Training for explosiveness / not mass

[LordGryn]

Hey guys,

I've been hitting the gym for around 3 months and I've gained around 5.5 kg of muscle and got my fat down to around 9%.

The thing is I've been doing intensity training as I wanted to up my body mass to around 80kg but now I don't want to gain any more mass but would rather just get more ripped and defined and also get back some explosive strength as I want to start Sprinting.

I know I need to change my workout routine ie sets reps and weights I use but i don't exactly know how- up til now I've been doing 2/3 muscle groups a day 3 sets for largers ones and 2 for smallers going for 12 reps upping weight to exhaustion, then upping weight on the last set and again around 6-10 reps.

I assume I should be doing more reps with less weight but this just seems weird to me as I love intensity training and pushing myself :P any input would be great!!

[slowgainer83]

You could still do lower reps and high intensity just reduce rest time between sets. For explosiveness do more core exercises like power cleans, squats, front squats and military press and dont forget the clean and jerk.. whilst focusing more on your legs.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drsquat16.htm

[G0tcha]

i kind of use the same type of workouts that the actors did in 300 (not the 300 workout because that wasnt something they did every day or multiple times a week. it was to test the progress). They would work one muscle group like for instance, a guy was attached to bands so taht he could sprint then reset then sprint which would cause blood to go from his upper body down to his legs. then he would work a diff muscle group like do push ups which would be difficult to get blood back up so it trains your body to effectively transport blood even though diff muscles are exhausted. pretty much try making a routine that you can rotate to constantly keep moving. what i did was instead of doing a full body circuit training sort of workout, i would try to focus on certain body parts just like a chest day or shoulder/leg days and so on. if you try this you will realize that you will be gasping and pushing yourself until you finish all sets as long as you use the right weight. exampletry making something that works for you) and there is no resting until you finish all sets
chest/tri day:
with both feet together i would hop over the adjustable bench from left counting 1 to right counting 2 until 40 times. then straight into
DB bench press 10 reps, then adjust bench for incline
DB incline press 10 reps, adjust back to flat for flys
DB flys 10 reps
repeat for 4 total sets
tris:
10 of those hops again
tricep pull down
repeat for 4 total sets of hops and pull downs
10 hops again
skull crushers 10 reps
repeat 4 sets total of each


for shoulder legs day i skipped the hops because i incorporated squats instead of the hops because squats being a compound exercise makes up for it by a lot believe me this day is harder then chest day
shoulders:
Squats 10 reps(draw the blood down)
double front lifts 10 reps
seated military DB press 10 reps
lateral raise 10 reps
seated at edge of seat reverse db raise 10 reps
Img: http://www.biofitness.com/demo18.gif but seated and leaning forward
then repeat starting from squats again with no rest until 4 cycles of the above list.

i rotate this depending on what i want to do with regular routine which is 4x10 mostly all exercises with high weight. i may just stick to this routine though because i like the intensity and the sweat i get from it which helps to burn fat and still build muscle. i was more sore doing this then doing my 4x10s with heavy weight. if you try this you have to find the right weight that you can push your self to finish. i usually benched 135lb inclined 2 40lbs and flys 2 25lbs but i had to drop weight to 25 bench 25 incline 20 flys but then my knee got injured a little while after i started this so i never started to move up in weight. try it out and see how you feel with the intensity of it. if your making up ur own routine just try to incorporate the hops so that you initially push blood down to your legs before beginning the next exercise which is pretty much whats happening. good luck

[LordGryn]

thats actually very interesting! ill have to look into that as I getinto routines and tend to do the same or similiar exercises or body parts on certain days. cheers!!

[DCR2489]

I would really just keep some heavy lifting 3 times a week, maybe westside for skinny bastards, which I find to be a good program for sports, and work on increasing your relative body strength, get your strength up and keep your weight the same. This will help with the explosiveness a lot. 3 times a week isn't too much to lift, and that still leaves another 3-4 days a week where you could run sprints. I've started sprinting myself lately, and I find a great way to increase speed is hill sprints.

[UtahRocks]

Study the lifts shown in these videos: http://www.aceathlete.com/hatch/video.htm

[Defiant1]

Explosiveness should be trained at lower intensities (e.g. 60% of 1rm).

High speed movements accelerating through the motion, should be used, for low repetitions.

[J.L.C.]

Explosiveness should be trained at lower intensities (e.g. 60% of 1rm).

High speed movements accelerating through the motion, should be used, for low repetitions.

Gotta disagree there.

Since I'm on the olympic kick lately.....

All of the o-lifts require lifting explosively, and most coaches say you can't train the lifts properly with anything less than 85%1RM...

Even max-outs are done at maximum explosiveness with cleans, jerks, and snatches.

I would assume most PLers lift explosively on their heavy stuff too.

[Defiant1]

Gotta disagree there.

Since I'm on the olympic kick lately.....

All of the o-lifts require lifting explosively, and most coaches say you can't train the lifts properly with anything less than 85%1RM...

Even max-outs are done at maximum explosiveness with cleans, jerks, and snatches.

I would assume most PLers lift explosively on their heavy stuff too.

But it is not MAXIMUM explosiveness. The ultimate goal is to move the most weight, not move as quickly as possible. In fact, it is more obvious in the powerlifts as they are certainly moving at maximum POSSIBLE speed.

The reason you don't train the lifts at less than 85% is because it is not specific to your performance (SAID principle).

Though maximum POSSIBLE relative explosiveness is used given the weight, it is not maximum possible explosiveness.

Main reason: maximum POWER is not possible at maximum load.

So for you, any non-applicable explosiveness training is a waste, but not in general for athletics.

Edit: This is a simple explanation of an extremely complex topic. There are all kinds of interpretations and applications of the term "explosiveness", so I don't mean to minimize it.

[J.L.C.]

My interpretation from Zat's book pg. 29
"Maximal Force is attained when velocity is small; inversely, maximal velocity is attained when external resistance is close to zero"

To me, that means you can ONLY generate MAXIMAL force with MAXIMAL weight. The most force will be generated when the weight doesn't even move.

But, this is where the language gets tricky. It all depends on what you mean by explosiveness - be it force, acceleration, power, or velocity.

Here's a cool link on power training (real power, not 'powerlifting' )
http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/power-training.html

[Defiant1]

I don't see it on my page 29. Mine doesn't list edition but lists publication date of 1995.

[Defiant1]

Actually, from your link:


"To summarise: the main difference between traditional heavy weight training and power training lies in the load and speed of the exercises. Loads of 75-95% of 1RM will result in increased maximum strength, while loads of 50-60% of 1RM, performed ballistically, will result in increased maximum power. Once an athlete has reached high strength levels, maximum power training may be more conducive to peak athletic performance than further increases in max strength. "

[J.L.C.]

Actually, from your link:


"To summarise: the main difference between traditional heavy weight training and power training lies in the load and speed of the exercises. Loads of 75-95% of 1RM will result in increased maximum strength, while loads of 50-60% of 1RM, performed ballistically, will result in increased maximum power. Once an athlete has reached high strength levels, maximum power training may be more conducive to peak athletic performance than further increases in max strength. "

Mine's the second edition with Kraemer co-authoring.

Nice exerpt from the link

I assume that's the reasoning behind the DE days in WSB?

Power is totally velocity dependent - which is why I think the term 'Powerlifting' is a misnomer. Powerlifting is more a representation of absolute/static strength than it is of an athlete's power - IMO.

[Defiant1]

My interpretation from Zat's book pg. 29
"Maximal Force is attained when velocity is small; inversely, maximal velocity is attained when external resistance is close to zero"

To me, that means you can ONLY generate MAXIMAL force with MAXIMAL weight. The most force will be generated when the weight doesn't even move.

But, this is where the language gets tricky. It all depends on what you mean by explosiveness - be it force, acceleration, power, or velocity.

Here's a cool link on power training (real power, not 'powerlifting' )
http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/power-training.html

You're right.

It is maximum POWER that is not available at maximum load. Not Force.

I corrected my above.

But the rest still stands true.

[Defiant1]

Mine's the second edition with Kraemer co-authoring.

Nice exerpt from the link

I assume that's the reasoning behind the DE days in WSB?

Power is totally velocity dependent - which is why I think the term 'Powerlifting' is a misnomer. Powerlifting is more a representation of absolute/static strength than it is of an athlete's power - IMO.

You were right about Force.

I corrected it above. It is POWER as you seem to realize.

[J.L.C.]

You were right about Force.

I corrected it above. It is POWER as you seem to realize.

I'm just glad we got to have a real discussion on here. It's been a while on this board

[all pro]

You were right about Force.

I corrected it above. It is POWER as you seem to realize.

Remember the argument I had with everyone's favorite troll, Bigbamboo A.K.A. Rob Specter. I used the S.A.E. conversion formula for horsepower. The key word being power.
1 horsepower = 33000 pounds of force, per foot, per minute.
From the reading and the testing that I've done maximum power seems to happen between 50 and 70% of a 1 rep max. It depended on the muscle groups involved in the lifts. I think it has to do with how much 2B fibers are present and the lifters ability to recruit them. So that comes down to 10 sets of 2 reps at 50-70% of 1 rep max with 1 minute rest intervals between sets.

[Defiant1]

I'm just glad we got to have a real discussion on here. It's been a while on this board

I don't tap the functional training part of my brain that often.

[Defiant1]

Remember the argument I had with everyone's favorite troll, Bigbamboo A.K.A. Rob Specter. I used the S.A.E. conversion formula for horsepower. The key word being power.
1 horsepower = 33000 pounds of force, per foot, per minute.
From the reading and the testing that I've done maximum power seems to happen between 50 and 70% of a 1 rep max. It depended on the muscle groups involved in the lifts. I think it has to do with how much 2B fibers are present and the lifters ability to recruit them. So that comes down to 10 sets of 2 reps at 50-70% of 1 rep max with 1 minute rest intervals between sets.

Good luck with that.

Their answer to everything is:

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

Power?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

Strength?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

Size?


"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"


Olympic lifting?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"


Psychosis?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

[all pro]

Good luck with that.

Their answer to everything is:

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

Power?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

Strength?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

Size?


"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"


Olympic lifting?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"


Psychosis?

"1 set, 8-12 reps. 2 up, 4 down to failure"

You forgot that H.I.T. cures cancer, aids, homo sexuality, blindness, depression, etc, etc, etc......

[J.L.C.]

You forgot that H.I.T. cures cancer, aids, homo sexuality, blindness, depression, etc, etc, etc......

and

the constant feeling of euphoria you only get from 1 set to failure.

[smitsky]

Study the lifts shown in these videos: http://www.aceathlete.com/hatch/video.htm

Agreed

I think that Plyometrics should be mentioned here. Matt Bruce performs some interesting ones in this video.

I personally do Bench Press Throws:

http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...ress_throw.mpg

Clap Pushups...

...and Leg Press Throws:

http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...ress_throw.mpg

[Jungle]

Hey guys,

I've been hitting the gym for around 3 months and I've gained around 5.5 kg of muscle and got my fat down to around 9%.

The thing is I've been doing intensity training as I wanted to up my body mass to around 80kg but now I don't want to gain any more mass but would rather just get more ripped and defined and also get back some explosive strength as I want to start Sprinting.

I know I need to change my workout routine ie sets reps and weights I use but i don't exactly know how- up til now I've been doing 2/3 muscle groups a day 3 sets for largers ones and 2 for smallers going for 12 reps upping weight to exhaustion, then upping weight on the last set and again around 6-10 reps.

I assume I should be doing more reps with less weight but this just seems weird to me as I love intensity training and pushing myself :P any input would be great!!

Dude you are mega ripped. The way you look is how I want to look when I'm finished losing weight. (no homo)

[qb-killa]

With olympic lifts doesn't maximum power output happen with your 1 rm? Olympic lifts have to be performed explosively, so if I was training for power would I lift in the 50-70 percent range with normal lifts, but stick with 80%+ for the olympic lifts?

[GoJu]

With olympic lifts doesn't maximum power output happen with your 1 rm? Olympic lifts have to be performed explosively, so if I was training for power would I lift in the 50-70 percent range with normal lifts, but stick with 80%+ for the olympic lifts?

yes, speed work applies mostly to the static lifts: presses, squats, deadlifts but with olympic lifts that are explosive by nature and traveling a much greater ROM than the static lifts, heavy weights performed quickly are what's going to get you faster in that ROM.

[LordGryn]

Agreed

I think that Plyometrics should be mentioned here. Matt Bruce performs some interesting ones in this video.

I personally do Bench Press Throws:

http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...ress_throw.mpg

Clap Pushups...

...and Leg Press Throws:

http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...ress_throw.mpg

yes ive been doing a bit of reading on plyometrics sounds like something that pertains to sprinting! ill haveto try the bench press throws today - and hope i dont kill myself

[LordGryn]

Dude you are mega ripped. The way you look is how I want to look when I'm finished losing weight. (no homo)

Cheers mate - I wish you success in reaching your goals

[smitsky]

yes ive been doing a bit of reading on plyometrics sounds like something that pertains to sprinting! ill haveto try the bench press throws today - and hope i dont kill myself

Hi. Start with very light weight, and be careful of the impact it puts on your wrists and joints in general.

Let me know how they go.