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  1. #1
    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Shoulder Dislocation, recovery, and surgery

    Sorry for double posting, but here is the thread i posted in the MMA forum:

    Hello, haven't posted here in a long time, but i thought this would be a good place to ask about this. I've been training MMA for about a year and dislocated my shoulder about a 3 weeks ago, and again about 2 weeks ago, the second time due to an unfortunate accident, whereas this first time occoured when i got taken down and landed awkwardly and posted with my left arm dislocating my left shoulder. Basically i saw a doctor and am getting an mri before seeing a surgeon, but i was wondering if anyone here had any experience with this, and how they turned out? How long was the recovery? Unfortunately, it sounds like i need surgery to tighten the ligaments up. Currently my arm feels fine and i am in no pain whatsoever. Range of motion is almost normal as well, however my arm feels somewhat unstable (possibly mental) and i am told it will go out again if i am not careful.

    I would like to add that i feel really well currently. There is no pain whatsoever in the join, merely a limeted rang of motion, along with tightness in the joint. Hopefully the MRI will turn out well. Recovery for this sort of injury looks like anywhere from 2-8 months, hopefully i will be ready in less than 3. To be honest i would continue and train if i didnt know better due to the fact that i feel fine, even the sports medicine doctor was baffeled that i showed no pain when being examined. The only problem is that i have done so twice, and even though i was in no pain 2 days after the second dislocation it appears that my ligaments have streatched and are not going to hold the humerus (sp?) in the socket well. I am also looking into Prolotherapy if anyone knows about that.

    Thanks for the help!
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    Registered User ralph86's Avatar
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    I had the exact same thing as you, Full strength in my shoulder, but mine would come out very often (from contact hockey). But a few days rest and my shoulder felt fine again. Let me save you some time and suggest you get surgery, because it is the only thing that will get your shoulder feeling normal again.
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Thanks, thats what i was told by the sports medicine doctor. I dont see any way around it. Hopefully the recovery will be reasonable.
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    Took me about 2 months before most of the pain went away. In the meantime, my middle deltoid was numb also, couldn't feel a thing. The day that I saw an orthopedic surgeon (about 4 days after it happened, it was on a Thursday before a holiday weekend) he told me that I could still go to the gym and work out, but to take it easy. However, it hurt basically all the time so I didn't go at all. I tried going back to the gym after 6 weeks (he said no "agility activities" for 2 months), and it hurt too bad so I stopped. I waited two more weeks, and then slowly eased back into my routine. It took me about 4 months total to pick up where I left off. My shoulder still isn't 100%, and I know it never will be without surgery. I'd guesstimate it's about 90-95%. Every now and then it'll hurt and/or feel loose if happen to fall asleep on my left side or my arm gets jerked or pulled suddenly for whatever reason. However, it hasn't completely dislocated again and it's been almost a year.
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Just an update, this is a duplicate from the MMA section of this forum.

    I got the MRI and Anthrogram back today, and it shows a significant tear in the labrum, so i am getting surgery. I meet the Orthopedic Surgeon next tuesday to schedule surgery. Recovery is projected at 6 weeks sling, plus 2-5 months of rehabilitation.

    I purchased some Oratropin after doing a lot of research on LR3 IGF-1 on the AM forum. Several of the people there have used it to rehabilitalte from major surgery but injecting 40 mcg ED or EOD into the injured area, with the first dose starting within 2 hours after the surgery is complete. One person recoverd from an extremely serious non acl knee injury about 4-6 times faster than the projected rate. The reason i chose Oratropin other than the legality issue is that some people claim that despite being inferior to the injectable igf-1 for gains, it may very well be superior for injury recovery. I am also interested in combining it with Hexatropin or Hexarelin.


    I'm also taking Animal Flex, Flax Seed Oil, and a few other supplements. Lifting is strictly lower body and abs, nothing that could aggravate the tear. I am doing joggind and stairmaster for cardio. No MMA training at all right now.


    Thoughts? Advice?

    once again sorry for the duplicate thread in the MMA forum.
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    Registered User skrypt's Avatar
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    I had a very serious tear in my Labrum and had to get surgery to fix it. It is not a fun experience. With a four to six month recovery time, you'll be able to start jogging again around four monthes. Lifting hard is pretty much out of the question until six monthes. It really sucks, but my best advice is to stay patient, do your rehab somewhere(at least three times a week), and don't try to come back too fast. I'm almost at six monthes post surgery now and can see the light at the end of the tunnel, but it's honestly not worth the risk to try and push this type of injury; it would be a mistake. So to reiterate, make sure you hit therapy hard, listen to your Doctors, and keep your eyes downroad on your bigger goal, it's not worth the risk to push this. If you have any specific question feel free to PM me or post them here. I hope I can be of some help.
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    ΛΦΕ AphtaLyfe's Avatar
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    I had an anterior tear of my labrum. I am currently at almost exactly 2 months post op.

    I have little to no pain in my shoulder. The only pain I get is when I go too far beyond my slightly limited range of motion.

    I can do pushups with no problem.

    My range of motion is actually pretty good. 2 weeks ago I was at about 75% range of motion, and now I'm at about 85%. I expect to have full range of motion by the middle of July. (3 months post op)

    I hurt my shoulder also doing MMA, but mine was breaking a lock while in guard.

    I have recovered far faster than average and my surgeon says I can return to MMA mid August, but I think I will opt to wait until Sept.

    He said I can even start lifting again. Starting with low weight high reps and reducing the reps and increasing the weight slowly.

    My physical therapist gave a slightly more conservative estimate but still thinks that I will be good to go by mid Sept for MMA.

    My tear was from about 1o'clock position to the 6o'clock position. I did not damage the biceps tendon nor did I need to have capsular shrinkage or shift. (Ligaments were all ok)

    For a SLAP tear, the recovery is much longer.

    I also took some supplements during my recovery time: MSM, Glucosamine, Chondroitin, Fish Oil, Multi-Vitamin

    -Good Luck
    Last edited by AphtaLyfe; 06-14-2007 at 12:50 PM.
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    typing w 1 hand, sorry for grammar

    tear was worse than anticipated. today the doc repaired bankhart lesion and slap tear. he says he wad able o repair both perfectly. took first dose ora 3-4 hours post surgery (earliest possible) on a very dry mouth. i let it sit in my right cheek for 10 min. will take gaba tonight. i plan on using oratropin ed for first week then eod for next 2, both morning on empty stomach. i am also using universal animal flex, flax, multi. its tough to tell if ora is working because i have a headache anyways. did i use it correctly? advice? thanks?
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  9. #9
    ΛΦΕ AphtaLyfe's Avatar
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    No idea about those drugs you're taking...

    The time of recovery is long because cartilage heals very slowly (especially in the shoulder since the labrum is not very vascular)... Are those drugs you're taking condusive to cartilage repair?

    -Good Luck
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    No idea about those drugs you're taking...

    The time of recovery is long because cartilage heals very slowly (especially in the shoulder since the labrum is not very vascular)... Are those drugs you're taking condusive to cartilage repair?

    -Good Luck
    yes, the anabolicminds forum explains it well, there are threads about the use of igf-1 to increase the rate of recovery from an injury (surgery in this case) by 300-600%. The labrum is deep in the shoulder, so injectible igf-1 lr3 may not reach it well, hence why i felt oratropin would help it more. i did a lot of research and communication with reputable membrs about this. some have had incredible results with it.
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    i will also pm or upload the photos from the arthroscope for those interested
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    ΛΦΕ AphtaLyfe's Avatar
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    K, I'm sure you did your homework...

    The normal heal time is 4 months before return to contact sports.

    So if does heal 300-600% faster that would mean that you should be able to return to contact sports in about 3-6 weeks...

    Which doesn't seem right... even bone takes 4-8 weeks to heal... and its fairly vascular.

    Let me know how it goes though...

    -Good Luck
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    K, I'm sure you did your homework...

    The normal heal time is 4 months before return to contact sports.

    So if does heal 300-600% faster that would mean that you should be able to return to contact sports in about 3-6 weeks...

    Which doesn't seem right... even bone takes 4-8 weeks to heal... and its fairly vascular.

    Let me know how it goes though...

    -Good Luck
    If used correctly it will accelerate the healing process. I turned out to be in pretty bad shape, slaop tear didnt show up on the arthrogram, but the doc thinks i nat still be able to do mma if i choose to. like i said igf-1 does help with healing a lot, if you are interested give me a pm and i will link you to a lot of good stuff
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Day 8:

    Took it out of the sling and move it around. ROM is actually pretty high at 70% normal. Pain is very low as well, mild soreness, when i raise it above my head and try to rotate it as if i were going to work my rotator cuff. I would say that the Oratropin is without a doubt helping the healing. I feel ready to start pt and ditch the sling, something people usually do at 4-6 weeks post op.

    Ora should last 12 more days. I'm gonna take 2-3 weeks off and use igf-1 again, unless that is too early? From the research i've done and people i have talked to this sounds right. Next time for price reasons i may use an injectible form, and am looking at 3 or 4 different sites for the best price.

    General rehab for a Slap tear and Bankhart lesion is 4-6 months, and I am shooting for 8-10 weeks, although I wont push it if it's not ready,

    Too bad Ora isn't cheaper, it has done wonders for me in the 1st week. This is defintely not placebo, there is no way that someone coming off surgery on an extremely bad tear of the Labrum recover this much ROM and have this little pain 8 days post op without the aid something to accelerate healing,
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    ΛΦΕ AphtaLyfe's Avatar
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    I'm already almost fully recovered at about 12 weeks. So no need for the drugs!

    Good luck with the healing tho... Let me know how PT goes... I thought I was doing ok too till I started PT and realized my ROM was lower than I had previously thought.
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    I'm already almost fully recovered at about 12 weeks. So no need for the drugs!

    Good luck with the healing tho... Let me know how PT goes... I thought I was doing ok too till I started PT and realized my ROM was lower than I had previously thought.

    Yea i am afraid of that. I am healing well but i have a ways to go. Just curious, how did you feel after 8-14 days post op? I want a basis for comparison. Thanks.
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    after 14 days I was changed from a immobilizing sling to a regular over the shoulder hanging sling.

    I could bring my arm up pretty far but my surgeon told me not to do that.
    It was around this time that I could sleep without much pain at night anymore, but occationally I would wake up in pain and have to take some meds.

    Be very careful... the damaged muscle heals quickly... its the labrum that has trouble healing correctly/fully. The labrum also does not have as many nerves on it... so if you hurt the labrum you probably won't notice till 3-4 months down the line.

    I really didn't have much pain after about 14 days... it was when I started physical therapy that I got most of the pain. Stretching sucks.

    -Good Luck
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    Registered User highpower1111's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    after 14 days I was changed from a immobilizing sling to a regular over the shoulder hanging sling.

    I could bring my arm up pretty far but my surgeon told me not to do that.
    It was around this time that I could sleep without much pain at night anymore, but occationally I would wake up in pain and have to take some meds.

    Be very careful... the damaged muscle heals quickly... its the labrum that has trouble healing correctly/fully. The labrum also does not have as many nerves on it... so if you hurt the labrum you probably won't notice till 3-4 months down the line.

    I really didn't have much pain after about 14 days... it was when I started physical therapy that I got most of the pain. Stretching sucks.



    -Good Luck
    how easy is it to mess up? i have taken it out a few times and moved it around with no pain, didn't go overhead or lift anything. is that ok? i'll make sure i leave it in from now on
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    Well its not terribly easy to mess up; Typically after surgery your surgeon will pull, yank, jerk your arm in all sorts of directions trying to pull out the pins he just put in... to make sure the pins are strong enough and the sutures aren't loose.

    I'm more paranoid about these types of things tho... I can't count how many times I thought I messed something up but really it was fine.

    Talk to your surgeon about what you can and can't do... I always brought a list of things to ask my surgeon at every followup haha.

    -Good Luck
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    Well its not terribly easy to mess up; Typically after surgery your surgeon will pull, yank, jerk your arm in all sorts of directions trying to pull out the pins he just put in... to make sure the pins are strong enough and the sutures aren't loose.

    I'm more paranoid about these types of things tho... I can't count how many times I thought I messed something up but really it was fine.

    Talk to your surgeon about what you can and can't do... I always brought a list of things to ask my surgeon at every followup haha.

    -Good Luck
    Haha thats how I am. I notice every detail about my body concerning injuries or changes. I actually had to beg my first doctor to send me to an Orthopaedic Surgeon and get an MRI because he was convinced that my shoulder was fine and didnt need PT much less an MRI, after the test came back he apologized a bunch, i guess i got lucky.
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    Day 26:

    Took off the sling today. Also had first day of PT. The PT said it is healing correctly and everything looks great. Started passive streatching 2x ED, and am going to start strenghtening in 2 weeks. Pain is still almost non existant. ROM is as expected, significantly decreased. The most impressive part part about today was that the PT commented that there was very little atrophy on the operated arm. This could be due to the IGF-1.

    In a few days i will start pinning 40-50 mcg EOD into the shoulder. If anyone is curious check out the AM forum and there are a lot of threads on IGF-1's ability to heal connective tissue.

    Everything so far is good, they think they can get me to 100% by the end of week 12, so 8 weeks from now. Considering the magnitude of the tear (from 6 to 12 o' clock) this would be a pretty good accomplishment.
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    I had an identical tear to yours... and after 12 weeks I was able to hit the gym pretty hard again. With little or no pain.

    Clearly your injections did not allow you to recover THAT much faster than normal.

    The 300-600% increased rate of recovery is a gross exaggeration.

    Good to hear that the atrophy is limited, mine wasn't too bad... the atrophy for me was also from not using it prior to surgery too.

    I was released from physical therapy right before the 12 week mark and my surgeon OK'd it too.
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    I had an identical tear to yours... and after 12 weeks I was able to hit the gym pretty hard again. With little or no pain.

    Clearly your injections did not allow you to recover THAT much faster than normal.

    The 300-600% increased rate of recovery is a gross exaggeration.

    Good to hear that the atrophy is limited, mine wasn't too bad... the atrophy for me was also from not using it prior to surgery too.

    I was released from physical therapy right before the 12 week mark and my surgeon OK'd it too.
    I think the injections would have helped to perhaps 200%. I used Oratropin which is controversal. The problem with the Labrum is the access to the area IMO. To be honest i think i could have been out of the sling ni 2 weeks, but i played it safe. You are right about the 3-6x, althoughy some people i have talked to have sped up their recovery that much. They were however using it for different injuries.
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    Originally Posted by highpower1111 View Post
    I think the injections would have helped to perhaps 200%. I used Oratropin which is controversal. The problem with the Labrum is the access to the area IMO. To be honest i think i could have been out of the sling ni 2 weeks, but i played it safe. You are right about the 3-6x, althoughy some people i have talked to have sped up their recovery that much. They were however using it for different injuries.
    even 200% seems unlikely.

    I took nothing out of the ordinary... and I recovered in 12 weeks.

    The only benefit I see from taking what you took is the prevention of muscle atrophy. Which is a good thing don't get me wrong.

    Happy to see you're recovering right on schedule though. =p
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    even 200% seems unlikely.

    I took nothing out of the ordinary... and I recovered in 12 weeks.

    The only benefit I see from taking what you took is the prevention of muscle atrophy. Which is a good thing don't get me wrong.

    Happy to see you're recovering right on schedule though. =p
    Thanks. There are a lot of factors that etermine someone's recovery. I think one of the biggest one's is the skill of the surgeon. Your's must have been really good as well. 12 weeks is a very fast recovery for this, in fact I haven't seen someone recover faster. Age also has a lot to do with it as well. I'm still in my prime for that.

    PT sucks by the way, the at home passive streatches kind of hurt.

    There really is not any discussion about IGF-1 and healing here, but there is a lot at the AM forum. There is a thread by a guy called "IGF-1 story, shocking" or something like that where a guy recovered in like a third of the time from a terrible knee injury that was supposed to have him out for something like 14 months. There are also threads about people using it to recover from tendon problems. I think even Patrick Arnold gives it credit for being able to heal connective tissue.

    There are things about this surgery that I imagine it would be difficult to speed the recovery in, such as the restoration of ROM. It should help in the initial stage by causing the labrum to reattach quicker. It does not help with ligaments though, I think you need HGH for that.

    Still, either way my recovery is going well. I hope i can return to MMA by the first of October. Good luck with yours as well, I'm interested to see how the grappling goes especially. I'm going to freak out whenever someone gets a keylock of kimura on me, even if it's not. I also am interested to see how throwing punches goes, because it seems like throwing a hard shot like an overhand right (or left) with the bad arm could tear the labrum again.
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    I'm like 14-15 weeks out and I did some casual boxing a couple weeks ago... no problem really.

    Grappling however I'm still a little timid about... especially since I've been lifting shoulders again... I don't want to tire them out and then subject them to odd angles and pressures.

    Yea stretching really sucks... just wait till your PT starts stretching it for you... now that blows big time!
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    Originally Posted by AphtaLyfe View Post
    I'm like 14-15 weeks out and I did some casual boxing a couple weeks ago... no problem really.

    Grappling however I'm still a little timid about... especially since I've been lifting shoulders again... I don't want to tire them out and then subject them to odd angles and pressures.

    i think what happened to me the other day is proof that throwning punchs and sudden blows are a lot worse than grappling...

    i was grappling in my mma class my class mate got my bad shoulder in a kamura for a whole minute...wrenched down on that sucker hard and i finnaly got out of it....then we both fell back as we stood up and that same arm doslocated for the 3rd time im 15 years...luckly it popped back in. I tried to catch my weight with my arm instead of slapping out or just falling on my back.
    hard lesson for me.
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    Unhappy shoulder dislocated .!

    doc told me to take 3 weeks rest... nd afta dat .. strt of wid wrkout... on vry lite weights ... !

    wat u think guyz ?
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    vist shoulder surgeon

    Originally Posted by highpower1111 View Post
    Sorry for double posting, but here is the thread i posted in the MMA forum:

    Hello, haven't posted here in a long time, but i thought this would be a good place to ask about this. I've been training MMA for about a year and dislocated my shoulder about a 3 weeks ago, and again about 2 weeks ago, the second time due to an unfortunate accident, whereas this first time occoured when i got taken down and landed awkwardly and posted with my left arm dislocating my left shoulder. Basically i saw a doctor and am getting an mri before seeing a surgeon, but i was wondering if anyone here had any experience with this, and how they turned out? How long was the recovery? Unfortunately, it sounds like i need surgery to tighten the ligaments up. Currently my arm feels fine and i am in no pain whatsoever. Range of motion is almost normal as well, however my arm feels somewhat unstable (possibly mental) and i am told it will go out again if i am not careful.

    I would like to add that i feel really well currently. There is no pain whatsoever in the join, merely a limeted rang of motion, along with tightness in the joint. Hopefully the MRI will turn out well. Recovery for this sort of injury looks like anywhere from 2-8 months, hopefully i will be ready in less than 3. To be honest i would continue and train if i didnt know better due to the fact that i feel fine, even the sports medicine doctor was baffeled that i showed no pain when being examined. The only problem is that i have done so twice, and even though i was in no pain 2 days after the second dislocation it appears that my ligaments have streatched and are not going to hold the humerus (sp?) in the socket well. I am also looking into Prolotherapy if anyone knows about that.

    Thanks for the help!
    Dear

    please see any shoulder surgeon urgently as this may be serious.
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