Back and biceps on the same day?

[jens]

Hi!

I got this schedule from a good book about bodybuilding.
They say that you can follow this and not get overtrained, sounds good. :-)

Day 1: Back 14set
Biceps 12set
Abs 8set max

Day 2: Chest 12set
Triceps 12set

Day 3: REST

Day 4: Legs 10set
Calves 6set
Abs 8set max

Day 5: Shoulders 11set
Hamstrings 4set
Glutes 4set
Pushups 150-200 reps x1 -Added
Dips (triceps) -Added

Day 6: REST

Then you start over.
If one does 14sets of back work, then do biceps, isn´t this too much at once. I mean, won´t this be extremely demanding on the biceps by doing 14 sets (!) of back work, then 12 sets of biceps work.

Would it be better if I switched the biceps to day 4 (look above)
and Calves to day 1?
This way the biceps wont get so extremely killed on the monday and then not for the rest of the week.
TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK!
What would you do?

Also, I have very poor calves. Will 6 sets per week, once a week be beneficial? I believe I have to add at lest another day with calves to see any difference in my most stubborn muscles, the calves.
I have very poor triceps as well ,that´s why I added the triceps dips on Day 5 as well.

// Jens

[Lee_5]

thats too many sets.

as a guidline:

10sets for chest, back,
6 for shoulders
6 for bis and tris
quads 4, hams 4, calves 3.


12 sets of biceps . Thats crazy. That book is not good.


and remove the pushups. they wont do anything for growth.

You could actually put shoulders and legs toegther. This will give you more rest days.

[LiL USMC BBer]

why are you training your hamstrings and glutes one day after your legs???

Also 12 sets for biceps and tirceps? I wouldn't even give them that many sets if they had there own day!! But let alone the same day? 4 sets tops!

[Frenkpie]

try to buy a new book....

[LiL USMC BBer]

~>Just starting into the world of fitness?

Been bodybuilding for a while but always find yourself stagnating and having trouble overcoming obstacles in this sport?

If so, then Bodybuilding Made Simple may be for you. http://www.ironpumping.com

[jens]

Hi!

Four sets of biceps work! No way!
Way too little if you´re training them once per week!

I don´t know about you guys, but I have trained in Kung-Fu class for almost a year, and built up a lot of endurance, doing 4 sets is not sufficient for me. I definetely don´t feel exhausted after only four sets.

I don´t think this book is bad, it is based upon the advices and statements from many bodybuilders.
Why is twelve sets bad? Why is four better than twelve?
The muscle will have and entire week to recover from the the workout, so I don´t think twelve sets are too much.

Why are push-ups so bad?
Everybody is totally rejecting them. They are so basic.
I can´t do 80 in a row, so I still feel that I need to get better at them. When I started training, last autumn, I basically did only push-ups, and I grew very wide very fast.
Maybe they don´t build very much mass, if any at all anymore, but they are still good for something.
Remember, I haven´t been training for a year yet, so I am far from the rest of you guys.

And, how do you know that 4-6 sets of work is optimal?

Plese note that I am NOT TRYING TO BE RUDE OR ANYTHING, I am just interested in LEARNING MORE, that´s why I am making counter-questions!

Thanks for great replies, this is a good place to learn and gather information!

// Jens

[LiL USMC BBer]

have you considered putting your biceps immediatly after back and triceps immediatly after chest?

If you can pump out 12 sets after a back work out or chest work out.. then maybe you need to increase the intensity of your lifts.

If this doesn't cuase growth.. then can you explain to me why I started off with like 10.5" arms and now have almost 14"?

[Not So Big]

Originally posted by ReSpAwN DeMoN
~>Just starting into the world of fitness?

Been bodybuilding for a while but always find yourself stagnating and having trouble overcoming obstacles in this sport?

If so, then Bodybuilding Made Simple may be for you. http://www.ironpumping.com

u really do love him dont u?

anyway, that book seems like it doesnt kno what its talkin about, whats it called?

[jens]

Hi!

The book is called "Bodybuilding ABC", and it is a well respected and successful book in Sweden.

I can´t explain why your arms have grown four inches.
Maybe you eat enough and I don´t.
Maybe you´ve found the ideal number of sets and reps for you.
I don´t know.

All I know is that my arms are 11 inches small and I need bigger arms!

My shoulders and chest have developed quite well, my arms haven´t.
I did the typical mistake of ignoring my triceps when I started, I mostly did only biceps. Bad!
My biceps have grown, because I neglected my triceps, my arms are poor. So I am working hard on those triceps now.
I think this will add some volume to my arms.

Why would 14 sets of back work be too much.
I mean, I split the sets of 5 exercises:
Front latpulldown (to chest)
Close latpulldown
Seated rows
T-bar rows
Behind the neck latpulldowns

// Jens

[akaMarko]

Originally posted by jens
Hi!

Four sets of biceps work! No way!
Way too little if you´re training them once per week!

I don´t know about you guys, but I have trained in Kung-Fu class for almost a year, and built up a lot of endurance, doing 4 sets is not sufficient for me. I definetely don´t feel exhausted after only four sets.

I don´t think this book is bad, it is based upon the advices and statements from many bodybuilders.
Why is twelve sets bad? Why is four better than twelve?
The muscle will have and entire week to recover from the the workout, so I don´t think twelve sets are too much.

Why are push-ups so bad?
Everybody is totally rejecting them. They are so basic.
I can´t do 80 in a row, so I still feel that I need to get better at them. When I started training, last autumn, I basically did only push-ups, and I grew very wide very fast.
Maybe they don´t build very much mass, if any at all anymore, but they are still good for something.
Remember, I haven´t been training for a year yet, so I am far from the rest of you guys.

And, how do you know that 4-6 sets of work is optimal?

Plese note that I am NOT TRYING TO BE RUDE OR ANYTHING, I am just interested in LEARNING MORE, that´s why I am making counter-questions!

Thanks for great replies, this is a good place to learn and gather information!

// Jens

I hope that this will be taken as another great reply.

You are obviously training for endurance by the info that you have posted. "trying to do 80 pushups in a row" or "not feeling exhausted after 4 sets of curl". You must understand that this is a bodybuilding forum and 99% of us aren't interested in spending hours in the gym training for endurance. We want to lift heavier for shorter time periods followed by lots of rest and eating so that we can grow. In Bodybuilding training, more lifting is not better, in fact it can be counter-productive.


Just my 2 cents.

[jens]

Hi!

I am not looking for more endurance either.
I want to gain as much mass as possible!

But if I do 12 sets of biceps work a week, and split these sets out over four different exercises, won´t this be good?

FUNDAMENTAL QUESTION: Does the body work this way when building mass ? - Say that I do 8 sets of biceps work, this causes microtrauma in the muscles, the muscles gets damaged.
Now they need to be repared. The body then uses the energy we get from foods to build up these muscles again.
But the body needs more than "just enough", it needs more calories then we spend on a day to be able to build up the muscles and make them a bit larger. Right?
This is why we need to eat so much.

Please, correct me on this.

Another thing: Is it also true that it is almost impossible to get fat when eating over your maintenance level if you´re training very hard? I mean, the body will need all the energy it gets to build muscle, right?

I will have to start calculating how much I eat every day.
I think this is what´s stopping me from getting huge.
I calculated my breakfast earlier, and I noticed that it was "smaller" than I tought. Only around 400-450 kcal.
I need to get more calories!

// Jens

[Younglifter14]

Originally posted by jens
Hi!

I am not looking for more endurance either.
I want to gain as much mass as possible!

But if I do 12 sets of biceps work a week, and split these sets out over four different exercises, won´t this be good?

FUNDAMENTAL QUESTION: Does the body work this way when building mass ? - Say that I do 8 sets of biceps work, this causes microtrauma in the muscles, the muscles gets damaged.
Now they need to be repared. The body then uses the energy we get from foods to build up these muscles again.
But the body needs more than "just enough", it needs more calories then we spend on a day to be able to build up the muscles and make them a bit larger. Right?
This is why we need to eat so much.

Please, correct me on this.

Another thing: Is it also true that it is almost impossible to get fat when eating over your maintenance level if you´re training very hard? I mean, the body will need all the energy it gets to build muscle, right?

I will have to start calculating how much I eat every day.
I think this is what´s stopping me from getting huge.
I calculated my breakfast earlier, and I noticed that it was "smaller" than I tought. Only around 400-450 kcal.
I need to get more calories!

// Jens

yes, you need to eat more to gain, and fat gain comes with eating alot, although it can be minimized

glad you picked up a few things from HST

Young

[jens]

Hi!

I calculated my average food intake last night.
I found out that I usually consume around 2600-2700 Kcal per day.
I think I need to add at lest 300-400 Kcal to this, what do you think?
I am 6 feet and 160 pounds.
Any tips on getting extra 300-400 Kcal per day?
Maybe another protein shake?
And some more food....

// Jens