down to 11% body fat for an extended amount of time is NOT healthy for women. You still seem to be overtraining, and considering your diet of 1100 cals per day, your metabolism has most likely shut down into starvation mode. The human body needs 1200 cals daily to sustain VITAL functions at optimal level. Meaning, if you were in a coma you would need to ingest 1200 calories just to breathe, maintain a healthy body temperature, and keep your heart beating at a normal weight.

If you increase your calories and get your metabolism going again- you may very well see definition in your abs sooner than you think.

Katie this is off the subject and I am new to this muscle building thing (I was all about low cal and cardio until I couldnt keep weight off) but I have the same stats as you and I went to a weightloss clinic and they said if I want to have a 18 percent body fat I would have to weigh anywhere from 115-119, my goal used to be 107 because when I was 20 years old I weighed 100 and was a size 0, but I guess from all the compound exercises Ive been doing i have built up a lot of muscle I am currently 149 and my body fat is 32% and 5'3 but they said if I keep up my workouts and 6 meals a day than I could still be a size 0 at 119lbs. Tell me what you think!

BTW I am 22 also

[lorabeann]

That post is kind of hard to understand. Could you punctuate it?

[hotterthan]

Sorry!! I had a few drinks when I typed the message!!

This message is for Kate. I have the same stats as you, (height, weight etc.) I noticed you said your goal weight is 107 and to have a body percent fat of 18%. I went to a weightloss clinic and they said if I want to have a body fat of 18 percent and be a size 0, I would have to weigh anywhere from 115-119, my goal used to be 107 because when I was 20 years old I weighed 100lbs and was a size 0 (and only did cardio and didnt lift weights period), but I guess from all the compound weight lifting exercises Ive been doing Ihave built up a lot of muscle. I am currently 149lbs and my body fat is 32%, 5'3 but my nutritionist said if I keep up my workouts and eat 6 meals a day than I could still be a size 0 at 119lbs. I do not see how this is possible.

BTW I am 22 also and just moved to South Florida!