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  1. #1
    Jacked up banker Krzna's Avatar
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    Cool Epistane for Dummies

    I have compiled a few commonly asked questions new users ask before getting into epistane by IBE. Please note that this thread is by no means makes you completely knowledgeable. I have not used epistane neither have I used Havoc, this thread is written strictly by looking at the chemical structre and with my over all experience with anabolics in general.


    I am 18, I have had 4 years plus lifting experience, I feel Ive reached a plateau and want to use this compound:
    I've been more than nice to you... you are a retard ... good bye.

    I have just got my epistane , how do I use it?
    The safest way to use epistane as with any anabolic is to keep the dosage safely low however still effective enough not to be a complete waste.

    Week 1 20mg
    Week 2 20mg
    Week 3 -30mg
    Week 4 30mg


    For a starter who is giving over the counter (OTC) anabolics a shot personally never recommend over 30mg. 4 week cycles are proven to be decently effective and safer than longer orals.


    For the advanced user:

    Week 1 20mg
    Week 2 30mg
    Week 3 40mg
    Week 4 40mg

    Can I stack epistane with other prohormones/AAS:
    You can.

    How do i do it?
    Read my other write up
    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?p=25789071


    What times of the day do I take epistane.
    I am old school and will not accept to the pulsing/epi till I see blood work, though it does make sense. Simply being that it is speculation based on the free alcohol. However I still feel the best way to take it would be as follows.

    Keep the doses prior to 6pm and around 5-6 hours in difference. Like an anabolic take it with EFA's - hormones are fat soluable. So assuming you work out around 6pm, take one with a EFA/complex carb rich break fast and the next dose with small concentrated carb rich pre workout.

    As opposed to SD, its hit on the lipid profile would not be as bad, however till I see blood work its better safe than sorry. Load up on all the ancillaries and accessory supplements as needed.

    Does epistane require a PCT?
    Like every other anabolic on the block epistane needs a PCT.

    What is your favourite PCT and WHY?

    wk1: 120mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight
    wk2: 90mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight
    wk4: 60mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight
    wk3: 60mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight

    This PCT looks different from your usual Nolvadex sermons. Why?
    a) By anecdotal and trial and error I have come to see that the fastest jump back with ZERO downtime is with a SERM+ a real low dose of a scheduled AI
    b) Epi if anything will be pretty supressive. I know that I hypothetically sugessted Nolva for SD cycles but looking at the heptatoxicity, I feel that toremifene is better.

    Do I need to be worried about gyno on epistane:
    Theoretically, no ... but again there is something on paper, something else real world so better safe than sorry. SERM all the way.

    What happens if my nuts shrink? Do i stop the cycle?
    Not necessary if you ask me. Throw in HCG ew 250ius x 2wice a week, you should be fine. Stop it in the PCT.
    Switch out to clomid in the PCT

    How do I run this clomid?
    Clomid is clomiphine citrate made by E-lily&Co
    Day 1- 300mg
    Week 1 -150mg
    Week 2- 100mg
    Week 3- 75

    Dont exceed 3 weeks on clomid, avoid the metabolite action.


    Where do I get these support chemicals:
    Asking for sources is against board rules. Please do not disrespect them. Look in some signatures, they may actually have an answer.

    Which is What are other good supplements I can run along side superdrol to combat side effects?
    Red Yeast Rice- A fermented rice product, that is our best fighter against negative sides form AAS concerning cardiovascular damage. Comprised of nine different monacolins, which are naturally occurring substances that help regulate cholesterol levels. Along with sterols, and monounsaturated fatty acids, it packs a strong punch.
    Dosage : 1.2g ED

    COQ10- Although this is abundant in food sources, I feel it prudent to put on here. Not only does it show to help cardiac function, but it?€™s also imperative to be used with Red Yeast Rice. Can be used in combination with other cholesterol lowering supplements.

    Celery Seed- A powerful anti-oxidant, shown to not only lower blood pressure, but may have cancer fighting properties as well. And there is evidence to show its ability in aiding the liver.

    Hawthorne Berry: Also very useful to lower BP and keep it on check. A great on cycle supplement.
    Dosage 1000mg ed on cycle.

    Policosanol- A blend of fatty alcohol?€™s, shows great promise in its use as beneficial to cardiovascular health, to include the maintenance of healthy lipid profiles. There is also some theory to a synergistic affect with EFA?€™s.
    Dosage : 20mg 2x a day

    Saw Palmetto: The prostrate is one delicate part of your system that you do not want to affect under any circumstances.
    SP @ 320mg/day

    A note on heptatoxicity and liver support:
    Liver support : What are your thoughts
    While there are many compounds in the market today, most of them which are good too, I stick to my own personal choice for liver protection- Liv 52.
    Why?
    Here is why
    * Capers (Capparis spinosa) - Well-documented hepatic stimulant and protector. Improves the functional efficiency of the liver.*
    * Wild Chicory (Cichorium intybus) - Powerful hepatic stimulant, increases bile secretion, acts on liver glycogen and promotes digestion.*
    * Black Nightshade (Solanum nigrum) ? Promotes liver and kidney health and has shown hepatoprotective activity in cases of toxicity induced by drugs and chemicals.*
    * Arjuna (Terminalia arjuna) ? Tonic for heart and liver. Regulates hepatic cholesterol biosynthesis.*
    * Negro Coffee (Cassia occidentalis) ? Digestive and hepatic tonic.*
    * Yarrow (Achillea millefolium) ? Stimulative tonic for the liver.*
    * Tamarisk (Tamarix gallica) - Hepatic stimulant; also provides digestive support.*

    I would recommend a steady dose of Liv 52 starting 2 weeks prior to the cycle. Keep yourself FREE of alcohol on cycle and keep the same dose of Liv 52 in the offcycle.

    Liver strength:
    Liver toxicity from androgenic compounds and methylation in some cases are over-stated. However, it is of prime importance to understand that the liver is central to all bodybuilding. why? because it is the mother of all detoxifiers, a phoenix in itself that regenerates with damage.
    In laymans terms It is also the site where Growth hormone is converted to IGF ... to cut a long story short, if you want to optimize the effect of all these anabolics you are taking, keep that liver of yours fit and fine, because while ON-cycle, you are giving it more damage than necessary

    Normally, the liver needs protein to repair itself. During detoxification, however, it may be necessary for a patient to temporarily decrease dietary protein, especially if blood levels of ammonia are high. (Ammonia is a waste product of protein metabolism that can become elevated in advanced cases of liver disease, particularly cirrhosis.) In the absence of elevated ammonia levels, diets adequate in protein can hasten liver regeneration. The sulfur-containing amino acids methionine, cysteine and taurine are particularly important.




    I am not a doctor and neither do my opinions construe medical advice. These are just my views after using and researching about this product and answering a number of queries from users who were as confused as me when I first started it. Do not PM me for source please, look in people's signatures,its easier. No I do not work for IBE/RPN or any other supplement company for that matter. These are just my personal opinions.
    Last edited by Krzna; 03-09-2007 at 02:18 PM.
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  2. #2
    Anabolic Innovations Rep zbtboy's Avatar
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    Great write-up. But no love for Cycle Support?
    "Use no way as a way, No limitation as a limitation" - Bruce Lee

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  3. #3
    Jacked up banker Krzna's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by zbtboy View Post
    Great write-up. But no love for Cycle Support?
    ask crowler to send me cookies lol ...
    i'll bump for CS ...
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  4. #4
    Unregistered User NoNameNecessary's Avatar
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    Great post (as always), Krzna.
    Many are the plans in a man's heart, but it is the Lord's purpose that prevails.
    -Proverbs 19:21

  5. #5
    Registered User Latosaurus Rex's Avatar
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    didnt someone already do one of these?

  6. #6
    Jacked up banker Krzna's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Latosaurus Rex View Post
    didnt someone already do one of these?
    no ... bloutes pct is differnt ... the point of my thread was more for the PCT if anything. Also look at my dosages.
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  7. #7
    Perma-Bulk haiz69's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Krzna View Post

    I am 18, I have had 4 years plus lifting experience, I feel Ive reached a plateau and want to use this compound:
    I've been more than nice to you... you are a retard ... good bye.
    This is the best part.
    NSCA-CSCS and CPT
    Currently Pursuing A Doctor of Physical Therapy Degree

  8. #8
    Jacked up banker Krzna's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by haiz69 View Post
    This is the best part.
    trust me, i get atleast 10 of those pm's ... so much so, for the longest time ever i decided never to empty them out.
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  9. #9
    Tellin' it like it is sublimejeh's Avatar
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    Bump for K's sweet thread, cuz epi rules
    Justinh@shredded-rx.com

  10. #10
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    hows this look


    epi 10 mg first 3 day 20mg last 4 days then 20/30/30 mabye 40mg on the last week if it feels good

    all dosings before 6 pm to prevent sum shutdown

    support supps:
    Cissus 4g
    Sesamin 1g
    G/C/M 3 caps
    2 scoops of cycle support
    liver longer 2 tabs
    taurine 5g
    Poseidon 2 servings
    Vit. E 400 i.e.
    ZMA 3 caps
    Super Enzyme 3 caps
    on's opti mens multi

    PCT:
    120 torm first 3 days then 90/90/60/30
    ebol
    powerfull 3.2g
    muira puama 2g
    tesojack 2 caps
    tribulus 6g
    fenugreek 3/4/5/6 caps
    Paravol
    CEE 4g
    GlycerGrow
    G/C/M 3 caps
    Retain 3 caps
    Extend
    ZMA 3caps
    on's opti mens multi
    taurine 5g
    Cycle Support 2 scoops
    sesamin 1g

    Starting week 3 of PCT X-Factor will be used and cycle support will be replaced with Liv52 and cissus will be dropped and sesamin will be dropped

    this is my first cycle, i am not running epi untill sometime in the summer Im still working on my diet for "ON"cycle any suggest would be helpfull, im clean bulking im 5'10" 190lbs 17%bf

    thanks

  11. #11
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    People stop growing taller because of excess estrogen, not testosterone. By using something like this at age 18, you can add 1-2 inches you would not normally have. Please do some research before insulting people.

  12. #12
    Registered User masterdine's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by johnwalker222 View Post
    People stop growing taller because of excess estrogen, not testosterone. By using something like this at age 18, you can add 1-2 inches you would not normally have. Please do some research before insulting people.
    who insulted anyone and u are correct in the estrogen part but wrong with all the rest

  13. #13
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    Originally Posted by johnwalker222 View Post
    People stop growing taller because of excess estrogen, not testosterone. By using something like this at age 18, you can add 1-2 inches you would not normally have. Please do some research before insulting people.
    WTF?
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  14. #14
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    im taking 20mg epi 100 mg prosta for first week.. whats the best way to dose it if i work out at like 1 pm? take 10mg epi and 50mg prosta in morning and the rest before workout? or take the rest later on the day after the workout?

    thx

  15. #15
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    Originally Posted by johnwalker222 View Post
    People stop growing taller because of excess estrogen, not testosterone. By using something like this at age 18, you can add 1-2 inches you would not normally have. Please do some research before insulting people.
    might be the dumbest theory ive ever read anywhere thanks for making me laugh out loud jonwalker lol

  16. #16
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    Originally Posted by Krzna View Post
    I have compiled a few commonly asked questions new users ask before getting into epistane by IBE. Please note that this thread is by no means makes you completely knowledgeable. I have not used epistane neither have I used Havoc, this thread is written strictly by looking at the chemical structre and with my over all experience with anabolics in general.


    I am 18, I have had 4 years plus lifting experience, I feel Ive reached a plateau and want to use this compound:
    I've been more than nice to you... you are a retard ... good bye.

    I have just got my epistane , how do I use it?
    The safest way to use epistane as with any anabolic is to keep the dosage safely low however still effective enough not to be a complete waste.

    Week 1 20mg
    Week 2 20mg
    Week 3 -30mg
    Week 4 30mg


    For a starter who is giving over the counter (OTC) anabolics a shot personally never recommend over 30mg. 4 week cycles are proven to be decently effective and safer than longer orals.


    For the advanced user:

    Week 1 20mg
    Week 2 30mg
    Week 3 40mg
    Week 4 40mg

    Can I stack epistane with other prohormones/AAS:
    You can.

    How do i do it?
    Read my other write up
    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?p=25789071


    What times of the day do I take epistane.
    I am old school and will not accept to the pulsing/epi till I see blood work, though it does make sense. Simply being that it is speculation based on the free alcohol. However I still feel the best way to take it would be as follows.

    Keep the doses prior to 6pm and around 5-6 hours in difference. Like an anabolic take it with EFA's - hormones are fat soluable. So assuming you work out around 6pm, take one with a EFA/complex carb rich break fast and the next dose with small concentrated carb rich pre workout.

    As opposed to SD, its hit on the lipid profile would not be as bad, however till I see blood work its better safe than sorry. Load up on all the ancillaries and accessory supplements as needed.

    Does epistane require a PCT?
    Like every other anabolic on the block epistane needs a PCT.

    What is your favourite PCT and WHY?

    wk1: 120mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight
    wk2: 90mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight
    wk4: 60mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight
    wk3: 60mg Fareston, EXEMESTANE - super low dose dependent on body weight

    This PCT looks different from your usual Nolvadex sermons. Why?
    a) By anecdotal and trial and error I have come to see that the fastest jump back with ZERO downtime is with a SERM+ a real low dose of a scheduled AI
    b) Epi if anything will be pretty supressive. I know that I hypothetically sugessted Nolva for SD cycles but looking at the heptatoxicity, I feel that toremifene is better.

    Do I need to be worried about gyno on epistane:
    Theoretically, no ... but again there is something on paper, something else real world so better safe than sorry. SERM all the way.

    What happens if my nuts shrink? Do i stop the cycle?
    Not necessary if you ask me. Throw in HCG ew 250ius x 2wice a week, you should be fine. Stop it in the PCT.
    Switch out to clomid in the PCT

    How do I run this clomid?
    Clomid is clomiphine citrate made by E-lily&Co
    Day 1- 300mg
    Week 1 -150mg
    Week 2- 100mg
    Week 3- 75

    Dont exceed 3 weeks on clomid, avoid the metabolite action.


    Where do I get these support chemicals:
    Asking for sources is against board rules. Please do not disrespect them. Look in some signatures, they may actually have an answer.

    Which is What are other good supplements I can run along side superdrol to combat side effects?
    Red Yeast Rice- A fermented rice product, that is our best fighter against negative sides form AAS concerning cardiovascular damage. Comprised of nine different monacolins, which are naturally occurring substances that help regulate cholesterol levels. Along with sterols, and monounsaturated fatty acids, it packs a strong punch.
    Dosage : 1.2g ED

    COQ10- Although this is abundant in food sources, I feel it prudent to put on here. Not only does it show to help cardiac function, but it???s also imperative to be used with Red Yeast Rice. Can be used in combination with other cholesterol lowering supplements.

    Celery Seed- A powerful anti-oxidant, shown to not only lower blood pressure, but may have cancer fighting properties as well. And there is evidence to show its ability in aiding the liver.

    Hawthorne Berry: Also very useful to lower BP and keep it on check. A great on cycle supplement.
    Dosage 1000mg ed on cycle.

    Policosanol- A blend of fatty alcohol???s, shows great promise in its use as beneficial to cardiovascular health, to include the maintenance of healthy lipid profiles. There is also some theory to a synergistic affect with EFA???s.
    Dosage : 20mg 2x a day

    Saw Palmetto: The prostrate is one delicate part of your system that you do not want to affect under any circumstances.
    SP @ 320mg/day

    A note on heptatoxicity and liver support:
    Liver support : What are your thoughts
    While there are many compounds in the market today, most of them which are good too, I stick to my own personal choice for liver protection- Liv 52.
    Why?
    Here is why
    * Capers (Capparis spinosa) - Well-documented hepatic stimulant and protector. Improves the functional efficiency of the liver.*
    * Wild Chicory (Cichorium intybus) - Powerful hepatic stimulant, increases bile secretion, acts on liver glycogen and promotes digestion.*
    * Black Nightshade (Solanum nigrum) ? Promotes liver and kidney health and has shown hepatoprotective activity in cases of toxicity induced by drugs and chemicals.*
    * Arjuna (Terminalia arjuna) ? Tonic for heart and liver. Regulates hepatic cholesterol biosynthesis.*
    * Negro Coffee (Cassia occidentalis) ? Digestive and hepatic tonic.*
    * Yarrow (Achillea millefolium) ? Stimulative tonic for the liver.*
    * Tamarisk (Tamarix gallica) - Hepatic stimulant; also provides digestive support.*

    I would recommend a steady dose of Liv 52 starting 2 weeks prior to the cycle. Keep yourself FREE of alcohol on cycle and keep the same dose of Liv 52 in the offcycle.

    Liver strength:
    Liver toxicity from androgenic compounds and methylation in some cases are over-stated. However, it is of prime importance to understand that the liver is central to all bodybuilding. why? because it is the mother of all detoxifiers, a phoenix in itself that regenerates with damage.
    In laymans terms It is also the site where Growth hormone is converted to IGF ... to cut a long story short, if you want to optimize the effect of all these anabolics you are taking, keep that liver of yours fit and fine, because while ON-cycle, you are giving it more damage than necessary

    Normally, the liver needs protein to repair itself. During detoxification, however, it may be necessary for a patient to temporarily decrease dietary protein, especially if blood levels of ammonia are high. (Ammonia is a waste product of protein metabolism that can become elevated in advanced cases of liver disease, particularly cirrhosis.) In the absence of elevated ammonia levels, diets adequate in protein can hasten liver regeneration. The sulfur-containing amino acids methionine, cysteine and taurine are particularly important.




    I am not a doctor and neither do my opinions construe medical advice. These are just my views after using and researching about this product and answering a number of queries from users who were as confused as me when I first started it. Do not PM me for source please, look in people's signatures,its easier. No I do not work for IBE/RPN or any other supplement company for that matter. These are just my personal opinions.
    Say you did see bloodwork for the pulse cycle? Would you reccomend any type of PCT to people? During those two weeks off in between doses would you recommend taking creatine/NO product?

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    Originally Posted by Rybino View Post
    Say you did see bloodwork for the pulse cycle? Would you reccomend any type of PCT to people? During those two weeks off in between doses would you recommend taking creatine/NO product?
    i dont give out any more pct on BB.com bro i am on ***************.com if u need me
    Proudly Sponsored by BETTER BODY SPORTS!
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    okay im 27 on my brothers account and i just recevied epistane, milk thistle, novadex xt for pct and a serm for pct. is there anything else i need for this cycle to increase my results or overall health?

    also i need to know when to take everything, do i take the milk thistle with the epi? and when do u take the serm?

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    Originally Posted by zbtboy View Post
    Great write-up. But no love for Cycle Support?
    Send me some for free for my next cycle and I'll pimp the hell out of it on here, phforum, anabolic minds, and locally. Locally they seem to buy what i tell them to.

  20. #20
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    Originally Posted by tiskfam727 View Post
    okay im 27 on my brothers account and i just recevied epistane, milk thistle, novadex xt for pct and a serm for pct. is there anything else i need for this cycle to increase my results or overall health?

    also i need to know when to take everything, do i take the milk thistle with the epi? and when do u take the serm?
    Age 21 and up.
    On a quest to 10% BF.

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    so it should be taken every 6-8 hours like
    6:00/1:00/8:00
    Ubby 86

    I eat, sleep, train, and work hard everyday

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    If you stuck with nolva what would your dosage be? Does it matter if it is with/without food?

    I was thinking maybe 30/20/10/10

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    Question

    Hey only very new to the epistane world, I have two bottles (120 caps) and am still not 100% sure on the amounts to take on cycles and how often to have a cycle? When people list their cycle amounts eg. 10/20/20/30/30, is this meaning 10mg only on day one and 20mg on day two? Or does this mean 10mg every day for the first week? If you catch my drift. I'm just after a typical detail of an epi cycle.

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    Originally Posted by wannagetstakt View Post
    Hey only very new to the epistane world, I have two bottles (120 caps) and am still not 100% sure on the amounts to take on cycles and how often to have a cycle? When people list their cycle amounts eg. 10/20/20/30/30, is this meaning 10mg only on day one and 20mg on day two? Or does this mean 10mg every day for the first week? If you catch my drift. I'm just after a typical detail of an epi cycle.
    That refers to weeks. Btw you're not allowed to discuss prohormones here anymore tbh.

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