Carb-up Question

[ballplaya4237]

Only done carb-ups once or twice. I just began an intermittent fasting protocol and would like to give carb-ups another try. My normal regimine consists of weightlifting Tue, Thur, Sat. That's it. Just wondering about two things.

1) When should I carb-up?
2) When should my next workout day be?

[ironstrife]

Should start immediately after your last workout... how long is your carb-up going to be?

[ballplaya4237]

1 day. I planned on doing it post-workout on Saturday. Just wanted to make sure.

The second question I have no idea about. Should I workout Sunday instead of Tuesday? Just looking for the ideal time to improve my lifts.

[Makaveli077]

you could do a 5 /2 day cycle . If u really want to cut just make it 1 day but i ussally do a 1.5 day carb up. I start on friday after work (about 4) till bedtime then all day saturday then have my cheesy eggs sunday morning. Or i also do a saturday sunday split. Toward the end of the week, use heavy loads still (none of that marathon Dan Duchaine glycogen depletion) as this is fine when your stores are lower.

It's all so relative and individual that you get to have fun and really learn yourself. As long as the CHO is kept in the acceptable range, and the load's aren't made too short or too long (12 being low end, @40 or so being high end) then all is good.

[ballplaya4237]

Alright, but where does that leave my first workout for the next week? I would do the 2 day thing except I'm doing the intermittent fasting deal. Makes that tough.

If I carb-up Saturday, eating the large majority of my calories post-workout, would my workout Monday still be affected positivly? Or would the whole deal be moot if I don't workout Sunday?

[ironstrife]

Sunday or Monday wouldn't really matter... If you're going to lift on Monday.. I'd throw in some low intensity cardio on Sunday...

[jaim91]

Alright, but where does that leave my first workout for the next week? I would do the 2 day thing except I'm doing the intermittent fasting deal. Makes that tough.

If I carb-up Saturday, eating the large majority of my calories post-workout, would my workout Monday still be affected positivly? Or would the whole deal be moot if I don't workout Sunday?

What is intermittent fasting and why are you diong it?

[ballplaya4237]

Here's a thread with actual results and information.

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ad.php?t=19399

It's intresting to me. I did varied forms of it on a cut however this is a bit more intense.

[jaim91]

Here's a thread with actual results and information.

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ad.php?t=19399

It's intresting to me. I did varied forms of it on a cut however this is a bit more intense.

what are you doing now that's different?

[ballplaya4237]

what are you doing now that's different?

Before: Random fasting. Skip lunch eat larger dinner. Variations such as that.

Now: Eating last meal at eight - ten. Breaking fast approx. 16 hours later with a 500 cal meal at lunch.

[jaim91]

Before: Random fasting. Skip lunch eat larger dinner. Variations such as that.

Now: Eating last meal at eight - ten. Breaking fast approx. 16 hours later with a 500 cal meal at lunch.

Never mind...I read up on it. I udnerstand now. But my question is, do you still eat maintenance calories?

And can you drink stuff like Diet Coke? Do you think it will effect yoru workouts? How long are you going to do this for?

[ballplaya4237]

Depends what your goal is.

Buking:
Off Days - Maintenance calories
Workout days - Maintenance + 25%

Cutting:
Off Days - 1000 - 1400 calories (Roughly 7 or 8 times body weight)
Workout days - Maintenance + 25%

Not sure about the diet coke. One of the effects after the first few days is reduced hunger. Drinking a few calories might iniate the reaction in your body that drives hunger, kinda like teasing you.

I never eat pre-workout anyways. I find I have more energy and better lifts. We were designed to have more energy on an empty stomach, hence tiredness after a large meal.

I'm doing a 1 month trial run right now. I'll re-evaluate after that.

[jaim91]

Cutting:
Off Days - 1000 - 1400 calories (Roughly 7 or 8 times body weight)
Workout days - Maintenance + 25%

So you'd eat 1400 calories in one sitting on days that you're only allowed to eat AFTER 6??

[Mainframe]

So you'd eat 1400 calories in one sitting on days that you're only allowed to eat AFTER 6??

I read the article your thinking of too. It wasn't very informative. You don't have to wait till six. You just have to have enough time between the meals you do eat before starting again I believe.

I'll let ballplaya give you a better answer.

[ballplaya4237]

So you'd eat 1400 calories in one sitting on days that you're only allowed to eat AFTER 6??

No. You would eat 1400 calories within an eight hour time period (+- 1 hour) on an off-day. Meal size and frequency is irrelevant, timing however, is of utmost importance.

Example off-day: Target 1400 Calories
Wake-up - 8:00am
Continue Fast - 8:00am - 12:59
Meal #1 - 1:00pm - 400 Calories
Meal #2 - 5:00pm - 500 Calories
Meal #3 - 9:00pm - 500 Calories
Begin fast following last meal.

Example Workout day: Target 3200 Calories
Wake-up - 8:00am
Continue Fast - 8:00am - 12:59
Meal #1 - 1:00pm - 600 Calories
Workout - 4:00pm
Meal #2 - 5:00pm - 1350 Calories
Meal #3 - 8:00pm - 1250 Calories

Main goal on workout days: Eat absolute majority of calories within 5 hours post workout.

There's infinite possibilities for meal plans, size, timing etc. as long as they follow the IF guidlines.

[The Director]

No. You would eat 1400 calories within an eight hour time period (+- 1 hour) on an off-day. Meal size and frequency is irrelevant, timing however, is of utmost importance.

Example off-day: Target 1400 Calories
Wake-up - 8:00am
Continue Fast - 8:00am - 12:59
Meal #1 - 1:00pm - 400 Calories
Meal #2 - 5:00pm - 500 Calories
Meal #3 - 9:00pm - 500 Calories
Begin fast following last meal.

Example Workout day: Target 3200 Calories
Wake-up - 8:00am
Continue Fast - 8:00am - 12:59
Meal #1 - 1:00pm - 600 Calories
Workout - 4:00pm
Meal #2 - 5:00pm - 1350 Calories
Meal #3 - 8:00pm - 1250 Calories

Main goal on workout days: Eat absolute majority of calories within 5 hours post workout.

There's infinite possibilities for meal plans, size, timing etc. as long as they follow the IF guidlines.

does that work? whered you get that system from?

[ballplaya4237]

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ad.php?t=19399

[The Director]

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ad.php?t=19399

dead link.

[ballplaya4237]

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...ad.php?t=19399

^Alive Link

[jaim91]

Is there a link to IF for someone who wants to cut?

[Mainframe]

Is there a link to IF for someone who wants to cut?

Depends what your goal is.

Buking:
Off Days - Maintenance calories
Workout days - Maintenance + 25%

Cutting:
Off Days - 1000 - 1400 calories (Roughly 7 or 8 times body weight)
Workout days - Maintenance + 25%

From everything I've learned, this really does explain it well. Do that, keep your meals in an 8 hour span and make sure that you're fasting 16 hours in between each 8 hour feeding period.

[ballplaya4237]

To straight cut/recomp/bulk you simply modify the calories of your off day to create calorie excess/surplus over a longer time span. Keep Post-workout nutrition the same.

[The Director]

so it like zig zagging calories? say:

Daily intake 2100.

Off day- 1200 cals. (2 off days)-900+900=1800
W/o day. (4 w/o days) 1800/4=450= 2550 calories a day.

?

[Mainframe]

so it like zig zagging calories? say:

Daily intake 2100.

Off day- 1200 cals. (2 off days)-900+900=1800
W/o day. (4 w/o days) 1800/4=450= 2550 calories a day.

?

As far as I know cause Ballplaya knows more, it's like zig zagging but you center all your food around your workout. So you eat all your food within an 8 hour period around your workout and then don't eat for 16 hours and then do it again.

[ballplaya4237]

I'd really hesitate to call it a cyclical (zig-zag) approach due the timing of the diet. In the sense of pure calories then I guess you could call it that.

I don't get what your calculations mean Filmmaker

[The Director]

isn't that catabolic though? I mean, people here eat some sort of casein before bed so muscle doesn't get eaten up during sleep, but if you fast even longer, isn't that a bad phase to be in?

[jaim91]

From everything I've learned, this really does explain it well. Do that, keep your meals in an 8 hour span and make sure that you're fasting 16 hours in between each 8 hour feeding period.

OK, so let's say my workout is at 12 pm everyday. I would eat 3 meals beween 1 pm and 9 pm the first day. I would stop eating again until 3 pm the next day. Then, I would eat 3 meals between 3 and 11, and not eat again until 5 pm the day after that.

Is this correct?

[ballplaya4237]

isn't that catabolic though? I mean, people here eat some sort of casein before bed so muscle doesn't get eaten up during sleep, but if you fast even longer, isn't that a bad phase to be in?

Fasting doesn't become catabolic around the 40th hour. It's perfectly fine to have some casein protein for your last meal. Your meals will continue being digested throughout the night and possibly into the next morning anyways.

Here's a simple version of what will happen:
Around the 12 hr mark, catcholamine output increases ==>> increased FFA mobilization, increased energy and supressed hunger.

OK, so let's say my workout is at 12 pm everyday. I would eat 3 meals beween 1 pm and 9 pm the first day. I would stop eating again until 3 pm the next day. Then, I would eat 3 meals between 3 and 11, and not eat again until 5 pm the day after that.

Is this correct?

You workout everyday? First off, I'd workout less and rest more. On your off day, why would you eat again at 3? Why not eat your first meal at one and finish your last meal at 9 again? It would just be a continuous cycle of the following.

Workout- 12
Eat - 1
Last Meal - 9

Off Day
Eat - 1
Last meal - 9.

Simply change your calories depending on if it's a workout day or a rest day. You don't have to get gradually later and later with your meals. Your goal would to fast from 15 - 18 hours. No more, no less.

[jaim91]

You workout everyday? First off, I'd workout less and rest more. On your off day, why would you eat again at 3? Why not eat your first meal at one and finish your last meal at 9 again? It would just be a continuous cycle of the following.

Workout- 12
Eat - 1
Last Meal - 9

Off Day
Eat - 1
Last meal - 9.

Simply change your calories depending on if it's a workout day or a rest day. You don't have to get gradually later and later with your meals. Your goal would to fast from 15 - 18 hours. No more, no less.

Because isn't this like only REALLY skipping breakfast?

[muruku]

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...threadid=96131
necro-threading
but gd thread on carb-up