Thinking of increasing my protein to 5g/kg of lean mass per day using whey

[mileena202]

Recommended by a body builder on this forum, I have been taking 2.5 g of protein per kg of lean mass for over a year now to affect my lean bulk. However, I have yielded little in muscle mass increase. Therefore, I have been thinking of increasing it to 5g per kg of lean mass per day. Should I do this?

This article seems to support the case, with nothing to lose:

"BEEF PROTEIN VS. WHEY PROTEIN: WHICH IS BETTER?
by Chad Kerksick, PhD

https://www.*********.net/blogs/blog...hich-is-better
(p r o s o u r c e . net)

1. "While we're on the subject, let’s put one myth to bed. Whether you're eating beef or taking a beef isolate supplement or drinking a whey protein shake, you probably can't take too much. Increased intakes of protein in otherwise healthy individuals have been deemed safe and in the past 5 years, a number of published studies and reports have indicated this is the case (Phillips 2014, Beasley et al. 2014, World Health Organization 2011). In fact, while several studies have merely flirted with protein intakes above the RDA (1.2 – 1.6 g/kg/day) (Pasiakos, McLellan, and Lieberman 2015), Jose Antonio and his group of colleagues have blown the doors off of the RDA. Their first study, published in 2015, had participants ingest through meals and supplementation a daily protein intake of 4.4 grams/kg/day while completing a resistance training program over an 8 week period. No, that is not an error, they had people consume over 5x the current RDA every day for 8 weeks.

Impressively, this higher intake led to a caloric surplus, but no increases in body fat were found after all participants were asked to continue following the same exercise regimen they had been completing (Antonio et al. 2014). Their next study recruited trained men and women and prescribed them to follow the same periodized resistance training program and consume either 2.3 or 3.4 grams of protein/kg/day; amounts that are 3-4x the current RDA, respectively. Again, both groups increased strength and improved their body composition while following a resistance training program even in the face of consuming an excessive amount of calories from protein. Of special note, no clinical indications of safety or adverse events were noted in the study (Antonio et al. 2015). Their final study could be considered a proverbial “nail in the coffin” as they required the same group of resistance-trained men to complete a crossover examination whereby in one arm they ingested their normal diet and in the other arm they ingested 3.4 grams of protein/kg/day. Again, no adverse event or clinical safety outcomes were presented and no unfavorable changes in body composition were found (Antonio et al. 2016)."

2. And, since I am older (52), I think I need more protein than younger people:

"Two studies have been completed using whey protein to identify the optimal dose and the differences in their results highlights a key consideration for the person’s age. For example, in 2012 Yang reported that a group of men with an average age of 71 years required a 40-gram dose of whey protein (Yang et al. 2012) while a 2014 study published involving young, resistance-trained males again concluded that a 20-gram dose of whey protein optimally stimulated muscle protein synthesis after a single bout of resistance training."

3. I also am wondering if whey protein is better than real food protein. Again, the article seems to say yes:

"Two other key considerations are what is the optimal dose of the protein being ingested and is there an optimal pattern to ingest protein? As mentioned previously, the leucine intake of the ingested protein source is a key factor, as the skeletal muscle appears to have a minimum threshold of approximately 3 to 6 grams of leucine to turn on skeletal muscle anabolism. Moreover, the essential amino acids are also critically needed to drive the process of muscle protein synthesis (Tipton et al. 1999, Volpi et al. 2003).

For this reason alone, whey protein is an excellent consideration as it routinely has been shown to have the highest amounts of these amino acids."

[mileena202]

Also, I tried it yesterday, but only was able to reach 4.0 g of protein per kg of lean mass. I lost weight this morning, but I felt bloated during my morning workout since I ate 75 g of protein of mostly chicken and some casein before bed. I am thinking whey and casein would make me feel less bloated??

[eatyourspinach]

Maybe it's just your overall caloric intake was too low rather than just protein

[mileena202]

Maybe it's just your overall caloric intake was too low rather than just protein

Thanks! I am doing around 3,700-4,000 kCals per day, with 20% fats (mostly unsaturated). Some people say you have to gain weight to increase strength (Alan Thrall), but others say that is not necessary (Barbell Medicine). Not sure.

[mtpaquette]

A LOT of factors are at play, but no you shouldn't consume 5g/Kg of body weight, which is roughly 2g /lbs. I don't even always do 1g /lbs on cuts & etc. myself. When paying close attention to a lot of the studies you'll notice it's 1g/lbs of LBM (lean body mass [not fat mass]).

I think some wires are crossed somewhere with your kcals and/or workouts. What are you goals? Eating that much protein may make sense for someone on gear, but not for an average joe at the gym. Even considering something like how long you've been training will come into play with how much mass you can gain annually. You can add a lot at first, but it greatly tapers off year by year.

[mileena202]

A LOT of factors are at play, but no you shouldn't consume 5g/Kg of body weight, which is roughly 2g /lbs. I don't even always do 1g /lbs on cuts & etc. myself. When paying close attention to a lot of the studies you'll notice it's 1g/lbs of LBM (lean body mass [not fat mass]).

I think some wires are crossed somewhere with your kcals and/or workouts. What are you goals? Eating that much protein may make sense for someone on gear, but not for an average joe at the gym. Even considering something like how long you've been training will come into play with how much mass you can gain annually. You can add a lot at first, but it greatly tapers off year by year.

Thanks for your help. I thought 5g/kg of lean mass of protein sounded too much. I am not an average joe, but a powerlifter (aspiring), but I am weak. The diet I had been following for a lean bulk was 2.5g/kg of lean mass, 20-35% of macros in fat, and the rest in carbs. But y weight and muscle mass have remained stable over a long time. I think my age (52) may play into it, sadly.

[mtpaquette]

Thanks for your help. I thought 5g/kg of lean mass of protein sounded too much. I am not an average joe, but a powerlifter (aspiring), but I am weak. The diet I had been following for a lean bulk was 2.5g/kg of lean mass, 20-35% of macros in fat, and the rest in carbs. But y weight and muscle mass have remained stable over a long time. I think my age (52) may play into it, sadly.

That is a LOT of kcals for a woman, and especially a woman your age, if that's the case. That's more kcals than I'd be eating to bulk. Are you weighing out your foods and positive you're accounting for your caloric intake correctly? How consistent is that? I personally always do a high and low day that differentiate from 200-700kcals.

[mileena202]

That is a LOT of kcals for a woman, and especially a woman your age, if that's the case. That's more kcals than I'd be eating to bulk. Are you weighing out your foods and positive you're accounting for your caloric intake correctly? How consistent is that? I personally always do a high and low day that differentiate from 200-700kcals.

Thanks again mtpaguette. Yeah, I eat at least that, probably more actually. It's a lot, but I burn the calories off and my weight has been stable. I used to track religiously (took me 1/2 hour or more each day) by weighing everything and totaled everything up daily on my self-made spreadsheet, but it became a chore. And someone here a while ago said that was unnecessary as the body has mechanisms anyway to control weight and a few hundred calories either way is not going to make a difference, and he was right. So I stopped tracking like a year ago, other than my complete proteins, and nothing changed. I should do an occasional full track every month or so just to make sure.

I like your idea of doing a high and low day. Do you do that weekly?

[mtpaquette]

Thanks again mtpaguette. Yeah, I eat at least that, probably more actually. It's a lot, but I burn the calories off and my weight has been stable. I used to track religiously (took me 1/2 hour or more each day) by weighing everything and totaled everything up daily on my self-made spreadsheet, but it became a chore. And someone here a while ago said that was unnecessary as the body has mechanisms anyway to control weight and a few hundred calories either way is not going to make a difference, and he was right. So I stopped tracking like a year ago, other than my complete proteins, and nothing changed. I should do an occasional full track every month or so just to make sure.

I like your idea of doing a high and low day. Do you do that weekly?

Daily. Like a 4/3 split or sometimes a 5/2 split. Just depends on how quickly I'm trying to make progress. It's hard to look at on a daily basis as your daily life is likely never identical. I have take the approach the last couple of years to look at it as a "weekly net deficit".

[mileena202]

Daily. Like a 4/3 split or sometimes a 5/2 split. Just depends on how quickly I'm trying to make progress. It's hard to look at on a daily basis as your daily life is likely never identical. I have take the approach the last couple of years to look at it as a "weekly net deficit".

Awesome! I think changing diet like you do makes sense, and I need to try this. Just like changing up your workout routine.