If you do not do direct ab work, you're an idiot.

[Random Guy]

How do I know? You see, I'm an idiot. I've never been very concerned with my abs because I've always been trying to gain weight. However, I went to get a bodyfat test done because..well..it was free. The results (caliper) were 8% bodyfat. I looked at my abs and was a little confused. I got it done by another, 8.5% bodyfat. Hmmm. Fast forward about two weeks, I get one of those (excuse me if I dunno what im talking about) biometric bodyfat tests (with the electrodes on ya and such), ya, said pretty much the same thing.

My abs are ****. Well, maybe it's because I never did direct ab work? I bought into too much bull**** I read here and never really did them.

If you're a bodybuilder, you need to train your abs. Heavy squats and heavy deads are not enough. I squat 400+ and dead close to 500 and it didn't do **** for my abs.

Just thought I'd share

[oldmanmarley]

Cool man. I agree. The abs are a muscle group that should be trained like any other important one. It'd be like not training calves or something.
I've been in your situation, however, one critical difference was that I WAS doing direct ab work - 3 times a week. I was at 8.5 (according to calipers), and my uppermost abs were visible, but my lower abs were hidden. It could have been that the ab work I was doing was like a 5-minute endurance session, or (more likely) that I seem to store a lot of fat in that area and my skin's not all that tight. (I can't believe I was struck by gravity at the ripe age of 19.)

[SDFlip]

maybe because you're really not 8-9% bf....

[papi93]

It's called bioelectrical impedence. It tends to give slightly higher readings than a skinfold test.

[Random Guy]

maybe because you're really not 8-9% bf....

So three individuals and two different tests are wrong? If I had access to/was overly concerned with my bodyfat, I'd try to do the water submergion.

[papi93]

So three individuals and two different tests are wrong? If I had access to/was overly concerned with my bodyfat, I'd try to do the water submergion.

Hydrostatic weighing, I believe.

[Random Guy]

Hydrostatic weighing, I believe.

Correct.

[Ajk_Lpool]

Just because your abs do not show, doesn't necessarily mean other abs won't. However, it makes sense to train them and not neglect them simply because, they do need attention like any other muscle group.

Some people's abs might show at 8-9 % bodyfat.. Using the phrase "idiot" doesn't really justify everybody on here.

[papi93]

Correct.

Water retention does play a factor sometimes. Monitoring of sodium intake can help with this.

[Defiant1]

There are 2 good points here:

1. Low bodyfat does not mean good abs.


2. Compounds are not going to give you good abs unless you have them naturally.

[Random Guy]

Water retention does play a factor sometimes. Monitoring of sodium intake can help with this.

I drink damn near all my calories and watch everything that goes into my body. Between oats, whey, olive oil, etc, I'd imagine that I wouldn't be getting a lot of sodium in my diet. In addition, I drink at least a gallon of water a day.

You may be right though. I'll have to be more observant.

[SDFlip]

don't get too caught up in the numbers then.

pay attention to what the mirror tells you.

[papi93]

I drink damn near all my calories and watch everything that goes into my body. Between oats, whey, olive oil, etc, I'd imagine that I wouldn't be getting a lot of sodium in my diet. In addition, I drink at least a gallon of water a day.

You may be right though. I'll have to be more observant.

I didn't mean you. It was just something to add to your thread. Some might be taking in too much sodium and might be blurring their definition. They could have the required low bodyfat and abdominal routine but are just holding too much water.

[Random Guy]

I didn't mean you. It was just something to add to your thread. Some might be taking in too much sodium and might be blurring their definition. They could have the required low bodyfat and abdominal routine but are just holding too much water.

Sorry if my response too edgy; it was not my intention. But you are most certainly correct. In an era of french fries and potatoe chips, its quite easy to exceed your sodium intake.

[MoGeaYuglay]

standing cable crunches and i'm done. my abs were built by heavy deads and squats. some get abs doing that some don't whatever.

[Random Guy]

standing cable crunches and i'm done. my abs were built by heavy deads and squats. some get abs doing that some don't whatever.

To be 6'1 250lbs and know your abs are well developed, I assume you have low bodyfat to gauge that? If thats the case, you must be a monster.

[Kung-fusion]

Do you drink milk? If so, try cutting all dairy out of your diet for two weeks, and your abs may magically appear (worked for me). I agree, though, that training abs is important, only because I got injured as a result of having a very strong upper body, very weak abs, and picking up heavy boxes rapidly with poor posture.

[J.L.C.]

I guess I'm an idiot

LOL@milk being anti-ab

[Defiant1]

I guess I'm an idiot

LOL@milk being anti-ab

Though I know you are not an idiot, dairy especially milk makes a lot of people retain water due to allergic reaction.

Northern Europeans usually don't have this problem, but the "darker" peoples almost all do to some degree (Latins, Blacks, Asians, Semites etc).

Though it seems REALLY crazy, humans in general aren't set up to drink cows milk, especially as adults.

[papi93]

Though I know you are not an idiot, dairy especially milk makes a lot of people retain water due to allergic reaction.

Northern Europeans usually don't have this problem, but the "darker" peoples almost all do to some degree (Latins, Blacks, Asians, Semites etc).

Though it seems REALLY crazy, humans in general aren't set up to drink cows milk, especially as adults.

To be honest...I have always seemed to retain more water when I take in milk.

[J.L.C.]

Though I know you are not an idiot, dairy especially milk makes a lot of people retain water due to allergic reaction.

Northern Europeans usually don't have this problem, but the "darker" peoples almost all do to some degree (Latins, Blacks, Asians, Semites etc).

Though it seems REALLY crazy, humans in general aren't set up to drink cows milk, especially as adults.

I agree with this.......but - in my opinion, most of the guys who say they are 'retaining water' are carrying too much bodyfat to notice it.

You have to be fairly lean to notice things like that. It's like people carb loading and manipulating sodium at 12% - fun, but it's not going to make visible difference

[Defiant1]

I agree with this.......but - in my opinion, most of the guys who say they are 'retaining water' are carrying too much bodyfat to notice it.

You have to be fairly lean to notice things like that. It's like people carb loading and manipulating sodium at 12% - fun, but it's not going to make visible difference

Meh...you nordic types don't know....


Ask Stella, I suspect she may have problems?


It depends on your degree of reaction-if I drink milk, I get VERY bloated, and it goes right through me. It also smooths me out (even more) and I am far from lean. Makes me look puffy. (er) lol.

When I was working out in college, I couldn't afford supps. One thing I did was to drink a quart of skim milk post workout.......BIG mistake.

It's gotten worse as I've gotten older. It started with whole milk, then skim, then SOME cheese, now it is most cheese. Yogurt is ok.

[DJAuto]

Scientific studies state that most adults, as they age, become lactose intolerant. I don't know if it is true or not, but it's certainly interesting.

[Mtguy8787]

Most people think that deads and squats will actually help you to build ab muscle.. It doesnt. It cant.

If you have great abs @ low bf, and all you ever did was squats & deads, then you already had the muscle. you did not build it from doing sqauts and deads.

Your lower back muscles are the ones being used when you are doing squats and deads. The abs are an antagonistic muscle group. Yes, they are an antagonistic stabilizer, but they are not being stimulated. They play the same role that the biceps do in a bench press. It is impossible for them to be contracting when you are doing a squat or deadlift.

[JOHN GARGANI]

if you are training correctly ( meaning correct breathing throughout the exercises) and your bodyfat is a TRUE ACCURATE 8 percent and you are not showing ABS, then something is quite wrong.......


I competed at that percentage and never did a single ab exercise once the entire time I trained and had rippling abs......

the breathing during bodybuilding movments, when done forcibly and correctly, greatly stimulates the abdominals, after all, lets face it, they are essentially nothing more than a breathing muscle, shortening the space between the lower part of the ribcage and the hip, assisting in forcible expiration of air....


caliper measurements are VERY inaccurate......

[Grand_Hustle]

i agree random guy that you gotta work your abs directly. Everybody treats the abs weird. Some people work them everyday doing 500 sit ups before they go to sleep and some people rely on compound exercises to get them their abs. Now when u said you bought into all the bull**** u read on here i agree with you somewhat. The reason i say that is bcuz every BB on here has different experiences working out and getting results and everyone has different opinions. The other day i asked someone on a diff section of the forum if higher reps lower weights means muscle gain and lower reps heavy weights equals strength and some people told me that that was a myth. Now on the first page in this section, everyone is saying thats true.

[dbcb314]

RG


post some pics

calipers can be off a lot of the times

[Dave P]

Calipers get worse and worse the lower your body fat gets I believe. In the same day you could test 8% or 13%...really innacurate.

If you really want to know your bodyfat get the Hydrostatic weigh in. Most campuses with a Kinesiology department have them and are more than happy to test you for like 10 bucks.

[jmonty]

i agree that 'if you are a bber you should train your abs'. but, i'm not a bber, and i don't work my abs directly very often because i don't want to gain mass their. compared to an average person who doesn't lift, i believe that people who weight train can build a good physique without direct ab work.

[GoJu]

if you are training correctly ( meaning correct breathing throughout the exercises) and your bodyfat is a TRUE ACCURATE 8 percent and you are not showing ABS, then something is quite wrong.......


I competed at that percentage and never did a single ab exercise once the entire time I trained and had rippling abs......

the breathing during bodybuilding movments, when done forcibly and correctly, greatly stimulates the abdominals, after all, lets face it, they are essentially nothing more than a breathing muscle, shortening the space between the lower part of the ribcage and the hip, assisting in forcible expiration of air....


caliper measurements are VERY inaccurate......

agreed, proper breathing is very improtant. I don't know about the rest of you but my abs are always stimulating doing all squat and deadlift variations, I do direct ab work but heavy squats, deads, and overhead presses WILL stimulate your core to a great degree.